Does Bergevin re-sign Emelin and Diaz for next year?

[WestIslander]

I don't see Diaz coming back nor do I see Markov being here this year past the trade deadline, I can see our defense look like this in the future:

Tinordi - Subban
UFA - Emelin
Gorges - Beaulieu

 

[Monctonscout]

I don't see Diaz coming back nor do I see Markov being here this year past the trade deadline, I can see our defense look like this in the future:

Tinordi - Subban
UFA - Emelin
Gorges - Beaulieu

Letting both Markov and Diaz walk would be a huge mistake. At least one needs to be re-signed if not both.

I could see Beaulieu or Nygren possibly replacing Diaz next season but no way either is close to replacing Markov.

Signing UFA d-men is usually a recipe for overpayment.

 

[HabsHockey*]

Get rid of Diaz, Bouillon and Murray on D.

 

[HabsHockey*]

Letting both Markov and Diaz walk would be a huge mistake. At least one needs to be re-signed if not both.

I could see Beaulieu or Nygren possibly replacing Diaz next season but no way either is close to replacing Markov.

Signing UFA d-men is usually a recipe for overpayment.

I'd resign Markov at a discount and keep his minutes down. 2nd line unit and PP and that's it.

 

[Sterling Archer]

Still have to keep him around until those guys actually take his spot with their play though, imo. The guys who didn't impress as much in camp certainly haven't had enough time to make any further case for themselves (certainly not enough to take a well-performing NHLer's spot), and Diaz is currently a 20 min/night guy and our second highest scoring defenseman. I would have to be astounded by hints from his agent as to what he might be asking in the off season, or a lot would have to change between now and the deadline, to make me consider moving Diaz this year.

I didn't say this year. My post was based on next years roster.

Diaz is a 20 minute a night guy because were thin on D right now. If we didn't have the injuries to Emelin, Murray and Drew I doubt he'd see that kind of ice time. Also probably a big reason why Bergevin is looking for more D right now.

Also, just beacuase he's playing 20 minutes a night, doesn't mean he's doing it well. He's exposed often and his lack of size is apparent in front of the net and along the boards.

I doubt very much Diaz is in the Canadiens long term plans as we already have a few offensive defencemen with more size than Diaz. Bringing Beaulieu along this year and allowing him to get used to the NHL level should be the catalyst to not re-sign Diaz at years end. At least that should be the hope for the Canadiens organization and their fans.

Having Beaulieu step up and take Diaz's place will be a step in the right direction for the future of the defence just as getting Tinordi ready to take over for Bou by the end of the year. I think our defence would be a lot better moving forward with Tionordi and Beaulieu than Bou and Diaz.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

Assuming Emelin is fine, which going by 24ch he looks on track, I would keep both and then try to find a play to push Gorges/Markov down a spot:

Emelin - Subban
Markov - XXX
Gorges - Tinordi

Girardi or Giordano would be a dream.

 

[Sterling Archer]

I don't see Diaz coming back nor do I see Markov being here this year past the trade deadline, I can see our defense look like this in the future:

Tinordi - Subban
UFA - Emelin
Gorges - Beaulieu

I'd replace UFA with Markov. Unless they can trade for someone significantly better, I'd see us resigning Markov but for less than what he's making now. Somewhere into he $4M range for 2 years or there abouts. He owes us at least that after his last contract and subsequent injuries and missed games. Also, he's a lost a bit of his step but is still a premier power play specialist.

 

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

Having Beaulieu step up and take Diaz's place will be a step in the right direction for the future of the defence...

Well you tell him that. Basically, if you think it boils down to him or Diaz, then if Beaulieu doesn't show signs of taking over Diaz's role by the time decisions have to be made about his contract (i.e. this trade deadline), then you can't count on Beaulieu as soon as the start of next season, either, so there'd still be a gap left by Diaz (unless Pateryn and/or Nygren also keep themselves in that mix). And remember, this organization isn't looking to develop rookies at any possible expense of making the playoffs, even if it seems like a no-brainer to anyone else.

 

[Issacar]

Emelin, absolutely, Diaz it dépends on what kind of contract he is looking for. I wouldn't really give him more hten what he currently earns, he'd also have to accept that his role could be diminished too.

 

[Sterling Archer]

Well you tell him that. Basically, if you think it boils down to him or Diaz, then if Beaulieu doesn't show signs of taking over Diaz's role by the time decisions have to be made about his contract (i.e. this trade deadline), then you can't count on Beaulieu as soon as the start of next season, either, so there'd still be a gap left by Diaz (unless Pateryn and/or Nygren also keep themselves in that mix). And remember, this organization isn't looking to develop rookies at any possible expense of making the playoffs, even if it seems like a no-brainer to anyone else.

I do think that Beaulieu can and will earn a spot this year as will Tinordi.

Giving rookies time to slowly wok their way into the line up and get acclimated will not destroy their learning curve or confidence. Look at the Gally's last year they were sheltered with his time and type do ice time their were exposed to. I don see why Tins and Beaulieu can't dot he same this year and be ready for a more prominent year next year.

Nothing Diaz has done this year in his 5 games or after he came back from injury last year gives me much confidence to play 20 min a night under all circumstances. He's a PP specialist and thats about it.

Watching Beau play, you can see glimpses of the type of player he can be and it's better that what Diaz is showing. Keeping Diaz past this year will only take precious ice time away from better prospects and defensemen.

I don't know wha he or his agent are asking for but I'm sure the Habs can get an upgrade on Diaz in the open market or via trade. Perhaps for DD?

 

[Chili]

I can see Diaz back in the Swiss league more sooner than later (where he is a star). He's not strong enough for the NHL to me.

People are already signing Emelin to long term deals. I'd wait to see how he looks coming back from another serious injury (not his first).

 

[Issacar]

Watching Beau play, you can see glimpses of the type of player he can be and it's better that what Diaz is showing. Keeping Diaz past this year will only take precious ice time away from better prospects and defensemen.

That's an extremist point of view. You are implying that yo ucan't give less ice time to Diaz to favor Beaulieu or TInordi which is nonsense. If Beaulieu or TInordi were outplaying Diaz right now, they'd be getting more ice time then he does.

Keeping Diaz as a #5-7 for the right price wouldn't hurt us at all.

 

[Fizzz]

We have two right handed D in our system in Pateryn and Nygren that makes Diaz and Georges very expendable. I think they should trade Diaz when Emelin, Dreweiski(spell?) and Murray are back or whenever he holds the most value. They can wait out on Georges and keep him around if they cannot sign a good FA.

With Subban gettin a 5m raise, Eller getting a 3m raise and Emelin getting a 2m raise we have to find 11m somewhere! Markov and Gionta are probably not coming back (barring hometown very cap friendly deals). Markov and Gionta give us approx 11m in cap space, there is also Bouillon and Murray who probably will not be back. We can assume the habs will have at least 13m in cap space plus whatever we get in cap augmentation next year. We will not have a ton of cap space to sign a FA, maybe 3-4m, witch do not get you far in the FA market these days!


Emelin - Subban
Beaulieu - FA Right handed shut down D (Georges OR Pateryn IF he steps up next season)
Tinordi - Nygren(Pateryn OR re-sign Diaz)

Emelin and Subban are our best D and they do not play on the same side so it would be illogical to keep them a part.

Beaulieu paired with either a FA veteran RH shutdown D, Georges or Pateryn if he keeps on beast mode in the AHL.

Tinordi and Nygren(Pateryn), i think Nygren will step up and be as or more productive then Diaz. If the Habs go out and sign a free agent RH shutdown D then you can place Pateryn with Tinordi witch would be ideal as a shutdown duo to play against bigger teams.

 

[Sterling Archer]

That's an extremist point of view. You are implying that yo ucan't give less ice time to Diaz to favor Beaulieu or TInordi which is nonsense. If Beaulieu or TInordi were outplaying Diaz right now, they'd be getting more ice time then he does.

Keeping Diaz as a #5-7 for the right price wouldn't hurt us at all.

When did i say that?

All I said was that easing prospects into the lineup is a good way to acclimate them them to the NHL. Diaz is a more trusted option now but so is Bouillon. That doesn't make Bou a better option than Tinordi next year, just right now.

By playing Beau and Tins more now but by managing their ice time, like we did for the Gally's last year, you're only helping the. Goan confidence that can enable them to be better players next year, also, as we're seeing now with the Gally's and Eller.

 

[Issacar]

When did i say that?

All I said was that easing prospects into the lineup is a good way to acclimate them them to the NHL. Diaz is a more trusted option now but so is Bouillon. That doesn't make Bou a better option than Tinordi next year, just right now.

By playing Beau and Tins more now but by managing their ice time, like we did for the Gally's last year, you're only helping the. Goan confidence that can enable them to be better players next year, also, as we're seeing now with the Gally's and Eller.

Re-read your last sentence, what you are saying as nothing to do with what I was saying.

Watching Beau play, you can see glimpses of the type of player he can be and it's better that what Diaz is showing. Keeping Diaz past this year will only take precious ice time away from better prospects and defensemen.

 

[Sterling Archer]

Re-read your last sentence, what you are saying as nothing to do with what I was saying.

Okay....

Am I wrong I saying that? I men there's only so many minutes to go around and eventually you're going to have to play the guys you think have a future more. I don't think the Habs think Diaz will be a better option for them in the future than Beaulieu is. At least I hope not.

 

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

Okay....

Am I wrong I saying that? I men there's only so many minutes to go around and eventually you're going to have to play the guys you think have a future more. I don't think the Habs think Diaz will be a better option for them in the future than Beaulieu is. At least I hope not.

But understand that "the future" means within the next 5 months (trade deadline), or at most 9-10 months when we're talking about the draft and shoring up next year's starting lineup. It's not as if a decision must be made between them, it's a matter of do we really need both. We don't get to see Beaulieu 10 months from now and then get to go back 5 months to the deadline to make a big decision about Diaz. Beaulieu is going to get games between now and then regardless, so ball is in his court. This team plans on not just making the playoffs, but winning a series, so Beaulieu is going to have to improve from his current level to help more than Diaz in that regard.

 

[Monctonscout]

I'd replace UFA with Markov. Unless they can trade for someone significantly better, I'd see us resigning Markov but for less than what he's making now. Somewhere into he $4M range for 2 years or there abouts. He owes us at least that after his last contract and subsequent injuries and missed games. Also, he's a lost a bit of his step but is still a premier power play specialist.

Re signing Markov for 2 years at 8 mil is not realistic. Look at the Gochar and Streit deals. Markov is easily better than both.

Plus, not sure that Markov owes the Habs anything, he got hurt playing NHL hockey, for the Habs...not skiing or riding a dirt bike. It sucks that he was out, but I'm sure it was a lot more unpleasant for him than for the Habs.

 

[Monctonscout]

I can see Diaz back in the Swiss league more sooner than later (where he is a star). He's not strong enough for the NHL to me.

People are already signing Emelin to long term deals. I'd wait to see how he looks coming back from another serious injury (not his first).

Guys that are "not strong enough for the NHL" don't play 20+ minutes a game like he has the last 2 years.

I don't think Emelin has a history of knee injuries unless I'm mistaken...

However, I think they'll make sure his knee is close to 100% before signing a big contract.

 

[Issacar]

Re signing Markov for 2 years at 8 mil is not realistic. Look at the Gochar and Streit deals. Markov is easily better than both.

Plus, not sure that Markov owes the Habs anything, he got hurt playing NHL hockey, for the Habs...not skiing or riding a dirt bike. It sucks that he was out, but I'm sure it was a lot more unpleasant for him than for the Habs.

I'm not saying he'll accept 4M$ per, but Markov has taken hometown discount for 80% of his career. Why would he stop taking hometown discount now? I mean a few years ago, he could of tried his luck on hte UFA market and get something similar to Brian Campbell if that's what he really wanted. Even at 5M$ he's a good bargain for his age given his skill set and his presence for younger defensemen like Emelin, Beaulieu or Tinordi.

 

[Monctonscout]

I'm not saying he'll accept 4M$ per, but Markov has taken hometown discount for 80% of his career. Why would he stop taking hometown discount now? I mean a few years ago, he could of tried his luck on hte UFA market and get something similar to Brian Campbell if that's what he really wanted. Even at 5M$ he's a good bargain for his age given his skill set and his presence for younger defensemen like Emelin, Beaulieu or Tinordi.

A home town discount for Markov would be 4 years and 22 mil or 5 years and 24 mil, not 2 years 8 mil.

If you structure his deal the right way...like what I proposed last week...

5 years 24 mil...
1-6 mil
2-6 mil
3-5 mil
4-4 mil
5-3 mil

Then in year 4 and 5 if he becomes expendable or not worth his cap hit, you can trade him to a non cap ceiling team, at 7 mil over 2 years, if he is still a #3-4 calibre guy he is well worth it.

 

[Issacar]

A home town discount for Markov would be 4 years and 22 mil or 5 years and 24 mil, not 2 years 8 mil.

If you structure his deal the right way...like what I proposed last week...

5 years 24 mil...
1-6 mil
2-6 mil
3-5 mil
4-4 mil
5-3 mil

Then in year 4 and 5 if he becomes expendable or not worth his cap hit, you can trade him to a non cap ceiling team, at 7 mil over 2 years, if he is still a #3-4 calibre guy he is well worth it.

I'd be happy if it came down to these parameters. I'd still keep him even if he is not Worth his cap hit in 4-5 years, you can always resign him for less and have a good tool on the PP. By then we should have Nygren, Tinordi, Beaulieu who cna all take the ice time Markov can't take anymore.

 

[Harpo]

I'm in for both. Now is an excellent time to sign Diaz for 2 years. He'lll be cheap and well worth it down the line.

 

[Runner77]

Emelin, absolutely, Diaz it dépends on what kind of contract he is looking for. I wouldn't really give him more hten what he currently earns, he'd also have to accept that his role could be diminished too.

If he reverts back to the type of play he showed early last season, his demands are probably going to be out of wack or be more appealing in an environment that is willing to afford him a larger role. I chuckled when someone dubbed him the Desharnais of defense but essentially, he's more easily replaceable than Emelin. Diaz should be trading fodder as soon as the market will show an openness to him -- get value for him while there is still time.

 

[S Bah]

Diaz's biggest problem IMO is lack of confidence, whether it's to do with his concussions from being hit or just the NA style of hockey, especially in the Habs Division. Having big players that can take the fear aspect out for him might be all it takes for him to excel. Like Phil Kessel and Nazim Kadri of the TML's, before the Leafs became a daunting bunch of thugs those players were playing cowardly. Now they both play like giants without any fear, due to the fact that anyone taking liberties with them, can expect a beating from one of the numerous aforesaid thugs.

So anytime people think that size doesn't make a difference in the way some players produce, just watch how Kessel and Kadri perform knowing their backs are covered. This is why the Habs will be ready to start making serious runs at the SC in 3-4 yrs. Tinordi, Deitz, Thrower, Beaulieu, McCarron and Crisp arrive to back up players like Collberg, Lehkonen, Andrighetto and so forth. When players with their abundance of talent are able to play unfettered by the thugs of the game, Hab fans can really look forward to entertaining hockey from the new version of Canadiens. A multi-cultural group that plays at full speed, hitting, scoring and breaking in the Bell Centre to a few Stanley Cup thrills and quite possibly the 25th SC parade.

Raphael Diaz may be quarterbacking the Habs 2nd PP and dazzling fans with his stickhandling and playmaking learned from his mentor Andrei Markov. It's all coming together under Marc Bergevin and his master plan for Hab greatness once again.