Proposal: Edmonton/New Jersey

[Nico Hischier]

Darnell Nurse to NJ

Sami Vatanen full retention, Pavel Zacha, Miles Wood to EDM

Details:
Sami Vatanen is one year from UFA and is slated to play on the top pair with P.K. and is poised to have a career year.
Zacha has played in one preseason game and looked fantastic but there are 3 other centers ahead of him - Nico, Jack, Travis - if he played in all of preseason, he might be ahead in the depth chart
Wood brings his speedy gritty game on the wing good for 15-25 goals even with limited ice time

Devils would be taking on a lot of risk by giving up quality pieces in hoping that Nurse would be a better fit than Vatanen playing with P.K.

Edmonton would get a third line center and winger who both could slot in the top 6. If Zacha played wing with Mcdavid and Draisaitl, he would break out easily. They also get a top 4 rhd who plays LD who could either be resigned or traded again.

Not sure if this proposal works with the cap or contract limit

Click to read more...

 

[HockeyGuy1964]

If Miles is good for 15-25 goals with limited playing time, the Devils should/will keep him. It's not that easy to score in the NHL.

Nurse to Vatanen seems like a sideways move for both teams & it shouldn't be worth 2 more roster players from the Devils to make it happen. I believe Nurse is a RFA after the season too so he'll need to be paid.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

If your proposal hinges on “if X got icetime with McDavid/Draisaitl he’d break out” then your proposal is absolutely no good.

you can’t sell Oiler fans on hypotheticals.

two third liners and a rental doesn’t get you Nurse.

 

[Nico Hischier]

Devils have unproven but ready to go McLeod and Boqvist who could take Zacha and Wood spots in the line up if they were to be traded

 

[Llamamoto]

If Miles is good for 15-25 goals with limited playing time, the Devils should/will keep him. It's not that easy to score in the NHL.

Nurse to Vatanen seems like a sideways move for both teams & it shouldn't be worth 2 more roster players from the Devils to make it happen. I believe Nurse is a RFA after the season too so he'll need to be paid.

Nurse and Vatanen do not have equal value.

Nurse is coming off a 41 point season. Vatanen just had 17.
Nurse is 24. Vatanen is 28.
Vatanen is a UFA at the end of this year. Nurse is an RFA.

 

[Nico Hischier]

If your proposal hinges on “if X got icetime with McDavid/Draisaitl he’d break out” then your proposal is absolutely no good.

you can’t sell Oiler fans on hypotheticals.

two third liners and a rental doesn’t get you Nurse.

When Zacha does break out offensively, he will be worth much more than Nurse. He will get plenty of opportunities this year alongside Nico and Jack. I think you are selling the Devils players short in that they wouldn’t be just third liners on Edmonton’s roster. They would literally be the next best forwards after mcdavid draisaitl and rnh. Zacha would instantly be the best pk forward

 

[ChaoticOrange]

When Zacha does break out offensively, he will be worth much more than Nurse. He will get plenty of opportunities this year alongside Nico and Jack. I think you are selling the Devils players short in that they wouldn’t be just third liners on Edmonton’s roster. They would literally be the next best forwards after mcdavid draisaitl and rnh. Zacha would instantly be the best pk forward

Again, purely hypothetical. There’s no guarantee Zacha EVER breaks out. All the risk is on Edmonton.

Wood had 10 goals last year and wasn’t very good in general.

I think you’re the one selling Nurse short. Guy had 40+ points and played top pairing minutes for the Oilers last year. Guys like that aren’t had for handfuls of disposable pieces.

 

[PizzaAndPucks]

When Zacha does break out offensively, he will be worth much more than Nurse. He will get plenty of opportunities this year alongside Nico and Jack. I think you are selling the Devils players short in that they wouldn’t be just third liners on Edmonton’s roster. They would literally be the next best forwards after mcdavid draisaitl and rnh. Zacha would instantly be the best pk forward

We dont know if Zacha will ever really break out. This is really his last season to establish himself as a legit top 6 C/LW. He can already handle a bottom 6 role well and would be awesome to keep on our roster long term. We have a good amount of players who can take away his shot at being a 2nd line player for us on the team already and in the future. Edmonton isnt moving Nurse for a UFA who they probably cant keep and 2 players who MAYBE will help them now and in the future.

 

[780il]

Bad deal. Bunch of meh for a good young piece.

 

[belair]

Zacha is a third line center. A fourth line center in New Jersey. You'll be waiting a while for that breakout.

Zacha for Puljujarvi still.

 

[Nico Hischier]

Again, purely hypothetical. There’s no guarantee Zacha EVER breaks out. All the risk is on Edmonton.

Wood had 10 goals last year and wasn’t very good in general.

I think you’re the one selling Nurse short. Guy had 40+ points and played top pairing minutes for the Oilers last year. Guys like that aren’t had for handfuls of disposable pieces.

What would it take to get Nurse to be P.K. Subban’s D partner?

Would an offer of Will Butcher, Jesper Bratt, and Miles Wood be more enticing and less risky?

Butcher is a proven top 4 D with term
Bratt is proven top 6 RW

 

[KidLine93]

Oilers had been dying to get a Dman who can handle big minutes and skate with the best of them. Now they are going to trade this piece for a rental player and 2 3rd liners? The oilers need legit wingers not more depth pieces. We literally have 3rd/4th liners filling in our top 2 lines why would we trade a young quality piece for even more of those.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

What would it take to get Nurse to be P.K. Subban’s D partner?

Would an offer of Will Butcher, Jesper Bratt, and Miles Wood be more enticing and less risky?

Butcher is a proven top 4 D with term
Bratt is proven top 6 RW

Wtf man, that’s horrific for NJ. Butcher is young and highly effective, Bratt has 1st line potential, Wood is a quality bottom 6 24 year old. We lose that trade big time.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

What would it take to get Nurse to be P.K. Subban’s D partner?

Would an offer of Will Butcher, Jesper Bratt, and Miles Wood be more enticing and less risky?

Butcher is a proven top 4 D with term
Bratt is proven top 6 RW

some might do that, I wouldn’t. More to the point, that puts us over the cap, downgrades our defence drastically, and runs us directly into the 50 contract limit.

I like Bratt, but we need scorers, and he’s not that. Seems like a lot just to add one Alex Chiasson worth of goals to our lineup.

Palmeiri and Butcher for Nurse and a dump might get me thinking, but it would need to be an offer with more immediate impact and less potential. We’ve got potential. What we need is proven. You want to keep your proven guys while adding more impactful proven guys. I think we’re poor partners.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Wtf man, that’s horrific for NJ. Butcher is young and highly effective, Bratt has 1st line potential, Wood is a quality bottom 6 24 year old. We lose that trade big time.

You’re not going to “win” a deal with Edmonton where Nurse is concerned. The organization loves him and for one more year at least he’s on a great contract. He’s not being moved this year and he’s definitely not being moved for lesser bits that don’t really make sense for us anyway.

 

[voxel]

Sami Vatanen is nice but a UFA soon and the Oilers are full up on mediocre forward and D. No quantity for quality deals for us.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

You’re not going to “win” a deal with Edmonton where Nurse is concerned. The organization loves him and for one more year at least he’s on a great contract. He’s not being moved this year and he’s definitely not being moved for lesser bits that don’t really make sense for us anyway.

Of course. Will Butcher alone is of comparable value to Nurse, in reality. He’s actually significantly better in a bunch of advanced metrics. But he isn’t worth the same around the league because of draft position, size, and a bunch of other things GMs seem to care about.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Of course. Will Butcher alone is of comparable value to Nurse, in reality. He’s actually significantly better in a bunch of advanced metrics. But he isn’t worth the same around the league because of draft position, size, and a bunch of other things GMs seem to care about.

like deployment, icetime, Qualcomp, physicality, blocks, production, ability to defend, zonestarts, PK ability, etc.

If you ignore the fact that Nurse is better at pretty much everything and is a first pairing defenceman to Butcher’s second pairing defenceman and plays nearly five minutes more a night then sure you bet they’re comparable.

if you truly believe Butcher and Nurse are comparable then lock this thread right now because there’s absolutely nothing else to discuss. He won’t be moved for Will Butcher prices.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

like deployment, icetime, Qualcomp, physicality, blocks, production, ability to defend, zonestarts, PK ability, etc.

If you ignore the fact that Nurse is better at pretty much everything and is a first pairing defenceman to Butcher’s second pairing defenceman and plays nearly five minutes more a night then sure you bet they’re comparable.

if you truly believe Butcher and Nurse are comparable then lock this thread right now because there’s absolutely nothing else to discuss. He won’t be moved for Will Butcher prices.

Most of Nurse's underlying numbers really stink. Edmonton Oilers: Darnell Nurse a Stud? Hardly.

Nurse is not "better at everything". That's preposterous and you're just basing that on unearned reputation. Butcher has spent most of his career next to Ben Lovejoy, keep in mind.

 

[Blackjack]

if you truly believe Butcher and Nurse are comparable then lock this thread right now because there’s absolutely nothing else to discuss. He won’t be moved for Will Butcher prices.

That's probably not a bad idea. There's already enough hot takes in this thread for a dozen midseason bumps, and it's clear that Edmonton fans won't move Nurse for anything less than Hischier, Hughes, and a 1st.

 

[Chayos]

Most of Nurse's underlying numbers really stink. Edmonton Oilers: Darnell Nurse a Stud? Hardly.

Nurse is not "better at everything". That's preposterous and you're just basing that on unearned reputation. Butcher has spent most of his career next to Ben Lovejoy, keep in mind.

It hard to use those comparisons as Butcher has 1/3 the minutes to compare with.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Most of Nurse's underlying numbers really stink. Edmonton Oilers: Darnell Nurse a Stud? Hardly.

Nurse is not "better at everything". That's preposterous and you're just basing that on unearned reputation. Butcher has spent most of his career next to Ben Lovejoy, keep in mind.

And Nurse has gotten Kris Russell on his off side for most of it, and you discounted anything that didn’t suit your argument as “things GM’s seem to care about”.

But hey you provided a chart of a dishonest 46 game sample size that looks like it was from before Butcher shit the bed last year - and less than a third of the minutes - so f*** me right?

Nurse is absolutely better than Butcher. It’s not even a question.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

That's probably not a bad idea. There's already enough hot takes in this thread for a dozen midseason bumps, and it's clear that Edmonton fans won't move Nurse for anything less than Hischier, Hughes, and a 1st.

there’s a significant gap between what you’re suggesting and the “here’s a bunch of broken toys we don’t like anymore” offer that the OP threw out there.

but yeah sure we’re the assholes for not wanting to move Nurse for a UFA and two guys coming off of mid 20 point seasons.

 

[Nico Hischier]

Wtf man, that’s horrific for NJ. Butcher is young and highly effective, Bratt has 1st line potential, Wood is a quality bottom 6 24 year old. We lose that trade big time.

Yeah it’s a big overpay but I like what Nurse brings and I feel he and Subban would be a solid top pair for the next 3 years. We would survive the trade because of our depth but you gotta pay especially when it’s for a player you really want and the other team is not really interested in trading.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

And Nurse has gotten Kris Russell on his off side for most of it, and you discounted anything that didn’t suit your argument as “things GM’s seem to care about”.

But hey you provided a chart of a dishonest 46 game sample size that looks like it was from before Butcher **** the bed last year - and less than a third of the minutes - so **** me right?

Nurse is absolutely better than Butcher. It’s not even a question.

Good evidence. Look at both players' numbers for their entire careers. You can use the entire sample. Tell me who's more effective.

Nurse plays more minutes, that's about it. If Butcher ends up on a pairing with Subban, this should be a fun thread to revisit. Nurse is a totally average player that is overrated because of size and where he was drafted.