have to consider the injuries considering Singer and Fowler are both “expected” back this weekend
Erie Otters 2019-20 Season Thread
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have to consider the injuries considering Singer and Fowler are both “expected” back this weekend
ohloutsider
Registered User
Former 5th round pick who I thought had a shot to make the team this year. Too crowded on defense and they ultimately went and signed Morton
Good luck to Ethan though. I always liked him as a prospect
Good call to EON on splitting up Golod/Yetman
let’s see if this group can finally stick for more than a game or 2
Fowler - Yetman - Singer
DAmato - Swankler - Golod
Sproule - Lockhart - Sellan
Sedore - Cohen - Hoffmann
Would like to see Hoffmann on the 3rd line but I can’t argue with the balance. Curious about the powerplay units though. Really don’t want to see Lockhart on PP1 or Sellan on any unit
let’s see if this group can finally stick for more than a game or 2
Fowler - Yetman - Singer
DAmato - Swankler - Golod
Sproule - Lockhart - Sellan
Sedore - Cohen - Hoffmann
Would like to see Hoffmann on the 3rd line but I can’t argue with the balance. Curious about the powerplay units though. Really don’t want to see Lockhart on PP1 or Sellan on any unit
nofriendsinhockey
Registered User
- Aug 31, 2018
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When you lose 4-2 and score both of your goals on the PP.. what do you expect??
Saginaw is a very good team and I didn’t expect them to win. They missed some chances in the game but at least Murphy continues to play strong. Guys like Sproule and Hoffmann need to be better offensively. Overall though I think the coaching staff is very average (at best) and it will continue to hold the team back unfortunately
Kingston tomorrow night should be a better night
A lot of players looked off tonight. The 4th line was pretty bad all -3. I felt like, even though Drysdale assisted twice, something was off with him too.
Murphy had a great game all things considered and Golod played really well. I felt Luke was pretty solid too. We came out pretty strong but seemed to just go through the motions until the middle/end of the 3rd period but by then it was too late.
It wasn't like we played really bad, we just seemed flat and they capitalized.
Another positive was the penalty kill and power play were pretty decent again.
Murphy had a great game all things considered and Golod played really well. I felt Luke was pretty solid too. We came out pretty strong but seemed to just go through the motions until the middle/end of the 3rd period but by then it was too late.
It wasn't like we played really bad, we just seemed flat and they capitalized.
Another positive was the penalty kill and power play were pretty decent again.
The whole team was flat and not sure how you call out 2 players that were on 3rd and 4th line, and did not start the pp. The only 2 goals came on pp by Golod and 1 was a 5 on 3, although Golod did have a great 2nd goal.
The coach seems to favour some players over others with less talent, so I hope he smartens up or maybe the Otters go 3 years without making the playoffs.
My issue with the coaching staff right now is partly related to just that. I see certain guys getting major opportunities and their talent level is not quite there. Then I see others given a lesser role when they have shown some good things in the past
for instance, Hoffmann is a big boy forward on a forward group with limited size. I felt in the first weekend and at least somewhat in the second weekend (didn’t watch every game to know) he has been using his body and working hard. The production hasn’t been there much like
Sproule but he has the talent. Yet tonight he’s on the fourth line with 2 rookies..
I’m not signaling out those 2 in regards to tonight but more just our offense and coaching overall. Our offense is inconsistent and in my view it is related to the weird lineups and special team units
Sproule/Hoffmann NEED to be producing more. Fowler / Singer have missed a few games yet have more going for them offensively. Golod / Yetman / Swankler all have been good
So what can we do to get our offense going? Oh idk, how about creating a lineup that benefits players like Hoffmann/Sproule
EON spoke on it yesterday when he said that Golod/Swankler should be paired with Hoffmann and Yetman with Sproule. That is the stuff I’m referring too. I don’t fully blame certain guys who aren’t producing but more feel their opportunities have been limited. Sproule/Hoffmann have the talent to be top 9 players or even top 6 players for us. And we absolutely need them to be this season and going forward with our team. Both are losing confidence when you have them on a line with:
Sellan / Lockhart (Sproule)
Cohen / Sedore (Hoffmann)
I will also add to my above comment how the lineups in the opening week seemed to work. Then we got injuries. I’m not sure why we didn’t at least keep some of them consistent
I agree that D’Amato has looked good in the early going but his ceiling is not as high as say a guy like Sproule. And it’s still early October .. we can’t possibly “give up” on Sproule and bury him right now. How do you expect him to all the sudden start producing when you now move him with lesser talents?
77 - 21 - 91
93 - 29 - 14
17 - 73 - 61
That is way more balanced of a lineup. You can swap Fowler and Singer if you would like. But either way, I see REAL balance. Hartsburg is more concerned though with trying to make 4 “solid” lines and as a result we are left with some imbalance. Can we just have 3 more respectable lines and let the 4th line be for those with current 4th line talent?? Or our we just going to keep experimenting and tomorrow see Cohen on the 2nd line and Singer on the 4th..
I agree that D’Amato has looked good in the early going but his ceiling is not as high as say a guy like Sproule. And it’s still early October .. we can’t possibly “give up” on Sproule and bury him right now. How do you expect him to all the sudden start producing when you now move him with lesser talents?
77 - 21 - 91
93 - 29 - 14
17 - 73 - 61
That is way more balanced of a lineup. You can swap Fowler and Singer if you would like. But either way, I see REAL balance. Hartsburg is more concerned though with trying to make 4 “solid” lines and as a result we are left with some imbalance. Can we just have 3 more respectable lines and let the 4th line be for those with current 4th line talent?? Or our we just going to keep experimenting and tomorrow see Cohen on the 2nd line and Singer on the 4th..
Great points. I agree with what you are saying, especially with: "I see certain guys getting major opportunities and their talent level is not quite there", plus many other good points.
I also don't think having guys like Hoffmann and Sproule down in the line up is great. They have both highly produced when given better opportunities such as various times last year. I see their points are minimum this year so far, but have seen them playing well for the 4 games I have seen so far (2 live and 2 on tv), and the points will come but need better opportunities.
Guys who continually play on #1 PP should have a lot of points. The only guys I see as locks on PP1 would be Drysdale, Golod, Yetman. The remaining 2 spots are up in the air and don't feel the various people who the coach continues to play on their have really deserved/earned those spots.
I do think there are a lot of good players (so much more depth) this year, and I am sure very tough on who sits each game (when all healthy) so hopefully this will push everyone.
I also don't think having guys like Hoffmann and Sproule down in the line up is great. They have both highly produced when given better opportunities such as various times last year. I see their points are minimum this year so far, but have seen them playing well for the 4 games I have seen so far (2 live and 2 on tv), and the points will come but need better opportunities.
Guys who continually play on #1 PP should have a lot of points. The only guys I see as locks on PP1 would be Drysdale, Golod, Yetman. The remaining 2 spots are up in the air and don't feel the various people who the coach continues to play on their have really deserved/earned those spots.
I do think there are a lot of good players (so much more depth) this year, and I am sure very tough on who sits each game (when all healthy) so hopefully this will push everyone.
Coaches and GM trying new combos to see who is in for the long haul.
Kids that are working hard and creating and playing 200' game are getting rewarded by coach. It shows in the Pk.
Hartsburg gives kids chances and rolls 4 lines most of the time and if you are moving down the lineup, there must be a reason.
Also, this team really only has 2 top 6 skilled forwards, maybe. They have average talent depth and the hard workers will separate themselves from the rest, in the eyes of the coaches. JMO
So far the only kids that deserve top 6 time (barring injured players) is 77,29,21,73 and 17.
Kids that are working hard and creating and playing 200' game are getting rewarded by coach. It shows in the Pk.
Hartsburg gives kids chances and rolls 4 lines most of the time and if you are moving down the lineup, there must be a reason.
Also, this team really only has 2 top 6 skilled forwards, maybe. They have average talent depth and the hard workers will separate themselves from the rest, in the eyes of the coaches. JMO
So far the only kids that deserve top 6 time (barring injured players) is 77,29,21,73 and 17.
Lockhart deserves it more than guys like Sproule or Hoffmann?
you are nuts if you think that
I understand shuffling lines but I’ve seen Golod stand around when opposing teams have the puck/score. Yet he plays top minutes because he’s really good offensively. Almost every single player on this team is inconsistent with their defensive effort (again because of coaching) and yet some guys are “punished” for it and others are “rewarded” for it
Lockhart will be a great player for us down the line but he is not close to ready for consistent top 6 minutes/PP time right now. Playing him there is only going to limit current team success. For me, as a fan, if this team doesn’t get to reasonable amount of wins/make the playoffs - I am going to stop investing my money in them. But actually it might be the best thing so that the organization can be left with no choice but to move on from the current coaching staff.. because right now I don’t think Hartsburg is close to capable of leading any team to a championship
Lol well I’m sad to say I predicted the same crap, different night stuff from Hartsburg
we will continue to have 4 lines with “balance” but no lines with legit talent, which will continue to lead to inconsistent offense. We will also continue to see yet another game with the lines different from the previous game. Great way to create chemistry!!
starting to wonder if Hartsburg just has fun mixing and matching lines like us fans do. He must love the white board and markers where he can eraser and flip flop lines every night
tonight’s lineup:
Sproule - Yetman - Cohen (why?? What has Cohen done?)
Sellan - Swankler - Golod (Sellan??)
Fowler - DAmato - Hoffmann (Fowler punished now?)
Sedore - Lockhart - Singer (let’s waste an OA spot on the 4th line. Singer at least has shown 25+ goal potential in this league and has good offensive skills but 4th line it is!)
I’m over the Hartsburg experiment. The coach seems clueless
I agree the lines were...well quite odd. My only thought was he knew we were going to win and was experimenting.
On the plus side, out of a few "rookie" mistakes Campbell looked really solid.
Max is on a tear...
And this team has a few people who can lose their cool pretty quickly. Yes, I understand some was warranted.
I would be okay with experimenting a bit but with the lines tonight, there is no chance the offense with these lines would consistently create against better teams. So what’s the point? The Western conference is once again a lot (A LOT ) stronger than the East. Add too it that the Midwest is super strong yet again. We have a tough schedule. Our offense can’t be good if we don’t rely more on guys like Singer
as for Campbell, so far the hype is warranted.. he’s been very good. If this continues, he will surely get split action with Murphy and be the #1 guy next year
for the disciplined play: again I blame that on coaching. Was never an issue with a Knoblauch here. That said, look around the league.. there have been 5/6 big name guys getting lengthy suspensions. We have no suspensions yet and for the most part we avoid the dirty hits or cheap shots.
Another thing of note, our PK is now leading the league at 91%
I don’t expect that to maintain but way better than last year even if we can just be around 86%
I don’t expect that to maintain but way better than last year even if we can just be around 86%
Well the bizarro lines worked somehow. Part of that is likely due to Kingston not being particularly good. Golod has looked superb offensively thus far this season. I honestly wouldn't be shocked if he's gone next season if he keeps this up.
I don't like what Hartsburg is doing with the lines and I'm not convinced this team is as good 5v5 as they could be. Yes, they don't have a bonafide superstar up front. But Golod/Yetman have both developed into high end guys, Swankler/Fowler are legit top 6 players/PPG guys, and Sproule/Hoffmann are borderline top 6 I think. They have better depth this season as well.
To the coaching staff's credit though, the special teams have been much better, especially the PK. The PP has gone from 18.4% to 25.0%, and the PK has gone from 67.6% (!!!!!) to 91.0%. That will keep them in most games.
The goaltending has been great this season as well. Murphy has played really well and his numbers are dragged down by being hung out to dry in that London game. And Campbell has been great these last two starts.
This team is 100% a playoff team this season, how much better than that depends on becoming more consistent 5v5 imo.
I don't like what Hartsburg is doing with the lines and I'm not convinced this team is as good 5v5 as they could be. Yes, they don't have a bonafide superstar up front. But Golod/Yetman have both developed into high end guys, Swankler/Fowler are legit top 6 players/PPG guys, and Sproule/Hoffmann are borderline top 6 I think. They have better depth this season as well.
To the coaching staff's credit though, the special teams have been much better, especially the PK. The PP has gone from 18.4% to 25.0%, and the PK has gone from 67.6% (!!!!!) to 91.0%. That will keep them in most games.
The goaltending has been great this season as well. Murphy has played really well and his numbers are dragged down by being hung out to dry in that London game. And Campbell has been great these last two starts.
This team is 100% a playoff team this season, how much better than that depends on becoming more consistent 5v5 imo.
Though I agree with Golod off to a great start, let’s calm down with it just a bit
If his pace continues he will reach 120+ points and that’s just not happening for him or for this team. Let’s also see if he can finish an entire season as in the past some injury concerns have crept up. Maybe he can reach 90ish points but he should be back next year as an undrafted guy.
as of now? 99% chance he has back next year. He will need to maintain top end play all year long to even get a pro look, let alone a contract. Even a contract didn’t stop someone like Kyle McLean from returning for his OA season
If his pace continues he will reach 120+ points and that’s just not happening for him or for this team. Let’s also see if he can finish an entire season as in the past some injury concerns have crept up. Maybe he can reach 90ish points but he should be back next year as an undrafted guy.
as of now? 99% chance he has back next year. He will need to maintain top end play all year long to even get a pro look, let alone a contract. Even a contract didn’t stop someone like Kyle McLean from returning for his OA season
As for the lines shuffling,
I totally agree with EON and our 5 on 5 play
The special teams and goalie play has saved us. But no question the 5 on 5 play should be better. I understand we don’t have a true superstar but I still think there are 3/4 guys that are near PPG or better players (Golod, Yetman, Swankler, Fowler). There are another 2/3 guys (Sproule, Singer, Hoffmann) who imo are at least 40+ point players. Then there are another 2/3 guys (DAmato, Lockhart, Cohen) who could be 30+ point players. Those are good options and depth to create offense. Plus MacDougall will be returning soon to add to it
Personally I want to see Swankler to continue to get work with Golod. And would love to see Fowler get time with Yetman. That leaves Singer, Sproule, Hoffmann to fill the remaining 2 spots. DAmato should be left to the 3rd line. He is a good 3rd liner but you start matching him up with top 2 line guys and his ceiling is limited..
I totally agree with EON and our 5 on 5 play
The special teams and goalie play has saved us. But no question the 5 on 5 play should be better. I understand we don’t have a true superstar but I still think there are 3/4 guys that are near PPG or better players (Golod, Yetman, Swankler, Fowler). There are another 2/3 guys (Sproule, Singer, Hoffmann) who imo are at least 40+ point players. Then there are another 2/3 guys (DAmato, Lockhart, Cohen) who could be 30+ point players. Those are good options and depth to create offense. Plus MacDougall will be returning soon to add to it
Personally I want to see Swankler to continue to get work with Golod. And would love to see Fowler get time with Yetman. That leaves Singer, Sproule, Hoffmann to fill the remaining 2 spots. DAmato should be left to the 3rd line. He is a good 3rd liner but you start matching him up with top 2 line guys and his ceiling is limited..
Given that Morton appears to be the weakest link on Defense. Do you all think it was wise to keep him up or are we regretting releasing Martin?
The -5 is a red flag. I realize he is young and needs to progress, the injury to Kish hurts in the short term, but I almost feel like we should have kept Martin and called up Morton when necessary but give him a year to develop.
The -5 is a red flag. I realize he is young and needs to progress, the injury to Kish hurts in the short term, but I almost feel like we should have kept Martin and called up Morton when necessary but give him a year to develop.
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This year Erie should be a playoff team no matter which team they roster.
I think its imperative to develop your players for a serious run next year, given that some of your best offensive and defensive players are 2000s and Drysdale may be gone after his 3rd year. Dave Brown is smart GM and he will make trades to add offense/defense during this coming summer.
Thus, having guys like Singer, Gritz, McDougall around make no sense considering that they are older and one dimensional. Play the crap out of the rest and develop them and see who separates themselves from the group.
Cohen and Hoffman can score but their 200' game and compete is below standard.
Golod-Swankler-Fowler
D'amato-Yetman-Sproule/Hoffman
Sedore-Lockhart-Hoffman/Sproule
Sellan- Cohen- Rookie
I think its imperative to develop your players for a serious run next year, given that some of your best offensive and defensive players are 2000s and Drysdale may be gone after his 3rd year. Dave Brown is smart GM and he will make trades to add offense/defense during this coming summer.
Thus, having guys like Singer, Gritz, McDougall around make no sense considering that they are older and one dimensional. Play the crap out of the rest and develop them and see who separates themselves from the group.
Cohen and Hoffman can score but their 200' game and compete is below standard.
Golod-Swankler-Fowler
D'amato-Yetman-Sproule/Hoffman
Sedore-Lockhart-Hoffman/Sproule
Sellan- Cohen- Rookie
Morton is young. Have to be patient. I like his size and his willingness to use the body. Plus the team had about 4/5 other options from the 2018 group that they could have signed but Morton was the guy they went with. Give it time
The team also didn’t plan on Gillard missing the entire year and Kischnick now being injured for at least a few weeks. As for Martin, I wanted him over Golden. The team decided Golden was more valuable. No chance I wanted 2 OAs plus 3 2000 born guys on the backend. Would leave us too vulnerable for next year when we have to replace them. The one nice thing about Morton is that he will be back next year and because of his experience this year, he will be better off for it
I would agree that Gritz is basically useless to the future and current roster. He adds center depth though so for now, he stays. I am curious what they will do when MacDougall returns. Obviously MacDougall doesn’t factor into next season but for now, he’s a better, more consistent option than guys like Cohen, Lockhart, or Sellan.
I have absolutely no issue with keeping and playing MacDougall and Singer in the top 9. At least until early January. At that point there can be moves made or decisions made that dictate someone like MacDougall slowly losses ice time
But as for Singer..
Did you know that no player on the current roster (outside of him) has ever scored more than 21 goals in an OHL season? I know a large chunk of that is due to them being younger the last few years but regardless, Singer scored 26 goals in 2017-18. I think he has a good shot and scoring ability. Which is our biggest weakness - consistent scoring. He still adds good value to this team and isn’t going anywhere. He also won’t be a difficult replacement for next year because guys getting older will simply replace his production.
That said, you can’t simply release a potential 20g, 45+ point player. Sellan, Cohen, Lockhart, etc. are not ready to give that production yet. Singer is not going anywhere anytime soon. Maybe in December someone like Lockhart starts to breakout more and Sedore comes along strong.. then MAYBE. Maybe you move on from Singer. But right now, if anything the team could afford to give him more top 6 mins over a guy like Sellan
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