[EDM/NYR] Oilers acquire Ryan Spooner in exchange for Ryan Strome (NYR retains 900k) Part 2

[joestevens29]

I still think its too early to say much about the trade. Neither guy was really doing much for their team.

I would of liked to see the Oilers make the Hitchcock hire first and see what he could of 0ut of Strome.

One thing Gregor mentioned was why we didn't try Strome for an extended amount of time in an offensive role. He was getting chances in his limited role, but was never really given the shot that he should've been given.

I know players need to earn their role, but at times it seemed like PC and TM where no where near close to the same page.

 

[Cloned]

One thing Gregor mentioned was why we didn't try Strome for an extended amount of time in an offensive role. He was getting chances in his limited role, but was never really given the shot that he should've been given.

I know players need to earn their role, but at times it seemed like PC and TM where no where near close to the same page.

TM at times coached like he wanted to prove how bad of a GM Chia is.

Like his 5 LH PP unit was his way of saying "there are no good offensive RH shots on this team."

 

[FlameChampion]

One thing Gregor mentioned was why we didn't try Strome for an extended amount of time in an offensive role. He was getting chances in his limited role, but was never really given the shot that he should've been given.

I know players need to earn their role, but at times it seemed like PC and TM where no where near close to the same page.

I completely agree. PC and TM were never on the same page. You can fault PC on the roster, he obviously hasnt done a great job here. Too many poor trades/signings but it seemed that TM never even tried at times to use the players that PC brought in, in the roles that PC envisioned. I think its pretty obvious at this point that TM just isnt a great coach. Hes below average to average.

 

[joestevens29]

TM at times coached like he wanted to prove how bad of a GM Chia is.

Like his 5 LH PP unit was his way of saying "there are no good offensive RH shots on this team."

I completely agree. PC and TM were never on the same page. You can fault PC on the roster, he obviously hasnt done a great job here. Too many poor trades/signings but it seemed that TM never even tried at times to use the players that PC brought in, in the roles that PC envisioned. I think its pretty obvious at this point that TM just isnt a great coach. Hes below average to average.

I just don't get it. As a fan it's quite clear we still have holes, but the coach should be getting the most out of his roster. TM didn't seem to do that. Hitch comes in and somehow gets the identity line to be a line that isn't hurting the team. Yet all 3 were either scratches or guys that TM could find a spot for.

I think if you want to prove your GM wrong, you need to do what a player has to do. Force your boss to give you more. If you are a coach and you aren't getting the most out of what you have, can you really always just ask for me? Same goes for a player. It's funny because that's where Spooner is at now. He has to force Hitch to give him more time. Scoring a game winner is going to help.

 

[guymez]

I just don't get it. As a fan it's quite clear we still have holes, but the coach should be getting the most out of his roster. TM didn't seem to do that. Hitch comes in and somehow gets the identity line to be a line that isn't hurting the team. Yet all 3 were either scratches or guys that TM could find a spot for.

I think if you want to prove your GM wrong, you need to do what a player has to do. Force your boss to give you more. If you are a coach and you aren't getting the most out of what you have, can you really always just ask for me? Same goes for a player. It's funny because that's where Spooner is at now. He has to force Hitch to give him more time. Scoring a game winner is going to help.

A couple of things come to mind for me. First...there was a clear disconnect between Chia and TMac regarding player usage. With Hitch he comes in and has the green light to do his thing because he doesnt have to worry about saving his job or doing the GM's bidding. He has carte blanche to do what he thinks is best.
TMac clearly never had that.

Secondly the players are clearly playing from a perspective of guilt over the firing. This happens all the time and Strudwick talked openly about it. Players play guilty (and much better) for a few weeks.

I get that the popular trend is to bad mouth the outgoing coach but these are 2 important factors that shouldn't be dismissed.

 

[joestevens29]

A couple of things come to mind for me. First...there was a clear disconnect between Chia and TMac regarding player usage. With Hitch he comes in and has the green light to do his thing because he doesnt have to worry about saving his job or doing the GM's bidding. He has carte blanche to do what he thinks is best.
TMac clearly never had that.

Secondly the player are clearly playing from a perspective of guilt over the firing. This happens all the time and Strudwick talked openly about it. Players play guilty for a few weeks.

I get that the popular trend is to bad mouth the outgoing coach but these are 2 important factors that shouldn't be dismissed.

Considering how guilty Kane felt they sure as hell aren't doing this in Chicago.

I also why players can do that? Sure says something about the character that you just give a shit for 3 weeks of the year

 

[guymez]

Considering how guilty Kane felt they sure as hell aren't doing this in Chicago.

I also why players can do that? Sure says something about the character that you just give a **** for 3 weeks of the year

Its a natural human response IMO....the coach gets fired and the players think that they were the reason the coach got fired so they pick it up.
Of course the players playing guilty may not be enough to elevate a team in every situation and possibly there are situations where the players feel vindicated by the firing.

I think the Oilers players are very motivated to embrace Hitchs new concepts. Its going to take time for this system to really settle in but the players are clearly all in...that is a major deal.

 

[joestevens29]

Its a natural human response IMO....the coach gets fired and the players think that they were the reason the coach got fired so they pick it up.
Of course the players playing guilty may not be enough to elevate a team in every situations and possibly there are situations where the players feel vindicated by the firing.

I think the Oilers players are very motivated to embrace Hitchs new concepts. Its going to take time for this system to really settle in but the players are clearly all in...that is a major deal.

They were all in with TM as well. They seemed to fall all out rather quickly.

It's not that I expected a lot out of this club, but they've shown quite a few times going back to last year that they don't give 100% enough of the time. If they would've gave 100% we may not have made the playoffs last year, but we should've been in the hunt at least.

Not to make excuses for PC, but when you have a coach that doesn't give 100% and players that don't give 100% sure makes it hard on you to figure out what you need to fix first.

 

[guymez]

They were all in with TM as well. They seemed to fall all out rather quickly.

It's not that I expected a lot out of this club, but they've shown quite a few times going back to last year that they don't give 100% enough of the time. If they would've gave 100% we may not have made the playoffs last year, but we should've been in the hunt at least.

Not to make excuses for PC, but when you have a coach that doesn't give 100% and players that don't give 100% sure makes it hard on you to figure out what you need to fix first.

Not following you here at all....not sure how you can make a claim that TMac wasnt giving 100%.
I call nonsense on that.
As for the players...sometimes they get too comfortable. They need a shake up.
They got it.

 

[Shathar]

Anything on repeat gets old. The coach says the same things (likely justifiably), the team loses, the coach says the same things again, the team loses. THAT is human nature. I think Todd cared a great deal about the guys in the room, and vice versa. It's just something that happens. How many times can the same person say the same thing? Hitch is a new guy, saying some new things but mostly the same things in a different way.

 

[joestevens29]

Not following you here at all....not sure how you can make a claim that TMac wasnt giving 100%.
I call nonsense on that.
As for the players...sometimes they get too comfortable. They need a shake up.
They got it.

The fact that he didn't match lines or his adjustments were as bad as they were shows he wasn't giving 100%.

 

[guymez]

The fact that he didn't match lines or his adjustments were as bad as they were shows he wasn't giving 100%.

Sorry but thats a ridiculous statement.

 

[joestevens29]

Sorry but thats a ridiculous statement.

Why? Took forever to adjust our special teams as a whole last year. I believe it was damn near 5 months before he did. Doesn't line match, not sure why he wouldn't do that.

 

[guymez]

Why? Took forever to adjust our special teams as a whole last year. I believe it was damn near 5 months before he did. Doesn't line match, not sure why he wouldn't do that.

Some coaches match lines full time...some would rather have all 4 lines going.
Its a difference in philosophy. Its not evidence of lack of effort.

BTW...TMac did match lines it just wasnt his go to strategy.

Regarding the Special teams....I posted all last year that the team had execution issues. It was a player commitment problem more than anything. I stand by that.

Its clear that you dont like TMac and you are trying really hard to justify your hate. Thats fine...its a common trend on here with outgoing coaches and players but some of your assertions are quite baseless IMO.

 

[joestevens29]

Some coaches match lines full time...some would rather have all 4 lines going.
Its a difference in philosophy. Its not evidence of lack of effort.

BTW...TMac did match lines it just wasnt his go to strategy.

Regarding the Special teams....I posted all last year that the team had execution issues. It was a player commitment problem more than anything. I stand by that.

Its clear that you dont like TMac and you are trying really hard to justify your hate. Thats fine...its a common trend on here with outgoing coaches and players but some of your assertions are quite baseless IMO.

I actually like TM.

He just didn't do enough this year to warrant keeping him

 

[Perfect_Drug]

Hitch is a new guy, saying some new things but mostly the same things in a different way.

Uhh not even close.

 

[Perfect_Drug]

Some coaches match lines full time...some would rather have all 4 lines going.
Its a difference in philosophy. Its not evidence of lack of effort.

BTW...TMac did match lines it just wasnt his go to strategy.

Regarding the Special teams....I posted all last year that the team had execution issues. It was a player commitment problem more than anything. I stand by that.

Its clear that you dont like TMac and you are trying really hard to justify your hate. Thats fine...its a common trend on here with outgoing coaches and players but some of your assertions are quite baseless IMO.

Todd might have had good strategies executed poorly, but the common thing I'm hearing is that he wanted everyone to play like McDavid.

That's great in a perfect world. 16 forwards who play like the best player in the world.

But reality was, we had size up front we weren't using. We had skill in other places, and a lot of fantastic tools he simply chose not to use, or put players in situations to succeed.

Watching Lucic try and stickhandle through the neutral zone was horrifying. Watching him do it for half a year was mindboggling.

Watching a new coach come here and simplify his game was a relief.

 

[MessierII]

Todd might have had good strategies executed poorly, but the common thing I'm hearing is that he wanted everyone to play like McDavid.

That's great in a perfect world. 16 forwards who play like the best player in the world.

But reality was, we had size up front we weren't using. We had skill in other places, and a lot of fantastic tools he simply chose not to use, or put players in situations to succeed.

Watching Lucic try and stickhandle through the neutral zone was horrifying. Watching him do it for half a year was mindboggling.

Watching a new coach come here and simplify his game was a relief.

Watching the team consistently have defensive miscues playing man defence was also mind boggling. Now that we play zone defence the errors are almost non existent.

 

[guymez]

Todd might have had good strategies executed poorly, but the common thing I'm hearing is that he wanted everyone to play like McDavid.

That's great in a perfect world. 16 forwards who play like the best player in the world.

But reality was, we had size up front we weren't using. We had skill in other places, and a lot of fantastic tools he simply chose not to use, or put players in situations to succeed.

Watching Lucic try and stickhandle through the neutral zone was horrifying. Watching him do it for half a year was mindboggling.

Watching a new coach come here and simplify his game was a relief.

Take a step back and think about the line I bolded. Its a ridiculous assertion. No one with any modicum of intelligence would accept that statement. It makes no sense therefore its nonsense.

That aside...there was an obvious disconnect between the coach and the players. That was very clear to me. Doesnt mean the coach was an idiot or tha he wasnt a good coach. He was an excellent coach in 2016/17.

IMO it means that coaches simply lose their voice in the room...they lose their ability to connect with the players.
I think thats exactly what happened here.

That said I am a HUGE Hitch supporter. I also think that (aside from his systems) his type of communicating was the perfect solution to what ails this team.

 

[guymez]

I actually like TM.

He just didn't do enough this year to warrant keeping him

Thats a pretty general statement that covers a lot of ground. It actually includes the reasons why i think it was time for a change.

So in a weird way we actually agree. I guess I just dont see the need to make up s*** just to justify why I feel the way I do.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Watching the team consistently have defensive miscues playing man defence was also mind boggling. Now that we play zone defence the errors are almost non existent.

The errors are still there. The goalie is just stopping them now. The Oilers give up a lot of odd man rushes and chances in the slot.

 

[MessierII]

The errors are still there. The goalie is just stopping them now. The Oilers give up a lot of odd man rushes and chances in the slot.

I disagree. Every team makes mistakes. They’ve cut them way down. I don’t think there’s a game we’ve been outplayed since hitch took over.

 

[guymez]

I disagree. Every team makes mistakes. They’ve cut them way down. I don’t think there’s a game we’ve been outplayed since hitch took over.

Hitch clearly has the teams attention. Its great to see.

Playing smart defence and managing the puck more effectively was always this teams achilles heel and the solution comes directly from Hitch's wheelhouse.

The zone defensive approach is refreshing as well. Really happy to see the team take that direction.

I am looking forward to when a lot of what Hitch teaches has become habit for this team. Thats when you add some secondary scoring and really make this team dangerous.

 

[Boom not bust]

All I know is that it is a breath of fresh air to have a coach that line matches (particularly with a talent like McDavid) and calls time outs when advantageous and properly slots in Lucic.

 

[A91]

The fact that he didn't match lines or his adjustments were as bad as they were shows he wasn't giving 100%.

Thats just who he is as a coach