OT: Does the coverage this team gets bother you?

KasperTheGrittyGhost

Registered User
Jan 12, 2008
1,401
255
Michigan
Does the coverage team for the Red Wings--Malik, St. James, Khan, 97.1, etc.--bother you? I've always recognized the people that cover pro sports in this area are a bit off the edge, but recently it's began to seriously bother me.

I don't see anyone close to that organization that will call people who matter out (Looking at you Kenny...). I don't hear anyone asking Babcock tough, honest questions. I don't hear anyone bringing stats to the fold. I hear and read excuses being made for the team. I hear "it's wasn't that bad", and the "defense was great" after a loss.

Does this bother anyone else? Is the team responsible for this? It drives me nuts.
 
Jul 30, 2005
17,659
4,588
I mean, what is location, really
I think the fact that everybody else in the hockey world doesn't think it's as bad as this forum does might be a reason to re-evaluate the position.

That's not to say that this forum is dead wrong, but we're hyperbolic at best. We're making mountains out of molehills and setting up ski resorts up there. I think it largely comes from how uncomfortable this fanbase is with having a poor team.
 

SirloinUB

Registered User
Aug 20, 2010
4,642
2,120
Canada
Yes and No. I agree with Guru:

I think the fact that everybody else in the hockey world doesn't think it's as bad as this forum does might be a reason to re-evaluate the position.

That's not to say that this forum is dead wrong, but we're hyperbolic at best. We're making mountains out of molehills and setting up ski resorts up there. I think it largely comes from how uncomfortable this fanbase is with having a poor team.

That being said, I think you might be on to something with the tough question bit. It would be nice to see members of the media publicaly challenge our braintrust and coaching. And im not just talking about writing a blog. I would have liked to see somebody ask babcock why datsyuk was playing with two grinders and no finesse/skill guys. Are two guys necessary to drag the piano? why can't one guy drag it and have two guys playing a duet?
 

KasperTheGrittyGhost

Registered User
Jan 12, 2008
1,401
255
Michigan
Red Wings fans in general can be pretty nasty people. I think what bothers people most about this team--atleast what bothers me most--is that it doesn't seem to have a direction. We bottleneck our prospects to save "the playoff streak". We don't move those guys to get better now. In hindsight, our GM has made consistently poor decisions in personnel management since 2009.

There isn't much "good" to grab ahold of.
 

Flowah

Registered User
Nov 30, 2009
10,249
547
I think the fact that everybody else in the hockey world doesn't think it's as bad as this forum does might be a reason to re-evaluate the position.

That's because until it's catastrophic, the Red Wings have over two decades of excellence as a reputation preventing most onlookers from a real critical and objective evaluation.

But even that's starting to fall apart. Watch the NHL channel on the Wings sometimes. They don't really pick them to win anymore. And they note how dearly this team misses Lids and how different it is compared to its former glory.

Sure, they'll always throw out the obligatory "But you can't ever count em out!" But that's empty talk.
 
Jul 30, 2005
17,659
4,588
I mean, what is location, really
That's because until it's catastrophic, the Red Wings have over two decades of excellence as a reputation preventing most onlookers from a real critical and objective evaluation.

But even that's starting to fall apart. Watch the NHL channel on the Wings sometimes. They don't really pick them to win anymore. And they note how dearly this team misses Lids and how different it is compared to its former glory.

Sure, they'll always throw out the obligatory "But you can't ever count em out!" But that's empty talk.
Yeah, maybe I wasn't very clear. I don't think the Wings are a good team; I think they're a bad team. I just think they're bad in an ordinary way that happens to every team eventually. It's not special or notable in any way.
 

The Zetterberg Era

Ball Hockey Sucks
Nov 8, 2011
40,956
11,575
Ft. Myers, FL
We did this thread during a tough point in the season and the honest question is a lot of the media look at the man games lost and some of the the other things and think they are doing quite well. I don't agree but, there seems to be that notion in a lot of the writers. This is where a lot of people thought we would be without some of the issues that have cropped up anyway.

As for the local crew, the Wings are a hard team to cover. Over the years both management and players have completely gone with a process of freezing out media types they didn't like. This really took off with Yzerman in the early/mid 90's. So those that have been around the team are about as soft as it gets. Kronwall is probably the best guy to go to with a quote and get an honest dead assessment and even there he basically blames himself and doesn't give you anything juicy. Z is pretty similar but uses more classic throw away cliches.

Babcock and Holland should have to answer more uncomfortable questions and would in a lot of different markets. They are protected in some ways by their track records, but also by the soft mentality and kid gloves environment that the Wings setup.

The other factor is this doesn't move the dial or really sell papers. There is no reason to get up in arms, in a lot of ways it is cutting off your nose to spite your face. I do wonder what people like Khan and St. James think that play ball to the ridiculous Red Wings way only to have stories like the JayBo package broken by larger media figures? Personally that would bother me a lot if I was those two.
 

Flowah

Registered User
Nov 30, 2009
10,249
547
Yeah, maybe I wasn't very clear. I don't think the Wings are a good team; I think they're a bad team. I just think they're bad in an ordinary way that happens to every team eventually. It's not special or notable in any way.

I don't understand why you think Wings fans are being hyperbolic then.

I can't think of a single person who thinks this team is the worst in the league. No one is going to say a team like Colorado, Calgary, Sabres, Panthers, are better than the Wings.

Even most of the people critical of Holland and Babcock know that the pipeline has a ton of talent incoming. That's actually a large reason for the frustration. Because the team has some of the tools to be successful right now and it's not using them.

Seems pretty on the mark with your own assessment of the team. Not a good team, not the worst team. Mediocre to bad.

This is the problem with some people on this board. For them, criticism of Holland/Babcock is somehow equated to "BLOW THIS TEAM UP." "SINK FOR SETH." "WORST TEAM IN THE LEAGUE." But few, if any, posters are actually saying that.

It's just cliches, cliches, cliches...and media trained players, management etc
Seriously man. Listening to the questions and answers in interviews is a laugh. You could probably make a list of 10 sentences that can be rearranged to be every player/coach's answer to a question. I kinda like Torts for, at least what appears to me, saying exactly what he's thinking with no filter.
 

detredWINgs

Registered User
Jan 1, 2004
17,966
0
Michigan
Visit site
I think the fact that everybody else in the hockey world doesn't think it's as bad as this forum does might be a reason to re-evaluate the position.

That's not to say that this forum is dead wrong, but we're hyperbolic at best. We're making mountains out of molehills and setting up ski resorts up there. I think it largely comes from how uncomfortable this fanbase is with having a poor team.

Right, because when Abdelkader has 4 points in 30 games, and the media is lauding him for his play while Wings fans are calling him out, its clearly the media that has their heads on straight.

Like most things in life, a superficial glance isn't going to reveal fundamental flaws.
 

Flowah

Registered User
Nov 30, 2009
10,249
547
We did this thread during a tough point in the season and the honest question is a lot of the media look at the man games lost and some of the the other things and think they are doing quite well.
Yeah they do that for sure. I've watched them do it. During national coverage of games, sometimes the NBC crew takes a look. The NHL channel does.

What none of them do is actually look at who's been injured and whether it makes an impact. It's not like we lost our #1 defenseman or forward for any length of time like some other teams. And they manage to keep winning somehow.

What's the difference between that and just looking at a stats sheet? We always say, you have to watch the damn games. The sheet at the end will not tell you the whole story, maybe not even half. But that's what those guys are doing. It irks me too when I hear Ken and Mickey pulling water the same way.
Like most things in life, a superficial glance isn't going to reveal fundamental flaws.
You think when you have to cover 30 teams, and Detroit isn't your home team, you're going to have the time or inclination to go deeper? Doooubt it.
 

GT500x

Im OK where we're at
Jun 15, 2008
2,664
0
My comfort zone
Yes. Yes they do bother me. At least 97.1 will look at flaws and question them but then Mike V. is a wang -- I can't stand him... at all.
 

Vladdy84

L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y
Dec 1, 2011
10,675
12
Farmington
Yes. Yes they do bother me. At least 97.1 will look at flaws and question them but then Mike V. is a wang -- I can't stand him... at all.

I love Valenti. But his hockey opinions are hit and miss. Uses a lot of straw man arguments. And just says **** to say ****. Unfortunately the idiots that call in to talk about the Wings are generally off base 65-75% of the time.
 

Adityase

Registered User
Mar 27, 2002
1,477
39
Troy, MI
Visit site
I don't know that sports reporters are supposed to criticize and pressure teams into making decisions. Where does it say that? You're suggesting a level of mismanagement that most people wouldn't agree with. I know it's frustrating for the posters here, but I believe that in their fandom, most posters here are unrealistic.

Because the team has some of the tools to be successful right now and it's not using them.

This isn't an unreasonable thing to say, but then to suggest that it's sufficient basis to determine that management has failed is a leap in logic.

Reporters are being more realistic. Realizing the team is old, has lost talent, is working in a lot of youth, and has experienced a lot of injuries. Plus they can't demand things like insisting that Filppula and White be traded. That's just not their job.

Lastly, there should be a distinction made in general between reporting facts and providing opinons. I'm not all that familiar with how journalism divides up that work, but I think those are different jobs, right?
 

RedWingsNow*

Guest
I think the fact that everybody else in the hockey world doesn't think it's as bad as this forum does might be a reason to re-evaluate the position.

That's not to say that this forum is dead wrong, but we're hyperbolic at best. We're making mountains out of molehills and setting up ski resorts up there. I think it largely comes from how uncomfortable this fanbase is with having a poor team.

I think you're huperbolic.

Except for 2-3 people, nobody thinks this team is "terriblle" on this forum,

I think the TRUTH is that the wings are just another run-of-the-mill hockey team - injuries or not.

And just saying that makes some of the fans angry and sparks outrage and insults.
'

As for the media -- the Red Wings media blows.

Perfect example is the Abdelkader situation.

First, Abdelkader gets put on the line. No raised eyebrows in the media.
Second. Abdelkader sucks on the line. No questions from the Detroit media.
Third, Abdelkader keeps sucking and Datsyuk's production begins to fall. No questions from the media

Then the Wings play on CBC and CBC says there have been questions in Detroit about Abdelkader playing with Datsyuk.

But where were these questions? Not in the media.

Then Abdelkader scores a hat trick and the Detroit media acts as if Babcock was vindicated. But vindicated from what? From the questions or criticisms the Detroit media never addressed in the first place?

Then Abdelkader goes silent for two weeks again and nobody mentions it again.

Meanwhile, our offense blows.

And the media doesn't ask why we've got CHUMPS like Abdelkader and Miller getting scoring line minutes.

And Obvious answer?

Call up Tatar. Bump Abdelkader to Andersson's center position.
Sit Andersson or Emmerton.

Don't expect to read that in the Detroit media
 
Last edited by a moderator:

RedWingsNow*

Guest
I love Valenti. But his hockey opinions are hit and miss. Uses a lot of straw man arguments. And just says **** to say ****. Unfortunately the idiots that call in to talk about the Wings are generally off base 65-75% of the time.

I can't stand Valenti.

And when it comes to the Red Wings, you can tell he's only talking because it's his obligation.
 

ArGarBarGar

What do we want!? Unfair!
Sep 8, 2008
44,017
11,677
Yes. Yes they do bother me. At least 97.1 will look at flaws and question them but then Mike V. is a wang -- I can't stand him... at all.

Yeah, but he tends to be right on his points.

Every time they do a Red Wings segment with Valenti and Foster nobody calls in. He may bash the team when they are mentioned but he's pretty much spot on with what he is saying.
 

RedWingsNow*

Guest
Yeah, but he tends to be right on his points.

Every time they do a Red Wings segment with Valenti and Foster nobody calls in. He may bash the team when they are mentioned but he's pretty much spot on with what he is saying.

Nobody calls in because Red Wings fans know that their show ranks hockey somewhere after college basketball.
 

ArGarBarGar

What do we want!? Unfair!
Sep 8, 2008
44,017
11,677
Nobody calls in because Red Wings fans know that their show ranks hockey somewhere after college basketball.

Yeah, I think it's a little of column A and a little of column B. To me most of the Red Wings talk is shoehorned into their Karsch and Anderson show and when Caputo puts Ken Kal on the air. Other than that I rarely hear about it. But at the same time the 2-6 slot should have a good number of Wings fans listening in regardless. While I don't care for the majority of what they listen to it's the only sports radio I can get.

Oh well. Maybe we should start our own Red Wings show. :sarcasm:
 

Marky9er

Registered User
Jan 30, 2008
7,476
729
I got a radio app a while back and started listening to 97.1, and they barely mention the wings between NFL mock drafts and complaining about the tigers bullpen.
 

BinCookin

Registered User
Feb 15, 2012
6,160
1,377
London, ON
I have one major complaint about this team right now.

I have no idea why the media has not grilled KH and Babcock about it.

Tatar!

Enough said.

He looked great.

I want some questions answered.
Possible answers I will accept, but maybe not agree with.

1) We sent Tatar down so that we could bring Nyquist up.
2) We sent Tatar down because he is too small
3) We sent Tatar down because he was starting to make us lose (Lie)
4) We sent Tatar down because we want to put rookies on the 3rd line and ease them into the league
5) We sent Tatar down because he had a nagging injury (Didnt look like it)

Also how about just mention his freakin name

1) Babcock... Do you think Tatar played well tonight?
2) Babcock, did you like Tatar's hustle
3) Babcock do you think Tatar brings some skill deeply missing to the third line?

Fark anything.

If i just looked at the media.. Tatar might as well be Mursak... NONEXISTENT!

I saw at worst a new 3rd line player for the DRW, and at best a new 2nd line player.

Just tell me something. Someone ask the questions.

Media!
Arg!
 

Brick Top

LANA!!!!!
Mar 2, 2012
1,847
0
Grand Rapids
In regard to the media coverage, I'd say the coaches and team management enjoy as much of a country club atmosphere as any of the players ever have with the team.

Compared to some other large sports markets, the Wings front office and coaches definitely get a free pass from the local media. If the Wings were in Toronto, Philly, Boston or NY, a lot more of the roster and lineup decisions would be questioned regularly.
 

The Zetterberg Era

Ball Hockey Sucks
Nov 8, 2011
40,956
11,575
Ft. Myers, FL
Would love for one of the beat writers to ask Holland why he hasn't signed our 23 year old draft pick that is 6'2" 195lbs elite skating D-man that was just named a first team all-american over DeKeyser (2nd team).

When Jensen pulls a Schultz on us after next season I am going to be very angry at Holland.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->