Confirmed with Link: Ethan Bear signs 2-year $2M AAV

CycloneSweep

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Sep 27, 2017
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The first story quoted did not support the claim that was made. The second story did.

To actually question people for support of unsubstantiated facts claimed is not 'odd' at all.



Glad you have been at it for over a decade. I asked a question about a comment on HFOil. With all people who provide information that isn't as widely distributed I ask for sources. When people provide sources they are acting in good faith. I don't care what the source is, but this was a good example of why sources matter.
I was talking more about the condescension part.
Someone directing you to where all the info you are asking for is, isn't condescension.

I don't know maybe if I'm a different breed but when someone makes a statement that is don't believe I'll ask for a source if I can't find the info in a 5 second Google search. It saves me and the other person a ton of time.
 

Tobias Kahun

Registered User
Oct 3, 2017
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He definitely started to struggle more later in the season. But I think he will be fine.

That said my hope is that Tippett doesn't lean heavy on him and Nurse. Last year they were the highest event pairing in the NHL on both ends of the ice and that's very risky. Were on the ice for lots of goals for and just as many goals against. Hopefully spreading their icetime out a bit more will allow them to clean up in their own end a bit more
Not having benning required to be sheltered at 12 minutes a game will help. Barrie has proven he can take 20+. That alone should help
 
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oiLowe

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Jan 14, 2009
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Thank you for the condescension. There is a reason why I don't go to other boards when ordered to do so. You are on the Oilers board making a comment you deem germaine to this board. Yes, this was condescending.


Thank you for doing the right thing, despite the condescension. This story only says the NHL is looking for more money. Had this been the only story you quoted then I would have known you were talking out of your butt.

The second story actually talks about NBC and ESPN potentially bidding against each others.

Yes, there was a legitimate reason to ask you to provide your sources. Had it just been the first story then I would have known you were just pulling stuff out of thin air without real support.

You are new here but you will learn Fourier provides some of most valuable information on this board. I think you should consider the source before calling out a veteran poster. Just some friendly advice.
 

CycloneSweep

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Sep 27, 2017
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Not having benning required to be sheltered at 12 minutes a game will help. Barrie has proven he can take 20+. That alone should help
Fingers crossed. All 3 right shot D we have, have had some success in the top pairing and have proven they can play those minutes. Larsson and Barrie have a bit of question makes if they still can. I'm much more worried about the left side. We have Nurse, 3rd pair Russell and a bunch of pure question marks.
 

Fourier

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Dec 29, 2006
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The first story quoted did not support the claim that was made. The second story did.

To actually question people for support of unsubstantiated facts claimed is not 'odd' at all.



Glad you have been at it for over a decade. I asked a question about a comment on HFOil. With all people who provide information that isn't as widely distributed I ask for sources. When people provide sources they are acting in good faith. I don't care what the source is, but this was a good example of why sources matter.
My response was also in good faith but you decided otherwise. Many people here have legitimate interest in cap related isssues. So I recommend the Business Board becuase it is the best source of information I know of. It is also by far and away the easiest place to find information that people on this board might care about. You seem to think that pointing this out is condescending.

As far as the first reference was concerned: The title of the story is Forbes Expect TV Rights for Sports to Soar...They then go on to talk about a looming rights battle between ESPN and NBC which is further outlined in the last reference. Moreoer within the story they write:

NBC would prefer to keep exclusive rights to the NHL but other networks are interested which will drive up the price. It has been reported NBC has the right of first refusal.
This is context to support the quote I gave you from John Ourand and the suggestion that I made to theother poster that the cap would be expected to rise. . That quote itself came from a post in the thread:
NHL could split media rights in next deal

on the Business Board. If you want a more detailed discussion of why the US TV deal is likley to be at least twice its current number that thread and others like it are a good place to look. If you don't want to do so that's fine.
 

shoop

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Jul 6, 2008
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Edmonton
I was talking more about the condescension part.
Someone directing you to where all the info you are asking for is, isn't condescension.

I asked him to provide the information. If the only thing you provided is to go digging through another forum is absolutely condescension. He did the right thing by providing links, which I thanked him for.

You are new here but you will learn Fourier provides some of most valuable information on this board. I think you should consider the source before calling out a veteran poster. Just some friendly advice.

Not friendly at all. Absolutely condescending.

I was a member here for a long time and got banned when all the insanity went down on the politics board after the 2016 US election. I didn't really care to come back, so I stayed away for three years or so. Then pandemic.

fwiw I have never seen anyone on HFOil try that friendly advice to the rookie bullshit ... get outta here with that.
 

shoop

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Edmonton
My response was also in good faith but you decided otherwise.

I have already said you did the right thing in providing the links, which I thanked you for.

You seem to think that pointing this out is condescending.

As I said earlier in the thread, if you had just pointed it out then yes it would have been condescension. But you did provide the links, which I thanked you for and already said was a good thing.

They then go on to talk about a looming rights battle between ESPN and NBC which is further outlined in the last reference.

Hmmm. Both what you said about the first reference and what I said are correct.

That quote itself came from a post in the thread:

I have no interest in going to that board. You gave enough information in the second reference. I thank you again for providing that reference.

If you don't want to do so that's fine.

Thank you for telling me it is ok to not look at another reference.
 

joestevens29

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Apr 30, 2009
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Hopefully hes improved his speed a bit this offseason, hes Benning slow out there last year.
He worked hard last off-season and changed the way he worked out. Hopefully he kept that same attitude and worked with someone on that first step.
 

AddyTheWrath

Registered User
Mar 24, 2015
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Toronto
I asked him to provide the information. If the only thing you provided is to go digging through another forum is absolutely condescension. He did the right thing by providing links, which I thanked him for.



Not friendly at all. Absolutely condescending.

I was a member here for a long time and got banned when all the insanity went down on the politics board after the 2016 US election. I didn't really care to come back, so I stayed away for three years or so. Then pandemic.

fwiw I have never seen anyone on HFOil try that friendly advice to the rookie bullshit ... get outta here with that.
I don’t think you understand what condescending means.
 
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shoop

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I like this contract and deal, I like bear, I love lamp, and this is about as good as Holland could do with this with being cap strung. Couldn't go longer if he wanted to.

A three year deal would have taken him to the end of being an RFA. Don't teams try and avoid that? Either leave a year left as an RFA like Holland did with this contract or 'buy' a year of UFA time which they did with Nurse I believe.
 

Llamamoto

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Sep 5, 2018
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I am actually surprised it’s that high in this economy. Guys like Hamonic, proven NHL top 4 vet, will likely sign for less. Not that I’m not happy with the deal, just thought at this time it would be less. Dermott, more NHL experience, took his QO at what 900K? Deangelo signed a 1 year 925 last offseason, similar circumstance in that he just needed to prove he could hold course.

The good thing about the deal is if Bear continues to impress your getting him relatively cheap for the second year. I just have my reservations when you look at all the Oiler D who look good for a season just to fizzle out, Gilbert, Davidson, Marincin, Benning though he looked better this past year. Oiler fans have a tendency of pumping a young lesser known D mans tires just for him to become the whipping boy the following year.

Hamonic's a 4/5 at this point, Bear is a much better player. Dermott has more NHL experience but he hasn't played top-4 minutes, let alone top pairing minutes.
 

CycloneSweep

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Sep 27, 2017
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I am actually surprised it’s that high in this economy. Guys like Hamonic, proven NHL top 4 vet, will likely sign for less. Not that I’m not happy with the deal, just thought at this time it would be less. Dermott, more NHL experience, took his QO at what 900K? Deangelo signed a 1 year 925 last offseason, similar circumstance in that he just needed to prove he could hold course.

The good thing about the deal is if Bear continues to impress your getting him relatively cheap for the second year. I just have my reservations when you look at all the Oiler D who look good for a season just to fizzle out, Gilbert, Davidson, Marincin, Benning though he looked better this past year. Oiler fans have a tendency of pumping a young lesser known D mans tires just for him to become the whipping boy the following year.
You also have to look at contract status and market.

In this current market teams have the upper hand with UFAs entirely. With RFAs teams still have the upper hand, but far less and keeping that player happy to keep the relationship good for the next contract negotiations are super important.
 
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Tobias Kahun

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Oct 3, 2017
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I am actually surprised it’s that high in this economy. Guys like Hamonic, proven NHL top 4 vet, will likely sign for less. Not that I’m not happy with the deal, just thought at this time it would be less. Dermott, more NHL experience, took his QO at what 900K? Deangelo signed a 1 year 925 last offseason, similar circumstance in that he just needed to prove he could hold course.

The good thing about the deal is if Bear continues to impress your getting him relatively cheap for the second year. I just have my reservations when you look at all the Oiler D who look good for a season just to fizzle out, Gilbert, Davidson, Marincin, Benning though he looked better this past year. Oiler fans have a tendency of pumping a young lesser known D mans tires just for him to become the whipping boy the following year.
More NHL experience =/ better NHL player.
 

MessierII

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Aug 10, 2011
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AA had 30 goals in the nhl. Had a 3m? Qualifying offer as a supposedly much more established nhler. We traded 2 second round picks for him (foolish imo but hypothetically worth it if everything went perfect).

Bear was a 4th rounder with one full success season under his belt and his QO will be around 2.5.

When you can get AA and Turris for under 2 mill and you set up Bear to make minimum 2.5ish on his next contract...

It's all relative perspective in the current environment.

Bear is unproven and paid more than some seriously solid vets...

Everyone is entitled to their opinions but the math suggests Bear is being paid extremely well in the current market. I was half expecting a 1 year 1 mill contract. A show me at least one more year while the flat cap curbs contracts.

Instead Bear and his agent are positioned extremely well to capitalize on a big second RFA deal with more bargaining rights, a rumored lucrative new TV deal, and hopefully a non covid/flat cap environment...

Bear, if he improves somewhat as is at least reasonable, did not sign a team friendly deal in anyway shape or form. He and his agent did exceptionally well versus Holland in an environment and RFA status that gave him no bargaining power.

This suggests the organization is extremely high on Bear and are rewarding him as such.

Jones for example got how much again?
Jones hasn’t even established himself as an nhl player. Bear played the most minutes of any nhl rookie with almost no PP time. That’s veteran top 4 defensive D man minutes and thrived.
 
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Drivesaitl

Time to Drive
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A three year deal would have taken him to the end of being an RFA. Don't teams try and avoid that? Either leave a year left as an RFA like Holland did with this contract or 'buy' a year of UFA time which they did with Nurse I believe.

By no means am I a capologist. Just figured that more years would mean more dollars per year in contract taking into account entering into RFA years or prime earning years.
 

KMart27

Registered User
Jun 9, 2013
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A three year deal would have taken him to the end of being an RFA. Don't teams try and avoid that? Either leave a year left as an RFA like Holland did with this contract or 'buy' a year of UFA time which they did with Nurse I believe.

A three year contract he still would have been an RFA.
 

tabs

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Oct 30, 2009
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A three year deal would have taken him to the end of being an RFA. Don't teams try and avoid that? Either leave a year left as an RFA like Holland did with this contract or 'buy' a year of UFA time which they did with Nurse I believe.
I believe that’s four years. Holland offered Bear a three year option as well but looks like Bear decided two year was the best fit right now.
 

Fourier

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Dec 29, 2006
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Waterloo Ontario
A three year deal would have taken him to the end of being an RFA. Don't teams try and avoid that? Either leave a year left as an RFA like Holland did with this contract or 'buy' a year of UFA time which they did with Nurse I believe.

Bear turns 27 in June of 2024. This deal leaves him with two years left as an RFA so even a three year deal would have still left the team with control. But I think both parties would be happy with this term. It gives the team certainty next year and lets Bear get his next deal at a point where the cap may be more favourable.
 

Fourier

Registered User
Dec 29, 2006
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Waterloo Ontario
By no means am I a capologist. Just figured that more years would mean more dollars per year in contract taking into account entering into RFA years or prime earning years.
I think two years is pretty much teh sweet spot for both sides. I agree that a three year deal may have been a bigger number.
 

shoop

Registered User
Jul 6, 2008
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Edmonton
But I think both parties would be happy with this term. It gives the team certainty next year and lets Bear get his next deal at a point where the cap may be more favourable.

I would agree with that. I think the second year was especially important for the team. Now Bear, Jones and Nurse are signed for 21-22. That extra piece of security makes things easier for Holland going forward.
 

LTIR

Registered User
Nov 8, 2013
25,851
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AA had 30 goals in the nhl. Had a 3m? Qualifying offer as a supposedly much more established nhler. We traded 2 second round picks for him (foolish imo but hypothetically worth it if everything went perfect).

Bear was a 4th rounder with one full success season under his belt and his QO will be around 2.5.

When you can get AA and Turris for under 2 mill and you set up Bear to make minimum 2.5ish on his next contract...

It's all relative perspective in the current environment.

Bear is unproven and paid more than some seriously solid vets...

Everyone is entitled to their opinions but the math suggests Bear is being paid extremely well in the current market. I was half expecting a 1 year 1 mill contract. A show me at least one more year while the flat cap curbs contracts.

Instead Bear and his agent are positioned extremely well to capitalize on a big second RFA deal with more bargaining rights, a rumored lucrative new TV deal, and hopefully a non covid/flat cap environment...

Bear, if he improves somewhat as is at least reasonable, did not sign a team friendly deal in anyway shape or form. He and his agent did exceptionally well versus Holland in an environment and RFA status that gave him no bargaining power.

This suggests the organization is extremely high on Bear and are rewarding him as such.

Jones for example got how much again?
No matter how you spin it, Bear making 1.5M this season and 2.5M next is a steal.
Who cares what his QO would be after 2 seasons. We can walk away from it ala AA if he crashes and burns. He could very well be looking at a 6M+ x 6yr deal if he continues to play ahead of Larsson/Barrie/Bouchard and on par with Nurse.

For Oilers' Ethan Bear, focus remains on winning after signing contract
 
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