DANOZ28
Registered User
not to be a buzz kill but dubnyk is NOT an elite goalie until he puts some playoff wins under his belt.
Player Discussion Devan Dubnyk II
- Thread starter Avder
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3 Playoff appearances:
-1 he had a broken something in his hand. (he wasn't good, but Kemps wasn't an option).
-1 he had no scoring help. (Wild scored 8g in 5 games, Dub allowed 2g in 4 of those games).
-1 they ran lost to the eventual Cup champs (Crawford was amazing and Dub wasn't).
Okay, one month everyone is saying how overrated Dubnyk is and we have to try to get rid of him asap and the next month people are saying he is so valuable to this team that we would not stay afloat without him. Our fans are just as schizophrenic as our team! I have personally always found Dubnyk to be a very unreliable goalie. He benefits from a defensive system that keeps shots for the most part from low chance areas. He is so big that the puck just happens to hit him most of the time. Some big goalies you can tell are actually athletic like Mike Smith, Rinne, or Ben Bishop, not Dubnyk. Notwithstanding some of the pretty laughable excuses here, his playoff performances have been bad as well. His mental fragility is also disturbing at times as is his penchant for complaining about EVERYTHING.
Dr Jan Itor
Registered User
Or maybe fans have differing opinions, and you're just hearing/reading different fans at different times?
We've seen mentally fragile; Kuemper gave us all a Master's level course on it last year. He might complain to the Ref's, but so what? It might get him a quicker whistle, or they give him some leeway on slashing the heck out of anyone net front. That complaining to the ref's also gives the team just a little more time between puck drops. A second or two might not seem like much, but it gives BB a little longer to challenge (if desired), and the players chance to shake pull their head out of their (pick an orifice).
He'll let in a soft goal once in awhile, all goalies do. Dub himself plays a part in the lack of high quality scoring chances with his rebound control and gobbling up pucks. There aren't a lot of second chances for team to get the Parise type of goal.
I'm not really sure any of those goalie listed are more athletic, they are more skilled at playing/handling the puck in open ice.
2Pair
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- Oct 8, 2017
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Not that many garbage rebound net front goals. The crazy behind the net/bank shot, goals he'll give up now and again.
Don't get me wrong there are maybe 10 goalies (MAF, Rask, Price, Vasilevskiy, Bob, Holtby, Quick, Lundqvist) I'd take over Dub on a night-to-night basis. But when he's riding a hot streak; which he can do for a sustained amount of time; he's as good as any of them. His lows are just lower than theirs when he's off.
Dub is a lot like Rinne. A goalie that could win a Cup if he's on, but you'll be playing golf within the first 2 Playoff rounds if he's not.
2Pair
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- Oct 8, 2017
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Once again, rebound goals/chances speaks to the system he plays in. I would tend to agree with you that there are 10-ish goalies that are "no-brainers" ahead of Dubnyk. I would also add that there are probably another 10 that are in the same discussion as Dubnyk as far as talent goes. Some might say that would pretty much make him an average goalie?
Goalies have more to do with rebounds than the system. You can't have a system like the Wild have with a goalie that doesn't have good rebound control/puck freezing ability.
Dub is an above average, but not elite goalie. The same thing that could describe most of the team.
Goalies cutoffs/rankings harder for me to quantify.
I think Dubnyk is probably about the 15th-20th best starter in the NHL. That is about the definition of average. When he plays his best he can be top 10 or higher but when he isn't playing well he is easily one of the bottom 5-10 starters.
When he plays his best he can be the best in the league. He just can't sustain it for a full season. Half a season is doable for him though. He's done it twice in the 3 seasons they've had him.
Dr Jan Itor
Registered User
I have an issue that every game isn't a shutout and they aren't scoring 60p a season.
He's big and most of the times a good goalie. Weakness is softies.. he isn't ready for unexpected shots, is poor at sealing the posts and filling the holes. Feels that some opponents use that. For example more shots from negative angle etc. Sometimes kills the flow with bad goals.
Decision making with the puck, stickhandling and undersranding how players want to have pucks from him are poor too.
In the end.. great cheap contract and overall package. Awesome regular season track record with the Wild, although not an elite level goalie.
Problem is the playoffs. Regular season is long and you can get away from bad stretches.. playoffs are different animal, they're over in a blink of an eye.
Decision making with the puck, stickhandling and undersranding how players want to have pucks from him are poor too.
In the end.. great cheap contract and overall package. Awesome regular season track record with the Wild, although not an elite level goalie.
Problem is the playoffs. Regular season is long and you can get away from bad stretches.. playoffs are different animal, they're over in a blink of an eye.
I'm not a fan of the R-VH style of sealing the post. I'd prefer to see Dub use the traditional VH positioning. Each one has it's pros and cons.
-VH: vertical horizontal. Pad is tight against the post (vertical) and the other pad is on the goal-line (horizontal).
-R-VH: reverse vertical horizontal: Uses the body to seal off the post with that pad on the ice (horizontal), and the other pad it upright (vertical).
Cory Schneider does a good job of braking them both down in this article/video:
Devils Schneider Breaks Down VH And Reverse-VH - InGoal Magazine
-VH: vertical horizontal. Pad is tight against the post (vertical) and the other pad is on the goal-line (horizontal).
-R-VH: reverse vertical horizontal: Uses the body to seal off the post with that pad on the ice (horizontal), and the other pad it upright (vertical).
Cory Schneider does a good job of braking them both down in this article/video:
Devils Schneider Breaks Down VH And Reverse-VH - InGoal Magazine
BagHead
Registered User
Man, you're making me feel old. I was trained to stand upright and seal off the post with the body and pad. When I play nets, I feel like an old-school goalie, now. But... I was a butterfly goalie! Now I guess they'd call it "hybrid".
That's Kari Lehtonen playing something similar to what I'm talking about in regards to positioning on the post, but I always preferred my arm to be on the outside of the post, hugging it. Doing that allowed me to squeeze tighter to the post, sealing up more holes along it, and also allowed my arm some mobility. The downside, of course, is that if a pass goes into the slot and you can't intercept it with your stick on a quick poke, you need to go down into a butterfly (whereas the other goalies are already in butterfly by that point) which takes a valuable half-second. That half-second has led to goals against in my experience. That said, I let up very little on tight shots toward the posts or wraparounds, as it is very easy to move laterally from that position. I guess in the end it's a combination of personal preference and playing a style that caters to your strengths and covers up some of your flaws. In my case, I was a very average sized goaltender (6'0") and so I needed to stay upright as long as possible to take away the top of the net. Dubnyk is like 8 feet tall, so I suppose it'd be a bit of a waste for him to stay upright. Now that I came to that conclusion, I don't know why I wrote this all anymore. It doesn't really have a point besides education, but... I don't want to delete it!
That's Kari Lehtonen playing something similar to what I'm talking about in regards to positioning on the post, but I always preferred my arm to be on the outside of the post, hugging it. Doing that allowed me to squeeze tighter to the post, sealing up more holes along it, and also allowed my arm some mobility. The downside, of course, is that if a pass goes into the slot and you can't intercept it with your stick on a quick poke, you need to go down into a butterfly (whereas the other goalies are already in butterfly by that point) which takes a valuable half-second. That half-second has led to goals against in my experience. That said, I let up very little on tight shots toward the posts or wraparounds, as it is very easy to move laterally from that position. I guess in the end it's a combination of personal preference and playing a style that caters to your strengths and covers up some of your flaws. In my case, I was a very average sized goaltender (6'0") and so I needed to stay upright as long as possible to take away the top of the net. Dubnyk is like 8 feet tall, so I suppose it'd be a bit of a waste for him to stay upright. Now that I came to that conclusion, I don't know why I wrote this all anymore. It doesn't really have a point besides education, but... I don't want to delete it!
Doobs is the 9th highest paid player on this team, and we have him for 2 more years. Bargoon!
AJ Thelen
Registered User
It would be nice if a lot of players showed up in the playoffs.
AJ Thelen
Registered User
Quite surprised with Dubnyk this year. With the changes in goalkeeper gear, I figured he would lapse a bit, because my take on him has been that he succeeds with size. Smaller size pads, I figured somewhat less effective...
But I was wrong. He's been very good.
But I was wrong. He's been very good.
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