Do most Americans know Hamilton or Ontario?

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ColdSteel2

Registered User
Aug 27, 2010
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I know them both and there are enough teams in that area as it is. They're low on the list of need IMO, even if they can support it.
 

dronald

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Mar 4, 2011
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Hamilton, ON
Oh, I agree with what you say. And I don't think this is an "American" thing. It's marketing.

It's just that I think if you're a fan of the game (any game) it wouldn't matter so much where the teams are from. I think a fan should be more interested in things like the team's performance, excitement level of play, divisional rivalries, their place in the standings, their star players etc., regardless if if was hockey, baseball, football, basketball or lacrosse.

If you're "selling the game", then sell the game. iI people are not going to a game because the team is from Oklahoma City, Cincinnati, Edmonton or Jacksonville, then what does that say about your product and ability to sell it?

I will admit that I am more interested in how the Raptors are doing against teams like the Lakers and the Heat... But that's more due to who's on the team than where the team is located. Even Pittsburgh is easier to sell to everyone because of Crosby.

So I dont know if it is a city issue, or who's on the team? Regardless, you're correct that if you really love say, the Phoenix Coyotes, who cares if they're playing NY, Toronto, LA or Hamilton?

I know them both and there are enough teams in that area as it is. They're low on the list of need IMO, even if they can support it.

Just going to add that when I started this discussion, I realized later I should have put in bold *This is not a discussion about Hamilton's viability or chances of obtaining an NHL team* So far it hasn't been so bad though.
 

Steve Passless*

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America can have terrific universities and a general population that's geographically challenged. I remember kids in high school who couldn't successfully label the states, and these weren't special-needs kids, either.
 

Melrose Munch

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Mar 18, 2007
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I will admit that I am more interested in how the Raptors are doing against teams like the Lakers and the Heat... But that's more due to who's on the team than where the team is located. Even Pittsburgh is easier to sell to everyone because of Crosby.

So I dont know if it is a city issue, or who's on the team? Regardless, you're correct that if you really love say, the Phoenix Coyotes, who cares if they're playing NY, Toronto, LA or Hamilton?



Just going to add that when I started this discussion, I realized later I should have put in bold *This is not a discussion about Hamilton's viability or chances of obtaining an NHL team* So far it hasn't been so bad though.
You can put that in the title still.
 

TheMoreYouKnow

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May 3, 2007
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America can have terrific universities and a general population that's geographically challenged. I remember kids in high school who couldn't successfully label the states, and these weren't special-needs kids, either.

I work in a field where knowledge of these things should be considered standard and I know various people in it who do not know much in the way of countries, cities, capitals - and they aren't all Americans either. There was a funny situation where someone had to do a presentation featuring a big map of Europe and he had individually placed major cities on the map and let's just say he was quite a bit off on a few of them.

In my experience, this is the sort of thing where you have an interest in it or you don't and if you don't, your knowledge on it probably isn't all that.
 
Nov 13, 2006
11,520
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Oh, I agree with what you say. And I don't think this is an "American" thing. It's marketing.

It's just that I think if you're a fan of the game (any game) it wouldn't matter so much where the teams are from. I think a fan should be more interested in things like the team's performance, excitement level of play, divisional rivalries, their place in the standings, their star players etc., regardless if if was hockey, baseball, football, basketball or lacrosse.

If you're "selling the game", then sell the game. iI people are not going to a game because the team is from Oklahoma City, Cincinnati, Edmonton or Jacksonville, then what does that say about your product and ability to sell it?

Why sell Hamilton? It's much easier to sell Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, Boston and Detroit. Do the Leafs hype Phoenix and Florida? If so, why are they much easier tickets to get than Montreal at the ACC?
 

dronald

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Mar 4, 2011
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Hamilton, ON
Why sell Hamilton? It's much easier to sell Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, Boston and Detroit. Do the Leafs hype Phoenix and Florida? If so, why are they much easier tickets to get than Montreal at the ACC?

You can get tickets easy at the ACC?
 

Killion

Registered User
Feb 19, 2010
36,763
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Now I realize you are not the original poster, but the question was not can Americans sell hockey. It was does Hamilton have brand recognition in the US? The answer is a resounding no. What does it all mean?

To me it means that a Hamilton NHL team would be one of those unattractive games in the US that is much harder to sell. Edmonton, Calgary, Florida, Phoenix and in the past Atlanta were tough sells here.

There is nothing wrong with that. Go check out the Leafs, Oilers, Flames or Canucks board and see the complaining from fans that the only games they can get tickets to see are Florida, Columbus, Nashville...Well, Hamilton would be like those teams. Winnipeg will be too after the initial novelty wears off. It has nothing to do with Canada or the US. Ottawa, Toronto,and Montreal traditionally sell well here.

In the purest sense of the form, I agree with this, and it goes back to an earlier thread, "Whats your Optimum NHL Size" and where?. Im old school, and believe you should Go Big or Go Home. Unfortunately or fortunately depending on ones perspective, we cant turn back the clock, nullifying & callously throwing away the in-roads made in many of the newer markets.

In a purely esoteric exercise, if we could wipe the slate clean & drop teams into strictly the largest & well known North American cities, we'd wind up with an 18-24 team league. Were well past such flights of fancy Im afraid, so in dealing with "name recognition", Id be willing to bet not a whole lot of Americans let alone Canadians could tell you exactly where Sunrise is short of "somewhere near Miami?", hence the moniker "Florida Panthers". Similar lines can be drawn to Columbus. Why werent they called the OHIO Blue Jackets?. Columbus is not well known, nor is Raleigh, hence the "Carolina" name. Dozens of examples in all sports as we know.

Hamilton is known throughout Canada of course & in the North Eastern US, but still, if its a "branding" issue & Hamilton's considered to be far too colloquial, then you could call them the Upper Canadian Loyalists, the Ontario Ocelots or the Lake Ontario Sea Fleas. Whatever turns your crank. The markets there to support a team in spades, just get it done. Winnipeg as well seems to be going through contortions over this issue with respect to the city name & Jets' moniker. Ideally, Id love to see them use "Winnipeg Jets" as Id love to see the "Hamilton Tigers" re-born. However, the league is not noted for its sentimentality so they'll be holding sway over branding & identification issues regardless.
 

jwhitesj

Registered User
Oct 9, 2006
3,314
2
Downtown San Jose
Hamilton has got to be the biggest city in NA I've never heard of. I just looked it up and was suprised that it's a bigger city than all but 4 of the big cities in California.

LA
San Diego
San Jose
San Francisco
 

Brodie

the dream of the 90s is alive in Detroit
Mar 19, 2009
15,399
359
Chicago
In my experience, this is the sort of thing where you have an interest in it or you don't and if you don't, your knowledge on it probably isn't all that.

Bingo. As with many subjects, there has to be an interest to retain the information. To test this, I called a friend from Canada who was a business major at a top end Canadian university (Waterloo) and asked him to name 3 countries in Africa. He got off South Africa and Chad (noting that he has a cousin named Chad so that one stuck with him) and then gave up. When I named off Libya and Egypt he said, I kid you not, "I thought those were over by India somewhere".

Again, interest level dictates knowledge here universally.
 

IceAce

Strait Trippin'
Jun 9, 2010
5,166
10
Philadelphia
Canada does export quite a bit of pop culture and entertainment to the world.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Canadians

Oh we're quite well aware of your exported entertainment:

Beiber
Nickelback
Celine Dion

Dont think these acts of aggression have gone unnoticed.

Not to mention the brain-washing we all got as kids from You Can't Do That on Television. There's a whole damn generation of us who still to this day every time we say "I dont know" half expect to get hit with a bucket of green oatmeal.


;) :sarcasm:
 
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Killion

Registered User
Feb 19, 2010
36,763
3,211
Oh we're quite well aware of your exported entertainment:

Beiber
Nickelback
Celine Dion

Dont think these acts of aggression have gone unnoticed.

:biglaugh::thumbu: Err, sorry bout dat. 1 out of 3 aint bad (Nickleback).
 

tarheelhockey

Offside Review Specialist
Feb 12, 2010
84,982
137,355
Bojangles Parking Lot
Hamilton has got to be the biggest city in NA I've never heard of. I just looked it up and was suprised that it's a bigger city than all but 4 of the big cities in California.

LA
San Diego
San Jose
San Francisco

It's smaller than Sacramento, Bakersfield, and Fresno.

Depending on how you view greater LA it's smaller than Riverside. I get the sense that Riverside/LA is akin to Hamilton/Toronto.

That is to say, the 8th largest city in California, a state with roughly the same population as Canada, is about the same size as the 8th largest city in Canada. Makes sense to me.
 

slimkay

Registered User
Mar 20, 2009
518
0
Montreal
Hamilton has got to be the biggest city in NA I've never heard of. I just looked it up and was suprised that it's a bigger city than all but 4 of the big cities in California.

LA
San Diego
San Jose
San Francisco

Wrong.

Sacramento, Fresno and Bakersfield are also larger (if you include the entire metro).

Long Beach, Oakland and Anaheim are very close as well.
 

jwhitesj

Registered User
Oct 9, 2006
3,314
2
Downtown San Jose
It's smaller than Sacramento, Bakersfield, and Fresno.

Depending on how you view greater LA it's smaller than Riverside. I get the sense that Riverside/LA is akin to Hamilton/Toronto.

That is to say, the 8th largest city in California, a state with roughly the same population as Canada, is about the same size as the 8th largest city in Canada. Makes sense to me.

I thought when I looked on Wikipedia it said that the population was ~650,000, I must have read it wrong.

I just glanced quickly and didn't notice I was reading Metro area not city population.
 
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No Fun Shogun

34-38-61-10-13-15
May 1, 2011
56,093
12,755
Illinois
Oh we're quite well aware of your exported entertainment:

Beiber
Nickelback
Celine Dion

Dont think these acts of aggression have gone unnoticed.

Not to mention the brain-washing we all got as kids from You Can't Do That on Television. There's a whole damn generation of us who still to this day every time we say "I dont know" half expect to get hit with a bucket of green oatmeal.


;) :sarcasm:

You just named the three worst things to come out of Canada.

Even with sarcasm, that's just painful to read.

At least mention freaking Rush! :yo:
 
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