Tawnos
A guy with a bass
Isn't that exactly what happened when he was promoted to Pittsburgh from Wilkes-Barre?
He took an underperforming team and made them live up to their abilities.
Isn't that exactly what happened when he was promoted to Pittsburgh from Wilkes-Barre?
Happens every year right now: predictions of the decline of Crosby and Malkin. If it doesn't happen, the Penguins making the playoffs isn't over-performing. It hasn't happened yet. Maybe next year.
Isn't that exactly what happened when he was promoted to Pittsburgh from Wilkes-Barre?
I know they had in juries in 14-15 but they always have injuries. He took an 8 seed that was out in 5 in the first round in 14-15 to back to back cups. People are falling over themselves to defend Quinn, but apparently that's not impressive.
Wait- so how can a team over perform by any other definition other than out playing the predictions and realities( about half their roster is out/ injured including Malkin.)? If you can;'t give Sullivan credit for getting his team into a playoff run without a good deal of his roster and missing half the stars on the team I'm not sure who you'd ever consider coaching up a team. He coached up a team and is getting them to outperform. I'm seriously at a loss as to how you define coaching a team to outperforming.
As always, context is king. Every prediction and “reality” where people were down on the Penguins was based on those guys declining and a residual of them losing to the Habs in the play-in. But they aren’t. And the Penguins have been easily making the playoffs for 10+ years with major man games lost, not just from the top 2 guys, but from a lot of the team. It’s not overperforming if it’s what they’ve done at least a half dozen times... including before Sullivan even got there.
Sullivan’s Penguins team is performing as you’d expect under the circumstances. Quinn’s team is performing as you’d expect under the circumstances.
Happens every year right now: predictions of the decline of Crosby and Malkin. If it doesn't happen, the Penguins making the playoffs isn't over-performing. It hasn't happened yet. Maybe next year.
I can't go down the circular logic pathway again. Because the Penguins have overperformed for years by having several games with a shortened roster filled with injured players now means the coach can't get guys to overperform and collectively be viewed as a coach who has a tradition of getting his teams to outperform....the logic here escapes me. You are making my point-- he's got a track record of getting his teams to outperform and overcome obstacles.
Having a coach who doesn’t know how to coach winning hockey is worse for player development. The leafs kids developed pretty freakin well for such a horrible problematic coach.No way to Babcock - the way he treats player any star who could would bolt and horrible for young player development.
I know they had in juries in 14-15 but they always have injuries. He took an 8 seed that was out in 5 in the first round in 14-15 to back to back cups. People are falling over themselves to defend Quinn, but apparently that's not impressive.
At some point, you have to stop considering something that happens over and over as a team overperforming. That's pretty basic logic there. Also, they did it plenty with Dan Bylsma as their coach. It's a very normal level of performance for them (depressingly for us Rangers fans).
Bylsma had to do next to nothing and still managed to f*** up some prime years in Pittsburgh. 1 Cup in 08-09 when Malkin had his monster playoffs, then the next highest showing in the following 6 years was a single conference finals appearance. Oh and don't forget that massive collapse they had where NYR came back from being down 3-1 in the 2nd round to beat them under Bylsma's watch. Wouldn't consider what they did under him as "overperforming" or even performing up to their abilities.
The Pens hired Sullivan in 14-15 a couple of years after NYR gave him and Torts the boot, then proceeded to win back to back Cups after his first season.
Bylsma had to do next to nothing and still managed to f*** up some prime years in Pittsburgh. 1 Cup in 08-09 when Malkin had his monster playoffs, then the next highest showing in the following 6 years was a single conference finals appearance. Oh and don't forget that massive collapse they had where NYR came back from being down 3-1 in the 2nd round to beat them under Bylsma's watch. Wouldn't consider what they did under him as "overperforming" or even performing up to their abilities.
The Pens hired Sullivan in 14-15 a couple of years after NYR gave him and Torts the boot, then proceeded to win back to back Cups after his first season.
At some point, you have to stop considering something that happens over and over as a team overperforming. That's pretty basic logic there. Also, they did it plenty with Dan Bylsma as their coach. It's a very normal level of performance for them (depressingly for us Rangers fans).
Bylsma had to do next to nothing and still managed to f*** up some prime years in Pittsburgh. 1 Cup in 08-09 when Malkin had his monster playoffs, then the next highest showing in the following 6 years was a single conference finals appearance. Oh and don't forget that massive collapse they had where NYR came back from being down 3-1 in the 2nd round to beat them under Bylsma's watch. Wouldn't consider what they did under him as "overperforming" or even performing up to their abilities.
The Pens hired Sullivan in 14-15 a couple of years after NYR gave him and Torts the boot, then proceeded to win back to back Cups after his first season.
No you have to look at the sum of the parts and if the sum of the parts is low( ie players are injured and missing games meaning the overall roster is not very good) but the outcome is consistently better than the parts( ie consistent playoff appearances plus overachieving predictions) the coach, by definition is coaching his team to a better than expected outcome. I’m floored by your logic. You seem to believe that because the Penguins are consistently good and Sullivan is consistently coaching a roster filled with injured players that this somehow makes him not a coach with a proven record of outperforming expectations. So he now gets punished in your eyes for doing a great job because he’s expected to always do a great job? Ok-....
Nothing I'm saying is to take away from what Sullivan has actually done. I just don't think he's gotten the team to overperform. He's gotten them to perform as expected, which is no small feat.
Literally not one thing I said is a punishment of Sullivan in any way. I'm tired of explaining this. It's not remotely a difficult concept to understand. Look inward.