Proposal: Ehlers for Draisaitl

ChaoticOrange

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Jun 29, 2008
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Edmonton
Draisaitl’s most common not-McDavid linemates

Khaira/Strome
Lucic/Cammalleri
Caggiula/Strome

Seven gassy dudes from Arkansas was the farthest thing from hyperbole.

Ehlers?

Most common Laine/Little
Then Laine/Stastny
Then Perreault/Little
Then Scheifele/Wheeler

I don’t know how the poor dear survived such hardship.
 
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QuietContrarian

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May 28, 2008
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I'm not blowing a fuse. I know Draisaitl is better and you said it yourself. I just think the argument you're making is totally flawed, hence 'reaching' on certain things. I'm not sure how you can say the 3 minutes would make a huge difference in points when a good chunk of those extra minutes are shorthanded.
Out of 1507 minutes of ice, 79, was SH. 1428 minutes of non SH that leaves.

Ehlers played 1318

Yeah that is a big enough difference to make a difference in pts.

Drai also had more PP toi per game than Ehlers.

2:50 against Ehlers 2:20.

We can agree to disagree tho, no biggie:)
 

QuietContrarian

Registered User
May 28, 2008
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Draisaitl’s most common not-McDavid linemates

Khaira/Strome
Lucic/Cammalleri
Caggiula/Strome

Seven gassy dudes from Arkansas was the farthest thing from hyperbole.

Ehlers?

Most common Laine/Little
Then Laine/Stastny
Then Perreault/Little
Then Scheifele/Wheeler

I don’t know how the poor dear survived such hardship.
Drai played 41% with McD.

And 49,1 % of his ES production with McD

And All his pp production with McD.

There is no need to be condescending towards Ehlers in any case.

Drai is the better piece in this trade, what more do you want from me.

I don't agree thet the skillgap at wing is big at all, and there are definitely things Ehlers does better.
Like zone entries, skating etc.
 
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ChaoticOrange

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Drai played 41% with McD.

And 49,1 % of his ES production with McD

And All his pp production with McD.

There is no need to be condescending towards Ehlers in any case.

Drai is the better piece in this trade, what more do you want from me.

I don't agree thet the skillgap at wing is big at all, and there are definitely things Ehlers does better.
Like zone entries, skating etc.

Meaning, 59% wasn’t with McDavid, 51% wasn’t with McDavid, (And therefore was with junk like Lucic and Cammalleri) and our powerplay was such a tire fire they probably would have been better off apart from each other.
 

QuietContrarian

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May 28, 2008
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Meaning, 59% wasn’t with McDavid, 51% wasn’t with McDavid, and our powerplay was such a tire fire they probably would have been better off apart from each other.

I want you to go to bed if you have a headache.

I would want the other part to go to bed to, if I did not havy any real answers to his posts...

You keep beeing condescending, and you keep not answering my point, and I fail to see what it is you want. Unless you somehow need me to think that Drais skill is heaps and bounds above Ehlers, which I do not think - And nothing you have written even remotely changes my mind.
This seems not like a give and take discussion from your point, but a take and take....
 
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ChaoticOrange

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I would want the other part to go to bed to, if I did not havy any real answers to his posts...

You keep beeing condescending, and you keep not answering my point, and I fail to see what it is you want. Unless you somehow need me to think that Drais skill is heaps and bounds above Ehlers, which I do not think - And nothing you have written even remotely changes my mind.
This seems not like a give and take discussion from your point, but a take and take....

Think what you want, you seem to be about the only one that thinks this is close in any way.

I want you to stop making excuses for Ehlers then claiming you have a headache and calling me hyperbolic when I apply your logic to Draisaitl.
 

QuietContrarian

Registered User
May 28, 2008
8,260
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Think what you want, you seem to be about the only one that thinks this is close in any way.

I want you to stop making excuses for Ehlers then claiming you have a headache and calling me hyperbolic when I apply your logic to Draisaitl.

I assure you I am not - No one here is claiming the skill level is lobsided other than Oilers fans.

[MOD]

My only logic was that ofc Ehlers does not have the same amount of pts. with 3 minutes less toi. He is already at the top of what players produce with his toi.

I wasnt the one who started with the whole linemate discussion, as I have tried to tell you around 5-6 times now, yet you still wanted to pin that on me, and hold me accountable to it, and then proceeded to turn the discussion in a whole other direction - then when I answer this whole new direction of yours, by calling some of it hyperbolic, you are now applying my logic to Draisaitl?


Nope you are saying Draisaitl is a much, much more skilled player, based on nothing but strawmans, and logics that can equally be used for Ehlers. I am saying the gap is not that big!

The difference in pts, was being used as an argument earlier in this thread, and I answered with what I think is a logical conclussion - That Ehlers does not get the same opportunites as Drai both in TOI and PP TOI.

But now that you mention it all the time, I think Ehlers would have more pts then what he got, playing 41% with McD and getting Drai's TOI and PP1 minus what he plays as SH.

Like I wrote, if you have no interest in answering the original post without all your bias, and without derailing it, there is no need to continue this.

We can agree to diasgree, this is a forum, this happens every day.
 
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ChaoticOrange

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Jun 29, 2008
50,570
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Edmonton
I assure you I am not - No one here is claiming the skill level is lobsided other than Oilers fans.

Making excuses? Since when are facts excuses? and what am I excusing? No I wrote your posts were very much all over the place, and did not grasp the post at hand, yet resorted to strawman arguments, bias and hyperbole.

I did not see the same logic used at all tbh.

My only logic was that ofc Ehlers does not have the same amount of pts. with 3 minutes less toi. He is already at the top of what players produce with his toi.

I wasnt the one who started with the whole linemate discussion, as I have tried to tell you around 5-6 times now, yet you still wanted to pin that on me, and hold me accountable to it, and then proceeded to turn the discussion in a whole other direction - then when I answer this whole new direction of yours, by calling some of it hyperbolic, you are now applying my logic to Draisaitl?


Nope you are saying Draisaitl is a much, much more skilled player, based on nothing but strawmans, and logics that can equally be used for Ehlers. I am saying the gap is not that big!

The difference in pts, was being used as an argument earlier in this thread, and I answered with what I think is a logical conclussion - That Ehlers does not get the same opportunites as Drai both in TOI and PP TOI.

But now that you mention it all the time, I think Ehlers would have more pts then what he got, playing 41% with McD and getting Drai's TOI and PP1 minus what he plays as SH.

Like I wrote, if you have no interest in answering the original post without all your bias, and without derailing it, there is no need to continue this.

We can agree to diasgree, this is a forum, this happens every day.

Icetime is not created equal, especially since as a centre Draisaitl has more defensive responsibilities and Ehlers got significantly easier zonestarts. It’s irresponsible to assume that he’d simply produce more if he got more icetime, just like it’s irresponsible to assume that would even benefit your team. More Ehlers probably means less Wheeler.

Second, Draisaitl played only a minute and a half more at evens. The extra time is in special teams -, which given how bad our powerplay was, was not the benefit you’re making it out to be.

Third, this isn’t about skill. This is about value and results, and in those categories Draisaitl is a significant cut above.

So even if you think they’re offensively close - which I don’t for a minute believe, since I don’t think Ehlers would be more than a 50 point player if he got saddled with the slugs Draisaitl had to drag along 60% of the time (which is the other half of the ‘Ehlers Would have more points if he played with McDavid’ argument that you’re missing completely). You don’t get to compare Ehlers/McDavid unless you compare 60% of his time with absolute nobodies as well to have a similar situation to Draisaitl.

For every 41 seconds he played with McDavid, he played 59 seconds with Lucic/Caggiula/Slepyshev/Strome etc, otherwise known as a collection of at best third liners. That’s why your logical conclusion isn’t logical at all.

Don’t pretend you aren’t biased too. If you weren’t you wouldn’t be searching so hard for reasons to prop a lesser player up.

I don’t believe Ehlers could overcome those odds - at least not while remaining a 60 point player.
 
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Halla

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Jan 28, 2016
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Jets would have to add a significant asset IMHO

70pt+ C who was his teams best player in the playoffs vs 60+pt W who was a ghost in the playoffs

just spitballing but a Roslovich/Vesalainen would need to be added
 

Jumptheshark

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Oct 12, 2003
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I am amused how some bang on about something like Leon D getting 55% of his pts while playing with McDavid (meaning 45% came without him) and down play Ehlers playing time with either Laine or Chef--If I am not mistaken--if you Ehlers % of pts with or without playing on a line with Laine or Chef is something like 80% to 20%
 

ottawa

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and how many pts did Ehlers get away from Laine and or Schiefle?

That doesn't warrant a response because clearly haven't been keeping up with the discussion. Restart from the beginning and you'll see why I'm saying that.

We’re not allowed to ask that. Everyone else in the NHL plays with koala bears on skates and makes 100% of their own offense happen.

ONLY DRAISAITL GETS AN OFFENSIVE BUMP FROM HIS LINEMATES! NO ONE ELSE!

NO QUESTIONS!

See above. The danger of jumping into a discussion is quite real.
 

Flair Hay

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I'd probably trade Ehlers for Draisaitl even with the difference in salary. But Ehlers is a burner who is only going to get more well rounded.
 

LTIR

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Nov 8, 2013
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I'd probably trade Ehlers for Draisaitl even with the difference in salary. But Ehlers is a burner who is only going to get more well rounded.
I would probably trade Draisaitl for Schiefle but Drai is probably going to be better C down the road.
Ehlers is a non starter for Draisaitl.
 

Whileee

Registered User
May 29, 2010
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We’re not allowed to ask that. Everyone else in the NHL plays with koala bears on skates and makes 100% of their own offense happen.

ONLY DRAISAITL GETS AN OFFENSIVE BUMP FROM HIS LINEMATES! NO ONE ELSE!

NO QUESTIONS!
Whoa, dude. Stop shouting. The stakes aren't that high...
 

yababy

Registered User
Jun 26, 2015
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I wouldn't trade Draisaitl for Ehlers if I was Edmonton. The Jets would have to add to Ehlers to get Draisaitl.

Ehlers is a salad. Sometimes I just love me a salad, and Ehlers is a mighty fine one indeed. But Draisaitl is meat and potatoes, and the only guy on the Jets in the same section of the menu is Scheifele
 

TFHockey

The CEO of 7-8-0
May 16, 2014
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My random thoughts on this topic:

I don't think most other fanbases really realize just how terrible the Oiler depth is on wing. Most of these discussions kind of gloss over that outside of RNH Draisaitl and McDavid played with some real mediocre talent. It's a damning statement for a team that had been rebuilding for so long. Oh yeah, and we have only $4.9 Million in cap space.

Oiler fans see it every game, 60 minutes per. We can only hope Puljujarvi and Yamamoto are as good as we think they are.

Lastly I think if Edmonton misses the payoffs this year (I think they're a bubble team so it'll be close) that will be it for Chiarelli and McLellan.
 

34

Registered User
Mar 26, 2010
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Not a fan of either team... no away Edmonton makes this trade. Drai is worth much more.
 

THall4

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
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Edmonton, AB
Let’s just not talk about the rest of the lines...

McDavid doesn’t need burners to play with. He plays best with guys that will give him the puck and get out of the way.
This, but more so get McDavid the puck get out the way...but can atleast finish

Its why a lot of Oiler fans were horny for James Neal..not a burner, not a puck carrier..but can finish
 

VoluntaryDom

Formerly DominicBoltsFan / Ⓐ / ✞
Oct 31, 2016
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Sorry a WebMD degree doesn't cut it for me. Until we have an update from a team medic who can actually gauge the severity of the tear and how Sekera is recovering i'm sticking with anywhere from 3-6 months with him returning around Christmas as likely.

Actually it isn't. The reason we are in this mess was giving Lucic the Taylor Hall money (6m for 6m), and Chiarelli overpaying players by 20% of what they are worth.
Achilles tears are never only 3-6 months.
 
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