Series Discussion: ECQF: Capitals vs. Leafs pt2 (Caps Win 4-2) (Leafs fans READ POST #1)

Fallschirmyager

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Jun 25, 2009
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Maybe they are getting 2-3 times more because they are trying 2-3 times more for bounces to go their way. Just a theory.

I will say it again, don't obsess over the goals. Look at what TO is trying the other times they don't score to see the pattern. They are not trying to beat Holts directly, 123456 nor 7 hole. I think its a brilliant move. It is working to the point they have Holts so befuddled he is practicing by himself. Why would he do that, if its all been blind dumb luck?

Other teams crest crest away, foolishly I might add. If you take 100 shots 1 has to go in. We have seen the red white and blue do that for 3 decades of playoff... failure.

I will stick to my guns and think unless Holts can adjust, we should expect 3-4 more per game against.

Babcock is a pain in the ass. Also evidenced through his end of game stall tactics. Little that is happening, is a coincidence.

As far as Babcock goes the CAPS should be lighting up the league demanding he be given delay of game minors. The league probably won't because it's Babcock.

Throwing 40 pucks a game into the tangle of skates and legs a game trying to get the bounces is fine but it still comes down to lucky bounces. TO should keep trying it until it doesn't work and then change.

However, the best defense to this is the way the CAPS played the first period. In the other end of the ice. The mistake was not continuing to press in the 3rd. They spent almost the entire time on their heals. That test of wills must be won and we can get another win.
 
Apr 28, 2004
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I have to agree with Bob, ronto has had insane puck luck this series and Holtby has looked rather pedestrian.
 

trick9

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Jun 2, 2013
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G4 was tighter than expected. Holtby was trash most of the night but Leafs didn't run out of luck as i expected. 3 fluky goals again and all the help in the world from the referees and they still couldn't win.

Andersen holds Backstrom's leg and then goes to hug him is a goaltender interference?

They've got this now.
 

FloridaCap

Beaglechuk Mania
Jun 30, 2012
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Gotta say... if we survive the series, and I expect we will, Toronto was the perfect team to get us ready for Pittsburgh.

Same speed, same luck :P
 

BobRouse

Registered User
Mar 18, 2009
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Trotz is even alluding to "puck luck" as he says it's hard to judge Holtby because of all the 'strange stuff' happening on the TO goals

RE: Toronto fans

One thing I find funny (and not just TO fans do this) but after the game where they are frustrated they say stuff like "The Caps aren't even that good!" or "they suck and will get crushed in the 2nd round!" or something along those lines.

What they are truly saying is that there team must suck 10x harder since they are losing to a sucky team. Isles fans did the same kind of stuff. Either they really think low of their team or they don't understand the implication they are making.
 

bags92

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Jan 2, 2010
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I have to agree with Bob, ronto has had insane puck luck this series and Holtby has looked rather pedestrian.

Those are two things that I've been thinking have to change sooner or later. No way they continue to get all these lucky bounces, and Holtby has been mediocre at best. Have to imagine he starts to come into his own soon.
 

RandyHolt

Keep truckin'
Nov 3, 2006
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Interesting to read that the "Capitals officials discussed putting in backup Philipp Grubauer to start the third period".

I am a bit surprised most think the Pinball effect Barry mentioned is random luck and is nothing deliberate. That JVR slapper towards the slot, was him trying for a pinball. I cannot be wrong dammit! If I am that was the worst shot on a PP i have ever seen. I guess we will see if it continues the next 3 games. Babcock will only change tactics if it stops working.
 

BobRouse

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Mar 18, 2009
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Interesting to read that the "Capitals officials discussed putting in backup Philipp Grubauer to start the third period".

I am a bit surprised most think the Pinball effect Barry mentioned is random luck and is nothing deliberate. That JVR slapper towards the slot, was him trying for a pinball. I cannot be wrong dammit! If I am that was the worst shot on a PP i have ever seen. I guess we will see if it continues the next 3 games. Babcock will only change tactics if it stops working.

RH....then Babcock and the Leafs remind me of my mom playing Blackjack.

She never hits when she has a hard 14-16 when she faces a dealers face card. When she gets lucky and wins a few times she suddenly believes that she has some secret strategy the whole world doesn't understand.

If they are indeed looking to pinball it (and not just trying to score normally) then they are reminding me of my mom playing blackjack.
 

Demandedace

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Apr 9, 2015
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Haven't been able to catch any of the interviews, has Trotz or any of the media outlets called out the refs for the consistent icing "oops wrong player" tactic being used by Toronto? Our outlets need to bring attention to it if we have any hope of drawing a DoG off of it (I know it's just a pipe dream)
 

RandyHolt

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Nov 3, 2006
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RH....then Babcock and the Leafs remind me of my mom playing Blackjack.

She never hits when she has a hard 14-16 when she faces a dealers face card. When she gets lucky and wins a few times she suddenly believes that she has some secret strategy the whole world doesn't understand.

If they are indeed looking to pinball it (and not just trying to score normally) then they are reminding me of my mom playing blackjack.

Is your mom facing the worlds best card player? Perhaps only through unorthodox play, can she then win. But she only has to win 4 out of 7 hands. She won't go through the 8 shoes where the odds finally start to catch up to her.

TO is facing Holtby, the worlds best playoff goalie of all time, if only statistically. The odds say Toronto will lose to Holtby using conventional means. The deck is stacked against TO playing it straight and cresting Holts hoping for a softie.

Why would we consider yanking Holts and kill his confidence on flukes? IIRC the only reason they didn't is because they didnt want to put Grubs out for a 5 on 3 to start. That tells me Barry thinks he is not making all the saves he should. On what you say are just bad luck goals, nothing any goalie is expected to stop.
 
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BobRouse

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Mar 18, 2009
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Is your mom facing the worlds best card player? Perhaps only through unorthodox play, can she then win. But she only has to win 4 out of 7 hands. She won't go through the 8 shoes where the odds finally start to catch up to her.

TO is facing Holtby, the worlds best playoff goalie of all time, if only statistically. The odds say Toronto will lose to Holtby using conventional means. The deck is stacked against TO playing it straight and cresting Holts hoping for a softie.

Why would we consider yanking Holts and kill his confidence on flukes? IIRC the reason they didn't is because they didnt want to put Grubs out for a 5 on 3 to start. That tells me Barry thinks he is not making all the saves he should. On what you say are just bad luck goals.

I don't buy that really. Trotz himself was quoted as saying Holtby isn't to fault for the strange stuff happening. Its a stretch of 4 games where TO has gotten an impressive helping for fortunate luck and even if it was by design the level of luck they have received has been beyond their wildest expectations if they searched their black corrupted souls.

Haven't been able to catch any of the interviews, has Trotz or any of the media outlets called out the refs for the consistent icing "oops wrong player" tactic being used by Toronto? Our outlets need to bring attention to it if we have any hope of drawing a DoG off of it (I know it's just a pipe dream)

Joe B and Craig were incredulous about it and I'm pretty sure it got mentioned by the studio gang as well. I'd be shocked if the Caps haven't brought this to the leagues attention. The real question is if the league will do anything about it or set a precedent that what Babcock is doing is perfectly fine.
 

Demandedace

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Apr 9, 2015
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Joe B and Craig were incredulous about it and I'm pretty sure it got mentioned by the studio gang as well. I'd be shocked if the Caps haven't brought this to the leagues attention. The real question is if the league will do anything about it or set a precedent that what Babcock is doing is perfectly fine.

In the Anaheim game later on they were intentionally misdrawing the faceoff to drag it out more, but that's not nearly as bad as intentionally sending the wrong player out multiple times and pretending like it was a mistake
 

HecticGlow

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Mar 14, 2016
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Seriously think playing 7D should be on the table when Alzner comes back, especially if Connolly is only going to get 6 minutes TOI on the fourth line with no special teams duties. Playing Connolly over Schmidt at this point would be silly - much better to spread the D's ice time out across 7 guys and benefit from Schmidt's speed, Alzner's PKing and Orpik's reduced ice time.

Putting Shattenkirk or Schmidt on wing for a few shifts could be positive too.

I wonder though if part of why Orpik's been out there and not Schmidt is actually about babysitting Shattenkirk, who notably has been benefiting from the easiest D assignments while arguably struggling a fair bit in his own end. Orpik, in theory, is a better counter balance to that than Schmidt. That's why putting Alzner with Shattenkirk could be beneficial.
 

RandyHolt

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Nov 3, 2006
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I don't buy that really. Trotz himself was quoted as saying Holtby isn't to fault for the strange stuff happening.... .

Know that Trotz is not going to throw Holts under the bus.

Were you not surprised to hear they almost put Grubs in?

I was stunned. I know that Holts is not seeing the typical offensive barrage, and don't consider the goals he is allowing are soft and warranting being yanked in a 2 goal game during intermission.

Have you ever seen a goalie yanked because of goals he is not expected to stop, pucks off heads? I haven't.
 

CapitalsCupReality

It’s Go Time!!
Feb 27, 2002
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You either find a way to make the saves or you don't. He can be a LOT better. That they seriously considered pulling him should clue in people just wanting to give him a pass for "bad breaks".

The guy can be and needs to be a lot better if the Caps are to win a Cup.
 

OV Rocks

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Jan 5, 2014
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Beach with Beer
Haven't been able to catch any of the interviews, has Trotz or any of the media outlets called out the refs for the consistent icing "oops wrong player" tactic being used by Toronto? Our outlets need to bring attention to it if we have any hope of drawing a DoG off of it (I know it's just a pipe dream)

Might be worth the league looking into in the future. If you get caught putting a player out after an icing its an automatic delay of game penalty. That really solves the problem
 

BobRouse

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Mar 18, 2009
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Know that Trotz is not going to throw Holts under the bus.

Were you not surprised to hear they almost put Grubs in?

I was stunned. I know that Holts is not seeing the typical offensive barrage, but don't consider the goals he is allowing are soft and warranting being yanked in a 2 goal game during intermission.

That's why I don't buy that. No chance they would have put in Grubauer after up 4-2 even without that 5 on 3.

I just watched the highlights again....

On that last TO goal...JVR..with no Cap around him just kicks Holtby for no reason. It was a donkey back kick that he did intentionally.

I don't think I've ever seen that in my life. WTH was he thinking and how was that not a penalty? At the very least they should have overturned that goal out of a sense of fairness (since it did distract Holtby altho it probably didn't stop him from making the save)
 

Drakon

Registered User
Mar 31, 2014
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In the Anaheim game later on they were intentionally misdrawing the faceoff to drag it out more, but that's not nearly as bad as intentionally sending the wrong player out multiple times and pretending like it was a mistake

I don't understand why that wouldn't be automatic, mistake or no.
 

895

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Jun 15, 2007
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We as a fanbase should stop with the greatest playoff goaltender of all time bit. It's a claim that's at best disingenuous and at worst embarrassing to make.
 

BobRouse

Registered User
Mar 18, 2009
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We as a fanbase should stop with the greatest playoff goaltender of all time bit. It's a claim that's at best disingenuous and at worst embarrassing to make.

What are you talking about?

I've not seen anyone make that claim. The only claim is a statistical one that he has the best all time sv pctg and that's a fact.
 

traparatus

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Oct 19, 2012
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Know that Trotz is not going to throw Holts under the bus.

Were you not surprised to hear they almost put Grubs in?

I was stunned. I know that Holts is not seeing the typical offensive barrage, and don't consider the goals he is allowing are soft and warranting being yanked in a 2 goal game during intermission.

Have you ever seen a goalie yanked because of goals he is not expected to stop, pucks off heads? I haven't.

Holtby was rattled, no question about it. I don't blame him for it and I think he had a good reason to be rattled. I have trust in him. He has been a rock for the Caps for a long time, he is surrounded by great coaching stuff and at the end of the day, he won the game. I won't lie though, if he lost that game I would be concerned. He'll reset and become what he needs to be in this series. A big fat puck blocker. You can't predict every weird bounce so just make yourself big and block most of the net.

I am much more concerned about the use and play of Shattenkirk in the last three games than I am about Holtby. He can be such a difference maker and I cannot understand what Trotz is doing with him. We finally get Schmidt in the lineup and you can see what a huge difference a smooth skating, talented puck mover can make in this series. Infuriatingly, just as Schmidt get restored into his rightful place in the line up, our other talented offensive-minded puck mover gets dumped to the bottom of the rotation. What the **** is that about?
 

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