Speculation: Dreger: Detroit are eager to make a move

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detredWINgs

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Totally random, but I had a dream last night that we traded Quincey for Robidas and there was speculation that Nill had actually been the guy to push for getting Quincey back in the first place.

Putting this here as evidence of my dream-state psychic powers, in case it happens. :naughty:
 

Bench

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Totally random, but I had a dream last night that we traded Quincey for Robidas and there was speculation that Nill had actually been the guy to push for getting Quincey back in the first place.

Putting this here as evidence of my dream-state psychic powers, in case it happens. :naughty:

In a similar vein, I had a dream I was being eaten by a taco. So I'd say the two confirm one another.
 

ArGarBarGar

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What the hell?

What's wrong with my line of reasoning.

Where have i "made up up" ridiculous reasoning?


Franzen was paid to $44M to be a chump.
He was paid to be reliable, hard working scorer.

He is paid to produce. If he produces like he has been for the past 3 seasons he will have had a good year. Perhaps not great but good.

25-30 goals is nothing to scoff at. And if he plays poorly he will be criticized for it, regardless of the contract. It's a dumb thing to bring up.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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Of course, when some of this stuff actually happens, you won't bring this up. Then next time you're unhappy, you'll say the exact same thing.

i 100% promise if KH makes an aggressive or bold move I will be the first to congratulate him and say well done

untill then or unless then, I am right

i dont support the "easy move" approach

i support the tough move or the right move regardless of cost
 

WingedWheel1987

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Nyquist being in the lineup "sooner rather than later" is still a massive failure on Holland's part. Thanks for bringing back garbage like Cleary. Charles Barkley thinks Ken Holland is a turrible GM.

How a GM can go ahead and bring back garbage like Cleary when you have a player like Nyquist waiting to play is inexcusable. It's like Holland doesn't want the team to succeed.

Holland will not make any bold moves. He is too mentally weak to make any bold moves. Soooooooo much cap space wasted on so many mediocre players.
 

RedWingsNow*

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And Pavel's getting a pay raise. Franzen never will.

Right.

it doesn't change a ****ing thing.

Franzen is paid to be a big producer.

You guys act that because his ******** cap circumventing deal provides a low cap hit, that he's some kind of bargain and therefore not expected to produce or work hard.

I'm saying that's bull ****.

He's paid to produce. He's paid to bring it every night.

Not float around until he gets shifted to a new position.

He's got no heart out there.
 

ArGarBarGar

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Right.

it doesn't change a ****ing thing.

Franzen is paid to be a big producer.

You guys act that because his ******** cap circumventing deal provides a low cap hit, that he's some kind of bargain and therefore not expected to produce or work hard.

I'm saying that's bull ****.

He's paid to produce. He's paid to bring it every night.

Not float around until he gets shifted to a new position.

He's got no heart out there.
Find me someone who says that.
 

RedWingsNow*

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He is paid to produce. If he produces like he has been for the past 3 seasons he will have had a good year. Perhaps not great but good.

25-30 goals is nothing to scoff at. And if he plays poorly he will be criticized for it, regardless of the contract. It's a dumb thing to bring up.

25 goals is nothing to scoff at.

He's paid for more than 25 goals. He's paid to work hard and show up with intensity every game.

If he was a 25 goal guy who played soft, lazy hockey, he wouldn't have gotten a lifetime contract based on 14 months of hockey.

We could just go find Ryan Malones and Jiri Hudlers to score 25 goals for 3 and 4 year deals.
 

Vladdy84

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The people who are lining up behind this notion that Franzen is earning his money when he only shows up to play 20 games a year.

I don't think anyone truly believes that who actually watches all these games. It's more like it's not the end of the world if a player with a 3.95M cap hit only scores 20-25 goals. There's a lot of players like that. I get mad as hell watching him play 75% of the time. Nothing can be done about it. From what I understand a buy-out is out of the picture. Or can a compliance buy-out be used next year without penalty? I think a coaching change would help. But who knows?
 

SoupNazi

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I don't think anyone truly believes that who actually watches all these games. It's more like it's not the end of the world if a player with a 3.95M cap hit only scores 20-25 goals. There's a lot of players like that. I get mad as hell watching him play 75% of the time. Nothing can be done about it. From what I understand a buy-out is out of the picture. Or can a compliance buy-out be used next year without penalty? I think a coaching change would help. But who knows?

A compliance buyout can be used without penalty; after using the one on CC last summer we have one more left.
 

Winger98

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I don't think anyone truly believes that who actually watches all these games. It's more like it's not the end of the world if a player with a 3.95M cap hit only scores 20-25 goals. There's a lot of players like that. I get mad as hell watching him play 75% of the time. Nothing can be done about it. From what I understand a buy-out is out of the picture. Or can a compliance buy-out be used next year without penalty? I think a coaching change would help. But who knows?

Yeah, there's another compliance buy out without a penalty available next year, unless a team used both buyouts this summer.

I don't know if there's a good way of wording it. I mean, the guy's caphit is $3.95m. He scores 25+ goals a year. Yeah, he floats, but if we were told we could sign a 25 goal scorer for $4m a year, I have to think we'd jump on the guy.
 

Vladdy84

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A compliance buyout can be used without penalty; after using the one on CC last summer we have one more left.

That's what I thought. But I don't think there's anyway Holland would do it. Even if he wanted to it would probably anger Kronwall, Big E and Z big time. So he wouldn't do it. And let's be honest, what free agents in the 2014 class could replace Mule's production in the 4M - 5M range on a relatively short term deal? All the players that I see are older and will cost more on the market.
 

SoupNazi

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And let's be honest, what free agents in the 2014 class could replace Mule's production in the 4M - 5M range on a relatively short term deal?

Nobody. That's the problem.

We will likely LTIR him before he can retire and stick us with the cap hit though.
 

ArGarBarGar

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If that's not what you think, explain why my opinion is "'ridiculous."

My opinion is he should produce, considering that is why he got the contract in the first place. If he can produce even with a lethargic attitude I will say he is earning the minimum of the money he is allotted. Doesn't mean I say he shouldn't compete. Every player should compete. I also don't think he is "some kind of bargain." So you have my position completely wrong.

Also, 25 goal scorer? I suppose I was incorrect in that statement. He's not technically a "30 goal scorer", but he is pretty close.

Franzen's last goal totals:

2013: (assuming production is consistent) 28 goals
2012: 29 goals
2011: 28 goals
2010: (assuming production is consistent even with a skewed 27 game sample) 30 goals
2009: 34 goals (in a huge offensive year for just about every Wing with offensive ability)

Hudler's best season is 25 goals, and has passed the 20 goal mark twice. Malone's best season is 27, and has basically scored at less than 25 goals for most of his career. Yeah, Franzen may be severely underwhelming to watch, but he provides goal scoring ability that puts him among the top goal scorers on the Wings consistently each year. He has not been what we have wanted, but he has scored and put up points on a consistent basis.

I will agree he is ripe for a compliance buyout over the offseason based on what he has provided so far.
 

ArGarBarGar

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That's what I thought. But I don't think there's anyway Holland would do it. Even if he wanted to it would probably anger Kronwall, Big E and Z big time. So he wouldn't do it. And let's be honest, what free agents in the 2014 class could replace Mule's production in the 4M - 5M range on a relatively short term deal? All the players that I see are older and will cost more on the market.

This is where a GM needs to pick up the phone and make a trade. Trade for youth. Trade for some temporary help. Trade for something that can provide help for the puck-possession game which has been having an issue for the past 4 years.

If Franzen doesn't score at his usual clip this season, then I'm not sure you can roll the dice that he gets it rolling again.
 

detredWINgs

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The thing with Franzen is, he's way too young (or perhaps the correct wording is "not far enough into his contract") to be looking at a 15 goal, 40 point season. There are plenty guys like that in the NHL, and I can't think of any right now who are signed for another half decade.

Also, one of the main sources of aggravation with Franzen is that he just...doesn't...try. We aren't talking about a 40 year old. We aren't talking about an injury-riddled vet. We aren't talking about a guy who is learning a new style or playing for an unfamiliar coach. We're talking about a dude who got his money and had since mailed it in. It's disgusting, especially considering his nickname is based on his long-lost work ethic.
 

The Zetterberg Era

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The thing with Franzen is, he's way too young (or perhaps the correct wording is "not far enough into his contract") to be looking at a 15 goal, 40 point season. There are plenty guys like that in the NHL, and I can't think of any right now who are signed for another half decade.

Also, one of the main sources of aggravation with Franzen is that he just...doesn't...try. We aren't talking about a 40 year old. We aren't talking about an injury-riddled vet. We aren't talking about a guy who is learning a new style or playing for an unfamiliar coach. We're talking about a dude who got his money and had since mailed it in. It's disgusting, especially considering his nickname is based on his long-lost work ethic.

There are rumors that isn't what his nickname is based on at all, that the Wings dressing room pulled a fast one on media people. Have heard that a few times, including from people around the team, they cleaned up the reasoning for those that would ask and found it humorous how quickly that spread.
 

Flowah

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There are rumors that isn't what his nickname is based on at all, that the Wings dressing room pulled a fast one on media people. Have heard that a few times, including from people around the team, they cleaned up the reasoning for those that would ask and found it humorous how quickly that spread.

I have to believe this rumor. One because it's hilarious. Two because it makes more sense for a guy that I see taking nights off 80% of the time.
 

The Zetterberg Era

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I have to believe this rumor. One because it's hilarious. Two because it makes more sense for a guy that I see taking nights off 80% of the time.

Also worth noting when it first started happening there were two different reasons given that I remember hearing. One was that he quit chewing tobacco and was "angry as a mule" as the expression goes, the other being Yzerman's more popular the guy is massive and can carry the load like a mule. But like I said have heard on several occasions the actual meaning behind it is what you would expect from a locker room full of dudes.
 

ArGarBarGar

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The thing with Franzen is, he's way too young (or perhaps the correct wording is "not far enough into his contract") to be looking at a 15 goal, 40 point season. There are plenty guys like that in the NHL, and I can't think of any right now who are signed for another half decade.

Also, one of the main sources of aggravation with Franzen is that he just...doesn't...try. We aren't talking about a 40 year old. We aren't talking about an injury-riddled vet. We aren't talking about a guy who is learning a new style or playing for an unfamiliar coach. We're talking about a dude who got his money and had since mailed it in. It's disgusting, especially considering his nickname is based on his long-lost work ethic.

One would expect (or hope) that he breaks out of this slump and puts together enough decent hockey to keep with his previous numbers.
 

DatsyukToZetterberg

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You have to wonder what we will do once we move the cap casualty player. We will then just have enough cap space to fit everyone in as it is if we want to make a trade to inject some life or at the TD we will have to clear more salary.

If we continue to play poorly I wouldn't mind seeing a bit of a blockbuster move. With Florida apparently looking to move out some players I wonder if Campbell or Fleischmann would be made available. both would help us out tremendously, Flash would fit in perfectly on the 2nd line with Weiss & Tatar, Campbell would give us one of the best PMD in the league and a legit PPQB.

I've been a proponent for trading for Campbell back to last years deadline. The only thing is that his contract is huge & we have little cap space. Say we traded for both of Campbell & Fleischmann we could roll a lineup of:

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Alfredsson
Fleischmann-Weiss-Tatar
Nyquist-Franzen-Bertuzzi
Abdelkader-Andersson/Helm-Miller

Kronwall-Campbell
Ericsson-Smith
Kindl-DeKeyser
Lashoff

Though that lineup seems a bit to much like fantasy. Cleary isn't in it & I'm not sure we have enough cap space to make it work but we shouldn't have a problem scoring anymore with a lineup like that.
 
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