Derek Stepan Sucks (UPDATE: Does Not Suck - 03/07/18)

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XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
54,886
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PHX
Can't stand him and Goligoski. Straight poison on the ice, especially if the team gets down. Goligoski rolled his eyes all dramatically tonight after he blew his own assignment. Probably has the worst body language I've ever seen from a skater if faced with the slightest bit of adversity. Maybe he has always been this way and it was covered up by competitive teams. Stepan had trouble staying motivated on a contender, I don't know why you'd trade for such a player.

Both need to be publicly called out at this point. I'd even settle for a "Our veterans are letting us down right now"
 

_Del_

Registered User
Jul 4, 2003
15,425
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As second line centers go he's reaching Robert Reichel levels of engagement. When he falls to Ribiero or Peter Holland level of intensity, I'll know the hockey gods have taken their blood price this season.
 

CC96

Serious Offender
Nov 6, 2012
18,098
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Mesa, Arizona
Hot dog man Stepan’s fatass is too busy stuffing his face with nachos at intermission, to give two shits about what’s going on, on the ice.
 

culex

Registered User
Oct 23, 2016
30
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I don't think he's a lazy player. Maybe he's looked lazy, but I wouldn't say he's one. I watched him on the Rangers and it was actually quite common for him to score/assist in bunches before hitting a bit of a cold streak, and it would cycle back and forth between the two. Maybe with his recent stint on assists, that was what you guys saw - not sure. I realize points isn't the only issue here. Any ways, I do have a few thoughts on him. There's a good chance this gets very long and a bit rambly, so I apologize in advance for that.

I watched the game today and he definitely looked lost out there. Could he still be adjusting? I get that as a well established NHL player, the expectation is that he adjusts more quickly but...I don't know. After playing with the Rangers for ~7 years under Torts and AV, I think it would be quite the challenge to basically jump into an entirely different system, to west coast team, new city, many young kids, and many players of different skill sets than what he's used to. I don't want this to sound like a cop out answer for the way he's played, but I do think it's worth considering.

From the little I have watched and heard, I get the impression that the expectation he would be this huge offensive driver of plays (feel free to correct me). And he does, but I think in just a different way. To give a bit of background, in the recent years with AV's tenure, I find that there was never a real designation of the lines (eg. 1, 2, 3, and 4). If anything, AV had this thing about rolling 3 really good lines and then a fourth line to grind/energize the team. The point I'm trying to make is not to say Stepan isn't a 1C or 2C or whatever. Rather, Stepan was considered a first line center but later, so were guys like Brassard and Zibanejad. They were just deployed during different opportunities.

Maybe that's stating the obvious. But I bring it up because Brassard was definitely the more explosive offensive center, reactive, with incredible play making skills. Stepan I feel as though has always been a bit more reserved and plays a lot more calculated. I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing, though, rather, depending on what your teams' needs are, you would pick one or the other. The other upside to Stepan was that he was always much more defensively responsible and very good on the PK. Rangers didn't need Brassard to be that calculated and solid two-way center because Stepan was there, and the reverse could be said as well. Though I will say, another thing about Stepan is that he is a bit of a poor skater and it makes me wonder if what you guys are perceiving as "lazy" is just that. He isn't the type to skate around guys, drive super creative plays, etc. Instead, he does rely heavily on his hockey IQ (he did always have a knack for finding the right place at the right time).

Any ways, I think his style of play is maybe an extension from his skating. If you can't skate around guys and go nuts on the ice, maybe you are more inclined to sit back, think, then make the play. As I said, I find he's always been quite calculated and even if you don't really notice him on the ice, the thing that always impressed me was that he was always in the right place at the right time. And this isn't to say he ALWAYS sat back, but again, he wasn't that explosive center the Rangers had...they didn't need him to be because there was Brassard. Perhaps this is why you guys haven't been seeing him be this juggernaut of a explosive 1C and instead, see him "floating around" or "standing and watching". I don't know if that's the expectation for him to be that, but it certainly feels like the case a lot because no one on the team seems to be the key driver of the offense, and I can only imagine that's one big reason why you guys decided to pick him up. But the problem is that when you take too much time to think and when you're being depended on being the main driver of the offense, you can see why it would create some friction from expectation vs. reality.

I agree he hasn't looked great but I honestly do not believe he sucks or is a lazy player. If anything, he genuinely looks lost and confused out there. I do think he's having a pretty hard time adjusting off and on-ice, more than what he might be given credit for.
 

Placid

Registered User
Feb 17, 2010
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I have not seen any of the Coyote games, so i've not seen him in action for you guys, but on the Rangers, he was solid. As culex mentioned, he could be somewhat "streaky", but he usually got 50+ points each season, very reliably. He was also considered our best center, maybe a little below average offensively (his playmaking skills are up there, but he isn't the fastest of skaters), and well above average defensively.

Im sorry to hear that he does not appear to have "clicked" with his teammates yet, and hope that it is just a matter of time before he does so.
 

XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
54,886
14,502
PHX
From the little I have watched and heard, I get the impression that the expectation he would be this huge offensive driver of plays (feel free to correct me). And he does, but I think in just a different way. To give a bit of background, in the recent years with AV's tenure, I find that there was never a real designation of the lines (eg. 1, 2, 3, and 4). If anything, AV had this thing about rolling 3 really good lines and then a fourth line to grind/energize the team. The point I'm trying to make is not to say Stepan isn't a 1C or 2C or whatever. Rather, Stepan was considered a first line center but later, so were guys like Brassard and Zibanejad. They were just deployed during different opportunities.

We understand what type of center he is because this team has always had to settle for 'good enough' 2C types. There was no expectation that he'd come in and be a PPG revelation.

Stepan's problem is that he seems completely disinterested in putting in any sort of work. I know a player that is not giving anything close to 100% when I see one, laid back playstyle or not. He has been fed prime minutes, linemates, and scoring opportunities so far this year and done nothing with them. I can put up with Domi being a headcase because he's on his ELC and he'll probably figure it out sooner or later. It's inexcusable for a veteran (and a former captain to boot) to show up after a team that traded a top 10 pick for you - one that professed a love and appreciation for you as a person and a player - and do jack shit for that team on the ice. He has made every line he has been put on worse.

He's playing worse than Vermette did, and he got bought out. There's no sugar coating his play this year.
 

Ori

#Connor Bedard 2023 1st, Chicago Blackhawks
Nov 7, 2014
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A bit overraction? Stepan has 15 pts. compare to Hayes on our 2nd. line who took Stepan role with 11 pts, this season, and Stepan is usually a slow starter in NHL and with Rangers - I doubt that his habit changed over the summer window. DeAngelo is playing in the minors.
 
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Matias Maccete

Chopping up defenses
Sep 21, 2014
9,645
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He sucks. I hate when he's on the ice. But at least he says all the right things, that's what solid leadership is about according to tocchet, not actually giving a f*** during the game.
 

BUX7PHX

Registered User
Jul 7, 2011
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Stepan even said this is a different system and mindset than he is used to, so I am certain some of it may have to do with uncertainty in learning the system, etc.

Just another situation where we were probably having these talks with the Rangers while Tippett was still our coach, and frankly, Stepan would fill in Tippett's system immaculately. Change coaches and get a new system, and the results aren't quite there. I don't think Stepan is as bad as people are maintaining he is here.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
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Stepan even said this is a different system and mindset than he is used to, so I am certain some of it may have to do with uncertainty in learning the system, etc.

Just another situation where we were probably having these talks with the Rangers while Tippett was still our coach, and frankly, Stepan would fill in Tippett's system immaculately. Change coaches and get a new system, and the results aren't quite there. I don't think Stepan is as bad as people are maintaining he is here.

I don't think he is either, but I expected more. He's on pace for 44pts. this year, about 10 less than his last two years with the Rangers. Most on this board thought he would produce a bit less because of the team not having as much talent. He is a 2C on most any team, but here he is treated like god and is playing 1C minutes without the results. I think we are expecting more than what he can give.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
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A bit overraction? Stepan has 15 pts. compare to Hayes on our 2nd. line who took Stepan role with 11 pts, this season, and Stepan is usually a slow starter in NHL and with Rangers - I doubt that his habit changed over the summer window. DeAngelo is playing in the minors.

We are expecting 1st line results from a 2nd. line C. I think Stepan is being asked to do more than he can give, like Stone and Murphy last year and KConn this year. He is not a 1st line C, simple as that.
 
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Coyotedroppings

Registered User
Jul 16, 2017
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The one and only thing that had me scratching my head when I heard about acquiring Stephan was his lack of speed and this is all we are seeing. He is not in the least bit lazy, or disinterested, he does seem a bit concerned with being able to cover mistakes of others and I believe that is what has lead culex (see post #6) to believe he looks confused.
 
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BUX7PHX

Registered User
Jul 7, 2011
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I don't think he is either, but I expected more. He's on pace for 44pts. this year, about 10 less than his last two years with the Rangers. Most on this board thought he would produce a bit less because of the team not having as much talent. He is a 2C on most any team, but here he is treated like god and is playing 1C minutes without the results. I think we are expecting more than what he can give.

Yet this infers the same coaching issue that has been stated, for years, we had players who were #2 centers (and/or worse) that had to play up a line or two, and we at least had some decent production there (Hanzal, Lombardi, Fiddler - most slotted a line or two ahead of where they would "normally" be).

So if we continue to see players that don't live up to the promise, even though we have been through that before, is that b/c Stepan is having to cover for a lot more errors by linemates, and is therefore exposed as an awful player? Or is it because the system that is being coached into the players is more difficult to understand and/or lacks clarity? Yes, it is upon the player to execute within the system, but that is also the coach needing to make things overtly transparent to the team for what he wants. I am not certain we are there yet, and frankly whatever "there" is seems like it is going to take far longer than I or anyone else imagined prior to the year
 

pheasant

Registered User
Nov 2, 2010
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The one and only thing that had me scratching my head when I heard about acquiring Stephan was his lack of speed and this is all we are seeing. He is not in the least bit lazy, or disinterested, he does seem a bit concerned with being able to cover mistakes of others and I believe that is what has lead culex (see post #6) to believe he looks confused.

I came into this thread to say something similar. Stepan is just no very quick, so it looks like he's being lazy. But I don't think that's the case. Combine that with the new team/coach, and the fact that he isn't a true top line center, and you have a player who is looking lost.

It will get better. I believe in this guy, and think he will click as a Coyote. I just hope the coach and fans give him the time he needs to get there. If Stepan and Goligoski can contribute like the #2C and 2nd pair D that they are expected to, paid to, and have proven in the past to be, then this team will look very good.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
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The one and only thing that had me scratching my head when I heard about acquiring Stephan was his lack of speed and this is all we are seeing. He is not in the least bit lazy, or disinterested, he does seem a bit concerned with being able to cover mistakes of others and I believe that is what has lead culex (see post #6) to believe he looks confused.

If this is the case put him with other vets so they can lead by example. The problem is, the vets are the ones looking confused and lost. Sure the kids make mistakes, but I would rather lose with the kids making mistakes and hopefully learning from their mistakes than having the vets continue to make mistakes. OEL has returned to form and is leading this team but he is not getting much help. The vets are playing better than the first part of the year, but it could be a too little too late.
 

Tawnos

A guy with a bass
Sep 10, 2004
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Charlotte, NC
As a big fan of his on the Rangers, I want to mention three things:

1.) Stepan is the definition of even keel. He's not a fiery player.
2.) He always seems to start the season slow. He paced 46 points per 82 in the first month of his season during his Rangers career. 59 points per 82 during all the other months.
3.) I have no evidence for this, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was depressed. I certainly would be in his place.
 
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rt

The Kinder, Gentler Version
May 13, 2004
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As a big fan of his on the Rangers, I want to mention three things:

1.) Stepan is the definition of even keel. He's not a fiery player.
2.) He always seems to start the season slow. He paced 46 points per 82 in the first month of his season during his Rangers career. 59 points per 82 during all the other months.
3.) I have no evidence for this, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was depressed. I certainly would be in his place.

This is his house:
Coyotes forward Derek Stepan pays $3M for north Scottsdale home

This is the weather forecast:
Scottsdale, AZ 10-Day Weather Forecast - The Weather Channel | Weather.com

This is his wife:
Derek Stepan’s Wife Stephanie Kent [Photos- Pictures] | PlayerWags.com

This is his job:
https://cdn.newsday.com/polopoly_fs...age.JPG_gen/derivatives/display_960/image.JPG

This is working overtime:
https://nhl.bamcontent.com/images/photos/290976148/568x320/cut.jpeg

Career earnings:
Derek Stepan - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

If he's sad because he has to work hard to help a bad team turn things around, that's still a problem with him and not a problem with the team.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
29,977
9,038
As a big fan of his on the Rangers, I want to mention three things:

1.) Stepan is the definition of even keel. He's not a fiery player.
2.) He always seems to start the season slow. He paced 46 points per 82 in the first month of his season during his Rangers career. 59 points per 82 during all the other months.
3.) I have no evidence for this, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was depressed. I certainly would be in his place.

Depressed? That is plain dumb. You would be in his place? Maybe come to Arizona and look around. Read rt's post, he hit the nail on the head.


Exactly!
 
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Tawnos

A guy with a bass
Sep 10, 2004
28,816
10,389
Charlotte, NC

A great house, nice area to live in (I've been to Arizona and Phoenix specifically several times. I love it), a good wife (which none of us know if she is or isn't... we just know she's good looking), great job, and money are all things that can help someone get through depression, but none of them prevent it. Being forcibly uprooted from the place he came into adulthood, where his closest friends are and where he was ready to spend at least the next 4 years of his life... that can really rattle a person and put them in that place.

But I forgot that depression is a highly misunderstood mood disorder, so it's my fault for even bringing it up. If you are depressed, it's really not a simple matter of willpower to bring yourself out of it. You've gotta work at it. I only brought it up because, if there's a fundamental difference between the way Stepan worked in NY and the way he is in Arizona, there's probably a better explanation than "laziness." Work ethic is a habit and habits are pretty hard to break. I didn't mean depression in the sense that he's sad about things. I meant it in a more clinical way. The kind of thing that leads to a loss of interest in things like work.
 
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