Prospect Info: Development Camp
- Thread starter Nevada Jones
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LadyStanley
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LadyStanley
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Cotter with a goal that IMO should not have counted. The play was blown dead and he chipped the puck in from the goalie's pads after. Second one for Cotter though.
I swear Glass is starting to pull off some passes I didn't think were possible. Granted it's development camp but still. He's the best passer here for sure. He had a pass from behind the net where it looked like he just gave up on the play but what he actually did was make an area pass to the point with just the right amount of speed for the pointman to get to it to continue possession for team white. For reference, aside from the fact that it is just dev camp, I've only ever seen the likes of Crosby, Malkin, Getzlaf, McDavid pull off area passes like that. A pass like that either requires the dumbest amount of luck imaginable or incredible aim and intelligence.
Guys like Bouchard and Leschesyn have not been noticeable at all.
Ferguson finally tested by someone on team white. Nice pass in front to Quinney who couldn't bury it past Ferguson's glove.
I swear Glass is starting to pull off some passes I didn't think were possible. Granted it's development camp but still. He's the best passer here for sure. He had a pass from behind the net where it looked like he just gave up on the play but what he actually did was make an area pass to the point with just the right amount of speed for the pointman to get to it to continue possession for team white. For reference, aside from the fact that it is just dev camp, I've only ever seen the likes of Crosby, Malkin, Getzlaf, McDavid pull off area passes like that. A pass like that either requires the dumbest amount of luck imaginable or incredible aim and intelligence.
Guys like Bouchard and Leschesyn have not been noticeable at all.
Ferguson finally tested by someone on team white. Nice pass in front to Quinney who couldn't bury it past Ferguson's glove.
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Brannstrom finally does something impressive. On an attempted zone exit, two defenders double up on him and he fumbled the puck under the pressure. He not only recovered the puck but shrugged off both guys (bigger than him by a fait bitl attempting to knock him down, spun the puck around, started a breakout and made a solid go ahead pass to Glass to start an offensive chance.
I can kind of see why Wong didn't get a contract last go around. He's more talented than most forwards here for sure but he's too inconsistent in his attempts to play the puck.
Three periods done and it ends 5-0. Team white just couldn't accomplish much with Glass and Kolesar being the only consistently dangerous/effective players.
I'll have a more comprehensive summary when I get home. I'm gonna stick around and see what "player availability" they have planned
I can kind of see why Wong didn't get a contract last go around. He's more talented than most forwards here for sure but he's too inconsistent in his attempts to play the puck.
Three periods done and it ends 5-0. Team white just couldn't accomplish much with Glass and Kolesar being the only consistently dangerous/effective players.
I'll have a more comprehensive summary when I get home. I'm gonna stick around and see what "player availability" they have planned
Here's my full breakdown starting with my top 5 forwards and defenders
F:
Glass
Suzuki
Cotter
Duke
Kolesar
D:
Hague
Whitecloud
Bodak
Nardella
Coghlan
Cody Glass: Despite being held scoreless today I still thought he was the best player on the ice. His passing game combined with his poise and vision in the way he roams around the ice, you can't look at number 9 out there and not think to yourself that this is a guy playing the game on an entirely different plane or dimension. Where I felt he improved from both dev camp and training camp is he was making much smarter decisions with the puck. Be it when to keep holding or when when and how to pass the puck. Where the game was mostly north south chance trading, when Glass got the puck, team White was able to play a competent possession game. They just had no finish for their chances. Glass also made some solid defensive plays both in his own zone and on the forecheck. His tendencies in that regard are clear but I think it might be too much to expect him to become a Bergeron, Toews, Kesler, Kopitar type. He is capable but I wouldn't say dominant defensively. He seemed more confident in going to the dirty areas which is a good improvement, though I still think he needs to add some bulk even with what appears to be a slightly stronger frame this time around. Much of where he decides to skate to seems geared around not being put in positions of being muscled off the puck. Which isn't inherently a bad thing but those situations can't be avoided even if you're a genius at picking your spots. I'd say he's NHL capable but there's room to round out his game so his style and smarts can be truly effective at the pro level.
Nicolas Hague: if I could give a most improved award it would go to Hague. Last year Hague's best contribution was showing that he has the tools of strength and skill but he lacked any kind of footspeed in his lateral movement and he got burned a lot. I was told his footspeed improved over the course of this year and I decided to remain skeptical until I saw for myself. I wasn't lied to. He's still not the fastest skater out there compared to the likes of Theodore, Miller, Schmidt, and Brannstrom. But he is more than fast enough to do his job effectively now. There are times he coasts but it's only in situations that aren't pressing. When he needs to get to a guy, he does, and suddenly attacking forwards have a hulking 6'6 presence they have to try to get around. His defensive play today vastly outweighed what you'd expect offensively from a guy that lead the CHL in dman scoring. He never got burned once on a rush and was difficult to get around on set ups. He didn't shoot the puck much but when he did it was absolutely booming, and still, I didn't think he was shooting at maximum capacity. It wouldn't surprise me if one day Hague could clap bombs from the point the way guys like Pronger, Chara, and Weber could. Put in simple terms, last year I said we have a diamond in the rough with Hague and that rough was his footspeed. As long as he could get it quick enough to get the positioning he needed, we have a guy with enormous potential. I think he's already done that and I am very excited to see what the future has in store for his development.
Nick Suzuki: I thought he was way more consistently dangerous this time around. Last year he would make some dazzling plays and then disappear for large pockets of the games he played. Or at least try to be too cute and fail. Today his game was far more simplified and mature. His puck skill and speed were still clearly on display but it was more in the vein of what I want to see from the guy. Being one of the OHL's superstars this year worked wonders for him. He played the game today in a way I can only properly compare to Vladimir Tarasenko. Now, whether this skill and speed can translate to the pro game depends entirely on his ability to adjust to NHL level defense so that he can finish his chances at this level. I can't say one way or the other how likely that is (relative to Glass whose passing accuracy and efficiency appears to me certain to translate to productive hockey) but he is certainly a player of immense talent and we should be excited for his prospects.
Zach Whitecloud: I was waiting for my chance to finally see this guy play and he didn't disappoint. He seems closer to the bigs than I originally though. My expectation given his play style is that he will be a good bottom pairing defenseman. He doesn't play an overly aggressive style in either end, but he defends and passes very efficiently. His pairing with Hague was the best on the ice by miles. If I could compare, his style is more akin to a Hampus Lindholm though not quite as strong positionally and certainly not as adept offensively (and this is bearing in mind that Lindholm isn't an elite offensive talent to begin with). With so many offensive minded defensemen on the big club and in the system, Whitecloud serves a need for a potential and proper stay at home defenseman. He marks his man well in the defensive zone and his passes are simple and straight forward as well as effective under forechecking pressure (something, for example, Brannstrom struggled with today). I'd have to see how he does in preseason but if he's able to play competently against NHL players, I wouldn't be opposed to letting him have Sbisa's spot.
Erik Brannstrom: I don't want to be too hard on the guy because I've seen him play some excellent hockey. But by his own Standards, Erik played worse today in dev camp than he did against harder competition at the Wjc. I know it's only dev camp but Brannstrom doesn't strike me as the type of guy content on coasting through an opportunity to demonstrate his ability like this. He had some good moments but they were far outweighed by his flubbed passes, poor stick work, folding under forechecking pressure...I mean the only thing be did consistently well was activating from the point with the puck to attack the net on his own and chase down pucks that got behind. But the whole thing felt like "hey pa, look what I can do!" and it's like...that's great kiddo, but you're a defenseman. We don't want you pulling that kind of risky shit in the NHL. Go back to aggressively retrieving the puck and being a quick fire cannon from the point...and make better passes. His passing was especially horrendous today. One leading directly to a goal against. He can and should be better tomorrow.
Continued with shorter feedback for the rest of the guys...
F:
Glass
Suzuki
Cotter
Duke
Kolesar
D:
Hague
Whitecloud
Bodak
Nardella
Coghlan
Cody Glass: Despite being held scoreless today I still thought he was the best player on the ice. His passing game combined with his poise and vision in the way he roams around the ice, you can't look at number 9 out there and not think to yourself that this is a guy playing the game on an entirely different plane or dimension. Where I felt he improved from both dev camp and training camp is he was making much smarter decisions with the puck. Be it when to keep holding or when when and how to pass the puck. Where the game was mostly north south chance trading, when Glass got the puck, team White was able to play a competent possession game. They just had no finish for their chances. Glass also made some solid defensive plays both in his own zone and on the forecheck. His tendencies in that regard are clear but I think it might be too much to expect him to become a Bergeron, Toews, Kesler, Kopitar type. He is capable but I wouldn't say dominant defensively. He seemed more confident in going to the dirty areas which is a good improvement, though I still think he needs to add some bulk even with what appears to be a slightly stronger frame this time around. Much of where he decides to skate to seems geared around not being put in positions of being muscled off the puck. Which isn't inherently a bad thing but those situations can't be avoided even if you're a genius at picking your spots. I'd say he's NHL capable but there's room to round out his game so his style and smarts can be truly effective at the pro level.
Nicolas Hague: if I could give a most improved award it would go to Hague. Last year Hague's best contribution was showing that he has the tools of strength and skill but he lacked any kind of footspeed in his lateral movement and he got burned a lot. I was told his footspeed improved over the course of this year and I decided to remain skeptical until I saw for myself. I wasn't lied to. He's still not the fastest skater out there compared to the likes of Theodore, Miller, Schmidt, and Brannstrom. But he is more than fast enough to do his job effectively now. There are times he coasts but it's only in situations that aren't pressing. When he needs to get to a guy, he does, and suddenly attacking forwards have a hulking 6'6 presence they have to try to get around. His defensive play today vastly outweighed what you'd expect offensively from a guy that lead the CHL in dman scoring. He never got burned once on a rush and was difficult to get around on set ups. He didn't shoot the puck much but when he did it was absolutely booming, and still, I didn't think he was shooting at maximum capacity. It wouldn't surprise me if one day Hague could clap bombs from the point the way guys like Pronger, Chara, and Weber could. Put in simple terms, last year I said we have a diamond in the rough with Hague and that rough was his footspeed. As long as he could get it quick enough to get the positioning he needed, we have a guy with enormous potential. I think he's already done that and I am very excited to see what the future has in store for his development.
Nick Suzuki: I thought he was way more consistently dangerous this time around. Last year he would make some dazzling plays and then disappear for large pockets of the games he played. Or at least try to be too cute and fail. Today his game was far more simplified and mature. His puck skill and speed were still clearly on display but it was more in the vein of what I want to see from the guy. Being one of the OHL's superstars this year worked wonders for him. He played the game today in a way I can only properly compare to Vladimir Tarasenko. Now, whether this skill and speed can translate to the pro game depends entirely on his ability to adjust to NHL level defense so that he can finish his chances at this level. I can't say one way or the other how likely that is (relative to Glass whose passing accuracy and efficiency appears to me certain to translate to productive hockey) but he is certainly a player of immense talent and we should be excited for his prospects.
Zach Whitecloud: I was waiting for my chance to finally see this guy play and he didn't disappoint. He seems closer to the bigs than I originally though. My expectation given his play style is that he will be a good bottom pairing defenseman. He doesn't play an overly aggressive style in either end, but he defends and passes very efficiently. His pairing with Hague was the best on the ice by miles. If I could compare, his style is more akin to a Hampus Lindholm though not quite as strong positionally and certainly not as adept offensively (and this is bearing in mind that Lindholm isn't an elite offensive talent to begin with). With so many offensive minded defensemen on the big club and in the system, Whitecloud serves a need for a potential and proper stay at home defenseman. He marks his man well in the defensive zone and his passes are simple and straight forward as well as effective under forechecking pressure (something, for example, Brannstrom struggled with today). I'd have to see how he does in preseason but if he's able to play competently against NHL players, I wouldn't be opposed to letting him have Sbisa's spot.
Erik Brannstrom: I don't want to be too hard on the guy because I've seen him play some excellent hockey. But by his own Standards, Erik played worse today in dev camp than he did against harder competition at the Wjc. I know it's only dev camp but Brannstrom doesn't strike me as the type of guy content on coasting through an opportunity to demonstrate his ability like this. He had some good moments but they were far outweighed by his flubbed passes, poor stick work, folding under forechecking pressure...I mean the only thing be did consistently well was activating from the point with the puck to attack the net on his own and chase down pucks that got behind. But the whole thing felt like "hey pa, look what I can do!" and it's like...that's great kiddo, but you're a defenseman. We don't want you pulling that kind of risky shit in the NHL. Go back to aggressively retrieving the puck and being a quick fire cannon from the point...and make better passes. His passing was especially horrendous today. One leading directly to a goal against. He can and should be better tomorrow.
Continued with shorter feedback for the rest of the guys...
Reid Duke: I didn't see much discernable difference between last year and this year other than he seemed to play with slightly less intensity this go around. Still one of the better forwards on the ice but I think that says more about the quality of the pipeline at forward than it does about his odds to make the NHL.
Paul Cotter: pretty obvious why he was a lower round pick. He has inconsistencies in his game at both ends. But when he got his chances he could be dangerous. It would take an overall improvement to his game but I'd say given his offensive instincts he has a chance to make it down the line.
Tyler Wong: last year he was a standout. This year he demonstrated that he has more natural skill than most guys here but he was terribly inconsistent. His numbers in the AHL make plain sense this time around. Short of a huge overhaul in his decision making with the puck and positioning I don't see him making it.
Lucas Elvenes: it's tough. Elvenes has so much acceleration in those legs but he still hasn't done much to work on his agility. As a result he spent most of the game chasing the puck north and south without accomplishing much outside of one good sequence in the first period.
Martin Bodak: he makes absolutely idiotic decisions with the puck but he was one of the better guys at using positioning, stick work, and even physicality to prevent scoring chances. At a bare minimum, he needs to improve his passing and timing if he wants to make the pros but I'd give him the outside chance.
Dylan Coghlan: Think Whitecloud but not as consistently effective at defending. No problem with skating, no snoozing in the zone. He just got beat from time to time or wasn't going to the right spots. But when he was good he was good. Maybe he'll have a better game tomorrow.
Keegan Kolesar: his AHL pedigree shows as he was one of the few forwards capable of possessing the puck long enough to take it somewhere and try for a chance on goal. He was the only other forward consistently effective with Glass. That said I don't think he looks any better than he did last year.
Jimmy Schuldt: when his defensive game is focused he's actually one of the best guys at using the stick to disrupt chances. The problem is too many times it looked like he had no idea what the f*** was going on until guys were already behind him or had received a pass. He still has a shot but he has a lot to work on.
Jake Lescheshyn: I rarely saw him except seeing him constantly get muscled off the puck. I don't think he made a single good play offensively all game. If one dev camp game is indication, his falling out of the first round makes sense.
Jack Dugan: Ken from SinBin had him as one of his three most impressive. I have no idea why. I didn't see him do anything bad, I just didn't see him do anything good either.
Ryan Wagner: skates fast with the puck and not much else.
Gage Quinney: struggled pretty heavily to find chances. Despite his best efforts. But he did have a couple chances for t. White.
Jonas Rondberg: did a whole lot of nothing.
Xavier Bouchard: didn't have any glaring mistakes but didn't have any glaring impressive moments either.
Bobby Nardella: seemed as effective defensively as Bodak but didn't make as many stupid passing mistakes.
Did not list goalies as this game wasn't great for analyzing individual talent as many shots were easily dtoppsble. Didn't list because I didn't pay enough attention to: Baker, Baker, DiPietro, Kemp, Kruse, Jones, Saket, Burghardt, Schueneman, Diliberatore, Corcoran, Campoli, Harvey-Pinard, Owrie, Chyzowski, Ege, Curti, Harsch. But that's because they all played pretty unremarkable hockey.
Overall, at first glance, Vegas has some great prospects at the top end but really do seem to lack depth. Especially at forward.
Paul Cotter: pretty obvious why he was a lower round pick. He has inconsistencies in his game at both ends. But when he got his chances he could be dangerous. It would take an overall improvement to his game but I'd say given his offensive instincts he has a chance to make it down the line.
Tyler Wong: last year he was a standout. This year he demonstrated that he has more natural skill than most guys here but he was terribly inconsistent. His numbers in the AHL make plain sense this time around. Short of a huge overhaul in his decision making with the puck and positioning I don't see him making it.
Lucas Elvenes: it's tough. Elvenes has so much acceleration in those legs but he still hasn't done much to work on his agility. As a result he spent most of the game chasing the puck north and south without accomplishing much outside of one good sequence in the first period.
Martin Bodak: he makes absolutely idiotic decisions with the puck but he was one of the better guys at using positioning, stick work, and even physicality to prevent scoring chances. At a bare minimum, he needs to improve his passing and timing if he wants to make the pros but I'd give him the outside chance.
Dylan Coghlan: Think Whitecloud but not as consistently effective at defending. No problem with skating, no snoozing in the zone. He just got beat from time to time or wasn't going to the right spots. But when he was good he was good. Maybe he'll have a better game tomorrow.
Keegan Kolesar: his AHL pedigree shows as he was one of the few forwards capable of possessing the puck long enough to take it somewhere and try for a chance on goal. He was the only other forward consistently effective with Glass. That said I don't think he looks any better than he did last year.
Jimmy Schuldt: when his defensive game is focused he's actually one of the best guys at using the stick to disrupt chances. The problem is too many times it looked like he had no idea what the f*** was going on until guys were already behind him or had received a pass. He still has a shot but he has a lot to work on.
Jake Lescheshyn: I rarely saw him except seeing him constantly get muscled off the puck. I don't think he made a single good play offensively all game. If one dev camp game is indication, his falling out of the first round makes sense.
Jack Dugan: Ken from SinBin had him as one of his three most impressive. I have no idea why. I didn't see him do anything bad, I just didn't see him do anything good either.
Ryan Wagner: skates fast with the puck and not much else.
Gage Quinney: struggled pretty heavily to find chances. Despite his best efforts. But he did have a couple chances for t. White.
Jonas Rondberg: did a whole lot of nothing.
Xavier Bouchard: didn't have any glaring mistakes but didn't have any glaring impressive moments either.
Bobby Nardella: seemed as effective defensively as Bodak but didn't make as many stupid passing mistakes.
Did not list goalies as this game wasn't great for analyzing individual talent as many shots were easily dtoppsble. Didn't list because I didn't pay enough attention to: Baker, Baker, DiPietro, Kemp, Kruse, Jones, Saket, Burghardt, Schueneman, Diliberatore, Corcoran, Campoli, Harvey-Pinard, Owrie, Chyzowski, Ege, Curti, Harsch. But that's because they all played pretty unremarkable hockey.
Overall, at first glance, Vegas has some great prospects at the top end but really do seem to lack depth. Especially at forward.
LadyStanley
Registered User
Natey
GOATS
- Aug 2, 2005
- 62,324
- 8,498
I have no idea how I see such a good player and no one else does, hahahaha. I hope he has a huge season and proves everyone wrong. He is really raw though, so I can see what the doubts are.
Wonder why he came to camp and then didn't play today? Did they have different players play yesterday?
Actually I did see him eventually he had a couple good steals but nothing else noteworthy.
Natey
GOATS
- Aug 2, 2005
- 62,324
- 8,498
Weird, you'd think someone who goes undrafted would want to make an impression. Maybe he didn't have the linemates to do anything else. He's a smart player with an absolutely disgusting shot. Skating needs work. Raw, like I said though. Steals makes sense, he usually works hard.
Oh well, I guess he'll have to go back to the W and prove his 40 point increase wasn't a fluke and increase his point totals another 40! lol
In fairness he was on Cody Glass' team and almost all of them except for Glass and Kolesar were either very sloppy or ineffective. Especially in the first five minutes it seemed like nobody could find a teammate with a pass.
LadyStanley
Registered User
LadyStanley
Registered User
Kind of disappointing as I'd heard Elvenes had made serious strides this year and seemed like he might turn out to be a real steal at 127.
I mean granted this is just one scrimmage. It could mean nothing. But I tend to think if you're trying to prove your salt you should do what you can not to struggle. It didn't look like anything changed from last year. Still didn't seem able to do anything but pure north/south skating.
LadyStanley
Registered User
LadyStanley
Registered User
LadyStanley
Registered User
Vegas Mac
Golden Shellback
- Jun 26, 2015
- 563
- 195
What is interesting is most of the guys in last year's dev camp seemed to take big steps forward in their following seasons. Hague most of all and of course he is a great story because usually the big d-men take a bit longer to come along, so we might really have something in him. Pretty nice duo with him and Brannstrom.
That initial draft, for that matter, just looks fantastic. Looks like four NHLers at a minimum, as I think Ferguson has a good chance to make it too.
Looking at the new kids Cotter has some grit to go with his offensive talent. Really like that pick, think they got great value there. It's going to be fun to have that second layer of players now coming through the pipeline. This year's group isn't nearly as talented as the last haul but to have a consistent winner you need a lot of role player types and I have to think with the coaching they're getting here we'll see a surprise or two.
That initial draft, for that matter, just looks fantastic. Looks like four NHLers at a minimum, as I think Ferguson has a good chance to make it too.
Looking at the new kids Cotter has some grit to go with his offensive talent. Really like that pick, think they got great value there. It's going to be fun to have that second layer of players now coming through the pipeline. This year's group isn't nearly as talented as the last haul but to have a consistent winner you need a lot of role player types and I have to think with the coaching they're getting here we'll see a surprise or two.
LadyStanley
Registered User
Whitecloud honors culture in chasing Golden Knights dream
Whitecloud using First National heritage to drive him.
Signed at 189; now at 206. Nice to see all that muscle added.
Whitecloud using First National heritage to drive him.
Signed at 189; now at 206. Nice to see all that muscle added.
LadyStanley
Registered User
Pirate Deadpool
Registered User
Anyone concerned that GMGM or the scouting staff has a preference for small forwards? It's one of the reasons that makes me think that Suzuki will be nothing more than an ok 3rd line guy who hustles and can score a decent amount of goals, but overall 2 way game will be hurt because he'll get pushed around in the dirty areas. Our top line got outmuscled in the final except for Smith who I feel held his own and contributed down low. It got so bad, everyone thought that Wild Bill must have been hurt for how bad he was looking out there. Sometimes I feel that Wild Bill would be a better winger than a center. He's definitely not a playmaker. He's more of a sniper IMHO. I hope that we acquire a legit top 2 center (ROR who else 
) and Glass can make the team in 2019-2020 season and be our top 2 centers and push Wild Bill into a sniper role on the wings. Yep I said it. This is my hot take of the week.
) and Glass can make the team in 2019-2020 season and be our top 2 centers and push Wild Bill into a sniper role on the wings. Yep I said it. This is my hot take of the week.
Holy crap. Brannstrom is 5’10”. Glass is 6’2”. Brannstrom is a twig, but he’s two pounds heavier than Glass.
Glass needs to do serious work this summer to at least add 10 pounds. It would be in his best interest to get a mentor like Gary Roberts.
Glass needs to do serious work this summer to at least add 10 pounds. It would be in his best interest to get a mentor like Gary Roberts.
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