Expansion After Seattle

[saskriders]

Simple question, what happens with alignment and expansion after Seattle joins the NHL?

Regarding alignment the simple solution is that one of Vegas or Arizona move to the central. However with Quebec and Houston both having arenas and plenty of fans it is easy to see the NHL expanding to the two cities. But 34 is only divisible by 2 and we would be back to uneven divisions. Would the NHL try and rectify that? Would they go to 36? Would they try and bring in 2 teams with Houston and Quebec? Would they try something more radical? Who would get these teams.


And now for my unrealistic pipe dream:

Northwest Division:

- Edmonton
- Calgary
- Vancouver
- Seattle Totems
- Portland Rosebuds (not sure on name)
- Vegas
- San Jose
- LA
- Anaheim
- Arizona



Central Division:

- Winnipeg
- Minnesota
- Wisconsin Somethings
- Chicago
- St. Louis
- Kansas City Scouts
- Colorado
- Nashville
- Dallas
- Houston Aeros


Atlantic Division:

- Ottawa
- Toronto
- Hamilton Tigers
- Montreal
- Montreal Maroons
- Quebec Nordiques
- Boston
- Buffalo
- Hartford Whalers
- Detroit

Metropolitan Division:

- Rangers
- Islanders
- New Jersey
- Philadelphia
- Pittsburgh
- Washington
- Carolina
- Florida
- Tampa Bay
- Columbus

Click to read more...

 

[Advanced stats]

No more expansion after Seattle.

 

[superdeluxe]

I think Expansion is on the back burner for a bit. Keep Houston/Quebec open for a failing franchise.

 

[End on a Hinote]

No more expansion. It will stay at 32 for the foreseeable future. Quebec will be getting a team through relocation. They have a new arena, and its quiet in Quebec. Too quiet.

 

[tony d]

It'll stay at 32 I figure for the next few yrs. at least. Houston and Quebec City probably get any team that relocates.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

how about no

 

[HisIceness]

After Seattle comes into the league I think we're done with expansion for at least 10 years if not more. Houston and QC will be back-up options in case worse comes to worse with a current market.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

the caveat to this thread as we've seen with Vegas, is what existing franchise in between starting the parent franchise and how many players can fill out the entire organizational structure, and the instability of existing franchises to be supplied by or affiliated with, as evidenced with the dissolution of Quad City as Vegas' entry-level affiliate....

then there's existing franchises namely Colorado's Eagles moving one team up to the next level from their current league....

 

[BattleBorn]

the caveat to this thread as we've seen with Vegas, is what existing franchise in between starting the parent franchise and how many players can fill out the entire organizational structure, and the instability of existing franchises to be supplied by or affiliated with, as evidenced with the dissolution of Quad City as Vegas' entry-level affiliate....

then there's existing franchises namely Colorado's Eagles moving one team up to the next level from their current league....

The Colorado Eagles have been an enigma forever. I was a Las Vegas Wranglers fan when they made the move to the ECHL and the fact that they've somehow parlayed that into an AHL franchise is insane to me.

However, it's important to recognize that what Colorado is doing has more to do with the fact that the AHL is finally recognizing that the western half of the country exists outside of California is more important to the whole thing than what the Eagles are doing in their specific market.

West coast cities were largely ignored after the fall of the IHL.

 

[gstommylee]

I think after seattle it comes to the question of who is gonna pay 650m+ for a franchise. Portland won't, houston probably won't quebec eh don't think so. Toronto (way way higher than 650m at minimal) KC no.

If NHL wants more than 32 teams, then the asking price would have to drop.

 

[PCSPounder]

I think after seattle it comes to the question of who is gonna pay 650m+ for a franchise. Portland won't, houston probably won't quebec eh don't think so. Toronto (way way higher than 650m at minimal) KC no.

If NHL wants more than 32 teams, then the asking price would have to drop.

If the asking price drops, owners would lose money on the deal. The TV revenue CANNOT be counted on to increase with the expansion. The NFL (of all leagues) lost money because they asked for too little from Carolina and Jacksonville all those years ago.

 

[gstommylee]

If the asking price drops, owners would lose money on the deal. The TV revenue CANNOT be counted on to increase with the expansion. The NFL (of all leagues) lost money because they asked for too little from Carolina and Jacksonville all those years ago.

That's the thing they have to drop the price if they want to go beyond 32 teams. So is it worth to them going beyond 32 teams when it means they have to drop the price.... No it won't to them.

 

[TheLegend]

Right now if anyone wants to pony up an arena and $650 million (US) the NHL will listen. Alignments and such be damned.

And for anyone who thinks they have to drop that price..... they’re dreaming. The current owners aren’t going to devalue themselves. In fact they’ll probably raise it to $700-800 million.

 

[gstommylee]

Right now if anyone wants to pony up an arena and $650 million (US) the NHL will listen. Alignments and such be damned.

And for anyone who thinks they have to drop that price..... they’re dreaming. The current owners aren’t going to devalue themselves. In fact they’ll probably raise it to $700-800 million.

Reminder the NHL only granted Vegas a team the last time the league expanded not Vegas and Quebec cause of alignment issues.

And guess what they aren't going to be more than 32 teams if the league keeps raising the price thats my point. It will probably be difficult for some current owners to even sell their teams if the prices is that ridiculously high.

The $$$ bubble on the cost of NHL teams will burst at some point and that burst bubble will hurt the league.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

You know, 32 seems like a very arbitrary number we are only used to because of NFL. There is no technical reason why NHL can’t expand beyond it.

 

[gstommylee]

You know, 32 seems like a very arbitrary number we are only used to because of NFL. There is no technical reason why NHL can’t expand beyond it.

One problem is the cost of the franchise. Seattle is probably going to be the last major market that doesn't have a team that will pay 650m. After that if the leagues want more teams than 32 the price will drop. They have to.

 

[StreetHawk]

Simple question, what happens with alignment and expansion after Seattle joins the NHL?

Regarding alignment the simple solution is that one of Vegas or Arizona move to the central. However with Quebec and Houston both having arenas and plenty of fans it is easy to see the NHL expanding to the two cities. But 34 is only divisible by 2 and we would be back to uneven divisions. Would the NHL try and rectify that? Would they go to 36? Would they try and bring in 2 teams with Houston and Quebec? Would they try something more radical? Who would get these teams.


And now for my unrealistic pipe dream:

Northwest Division:

- Edmonton
- Calgary
- Vancouver
- Seattle Totems
- Portland Rosebuds (not sure on name)
- Vegas
- San Jose
- LA
- Anaheim
- Arizona



Central Division:

- Winnipeg
- Minnesota
- Wisconsin Somethings
- Chicago
- St. Louis
- Kansas City Scouts
- Colorado
- Nashville
- Dallas
- Houston Aeros


Atlantic Division:

- Ottawa
- Toronto
- Hamilton Tigers
- Montreal
- Montreal Maroons
- Quebec Nordiques
- Boston
- Buffalo
- Hartford Whalers
- Detroit

Metropolitan Division:

- Rangers
- Islanders
- New Jersey
- Philadelphia
- Pittsburgh
- Washington
- Carolina
- Florida
- Tampa Bay
- Columbus

Not sure if you realize that Arizona doesn’t observe day light savings.

So from April until he end of October, Arizona is on pacific time. During the bulk of the regular season they are on mountain time.

So, does the nhl, which likely will stay with division playoffs want a pst zone team in the same division as 6 cst zone teams?

Cause they could move Colorado who is mst to thbe pacific division and shift both teams end and cal to ththe central.

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

- Wisconsin Somethings

Can't wait to buy Somethings merchandise.

 

[SabresSharks]

We're done at 32. No more expansion, please. Ever.

 

[TheLegend]

Reminder the NHL only granted Vegas a team the last time the league expanded not Vegas and Quebec cause of alignment issues.

And guess what they aren't going to be more than 32 teams if the league keeps raising the price thats my point. It will probably be difficult for some current owners to even sell their teams if the prices is that ridiculously high.

The $$$ bubble on the cost of NHL teams will burst at some point and that burst bubble will hurt the league.

Alignment was only one reason they gave for holding back on QC, Tommy. There was a lot more to it than that and you know it.

Bet ya anything the weak $CDN was their main concern (and Quebecor’s for that matter). Plus they didn’t know where the situation in Carolina was heading at that time.

Alignment is one of the weakest reasons for denying an expansion when you’ve got that much cash on the table.

 

[Fugu]

Alignment was only one reason they gave for holding back on QC, Tommy. There was a lot more to it than that and you know it.

Bet ya anything the weak $CDN was their main concern (and Quebecor’s for that matter). Plus they didn’t know where the situation in Carolina was heading at that time.

Alignment is one of the weakest reasons for denying an expansion when you’ve got that much cash on the table.

Yet I believe Jacobs et al. turned QC down because of alignment. They'd have to have three conferences if the added more teams than 32.

 

[gstommylee]

Alignment was only one reason they gave for holding back on QC, Tommy. There was a lot more to it than that and you know it.

Bet ya anything the weak $CDN was their main concern (and Quebecor’s for that matter). Plus they didn’t know where the situation in Carolina was heading at that time.

Alignment is one of the weakest reasons for denying an expansion when you’ve got that much cash on the table.

And where are you going to fit quebec? they aren't going 15/17 nor they are going to make blue jackets or red wings move to the western conference. They are on record saying it was alignment reasons as to why quebec didn't get a team.

 

[LeafalCrusader]

They'll stay at 32 for a while.

 

[gstommylee]

They'll stay at 32 for a while.

I don't see a scenario where they go beyond 32 as long as the price of expansion is extremely high.

 

[ponder719]

I fully expect they'll go past 32 eventually (my thought is that, by the 150th, we'll have 40 teams; we're probably a generation away from expansion to 36), but for the foreseeable future, we're at 32.