Speculation: Do loan trades exist?

[illpucks]

I'm curious. Is this type of trade allowed by the NHL? What would you think about this sort of trade?

To TOR: Alex Ovechkin 30 percent retained (must return/trade back to WSH by April 12th,2021)

To WSH: William Nylander (must return/trade back to TOR by April 12th, 2021)

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[Qwijibo]

I'm curious. Is this type of trade allowed by the NHL? What would you think about this sort of trade?

To TOR: Alex Ovechkin 30 percent retained (must return/trade back to WSH by April 12th,2021)

To WSH: William Nylander (must return/trade back to TOR by April 12th, 2021)

You’re not actually serious are you?

 

[DingDongCharlie]

You’re not actually serious are you?

He’s serious like Toews vs rookies

 

[6zag]

Considering these type of loans are very common in soccer it's not that out of this world to imagine this - But it hasn't happened in hockey yet and I don't see it happening either. Talent is way more thin in hockey than it is in soccer due to amount of players in the world.

 

[Fig]

This is the closest I could think of...

December 19, 2017

Stars trade Jaime Oleksiak to Penguins for 4th round pick

January 28, 2019

Penguins trade Jaime Oleksiak back to Stars for the same 4th round pick the traded to the Stars

 

[Hostile Offer]

I'm curious. Is this type of trade allowed by the NHL? What would you think about this sort of trade?

To TOR: Alex Ovechkin 30 percent retained (must return/trade back to WSH by April 12th,2021)

To WSH: William Nylander (must return/trade back to TOR by April 12th, 2021)

I'm not sure but the league would probably nix any trade back conditions included in the trade. I believe if it'd be allowed to trade a player to another team for a playoff run for example and then trade him back to his old team (with conditions added to trade), it would've been done already.

 

[Charlie Conway]

I'm not sure but the league would probably nix any trade back conditions included in the trade. I believe if it'd be allowed to trade a player to another team for a playoff run for example and then trade him back to his old team (with conditions added to trade), it would've been done already.

Something similar was done with Keith Tkachuk between the Thrashers and Blues. Blues sent him to the Thrashers for a playoff run. Thrashers traded his rights back for a pick and he re-signed with the Blues. There were conditional picks if he ultimately signed with the Thrashers, but who knows if this was just for looks. I think this is the closest thing to a loan that’s happened.

I didn’t see anything specific about it in the CBA from what I was able to Google—Some stories about players loaned to other AHL clubs and teams needing to pay relocation expenses, but there are limits to types of loans.

I’ll have to read the CBA a bit more.

The real question is why the Caps are retaining 30% for free.

 

[Frenzy31]

Something similar was done with Keith Tkachuk between the Thrashers and Blues. Blues sent him to the Thrashers for a playoff run. Thrashers traded his rights back for a pick and he re-signed with the Blues. There were conditional picks if he ultimately signed with the Thrashers, but who knows if this was just for looks. I think this is the closest thing to a loan that’s happened.

I didn’t see anything specific about it in the CBA from what I was able to Google—Some stories about players loaned to other AHL clubs and teams needing to pay relocation expenses, but there are limits to types of loans.

I’ll have to read the CBA a bit more.

The real question is why the Caps are retaining 30% for free.

I don't think this is correct. The Blues didn't trade for his rights, he just signed as a UFA. Doug Weight did the same thing with the Blues and the Canes.

 

[Hostile Offer]

Something similar was done with Keith Tkachuk between the Thrashers and Blues. Blues sent him to the Thrashers for a playoff run. Thrashers traded his rights back for a pick and he re-signed with the Blues. There were conditional picks if he ultimately signed with the Thrashers, but who knows if this was just for looks. I think this is the closest thing to a loan that’s happened.

I didn’t see anything specific about it in the CBA from what I was able to Google—Some stories about players loaned to other AHL clubs and teams needing to pay relocation expenses, but there are limits to types of loans.

I’ll have to read the CBA a bit more.

The real question is why the Caps are retaining 30% for free.

I think it's a little bit different case as Tkachuk was on an expiring deal and it was just his UFA signing rights that were traded back. A scenario where a player under contract is traded back and forth is much more complicated when it comes to trade conditions, and I'd understand why the league would frown upon that.

 

[Number 57]

I'm not sure but the league would probably nix any trade back conditions included in the trade. I believe if it'd be allowed to trade a player to another team for a playoff run for example and then trade him back to his old team (with conditions added to trade), it would've been done already.

There is absolutely nothing that says a player cannot come back to a team that traded him. It has been done plenty of times in the past

You seem to be a Habs fan, do you know who Tomas Plekanec is? I'm guessing yes

Traded to Toronto as a rental and signed back with Montreal in the off-season

 

[Number 57]

I'm curious. Is this type of trade allowed by the NHL? What would you think about this sort of trade?

To TOR: Alex Ovechkin 30 percent retained (must return/trade back to WSH by April 12th,2021)

To WSH: William Nylander (must return/trade back to TOR by April 12th, 2021)

The only problem here is there is no incentive for Washington to do this. Ovechkin is cleary the better player and Toronto is acquiring him for a cup run. So Washington gets Nylander for a couple of months and then he leaves... this makes zero sense from a Washington point of view. They're loaning Ovechkin to TOR just so they can have Nylander for a few months? Why would they do that?

Now if they would receive some picks or prospects as well, then sure it's doable

 

[Flukeshot]

Each trade would be two separate transactions and there would be no obligation to do the 2nd trade returning the player.

True loans do not exist.

 

[Hostile Offer]

There is absolutely nothing that says a player cannot come back to a team that traded him. It has been done plenty of times in the past

You seem to be a Habs fan, do you know who Tomas Plekanec is? I'm guessing yes

Traded to Toronto as a rental and signed back with Montreal in the off-season

You're missing the point. The premise of "loaning" here is that the traded player would be traded back after spending a couple of months with the other team, while still being under contract and that the trade back would be planned at the time of the first trade. UFAs signing with their old team obviously isn't anything new.

 

[Djp]

I'm not sure but the league would probably nix any trade back conditions included in the trade. I believe if it'd be allowed to trade a player to another team for a playoff run for example and then trade him back to his old team (with conditions added to trade), it would've been done already.

The,eaguehas rules on trading players back on retrntion. I think there was a trade where Pitt traded a player in the summer Thrn wanted him back but coukdnt.

I think the nhl frowns on p,ayoff rental trades like you describe. I recall baseball had such a trade about 20+ yrs ago where a top pitcher goes to a playoff team Then sent back.

 

[Legion34]

Lots of players have went back after UFA. Like glen wesley in Toronto wayyyy back when.

I don’t think it’s likely now. It’s more of the buyout and re sign that has happened recently. Which have been looked into but allowed.

I personally think due to the pandemic eventually the league will allow stuff like this for bonuses.

Ie. trade say OEL to Toronto for a 7th. Toronto pays bonus and then trades him back for assets.

people don’t like stuff like that but money talks and eventually it will happen.

 

[Number 57]

You're missing the point. The premise of "loaning" here is that the traded player would be traded back after spending a couple of months with the other team, while still being under contract and that the trade back would be planned at the time of the first trade. UFAs signing with their old team obviously isn't anything new.

That is not mentioned in the opening post.

Plus he is using Ovechkin as an exemple, who is actually a UFA this year

I get what you're saying, but the OP did not specify anything about this

 

[Jumptheshark]

I'm curious. Is this type of trade allowed by the NHL? What would you think about this sort of trade?

To TOR: Alex Ovechkin 30 percent retained (must return/trade back to WSH by April 12th,2021)

To WSH: William Nylander (must return/trade back to TOR by April 12th, 2021)

the flag would be thrown is the second deal was already agreed at the time of the first deal. As it is part of the first deal and if agreed upon at that that time, both NHL teams would have informed the NHL at that time

 

[LTIR]

Sure, Oilers could then 'loan' McDavid to OTT every time they play Flames.

 

[Hostile Offer]

That is not mentioned in the opening post.

Plus he is using Ovechkin as an exemple, who is actually a UFA this year

I get what you're saying, but the OP did not specify anything about this

It is specified in there though, as in the OP scenario it is agreed that both players would be traded back to their previous teams by April 12th.

 

[Brodeur]

This one is going back a ways, but Phoenix traded Brian Savage to St. Louis at the 2004 trade deadline for future considerations. Part of the agreement was that Phoenix would agree to take Savage back after the season since St. Louis only wanted him for playoff depth and didn't want him on their payroll for a hypothetical 2004-05 season. St. Louis waived him after the regular season and Phoenix claimed him. As I understand it, Phoenix didn't get anything from St. Louis and they merely did it to save whatever salary remained of Savage's contract for the 2003-04 season.

Probably a little tougher to do that in today's NHL due to the sheer number of NTCs.

 

[Hookslide]

Bruins have loaned the Sabres their GM Don Sweeney, and he trades Jack Eichel to the Bruins ............and get this Buffalo does not have to repay the loan........

 

[Del Preston]

This one is going back a ways, but Phoenix traded Brian Savage to St. Louis at the 2004 trade deadline for future considerations. Part of the agreement was that Phoenix would agree to take Savage back after the season since St. Louis only wanted him for playoff depth and didn't want him on their payroll for a hypothetical 2004-05 season. St. Louis waived him after the regular season and Phoenix claimed him. As I understand it, Phoenix didn't get anything from St. Louis and they merely did it to save whatever salary remained of Savage's contract for the 2003-04 season.

Probably a little tougher to do that in today's NHL due to the sheer number of NTCs.

The same thing was done with Geoff Sanderson on the same day as the Savage trade. Columbus sent him to Vancouver with the condition that he would be waived after the season so the Jackets could claim him.

 

[Silky mitts]

Chicago lost the Saad deal going and coming

 

[cyris]

Another one involving St. Louis.
Florida traded Valeri Bure to the Blues on March 2003 and waived him after the season and Florida picked him back up.

 

[DesertPenguin]

It's not unheard of for a team to trade an expiring UFA to a contender, and then sign that UFA back after the season. It happens often enough that I wonder whether the FO has a very off the record conversation with the player beforehand, telling them they are dealing them to a contender but would welcome them back with a new contract in the summer. It's a win for a player who wants to chase a cup during a rebuild, and a win for the home club who gets an asset during what is otherwise a late season tank.