F Alexis Lafreniere (2020, 1st, NYR) part 3

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nbwingsfan

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I cited a source. If that's not enough, its too bad. I don't memorize where I read everything to suit people who want to play dense. I also never tried to convince you about the strength of the draft. I argued a point you still haven't addressed, which is that the strength of the draft is a polarizing topic. Trying to debate me about the strength of the draft doesn't have anything to do with a discussion about how the draft is regarded, considering you and I are two fans that don't work inside the NHL. What do our opinions mean?

You didn’t cite anything, you just said “Pronman says some people don’t like the draft”. That’s just you making a statement. I can say “All NHL scouts have said it’s a great draft” and it’s just as reliable.

Also it’s not a polarizing draft when the vast majority of people say it’s a great looking draft. That’s just you enjoying to disagree, which seems to be a common trend for you.
 

Pavel Buchnevich

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Also it’s not a polarizing draft when the vast majority of people say it’s a great looking draft. That’s just you enjoying to disagree, which seems to be a common trend for you.

For the sake of debate, I'll take your argument at face value instead of being intentionally dishonest, why don't you prove that the vast majority of people say its a great looking draft?
 

CambieKev

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Here is a bit of extra footage of Alexis Lafreniere. This is a look at his performance on March 1, 2020 against the Moncton Wildcats.

 

LeProspector

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The Hockey News:
“Strong 2020 NHL draft class extends past first round talents”

Pierre Dorian:
“The top 20 is really outstanding, From what I’ve seen…there’s probably another drop off around 20 and from there I’d have to tell you from about 20 to 60 it’s a very good draft,” Dorion said. “It’s one of the better drafts, our scouts feel, in a long time and we’re fortunate enough to probably have six picks in the first 60 or so, or 65, so we feel we’re going to have a pretty good draft this year.”

Bob MacKenzie:
“Lafreniere leads loaded class in TSN hockey’s pre-season draft ranking”

This took me 2 minutes of looking.
 
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bert

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I’ll take the plunge

The Hockey News:
“Strong 2020 NHL draft class extends past first round talents”

Pierre Dorian:
“The top 20 is really outstanding, From what I’ve seen…there’s probably another drop off around 20 and from there I’d have to tell you from about 20 to 60 it’s a very good draft,” Dorion said. “It’s one of the better drafts, our scouts feel, in a long time and we’re fortunate enough to probably have six picks in the first 60 or so, or 65, so we feel we’re going to have a pretty good draft this year.”

Bob MacKenzie:
“Lafreniere leads loaded class in TSN hockey’s pre-season draft ranking”

This took me 2 minutes of looking.
Lol yeah its common knowledge. If people dont want to take the professionals opinion then just look at the amount of draft eligibles that not only played in the WJC but excelled. Then compare it to other years like say 2015. If that isnt enough look at how many players produced at historic rates in this draft season. But hey it's the internet so there is always room for a debate no matter how much evidence points to the contrary.
 

Pavel Buchnevich

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Lol yeah its common knowledge. If people dont want to take the professionals opinion then just look at the amount of draft eligibles that not only played in the WJC but excelled. Then compare it to other years like say 2015. If that isnt enough look at how many players produced at historic rates in this draft season. But hey it's the internet so there is always room for a debate no matter how much evidence points to the contrary.

Why don't you tag me?

You've now done this twice in the last few days where you angrily react against things I say in a passive-aggressive fashion by not directing it towards me, but obviously talking about me. I don't think the whole forum wants to hear your anger about me. People come here to discuss hockey. Please put me on ignore or stop. This is not a chatroom.

The poster you quoted didn't prove anything because it doesn't address the discussion, and of course you know that because you seem to remember the discussion we had very well. I suspect that person didn't read what was discussed, and scrolled through it. But it's still an open offer to you or anyone. Prove what I said was wrong. You had no interest in doing that, but you still want to get accusatory against me.
 

GlassesJacketShirt

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Just in case anyone forgot how he was the best player at the WJC by a huge margin, or is still harbouring doubts about him going first overall.

ETA: Also, what gives? Hughes and Kakko threads never left the first page last season. Is the lack of discussion because of the lack of competition?


Lafreniere has no real competition at this point. A select few prefer Byfield because of potential upside (a view I understand though disagree with), but that's about it.

Kakko and Hughes were close enough in relative performance pre-draft to cause a commotion.
 

bert

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Why don't you tag me?

You've now done this twice in the last few days where you angrily react against things I say in a passive-aggressive fashion by not directing it towards me, but obviously talking about me. I don't think the whole forum wants to hear your anger about me. People come here to discuss hockey. Please put me on ignore or stop. This is not a chatroom.

The poster you quoted didn't prove anything because it doesn't address the discussion, and of course you know that because you seem to remember the discussion we had very well. I suspect that person didn't read what was discussed, and scrolled through it. But it's still an open offer to you or anyone. Prove what I said was wrong. You had no interest in doing that, but you still want to get accusatory against me.
It wasnt just directed specifically at you, it was for everyone that keeps trying to push a narrative its not a strong draft. I am not angry about you in the slightest, I think you provide alot of great insight.

Its impossible to prove you wrong for certain as we are projecting players. However all the reasons @GoldenBright brought up along with what I had to say in the post you quoted are examples of why its strong.

The same amount of players played in the 2015 WJC as this season and players like Sanderson, Lundell, Rossi, Perfetti and Quinn didnt even participate. The draft eligibles that did play all played very well for the most part and 2015 was a very very strong draft.

For several years people have been talking about the strength of this draft, plus players are producing at an exceptional rate in this draft year.

@Draft Dynasty recently mentioned in his player break down of Jacob Perreault how most years he would be a top 10 pick this year he is slated to go 15 to 25. There are many many many credible sources that are on record of this being a strong draft.

At this point its on you to prove its not, the general concensus in the hockey world dissagrees.
 

Obvious Fabertism

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Here is a bit of extra footage of Alexis Lafreniere. This is a look at his performance on March 1, 2020 against the Moncton Wildcats.


Thanks for posting, always nice to see a full game, this one actually looked pretty ugly from a play standpoint, some of those passes and turnovers were real headscratchers, though he obviously had a positive impact. Still, must have been an off game, if that was my first look at him though I would think hes a big work in progress and was handled quite nicely by the opposing defenseman.
 

newfy

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Just in case anyone forgot how he was the best player at the WJC by a huge margin, or is still harbouring doubts about him going first overall.

ETA: Also, what gives? Hughes and Kakko threads never left the first page last season. Is the lack of discussion because of the lack of competition?


Man rwatching that video is awesome. That wasone of the more dominant tournaments I can remember for a while and he was draft eligible. His games against the States stand out the most. When the USA got a couple quick goals, Lafreniere came out and threw two big hits, McIsaac and Bahl threw a couple on the same shift/shortly after and momentum completely changed. I think Lafreniere went on to have 3 or 4 points including that sick game winner right off the faceoff after the USA tied it.

That game sealed him as a 1st overall in my eyes. Physical, leadership, puts the puck in the net and clutch. What else could you want in a first overall pick?
 

nbwingsfan

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Thanks for posting, always nice to see a full game, this one actually looked pretty ugly from a play standpoint, some of those passes and turnovers were real headscratchers, though he obviously had a positive impact. Still, must have been an off game, if that was my first look at him though I would think hes a big work in progress and was handled quite nicely by the opposing defenseman.

Moncton was probably the best team in the Q this year and definitely shut him down correctly. He does have a tendency to try and do too much on his own but I’m sure he will correct this.
 
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57special

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As a MN fan , was pleased to see how well Addison meshed with Lafreniere. Hopefully he can bring that skill with him to the NHL.
 

docbenton

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Thanks for posting, always nice to see a full game, this one actually looked pretty ugly from a play standpoint, some of those passes and turnovers were real headscratchers, though he obviously had a positive impact. Still, must have been an off game, if that was my first look at him though I would think hes a big work in progress and was handled quite nicely by the opposing defenseman.

I had a similar impression in the league games I watched, his impact was surprisingly not nearly as high as at the WJC. Some of that may be quality of teammates, but I do think the WJC performance might be overvalued with regard to Lafreniere being seen as clearly #1. I think he's going to be really good with no real weaknesses in his game, but I also think there's a reasonable chance other players develop into better assets down the road.
 

MBH

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Thanks for posting, always nice to see a full game, this one actually looked pretty ugly from a play standpoint, some of those passes and turnovers were real headscratchers, though he obviously had a positive impact. Still, must have been an off game, if that was my first look at him though I would think hes a big work in progress and was handled quite nicely by the opposing defenseman.

LOL.
I watched the same guy do a Byfield game.
And I saw a big fast kid just overmatching kids. I saw some heads up hockey from Byfield, too.
I wasn't unimpressed with him. But he definitely looked raw. Which is understandable for a 6'5 17-year old.

So I figured I'd watch the same guy do a Lafreniere video, the one above. I expected my impression of Lafreniere to be MUCH better than what I'd just seen.
And it wasn't.

While Lafreniere is clearly more polished than Byfield, (he should be, he's a year older and not growing into a gargantuan body), I really didn't think he was better.

I'm looking for more shift videos. But honestly, I can't say I'd take Lafreniere over Byfield if I'm Yzerman with the #1 pick.
 
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