Speculation: Facing cap issues after this year; who stays -- Buff or Wheeler?

Who stays: Buff or Wheels?

  • prefer to keep Buff

    Votes: 4 3.5%
  • perfer to keep Wheeler

    Votes: 83 73.5%
  • Lets keep both and make some real hard choices elsewhere

    Votes: 26 23.0%

  • Total voters
    113

csk

Registered User
Nov 5, 2015
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Myers is most certainly not close to our best D. He was getting some of the easiest minutes among his peers this season and has performed just ok. I like the guy but he has spent most of the year playing against other teams third and fourth line players.

Here I was starting to wonder if Myers was our 6th best Dman
 

Board Bard

Dane-O-Mite
Jun 7, 2014
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Buff signed because he wanted to play with the kids. If he keeps regressing, opposing forwards are going to be blowing by him with regularity, and he'll be playing with the kids but not winning with the kids. It's entirely possible that just by being on the team in future years, Buff will defeat the purpose of winning.
 
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libertarian

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Jul 27, 2017
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if the team loses depth to keep a big contract that hasn't been playing a significant role on the jets for a while
the jets will be running to more challenges by letting go of depth talent that's still on the rise

he really doesn't have much of place on the jets anymore with that kind of contract

whatever their plan is
It's not optimal to keep a 7.6 million defenseman who puts up 6 million defenseman numbers

wheeler>buff
5 of the jets defenceman > buff

Totally agree with this. Buff has to go. We can't afford him and sign all of our great prospects and keep Wheeler. I think Wheels is the piece we need to hold to win a SC.
 

GNP

Here Comes the Jets -look out hockey world !!!
Oct 11, 2016
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While not untrue entirely, your statement is a bit ingenuous.

IMG_0430.jpg
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You see Aavco - a couple of posts back I said, Toews and Kane were making 12.5 mil each and taking up about 1/3 of the Hawks cap space. I wasn't exactly right, but closer than you who "corrected me" saying they made only $ 10.5 mil each. Well if this list is right, we're both wrong and "both way over paid" at $ 13.8 mil

Why is Connor Mc David not on this list ??? - maybe last years list ???
 
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GNP

Here Comes the Jets -look out hockey world !!!
Oct 11, 2016
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Unfortunately even with Enstrom coming off the books it isn't enough if you want to sign Trouba (6.5), Morrissey (5.5), Helle (5) and Lowry (3.5) to long term deals and then also re-up Armia (2.5), Tanev (2), Poolman (1) and Dano (1).

Even with an $80 million dollar cap next season I have us over that without factoring the bonuses for Laine, Connor, Roslovic. (I've tried to be realistic but slightly generous with the projections)

Maybe we have to bridge Morrissey or give Helle another show me deal in order to make it work, but I won't be surprised if someone goes. Maybe it will be Mason... re-sign Comrie to a $1 million dollar deal. That would get us under $80 million but we would likely have bonus overages which hurt us the following season when we're trying to get Laine, Wheeler and Connor done.
_____________________________________________________

Without taking out my calculator -- I'd say just start with letting an aging Enstrom go, and there's $ 5.5 mil ( we're winning without him) and Dano at $ 1 mil --give him away for "nothing"

The "key" then will be if Trouba wants to stay here at "reasonable money"-like $ 6mil, and if not--then trade him. Problem will be solved with a little juggling.

If Trouba does want to stay -- then you'd have to let go Buff or Myers, or Mason. I think it may be time to say bye to Buff -- if the Jet's feel that Myer's body will hold up ?? and that's a very tough decision. There's no real answer for that !!!

If the Jet's feel that Myer's body will not hold up, then you have to let Myers go, and keep Buff.
 
Jun 15, 2013
5,559
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Winnipeg
_______________________________________________

You see Aavco - a couple of posts back I said, Toews and Kane were making 12.5 mil each and taking up about 1/3 of the Hawks cap space. I wasn't exactly right, but closer than you who "corrected me" saying they made only $ 10.5 mil each. Well if this list is right, we're both wrong and "both way over paid" at $ 13.8 mil

Why is Connor Mc David not on this list ??? - maybe last years list ???

No that's this years list. McDavid is currently making $925,000

His salary doesn't jump until next year. If you're a hockey fan interested in the salary side of the game your should have capfriendly.com favourited on your browser & you can easily look up that information yourself.

Edmonton Oilers - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps
 

Halberdier

Registered User
May 14, 2016
4,467
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_____________________________________________________

Without taking out my calculator -- I'd say just start with letting an aging Enstrom go, and there's $ 5.5 mil ( we're winning without him) ...

We are winning without Enström (though we had a losing streak without him too), but not because Enström is replaced with Chiarot. Thing is that if Enström goes, you will need some decent LHD to replace him. Someone not named Ben Chiarot, as he is not decent.
 
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GNP

Here Comes the Jets -look out hockey world !!!
Oct 11, 2016
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No that's this years list. McDavid is currently making $925,000

His salary doesn't jump until next year. If you're a hockey fan interested in the salary side of the game your should have capfriendly.com favourited on your browser & you can easily look up that information yourself.

Edmonton Oilers - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps
________________________________________________________

Yes - I see what your saying there Fonz-- just that I read McDavid signed a big contract for around $ 12 mil per year. Is that incorrect ??? I guess so, according to your post saying $ 925,000 -- unless his big money contract kicks in next year ??? or I have this totally wrong ??? I'll do some checking --thanks for that.
 
Jun 15, 2013
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Winnipeg
The Jets have ZERO worries of exceeding next years cap.

2018-2019 Jets currently have 21 million in cap space & that'll jump to 26 million with the cap increase. There's 8 players to sign that all remain RFA's. Other than Trouba & Hellebuyck, not one of these will exceed 3 million & half of these will be 1.5 million or less.

With that said, decisions made next year could have implications in the seasons after that. I'd elaborate further but that's not the topic of this thread.

The topic of this thread is cap implications at the end of this season.

Further there are no problems keeping this entire team intact next season. There should even be enough room to resign Enstrom providing he takes a pay cut on par with his current play level.

My major issue following this season is waiver eligibility. If the team is to be kept intact there would be a problem with resigning Hendricks, as Petan becomes waiver eligible. Another issue will be Roslovic, as in all likelihood he's making the team out of camp. A low level trade will have to occur otherwise Petan or Dano will be lost to waivers.
 
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________________________________________________________

Yes - I see what your saying there Fonz-- just that I read McDavid signed a big contract for around $ 12 mil per year. Is that incorrect ??? I guess so, according to your post saying $ 925,000 -- unless his big money contract kicks in next year ??? or I have this totally wrong ??? I'll do some checking --thanks for that.

Correct. It kicks in next year at $12.5 million until 2024.
 

10Ducky10

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Let's assume the cap goes up to 78.5m and then to 82m the following year. I will round numbers slightly.
Wheeler 5.6
Scheif 6.125
Laine 1.0
Littler 5.3
MP 4.125
Connor 1.0
Copp 1.0
Ehlers 6.0
Lowry 2.75
Armia 2.0
Lemieux 1.0
Roslo 1.0
Dano 1.0
Tanev 1.0

38.9m for forwards.

Buff 7.6
Kuli 4.33
Chiarot 1.4
Trouba 6.5
Poolman 1.0
Morrissey 5.75m
Enstrom 2.5

29.08m for D men.

Mason 4.1
Helle 4.5
8.6 for goalies.

76.58 or about 2m under but bonuses cap us out. Notice I don't have Myers on the team.

The next season...

Wheeler 6.5 (0.9 bump)
Connor 3.0 (2 bump)
Comrie (1 bump)
Laine 6.5(5.8 bump)
Copp 1
Lemieux 1.0
Niku 1.0
(replaces Chiarot for a -0.4 bump)
Comrie 1.0 (-3.1 bump)
cap increase 3.5

We are out just over 3m this season.
Did I do this right or am I missing someone or something?
 
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Lempo

Future Considerations Truther
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No that's this years list. McDavid is currently making $925,000

His salary doesn't jump until next year. If you're a hockey fan interested in the salary side of the game your should have capfriendly.com favourited on your browser & you can easily look up that information yourself.

Edmonton Oilers - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

But as a side note, you have to notice that high-drafted kids and certain special cases (=supreme KHL talents and Jimmy Vesey) have sizeable potential Schedule B Performance bonuses on their ELCs that don't appear on this team view but will count against the cap (and in case of an overage, will roll over to the next year). McDavid for example can be considered to be, barring injury, locked for $2.85M in total bonus in addition to his $925k base salary.

The Projected Cap Hit on the team view page takes these in consideration though, so the math won't add up if you just sum the base salaries listed there.
 
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Lempo

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Did I do this right or am I missing someone or something?

Laine's ELC counts against the cap with total force of $3.575M at this point. Ditto with all the ELC boys who have Schedule A bonuses agreed on. The potential bonuses count against cap in full until the moment when they have become impossible to attain (which doesn't really happen to any big extent until after Game 82). So, also Connor is missing $0.85M in your list.

But, Laine's and Connor's bump also won't be quite as high as (projected) $5.8M and $1M because of that.
 
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Jets 31

This Dude loves the Jets and GIF's
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Mar 3, 2015
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No one wants Buff at that price. We would have to give up a first just to get anyone to take him and his contract.
Man am i glad you're not Chevy , are you serious ? Chevy himself said that every team in the NHL would have tried to sign Buff if he went to free agency . You don't like Buff and that's fine but do you really think , i don't know , a team like Edmonton or Toronto or the Rangers , just to name a few , wouldn't kill for a defenseman like Buff ?
 
Jun 15, 2013
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Let's assume the cap goes up to 78.5m and then to 82m the following year. I will round numbers slightly.
Wheeler 5.6
Scheif 6.125
Laine 1.0
Little 5.3
MP 4.125
Connor 1.0
Copp 1.0
Ehlers 6.0
Lowry 2.75
Armia 2.0
Lemieux 1.0
Roslo 1.0
Dano 1.0
Tanev 1.0

38.9m for forwards.

Buff 7.6
Kuli 4.33
Chiarot 1.4
Trouba 6.5
Poolman 1.0
Morrissey 5.75m
Enstrom 2.5

29.08m for D men.

Mason 4.1
Helle 4.5
8.6 for goalies.

76.58 or about 2m under but bonuses cap us out. Notice I don't have Myers on the team.

Did I do this right or am I missing someone or something?

Lemieux & Roslovic are still under contract so let's go with their literal salaries in your projection for next year, but leave all the RFA & UFA contracts as you project for the time being.

Using exactly the numbers you quoted AND placing Myers back on the roster would give us a cap hit of $82,41,655 with another $3,912,500 in potential bonuses. If the cap goes to $80 million as projected your suggestions plus Myers have the Jets over the cap by $2,241,665 . Factor in potential bonuses of $3,912,500 & that's $6,154,165 over the projected cap.

It's no wonder you removed Myers. With that said the above is a 24 man man roster:

-lets begin by placing Lemieux back on the Moose so the roster is at 23. $839,167.00 taken away.

-despite Morrissey's play, I would suggest it's unrealistic to think Chevy would give him that kind of raise. Trouba's 2nd contract was a bridge deal paying him $2.5 million last season & $3.5 this season. Simply for the sake of argument lets assume Morrissey gets the same deal. $3.25 million taken away.

-Hellebuyck is having a hell of a year, but by comparison John Gibsons recent 2nd contract was $2.3 million & Matt Murray's even more recent 2nd contract was $3.75 million. I'll meet you halfway & say $3 million. $1.5 million taken away.

That shaves off $5,589,167 & gives us a cap hit of $76,652,498, well under the $80 million and still has Myers on the team.

Potential bonuses are a $3,712,500 which would at worst take the team $364,998 over the cap. Some minuscule adjustments to each of Lowry, Armia, Tanev & Poolman's new deals & we beat the cap even with bonuses factored in while still giving Trouba $6.5 million.

Granted bridge deals involving Morrissey & Hellebuyck could bite the team in the ass a few years down the road & perhaps buying UFA years now would have future benefit.
Screen Shot 2018-01-07 at 11.36.32 AM.png
 
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Stej

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Jul 28, 2006
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I really think a Morrissey bridge is a mistake. Take the opportunity to lock him up at something in the low 5’s for 7 or 8 years, IMO. He just strikes me as a cerebral player who will continue to improve and the comparables for him are really cap-friendly at this time.

Then you’ve got 3 young steals locked up long term with him, Scheifele, and Ehlers.

Obviously the to bridge or not to bridge debate comes down to a gamble on future progression.
 
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I really think a Morrissey bridge is a mistake. Take the opportunity to lock him up at something in the low 5’s for 7 or 8 years, IMO. He just strikes me as a cerebral player who will continue to improve and the comparables for him are really cap-friendly at this time.

Then you’ve got 3 young steals locked up long term with him, Scheifele, and Ehlers.

Obviously the to bridge or not to bridge debate comes down to a gamble on future progression.

I think locking up Morrissey is the right thing to do, but doing so may move up the timetable on other decisions.

Although I've previously stated the Jets have no cap concerns heading into next season, they certainly will feel an immediate pinch if they begin making long term commitments to all of Trouba, Morrissey, Hellebuyck, Lowry & Armia.

There needs to be a certain number of players than sign bridge deals
 
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Stej

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Jul 28, 2006
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I think locking up Morrissey is the right thing to do, but doing may move up the timetable on other decisions.

Although I've previously stated the Jets have no cap concerns heading into next season, they certainly will feel the pinch if they begin making long term commitments to all of Trouba, Morrissey, Hellebuyck, Lowry & Armia.

There needs to be a certain number of players than sign bridge deals

I agree there will be tough decisions and some may need to get bridged.
 

Adam da bomb

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May 1, 2016
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Let's assume the cap goes up to 78.5m and then to 82m the following year. I will round numbers slightly.
Wheeler 5.6
Scheif 6.125
Laine 1.0
Littler 5.3
MP 4.125
Connor 1.0
Copp 1.0
Ehlers 6.0
Lowry 2.75
Armia 2.0
Lemieux 1.0
Roslo 1.0
Dano 1.0
Tanev 1.0

38.9m for forwards.

Buff 7.6
Kuli 4.33
Chiarot 1.4
Trouba 6.5
Poolman 1.0
Morrissey 5.75m
Enstrom 2.5

29.08m for D men.

Mason 4.1
Helle 4.5
8.6 for goalies.

76.58 or about 2m under but bonuses cap us out. Notice I don't have Myers on the team.

The next season...

Wheeler 6.5 (0.9 bump)
Connor 3.0 (2 bump)
Comrie (1 bump)
Laine 6.5(5.8 bump)
Copp 1
Lemieux 1.0
Niku 1.0
(replaces Chiarot for a -0.4 bump)
Comrie 1.0 (-3.1 bump)
cap increase 3.5

We are out just over 3m this season.
Did I do this right or am I missing someone or something?
you can replace Dano with someone cheaper.
 

surixon

Registered User
Jul 12, 2003
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Winnipeg
Here is my two year cap projections:

20192020Estimated a 2.5% cap increase
Cap Ceiling 80,000 82,000
Forwards
Scheifele 6,130 6,130
Wheeler 5,600 7,500
Little 5,290 5,290
Perrault 4,130 4,130
Lowry 3,000 3,000
Copp 1,000 1,500
Laine 925 7,500
Armia 2,000 2,000
Connor 925 3,000
Ehlers 6,000 6,000
Roslovic 894 894
Tanev 850 850
Lemieux 839 1,000
Depth 1 800 800
Forward Total38,38349,594
Defense
Buff 7,600 7,600
Trouba 6,000 6,000
Morrissey 5,400 5,400
Kulikov 4,330 4,330
Toby 2,500 -
Poolman 1,300 1,300
Chariot 1,400
Niku 775
Depth 1,000
Defense total 28,530 26,405
Goalie
Helle 4,250 4,250
Mason 4,100 -
Comrie 800
Goalie total 8,350 5,050
Bonuses and BO
Rookie 3,500 500
Stuart BO 582
Bonuses and BO Total 4,082 500
Total Cap allocated 79,345 81,549
Cap space remaining 655451
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
Assumptions:
  • Trouba is willing to stay and signs a 5 year $30 million deal
  • Myers is traded sometime this coming summer for a 1st round pick and a prospect
  • Toby is brought back on a 1 year 2.5 million deal in order to act as a full time mentor for Poolman who will be on the team full time.
  • Lemieux and Roslovic make the team full time starting next season
  • My philosophy with depth players (Even very useful ones) is to go short term on their deals. If that means Armia or Copp walk as UFA when eligible then that is a risk I am willing to take as we will have Roslovic, Vasalinen, Foley, Lemieux, Appelton, Spacek etc waiting in the wings to take those spots.
Let me know your thoughts.

Edit:
As an aside it hasn't been that hard to fit people in, I think Chevy and his staff have done a fantastic job of managing the cap and staggering contracts.
 
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GNP

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I really think a Morrissey bridge is a mistake. Take the opportunity to lock him up at something in the low 5’s for 7 or 8 years, IMO. He just strikes me as a cerebral player who will continue to improve and the comparables for him are really cap-friendly at this time.

Then you’ve got 3 young steals locked up long term with him, Scheifele, and Ehlers.

Obviously the to bridge or not to bridge debate comes down to a gamble on future progression.
______________________________________________________

I agree with this --if Morrissey keeps on getting better and better, Chevy will regret not signing Josh - "long term"-- right now while he's cheap. This will guarantee us long term depth, and I'm certain Chevy will sign Morrissey long term, this off season.

This would give us Ehlers, Scheifele, and Morrissey at "very affordable" contracts, of which some clubs would pay close to double to sign guys like this. This will ensure the Jet's will have depth for a long time to come.

Note -- just look at the trouble the Hawks are in with Toews and Kane getting $ 13.8 mil each --that's like around $ 27 mil of cap space, "just for 2 guys"-- and look where they are right now because they've had to let good depth players go. Just 2 to 3 guys cannot carry the load in today's NHL -you need depth.
 
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surixon

Registered User
Jul 12, 2003
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Winnipeg
I think locking up Morrissey is the right thing to do, but doing so may move up the timetable on other decisions.

Although I've previously stated the Jets have no cap concerns heading into next season, they certainly will feel the pinch if they begin making long term commitments to all of Trouba, Morrissey, Hellebuyck, Lowry & Armia.

There needs to be a certain number of players than sign bridge deals

I think the solution is to go short term with your depth players. In another 2.5 years we should have players that can replace the Copp's and Armia's of the world as they become too expensive.
 

BigZ65

Registered User
Feb 2, 2010
12,355
5,319
Winnipeg
Mason will not be a Jet next season. The only thing to discuss cap wise with Mason going forward is whether the Jets have to eat salary (straight up or via a contract in trade) to move that contract. If Helle is playing 60 plus games there's no chance they have Mason on the bench at 4 plus.
 

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