TSN: Ducks listening on everyone.

[WhatTheDuck]

How many of those RHD listed are on one year deals?

Only Gudbranson is signed for next year. Does it matter? It would be terrible RD depth either way.

 

[therealkoho]

He seems unmotivated right now I think he is on the block for sure.

unmotivated or not, Manson isn't the player a lot of LeaFlanders think he is, he's a good #4, but I think the buds need a guy who belongs in the 1st pair

a better target on that Duck blueline imo would be Fowler or Lindholm, preferring Fowler tbh, regardless of them both being lefties

 

[WhatTheDuck]

unmotivated or not, Manson isn't the player a lot of LeaFlanders think he is, he's a good #4, but I think the buds need a guy who belongs in the 1st pair

a better target on that Duck blueline imo would be Fowler or Lindholm, preferring Fowler tbh, regardless of them both being lefties

Pretty odd take to be honest. Lindholm is younger, better and on a cheaper contract...and his greatest strength (defending against top competition) represents the Leafs biggest need. Moot point anyway because it's highly unlikely either is dealt.

Also there is nothing wrong with playing Manson on a top pairing. He can be used for 20+ mins per night against top lines, taking on a large portion of the defensive zone starts. Has been doing so for years now.

 

[Liferleafer]

Pretty odd take to be honest. Lindholm is younger, better and on a cheaper contract...and his greatest strength (defending against top competition) represents the Leafs biggest need. Moot point anyway because it's highly unlikely either is dealt.

Ya, i agree. As a Leafs fan in order of targets?
Lindholm
Manson



Fowler

 

[13pacheco31]

Pretty odd take to be honest. Lindholm is younger, better and on a cheaper contract...and his greatest strength (defending against top competition) represents the Leafs biggest need. Moot point anyway because it's highly unlikely either is dealt.

Also there is nothing wrong with playing Manson on a top pairing. He can be used for 20+ mins per night against top lines, taking on a large portion of the defensive zone starts. Has been doing so for years now.

And his production as a top pairing guy has been poor. I agree, he's not a true top pairing guy, he's more of a top 4 that can play top pairing if need be. The way you guys talk him up and the asking price though, I'd think we're talking about a player more in the mold of parayko or trouba or something.

 

[therealkoho]

Ya, i agree. As a Leafs fan in order of targets?
Lindholm
Manson



Fowler

excellent take good to know

Pretty odd take to be honest. Lindholm is younger, better and on a cheaper contract...and his greatest strength (defending against top competition) represents the Leafs biggest need. Moot point anyway because it's highly unlikely either is dealt.

Also there is nothing wrong with playing Manson on a top pairing. He can be used for 20+ mins per night against top lines, taking on a large portion of the defensive zone starts. Has been doing so for years now.

There are only 2 years difference between the two of them, which isn't a whole lot of difference. If Fowler was 5 or 6 years older however, then I think it would really come into play. Fowler is also locked in which allows for cost certainty at the very least, my guess is that Lindholm's next contract will be kinda rich as he'll be a UFA. All in all either guy would be great to have, my preference just happens to be Fowler

inre to Manson being a 2nd pairing guy that "can" play the first pair, just doesn't make him a first pairing guy, Manson's numbers aren't all that much different from Ceci's who happens to be another 2nd pairing guy that was playing in the 1st pair. As far as I could tell, Mansons numbers were better overall when playing fewer minutes. The pedigree he carries I think gets a lot of people thinking he's something he's not.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

And his production as a top pairing guy has been poor. I agree, he's not a true top pairing guy, he's more of a top 4 that can play top pairing if need be. The way you guys talk him up and the asking price though, I'd think we're talking about a player more in the mold of parayko or trouba or something.

Trouba is one of the most overrated players in the game. I'd much rather have Manson matched up against opponents top players defensively and he makes half the money.

 

[13pacheco31]

excellent take good to know



There are only 2 years difference between the two of them, which isn't a whole lot of difference. If Fowler was 5 or 6 years older however, then I think it would really come into play. Fowler is also locked in which allows for cost certainty at the very least, my guess is that Lindholm's next contract will be kinda rich as he'll be a UFA. All in all either guy would be great to have, my preference just happens to be Fowler

inre to Manson being a 2nd pairing guy that "can" play the first pair, just doesn't make him a first pairing guy, Manson's numbers aren't all that much different from Ceci's who happens to be another 2nd pairing guy that was playing in the 1st pair. As far as I could tell, Mansons numbers were better overall when playing fewer minutes. The pedigree he carries I think gets a lot of people thinking he's something he's not.

I agree with most of what you said except comparing him to ceci. Ceci is complete hot garbage

 

[WhatTheDuck]

excellent take good to know



There are only 2 years difference between the two of them, which isn't a whole lot of difference. If Fowler was 5 or 6 years older however, then I think it would really come into play. Fowler is also locked in which allows for cost certainty at the very least, my guess is that Lindholm's next contract will be kinda rich as he'll be a UFA. All in all either guy would be great to have, my preference just happens to be Fowler

inre to Manson being a 2nd pairing guy that "can" play the first pair, just doesn't make him a first pairing guy, Manson's numbers aren't all that much different from Ceci's who happens to be another 2nd pairing guy that was playing in the 1st pair. As far as I could tell, Mansons numbers were better overall when playing fewer minutes. The pedigree he carries I think gets a lot of people thinking he's something he's not.

Age is far from the biggest factor though, Lindholm is a better player and he's cheaper for at least the next couple seasons.

Lindholm puts up similar offensive numbers with less PP time and heavier defensive usage. He's not only clearly the better Dman, but his superior defensive ability also makes him a better fit for the Leafs needs.

Your biggest need is to improve defensively, preferring Fowler over an elite defender makes zero sense. Nothing against Fowler, I've defended him a lot on these boards, but Lindholm is the superior player without question.

 

[13pacheco31]

Trouba is one of the most overrated players in the game. I'd much rather have Manson matched up against opponents top players defensively and he makes half the money.

I think you're going to find yourself on an island on that one. Trouba gets paid more but he's a far better player than manson. He's very good defensively and is capable of contributing offensively. But that's besides the point. I was just using trouba's play as a comparison as to what type of player I'd expect manson to be for his asking price.

 

[Liferleafer]

excellent take good to know



There are only 2 years difference between the two of them, which isn't a whole lot of difference. If Fowler was 5 or 6 years older however, then I think it would really come into play. Fowler is also locked in which allows for cost certainty at the very least, my guess is that Lindholm's next contract will be kinda rich as he'll be a UFA. All in all either guy would be great to have, my preference just happens to be Fowler

inre to Manson being a 2nd pairing guy that "can" play the first pair, just doesn't make him a first pairing guy, Manson's numbers aren't all that much different from Ceci's who happens to be another 2nd pairing guy that was playing in the 1st pair. As far as I could tell, Mansons numbers were better overall when playing fewer minutes. The pedigree he carries I think gets a lot of people thinking he's something he's not.

Gee, sorry my opinion doesn't match yours...i'll try harder next time.

 

[therealkoho]

Age is far from the biggest factor though, Lindholm is a better player and he's cheaper for at least the next couple seasons.

Lindholm puts up similar offensive numbers with less PP time and heavier defensive usage. He's not only clearly the better Dman, but his superior defensive ability also makes him a better fit for the Leafs needs.

Your biggest need is to improve defensively, preferring Fowler over an elite defender makes zero sense. Nothing against Fowler, I've defended him a lot on these boards, but Lindholm is the superior player without question.

so let's just go with your take

what's the price for Lindholm?

 

[therealkoho]

Gee, sorry my opinion doesn't match yours...i'll try harder next time.

please don't wouldn't want to see you hurt yourself

 

[WhatTheDuck]

I think you're going to find yourself on an island on that one. Trouba gets paid more but he's a far better player than manson. He's very good defensively and is capable of contributing offensively. But that's besides the point. I was just using trouba's play as a comparison as to what type of player I'd expect manson to be for his asking price.

There's a reason why Rangers fans are already hating that contract, and no I'm definitely not the only one around here who wouldn't want to pay Trouba anywhere close to 8M or have to use him against top matchups. He's not "very good defensively" at all.

 

[AfroThunder396]

So what's the deal with Ondrej Kase? Seems like the kind of guy I would want to build around, yet there are always these rumors of him being shopped for a defenseman. Is he available?

 

[WhatTheDuck]

so let's just go with your take

what's the price for Lindholm?

He's not going anywhere. Having a true top shutdown guy and top goalie puts the Ducks miles ahead of where most retooling teams have to start from.

I just thought it was silly to prefer Fowler when Lindholm is both better and more suited to the Leafs needs. Realistically don't expect either to be moved.

 

[Liferleafer]

please don't wouldn't want to see you hurt yourself

Oh i'll be fine. Just didn't see the need to justify why i would prefer Lindholm (26..and although a lefty, much better than Fowler while signed for 2 more years at 5.2) first...then Manson (RHD, defense 1st solid player at 27 with 2 more years at 4.1) second...both before Fowler (already older than both at 28... lefty, and still having 6 more years at 6.5)

If i were choosing a LHD (not sure why with Rielly/Muzzin?Dermott)...why wouldn't i choose the younger and better Lindholm? The bigger question is why not choose the RHD that fits exactly what the Leafs need (Manson) before Fowler.


I hope that's a better "take" for you.

 

[I am Canadian]

So what's the deal with Ondrej Kase? Seems like the kind of guy I would want to build around, yet there are always these rumors of him being shopped for a defenseman. Is he available?

Why would you build around a 40p winger?

 

[WhatTheDuck]

So what's the deal with Ondrej Kase? Seems like the kind of guy I would want to build around, yet there are always these rumors of him being shopped for a defenseman. Is he available?

Going back to the Kase for Faulk rumors, it sounds as though they'd at least entertain moving him.

The kid has so much upside, but with the Ducks being a penny pinching team and Murray having expressed his frustration with an injury prone bunch - I get the sense that even if Kase was having a healthy and productive year, Murray would be weary about committing long term due to the previous injury problems.

I don't think the Ducks will trade him for the sake of a trade, if they can't get more than the price Lebrun suggested (nothing essentially), then it definitely makes more sense to hold on. But if something the Ducks really need (expansion exempt RHD prospect for example) gets put on the table, I'm sure they're willing to talk.

I really do hate the idea of selling low on Kase, his ability to drive the play is second to only Getzlaf among Ducks forwards. But he hasn't nearly been able to prove himself as much as guys like Silf and Rakell.

 

[therealkoho]

He's not going anywhere. Having a true top shutdown guy and top goalie puts the Ducks miles ahead of where most retooling teams have to start from.

I just thought it was silly to prefer Fowler when Lindholm is both better and more suited to the Leafs needs. Realistically don't expect either to be moved.

if that's the case nice talking to you, wouldn't want to sound silly there champ

 

[IPS]

He's not going anywhere. Having a true top shutdown guy and top goalie puts the Ducks miles ahead of where most retooling teams have to start from.

I just thought it was silly to prefer Fowler when Lindholm is both better and more suited to the Leafs needs. Realistically don't expect either to be moved.

Agreed I don't think anything short of a drastic over-payment is prying Lindholm out of Anaheim.

Anaheim's already got a terrific forward group for prospects, having a defensemen like Lindholm to play behind them is a big plus.

 

[13pacheco31]

There's a reason why Rangers fans are already hating that contract, and no I'm definitely not the only one around here who wouldn't want to pay Trouba anywhere close to 8M or have to use him against top matchups. He's not "very good defensively" at all.

He hasn't been living up to his contract in New York but just as jets fans what they thought about him

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Agreed I don't think anything short of a drastic over-payment is prying Lindholm out of Anaheim.

Anaheim's already got a terrific forward group for prospects, having a defensemen like Lindholm to play behind them is a big plus.

Yeah I think some people who advocate for a complete scorched earth tear down forget that the Ducks already have a high end prospect pool, and another early pick this year and very likely next. If some key contributors emerge on ELCs over the next couple seasons, the Ducks won't be down and out for long (especially in the Pacific). That's assuming they aren't having to try and go find players to replace Lindholm and Gibson as well.

 

[Papa Francouz]

I know it's likely been discussed previously in this thread, but what would the cost on Silfverberg look like, Ducks bros?

 

[darkwingduck]

I know it's likely been discussed previously in this thread, but what would the cost on Silfverberg look like, Ducks bros?

Probably more than Rakell, felt he was available to be had last year, but management clearly made it apparent Silfverberg will be here for awhile. I personally don't think he's a trade option like others are. Sorry.