HF Habs: Expansion Draft 2021 Part 6
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HostileCapSpace
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Yup. If they want a veteran backup for shorter term and money there are guys like Holtby out there who can do the job. I picked Driedger, Holtby and Vanecek in my mock draft -- all three combined are cheaper than Price. There are other goalies also available. Khakonen, etc. Allen would have been perfect.
@Habs Halifax : re. Drouin trade
pre-weber LTIR and I'd probably agree... but now? cap space isn't nearly as pressing for us, we'll have a hard time filling needs via UFA as it is. Drouin, if he's returning, i don't think has net-negative value, so sending away assets just to get more cap space doesn't make much sense to me in our current situation.
a trade for a similar player that is a "bad fit" in their team, but can address a need for us (ghost is a great example, Erik Johnson or Tarasenko are even better ones imo) makes more sense to me... especially if we can leverage our abundance of cap space to perhaps get a pick/prospect included by taking on a heavier cap hit.
pre-weber LTIR and I'd probably agree... but now? cap space isn't nearly as pressing for us, we'll have a hard time filling needs via UFA as it is. Drouin, if he's returning, i don't think has net-negative value, so sending away assets just to get more cap space doesn't make much sense to me in our current situation.
a trade for a similar player that is a "bad fit" in their team, but can address a need for us (ghost is a great example, Erik Johnson or Tarasenko are even better ones imo) makes more sense to me... especially if we can leverage our abundance of cap space to perhaps get a pick/prospect included by taking on a heavier cap hit.
This is what I wrote on the main board, I don't think they take Price but what's driving everything is based on the below
Francis had a quote that Cap Space was valuable and he wanted to keep it,
Francis had another quote that he'd ask for more depending on how valuable they viewed the player, we've all heard the average value for Francis was a 1st+3rd.
Francis likely valued Allen as that greater amount given the AAV, Term and Performance. Goalie at <$3MM who can play like a 1b in spurts and works best in a tandem. This is likely the driver of their expansion draft, targeting players overperforming their contracts who have value to the rest of the league.
Bergevin wants Drouin or Byron Selected, Byron for Cap relief, Drouin to help the player start again and cap relief, and hears more then a 1st or 3rd due to Allen's perceived value to Francis
Bergevin checks around to see if anyone would provide value to MTL for Allen and hears crickets, likely for the same reason Seattle wants him, he's only good in a tandem and teams with a starter realize that they end up in the same situation as the habs we're.
Bergevin then evaluates the market and realizes what he'd need to give up for a competent backup either in trade or free agency is high (either in AAV/ Term or assets and doesn't like that he doesn't know if they'll work in Montreal.
Bergevin hears from Price that he's seriously injured and he's willing to waive to help (likely because he's fine in either city), does the quick calculus of
Francis had a quote that Cap Space was valuable and he wanted to keep it,
Francis had another quote that he'd ask for more depending on how valuable they viewed the player, we've all heard the average value for Francis was a 1st+3rd.
Francis likely valued Allen as that greater amount given the AAV, Term and Performance. Goalie at <$3MM who can play like a 1b in spurts and works best in a tandem. This is likely the driver of their expansion draft, targeting players overperforming their contracts who have value to the rest of the league.
Bergevin wants Drouin or Byron Selected, Byron for Cap relief, Drouin to help the player start again and cap relief, and hears more then a 1st or 3rd due to Allen's perceived value to Francis
Bergevin checks around to see if anyone would provide value to MTL for Allen and hears crickets, likely for the same reason Seattle wants him, he's only good in a tandem and teams with a starter realize that they end up in the same situation as the habs we're.
Bergevin then evaluates the market and realizes what he'd need to give up for a competent backup either in trade or free agency is high (either in AAV/ Term or assets and doesn't like that he doesn't know if they'll work in Montreal.
Bergevin hears from Price that he's seriously injured and he's willing to waive to help (likely because he's fine in either city), does the quick calculus of
- Price injured and contract status makes him not as valuable to Francis
- Allen no longer available and exposes less valuable players (Kulak, Drouin, Fleury and Byron), this makes the ask from Francis potentially not as severe and gives more negotiating room to Berg now the ask to take dru isn't as high it's only a 1st (for arguments sake) or he just lets them have one of the above
- Downside, if Price is taken he will resign as GM shortly thereafter and allow a new GM to take over with a fully clean slate on the cap and a list of prospects and picks a mile long
- Upside, if Price isn't taken the team is in a good spot contractually with the weber contract likely off the books and needs some retooling but not a mountain of it to be competitive again, then he'll re-sign as GM likely for 3 years to close out Prices window and then retire from there.
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Habs Halifax
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Best cause I see is we play him with Danault and Gallagher for a full season and leave him there. However, I fear that whatever caused him to go on LTIR will happen again if he is with us next year. I do think management will try to find a new home for him. Fresh start
Even if he puts up 55 pts and 15 goals, he will still be targeted as a soft winger IMO.
If we can flip him for Tarasenko, I'm game for that!
Best case is he’s gone. Worst case is he’s still a hab in a couple of weeks. The Drouin experience is over. Problems or not , he’s been a massive disappointment. Add a 2nd and decent prospect. Just get rid of him
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
I would not go that high. Rather flip him for Ghost if I had to pay Seattle a 2nd and a decent prospect. I would grumble on two 3rd's but would offer a 3rd and a 4th. That's as far as I would go with Seattle. If they say no, I say go ahead and take Price or someone else then. Then we engage on other options
A 2nd and decent prospect is evidence of desperation and emotionally attached to getting rid of him no mater what. I don't support that kind of narrative.
salbutera
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@Burke the Legend re: Habs allocating $15M to goaltending
Habs have Suzuki, Caufield, KK, Romanov and potentially Poehling playing significant TOI at cheap cap hits. Seattle doesn’t have that option , no Karlsson, Marchessault, Tuch, Theodore available as it was for VGK
Habs have Suzuki, Caufield, KK, Romanov and potentially Poehling playing significant TOI at cheap cap hits. Seattle doesn’t have that option , no Karlsson, Marchessault, Tuch, Theodore available as it was for VGK
Man...........the drama on the main boards.
First, the habs drive everyone nuts because of their playoffs performance.......
Now, the Seattle expansion is not about Seattle, it's about the Habs!!
LOL
First, the habs drive everyone nuts because of their playoffs performance.......
Now, the Seattle expansion is not about Seattle, it's about the Habs!!
LOL
indeed... Drouin the hockey player has not been a total failure by any stretch. Yes, it was a terrible trade. Yes, he's underwhelming given how much talent/potential he "could" have if he competed harder or was more committed to his craft... but if we just accept what he is as a hockey player, he's still a very valuable middle-6 foward that contributes offensively to a degree that makes his cap hit not so egregious. As an asset, he remains something we should be leveraging for value, not discarding at all cost.
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
Agreed! Some people need to calm down with how low he has fallen. He's a slightly overpaid soft/skilled winger who can skate and has decent vision on the PP. Someone will consider him and Blues fans were talking about it last week. It's not like how some in our fan base thinks it is. Truth is in the middle somewhere.
Sorry, he is regressing......
2G and 20A in 45 games............Cory Perry scored 2 goals in one game this season....
JD has reinvented himself, as an even softer version of himself.....Sad...loads of talent, but nothing else.
He did though, help the TB Lightning, win 2 Cups.
well, he did take a LTIR for non-physical injury this past year, so not sure we can call this year's stats a sign of "regression".
last year he was at .59ppg overall, which is right on par with his career average, and it did seem like he was playing a bit better overall than he was in his first few seasons even if the scoring rate dropped a bit.
i'm no fan of his play nor do i have any issue with us moving him. i'm just suggesting that the emotions stay out of it and the asset be leveraged for as much value as possible... which i think is more than net negative.
HostileCapSpace
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Chris Drieger who according to Friedman will sign a 3x-3.5 million contract with Seattle is represented by Gerry Johansson, who is also Price's agent. There's been a rumour for a while that Seattle would sign him. Wonder if the "Price clan" and by extension MB were aware of this. Just speculating here. Allen would have been a great backup for Driedger.
Contracts by Agent | Puckpedia
Contracts by Agent | Puckpedia
Adam Michaels
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So Driedger set to be signed for 3 years at $3.5M.
I still maintain that they will select Holtby out of Vancouver, who has one more year left at $4.3M
As Friedman says, it doesn't mean the Driedger deal is confirmation they're not taking Price, but I do feel like they wouldn't commit to Driedger for that long and at that AAV so he can be a back up.
Because if they take Price, he's their starter. Even if he misses time next year, he will return at some point. And he's still got 5 years left at 10.5 AAV. And his NMC will travel with him so he ain't being moved unless he agrees to.
I still maintain that they will select Holtby out of Vancouver, who has one more year left at $4.3M
As Friedman says, it doesn't mean the Driedger deal is confirmation they're not taking Price, but I do feel like they wouldn't commit to Driedger for that long and at that AAV so he can be a back up.
Because if they take Price, he's their starter. Even if he misses time next year, he will return at some point. And he's still got 5 years left at 10.5 AAV. And his NMC will travel with him so he ain't being moved unless he agrees to.
1909
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1909
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Driedger and Price can easily split the # of games played in regular season. Price would become, though, THE Playoffs goalie.
A small soft perimeter winger. Yes he is that bad. Plus his wrist is f***ed. I think the has 3 goals total since he came back from his wrist surgery.
He’s not needed. If he’s not on LTIR then he should be bought out
Adam Michaels
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If they don't select Price, I have a feeling they'll take Kulak.
@Lafleurs Guy re: "No, it’s because we rely on him to a crazy extent. He just led us to the finals for Pete’s sake."
Not sure why you keep bringing up that he led us to the Finals...no one denying that.
But he's one player and the team will find a new identity after he's gone. They don't have to throw up the white flag and shut down shop.
Carey Price is not the only goalie in the world who can stop pucks
Not sure why you keep bringing up that he led us to the Finals...no one denying that.
But he's one player and the team will find a new identity after he's gone. They don't have to throw up the white flag and shut down shop.
Carey Price is not the only goalie in the world who can stop pucks
HostileCapSpace
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I really don't think they will take Price following this announcement. There's Khakonen, Venacek available, and if they want a veteran for one year there's Holtby, etc. Much smarter way to manage the cap for a new franchise.
Anyway, we'll see.
Adam Michaels
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HostileCapSpace
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I really think they wanted Allen as a backup, that's why they're angry and leaked stuff about Price to all the reporters. Allen's contract for the next two years is good for a veteran backup. They'll have to settle now for Kulak IMO, maybe Fleury, or they make a gamble on Drouin depending on what info they have.
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