Confirmed with Link: Elias Lindholm and Noah Hanifin coming to Calgary for Dougie Hamilton, Adam Fox, Micheal Ferland

OvermanKingGainer

#BennettFreed #CurseofTheSpulll #FreeOliver
Feb 3, 2015
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2022 Cup to Calgary
Ferland is certainly doing great so far this season (4 goals in 7 games).
However, let me remind everyone that last year in the first 42 games he scored 19 goals and then in the next 35 he scored 2.

And?

Neal, who we signed to over 5 million, scored his first 22 goals in his first 47 games, and then had 3 in the next 24
Lindholm, who we traded Ferland for, scored his first 14 goals in his first 45 games, and then had 2 in his next 36

Goal.
Scorers.
Are.
Streaky.

The ones that aren't are the guys who get primo PP1 and 3v3 time and emptynetters, because that masks streakiness.

Consistency is very much a myth.
 
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DFF

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
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And?

Neal, who we signed to over 5 million, scored his first 22 goals in his first 47 games, and then had 3 in the next 24
Lindholm, who we traded Ferland for, scored his first 14 goals in his first 45 games, and then had 2 in his next 36

Goal.
Scorers.
Are.
Streaky.

The ones that aren't are the guys who get primo PP1 and 3v3 time and emptynetters, because that masks streakiness.

Consistency is very much a myth.


So what is your point? He is streaky and his streak is not going to last...what does Neal have anything to do with Ferland. You keep bringing him up.
Ferland was part of the failure in Calgary. Neal was going to be signed whether Ferland is here or not.

And yes, I would rather have Lindholm for Ferland 10 out of 10 times.
 

Anglesmith

Setting up the play?
Sep 17, 2012
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Victoria
It's not even just the off-ice stuff. He's a bad eye-test player. If the play isn't created for him to be in the right spot at the right time, there isn't much he does to help the team. His pairing was great with Gio because Gio is that good. His offensive numbers are good because guys fed him in the right spots. But you can't rely on him to lead on the ice.
 

joescores

Registered User
Mar 21, 2011
2,086
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So what is your point? He is streaky and his streak is not going to last...what does Neal have anything to do with Ferland. You keep bringing him up.
Ferland was part of the failure in Calgary. Neal was going to be signed whether Ferland is here or not.

And yes, I would rather have Lindholm for Ferland 10 out of 10 times.

I think his point was that we shouldn't add Ferland in that package and then get an expensive anchor instead.

Time will tell but Neal hasn't impressed me so far and I can only hope his game will improve.

PS to Neal: Hit the gym bro. Your upper body looks incredibly weak.
 
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crackdown44

Cold milk cools down hot food
Dec 1, 2017
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I think his point was that we shouldn't add Ferland in that package and then get an expensive anchor instead.

Time will tell but Neal hasn't impressed me so far and I can only hope his game will improve.

PS to Neal: Hit the gym bro. Your upper body looks incredibly weak.

I doubt the trade happens if we don’t add Ferland. You can’t get something for nothing. Overall Lindholm is a better player

I’m not worried about Neal at all. He’s never been a dynamic player. His usage hasn’t been huge this year, he’ll get his time and put up his 20 goals eventually
 
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Anglesmith

Setting up the play?
Sep 17, 2012
46,442
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Except Coyotes are pretty poor when it comes to corsi until this season thus far.
They're interesting in a few ways. They hired an analytics guy as GM, he has made a ton of moves with his mandate now so the roster is now truly reflective of his vision, the Corsi is there now, and they can't win with good analytics.
 

Volica

Papa Shango
May 15, 2012
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So what is your point? He is streaky and his streak is not going to last...what does Neal have anything to do with Ferland. You keep bringing him up.
Ferland was part of the failure in Calgary. Neal was going to be signed whether Ferland is here or not.

And yes, I would rather have Lindholm for Ferland 10 out of 10 times.

I'd even move it to 11/10 times.
For his hot start, Ferland isn't a portion of the player Lindholm is overall. Ferland couldn't play the PK; Ferland couldn't be trusted with tough defensive assignments.

With Lindholm on the top line (the half game he's there it seems because we're always chasing); I really think that he brings a responsibility and 2-way IQ to the line it didn't have without him.

I love Ferly. But he is inconsistent. I don't care how much you break down scoring in terms of games, it's not what makes him an inconsistent player. It's the fact for 5-10 game stretches, you forget he's even on the team. He moved away from physicality on the top line; and without scoring you barely notice he's in the game.
 

Rubi

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Jan 9, 2009
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I'd even move it to 11/10 times.
For his hot start, Ferland isn't a portion of the player Lindholm is overall. Ferland couldn't play the PK; Ferland couldn't be trusted with tough defensive assignments.

With Lindholm on the top line (the half game he's there it seems because we're always chasing); I really think that he brings a responsibility and 2-way IQ to the line it didn't have without him.

I love Ferly. But he is inconsistent. I don't care how much you break down scoring in terms of games, it's not what makes him an inconsistent player. It's the fact for 5-10 game stretches, you forget he's even on the team. He moved away from physicality on the top line; and without scoring you barely notice he's in the game.
Exactly. If Ferland isn't scoring, he's virtually invisible out on the ice.

Ferland picked up points in 34 games last year so for the other 43 games he was a non-factor.
Ferland had one great 6 game playoff series against Vancouver a few years ago and his reputation was built on that. He also had the great luck to play on the right side of one of the best twosomes in the game.
I like Ferland and when he's scoring and banging and crashing he's fun to watch. Unfortunately he's not more times than he is. So many times last year, I've said to myself... was Ferland scratched from the lineup? I don't remember seeing him out there.

Lindholm >>>>>>> Ferland and its not even close.
 

Fig

Absolute Horse Shirt
Dec 15, 2014
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They're interesting in a few ways. They hired an analytics guy as GM, he has made a ton of moves with his mandate now so the roster is now truly reflective of his vision, the Corsi is there now, and they can't win with good analytics.

I agree the roster is reflective of his mandate. I think the slight problem though is a bit old school.

The Yotes need more gellin and a bit more stability. That roster has been insanely overhauled to the point I think more than half the roster has not been with the team more than 2 seasons. Add in coaching changes... that's like thinking you're close to completing a Lego death star after a good solid 4 hour session.

I think the Yotes will be very dangerous in the long run. But this season, I think they languish while finding their way. This is a roster that legitimately needs to stop moving and just familiarizing and fine tuning.
 

Fig

Absolute Horse Shirt
Dec 15, 2014
12,957
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I'd even move it to 11/10 times.
For his hot start, Ferland isn't a portion of the player Lindholm is overall. Ferland couldn't play the PK; Ferland couldn't be trusted with tough defensive assignments.

With Lindholm on the top line (the half game he's there it seems because we're always chasing); I really think that he brings a responsibility and 2-way IQ to the line it didn't have without him.

I love Ferly. But he is inconsistent. I don't care how much you break down scoring in terms of games, it's not what makes him an inconsistent player. It's the fact for 5-10 game stretches, you forget he's even on the team. He moved away from physicality on the top line; and without scoring you barely notice he's in the game.

I think it's obvious Lindholm is worth to Ferland value wise because his capabilities are significantly greater. But I think Ferland is valuable as well and I could imagine him fetching a 1st in a rental this season. I think that value difference was the biggest bridging of the value gap between Hanifin and Hamilton. Ferland would be a scary guy to the Pens in the same vein as the Reeves deal, but he'd actually be good regularly on the top 6 rather than a bottom 6 staple as Reeves was used.

There were reasons to get rid of the guys we did, but on the other end of the spectrum, there were major reasons why Carolina wanted to acquire these guys too. They are able to cover holes in both respective rosters in ways far more significant than they could on their original rosters. Hamilton filled a RHD hole that Hanifin couldn't remotely close to consider filling. Ferland helps in the top 6 while also filling in a deterrent role that Lindholm could never have imagined filling. Their flaws will be more easily covered in Carolina and their strengths magnified there as opposed to the opposite here.

Likewise for us. Face offs, RHS in the top 6. Ferland can't fit that in our top 6. Hamilton out of our d corps and Hanifin in + Brodano was essentially a quality for quantity trade which has worked greatly to properly spread the wealth in our d corps and by taking some pressure off Gio by being able to rely on the second and third pairing more, that's valuable too.
 

Tkachuk Norris

Registered User
Jun 22, 2012
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I agree Lindholm is a much better player.

But the narrative that Ferland didn’t hit is the stupidest narrative around. He lead our team in hits by a mile every year.

It’s really hilarious. When he was hitting everyone “no skill goon” when he starts scoring and Gully became coach which means you retreat instead of going for the hit “why isn’t Ferland hitting anyone”

People are dumb
 

Lunatik

Normal is an illusion.
Oct 12, 2012
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I agree Lindholm is a much better player.

But the narrative that Ferland didn’t hit is the stupidest narrative around. He lead our team in hits by a mile every year.

It’s really hilarious. When he was hitting everyone “no skill goon” when he starts scoring and Gully became coach which means you retreat instead of going for the hit “why isn’t Ferland hitting anyone”

People are dumb
Ferland disappeared for stretches physically too, as much as you want to deny it. He did it under Hartley, he did it in the AHL It's not a Gulutzan problem.
 

Tkachuk Norris

Registered User
Jun 22, 2012
15,602
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Ferland disappeared for stretches physically too, as much as you want to deny it. He did it under Hartley, he did it in the AHL It's not a Gulutzan problem.

And yet he led our team in hits by a huge margin...

Let’s see you go throw around 220 pounds at 20 km hr 200ish times a year and see how you feel everyday..
 

Lunatik

Normal is an illusion.
Oct 12, 2012
56,185
8,337
Padded Room
And yet he led our team in hits by a huge margin...

Let’s see you go throw around 220 pounds at 20 km hr 200ish times a year and see how you feel everyday..
17 hits more than the next closest forward, a guy that 18 fewer games and 3 and a half minutes less per game, oh and is about the same size and sacrifices his body more to block shots..... but please tell me more about this HUGE MARGIN he led by. Also leading the Flames in hits isn't exactly a difficult feat.

Also, players are capable of throwing more than big hits, you do know this right?

Ferland averaged 2.2 hits per game. Yet he had had long stretches where he rarely went above that average. From November 2nd to December 22nd (24 games), Ferland surpassed 2 hits on just 3 occasions, only once did he exceed 3 hits (to get 4). He had as many no hit games over that time as he did more than 2 hits. His 27 hits in the 11 games prior to that must have worn his body down, amirite?
 

Tkachuky

Registered User
Dec 30, 2009
5,280
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In the Dome
And?

Neal, who we signed to over 5 million, scored his first 22 goals in his first 47 games, and then had 3 in the next 24
Lindholm, who we traded Ferland for, scored his first 14 goals in his first 45 games, and then had 2 in his next 36

Goal.
Scorers.
Are.
Streaky.

The ones that aren't are the guys who get primo PP1 and 3v3 time and emptynetters, because that masks streakiness.

Consistency is very much a myth.

Consistency is key... you're not going to win 100+ games in the season without consistency. A good team has consistency to their game. Flames suffered the past few years from games where they have lapses of time and completely drop the ball in games and get scored on multiple times.

At a player level, give me the guy that scores 1 goal a game every 2-3 games compared to a guy with same goals but doing it in a specific type of time frame like you have above.

And Lindholm wasn't traded for Ferland. Ferland was more of a add to Hamilton to get Lindholm and Hanifin.
 

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