Defensemen, cumulative plus/minus

[SoupGuru]

So, at the Olympics break, I thought I'd summarize some plus/minus numbers on our defensemen. I believe plus/minus can be useful when evaluating teammates, especially defensemen.

I like to sum up the numbers and chart them since it makes it really easy to visualize trends and which way the numbers are headed.

Kronwall had a great first part of the season and has been in a decline since December.

Ericsson is on a nice upward trend with significant chunks missing due to injury.

Quincey had an awful two months to start the season but has held steady for awhile and might be on the upswing.

Kindl has just been declining.

DeKeyser has been pretty steady.

Lashoff has been remarkably steady.

Smith went down then up in the first two months and has held pretty steady since.

Anyway, sorry for the crappy chart but I thought it was interesting enough to share.

Click to read more...

 

[Frk It]

Said this over the off season, but a problem is that we have mostly one dimensional d men IMO.

Kronwalls maybe the only guy you could say is a 2 way, but both his offensive and defensive game is incredibly streaky.

Dekeyser's young still, so he has a shot at being 2 way still, but I think he's going to ultimately end up just like Ericsson.

Babcock really wants Smith to become a two way guy, but I doubt it, seems like hell always be a gamblin' offensive D. Might as well just unclip his wings and let him fly.

 

[detredWINgs]

Nice job, SG. Interestingly, I'd say that chart more or less maps onto the eyeball test for what's been going on this season.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Good stuff. I agree with your summary. My take:

1. DeKeyser has been propping up Quincey. We need Smith to pick up his game as a top 4 of E-Kronner, DeKeyser-Smith would be best for the DRW.

2. Smith needs to get PP ice time. We've got one legit d-man who can contribute on the PP and that's obviously Kronwall. I have no problem with DeKeyser getting PP ice time as a rookie but he's not quite making a positive contribution to this point.

3. We desperately need another offensive d-man. Ideally Smith would turn the corner and offset this need somewhat. When it comes to absolute QoC Smith is very close to Quincey. We need him to make that leap and lock down that #4 d-man spot.

4. Kindl and Quincey have no future with this team. If Holland isn't going to make a trade he needs to begin giving our d-man prospects ice time in Detroit.

 

[detredWINgs]

Said this over the off season, but a problem is that we have mostly one dimensional d men IMO.

Kronwalls maybe the only guy you could say is a 2 way, but both his offensive and defensive game is incredibly streaky.

Dekeyser's young still, so he has a shot at being 2 way still, but I think he's going to ultimately end up just like Ericsson.

Babcock really wants Smith to become a two way guy, but I doubt it, seems like hell always be a gamblin' offensive D. Might as well just unclip his wings and let him fly.

If you ask me, the bigger problem is that our two allegedly one dimensional defenseman - Quincey and Kindl - are flat out mediocre at that their respective one dimensions. If we remedied that, then we'd have ideal partners for both Smith and Ericsson.

Also not surprisingly, DeKeyser had his best offensive stretch when he was playing alongside Kronwall.

Our defense would be worlds better if it went something like this:

Kronwall - Dekeyser
Ericsson - (offensive defenseman, e.g. Marek Zidlicky)
Smith - (defensive defenseman, e.g. Matt Greene)

I think we'd hardly be worrying about Ericsson and Smith's lack of a two-way game if that were the case.

 

[Frk It]

If you ask me, the bigger problem is that our two allegedly one dimensional defenseman - Quincey and Kindl - are flat out mediocre at that their respective one dimensions.

Haha you got it! That's why I didn't even mention them.

Kindls supposed to be an offensive D. Except he produces no pts or offense in general anymore.

I don't even know what Quinceys supposed to be? When we were developing him, we thought he was a stay at home D. Then he went to COL and LAK and put up a bunch of pts on garbage teams on the PP. So I think when we traded for him we thought we were getting a two way d. But he has like 2 pts in his last 16 games. And he messes up in the D zone all the time, though he's been better over the last month or so.

I'm really really hoping Ouellet is a guy that can take off and be that calming two way D that can play a lot of minutes. A guy that is solid in his own end, but isn't a complete non factor in the PP or offensive zone like Ericsson and Dekeyser are IMO.

 

[Anchor Town*]

Kindl's not really an offensive defenseman, never has been. Not sure where some of you are getting that. That's not to say he's a defensive defenseman either. He's a two way guy who is decent at a lot of things and spectacular at none.

 

[waltdetroit]

Everything kinda smooths out after the forwards get younger

 

[Mount Suribachi]

Nice job, SG. Interestingly, I'd say that chart more or less maps onto the eyeball test for what's been going on this season.

Exactly what I thought. DD struggling after he came back from injury, Smith getting better after he came back from injury, Quincey not being as bad, Lashoff being steady.

 

[14ari13]

The question is whether Babcock uses them right?

 

[Frk It]

Kindl's not really an offensive defenseman, never has been. Not sure where some of you are getting that. That's not to say he's a defensive defenseman either. He's a two way guy who is decent at a lot of things and spectacular at none.

Kindl's been billed as an offensive defenseman pretty much since the day he was drafted.

Here's his RWC profile for you

Skating and offensive skills are biggest strengths … Moves well on his skates … Good acceleration and speed … Carries the puck well … Supports offense with great vision, good passing ability … Hard, accurate point shot …

If you're expecting him to be a two way guy you're gonna be disappointed. He's been brutal in his own end this year.

 

[SoupGuru]

I use plus/minus to answer the question "Is the player doing his job?" If your #1D and #6D both have good numbers, you can say they're doing what they're being asked to do even if their roles are pretty different.

Lashoff is decent at eating some minutes against the other team's lower lines. Ericsson is doing pretty well against the other team's top lines. So it seems like they're being used adequately. Can't move Ericsson up. You might give him more minutes, I guess. Can't move Lashoff down any further to improve his numbers.

Kronwall is struggling a bit lately. You could move him down to find easier competition but who would you move up? DeKeyser, maybe, but his numbers look like he's handling his current role well, but not much more. Maybe the uptick lately is good, but will it last?

Kindl is awful, can't move him further down except for the bench, which is an excellent idea.

Smith is holding on at his role lately.

Quincey has been pretty even lately so you can't expect to move him up. You could move him down but there's no one to take his place.