Player Discussion David Quinn: Part II

[True Blue]

He can control who he ices out there. There is not a single playoff caliber team past game 60 that plays 3 lines in today's NHL. That's been proven out for the better part of the decade. They can try a bunch of call-ups and see who grabs that role rather than it being a 3-7 minute a night breather for the other guys.

But that is the thing. They are not a playoff caliber team and what this roster will look like has yet to be determined.

 

[duhmetreE]

I downgraded to a C after watching that PP, line management and ultimately breaking up the Chytil line.

It seems as if he's out of touch in this regard

 

[JHS]

But that is the thing. They are not a playoff caliber team and what this roster will look like has yet to be determined.

Why are you so happy to just keep writing that this team is not a playoff team? The goal should always be to win hockey games. At the simplest level that’s what the game is about. You seem to just be so happy with this notion that everyone gets a pass because the team is young( so of course they will mistakes) the players are inexperienced so of course we can’t hold the coach accountable for anything. So I’m confused— when do we hold anyone accountable for anything? Am I supposed to wait for another letter from the organization saying “OK fans we feel like the rebuild is now complete?” This mindset of “everyone gets a pass” is exactly what drives me up the wall here. These are NHL players getting paid NHL salaries. They need to be held accountable and so does the coach. Some people on here really just excuse everything but the thing is— there is no magic switch that we can all just turn on and say “now we can hold people accountable.” That’s why you need the best and brightest people at the top making the correct decisions about who to hold accountable and when.

For my issues with Quinn, I respect that he almost always holds players accountable. My issue is though, from a players standpoint, when the coach is making obvious coaching mistakes, it’s hard to hear that accountability message.

 

[BPD]

Why are you so happy to just keep writing that this team is not a playoff team? The goal should always be to win hockey games. At the simplest level that’s what the game is about. You seem to just be so happy with this notion that everyone gets a pass because the team is young( so of course they will mistakes) the players are inexperienced so of course we can’t hold the coach accountable for anything. So I’m confused— when do we hold anyone accountable for anything? Am I supposed to wait for another letter from the organization saying “OK fans we feel like the rebuild is now complete?” This mindset of “everyone gets a pass” is exactly what drives me up the wall here. These are NHL players getting paid NHL salaries. They need to be held accountable and so does the coach. Some people on here really just excuse everything but the thing is— there is no magic switch that we can all just turn on and say “now we can hold people accountable.” That’s why you need the best and brightest people at the top making the correct decisions about who to hold accountable and when.

For my issues with Quinn, I respect that he almost always holds players accountable. My issue is though, from a players standpoint, when the coach is making obvious coaching mistakes, it’s hard to hear that accountability message.

I think the idea here is that Quinn's success is significantly less predicated on the win column when your team has six guys who couldn't buy a beer at MSG on day one. Success this season is player development and growth. It's Kakko being used to the NA game enough to begin to be the threat we know he can. It's Fox and Hajek and Lindgren acclimating to NHL life. It's Chytil and Howden and Andersson and maybe Gettinger finding their footing well enough to be our 2C/3C/4C group in proper next year. It's Shesterkin getting his cup of coffee at the NHL level and figuring out just what needs to happen for him to take half of Hank's workload next year and begin that transition. It's probably a lot of losing, a lot of lessons, and a lot of growth.

I'd call a 75 point season where it's clear that Kakko, Fox, Chytil, etc have taken very purposeful next steps successful before I call an 87 point season where that remains foggy, but we were two spots closer to the big dance.

In this regard, Quinn's getting at least part of the job done. Fox, Lindgren, Chytil, and Kakko(in moments) look like phenomenal additions to the team. Howden, Andersson, Hajek, and Kakko (in other moments) need more of that focus.

 

[JHS]

I think the idea here is that Quinn's success is significantly less predicated on the win column when your team has six guys who couldn't buy a beer at MSG on day one. Success this season is player development and growth. It's Kakko being used to the NA game enough to begin to be the threat we know he can. It's Fox and Hajek and Lindgren acclimating to NHL life. It's Chytil and Howden and Andersson and maybe Gettinger finding their footing well enough to be our 2C/3C/4C group in proper next year. It's Shesterkin getting his cup of coffee at the NHL level and figuring out just what needs to happen for him to take half of Hank's workload next year and begin that transition. It's probably a lot of losing, a lot of lessons, and a lot of growth.

I'd call a 75 point season where it's clear that Kakko, Fox, Chytil, etc have taken very purposeful next steps successful before I call an 87 point season where that remains foggy, but we were two spots closer to the big dance.

In this regard, Quinn's getting at least part of the job done. Fox, Lindgren, Chytil, and Kakko(in moments) look like phenomenal additions to the team. Howden, Andersson, Hajek, and Kakko (in other moments) need more of that focus.

Right I totally get that it’s absurd to say that Quinn should have this roster competing for a cup but I think people are missing a key point- player development and winning are not mutually exclusive things. Players can develop while the expectation is to win! In fact players will develop quicker when they are expected to win! When players are allowed to feel like they can just lose— that’s the definition of a losing culture.

Yes I want the young guys to develop but I want this team to win at the same time. I don’t look at that as impossible which I think many on this board do.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Some scorching hot takes in here.

 

[BPD]

Right I totally get that it’s absurd to say that Quinn should have this roster competing for a cup but I think people are missing a key point- player development and winning are not mutually exclusive things. Players can develop while the expectation is to win! In fact players will develop quicker when they are expected to win! When players are allowed to feel like they can just lose— that’s the definition of a losing culture.

Yes I want the young guys to develop but I want this team to win at the same time. I don’t look at that as impossible which I think many on this board do.

It's not impossible, but it's also probably not the best way to measure success in 19-20.

In 20-21, when these guys have 100 games under their belts and they "get it"? Sure, time to add "win a bunch of games" to the success criteria. I'd be pretty disappointed if they weren't at least thinking wild-card for next season.

This one? I want progress on the ice. I can live with shit standings if I get clear progress.

 

[True Blue]

Why are you so happy to just keep writing that this team is not a playoff team?

I am not happy to write it. I am simply stating my belief. And have listed my reasons in multiple threads and multiple replies.

The goal should always be to win hockey games.

Who said the team is not trying to win every game? Did I miss that?

At the simplest level that’s what the game is about. You seem to just be so happy with this notion that everyone gets a pass because the team is young( so of course they will mistakes) the players are inexperienced so of course we can’t hold the coach accountable for anything.

What in the name of anything remotely relevant are you even talking about? I want the team to loose so that Quinn cannot be held accountable? Seems to me that you are suffering from the Quinn Derangement Syndrome here.

So I’m confused— when do we hold anyone accountable for anything? Am I supposed to wait for another letter from the organization saying “OK fans we feel like the rebuild is now complete?” This mindset of “everyone gets a pass” is exactly what drives me up the wall here. These are NHL players getting paid NHL salaries. They need to be held accountable and so does the coach. Some people on here really just excuse everything but the thing is— there is no magic switch that we can all just turn on and say “now we can hold people accountable.”

Are you really this obtuse? A coach for this Rangers team is judged differently than a coach for say the Boston Bruins. Or even Colorado. Why? Because those teams are either competing for the Cup or are at a minimum expected to make deep runs. A coach of a team that is icing the youngest collection of players in the league is not going to be judged by the same standards. His primary job last year and this year is to develop this assortment of young players, change the culture and ensure that they take steps forward. Do I want the Rangers to make the playoffs? Yeah, would be nice. I root for them to win each and every game. But my standard of success is not Playoffs or Bust. At least not this year. And I assure you, it is also not one that both Gorton and JD are utilizing.

This team is icing a defense that has THREE rookies and one sophomore. Can you name another team that is remotely even close to that? Can you name for me another team in the last decade that did that? How many teams in the last 25 years that have done that? And the fantastic thing is that this assortment of 'yoots is progressing. Of course they are not yet the caliber of a defense that makes deep playoff runs. But they are taking steps to get there. Same goes for the forwards.

The seeming notion that Quinn is to be judged by the same exact standard as a Butch Cassidy for this year is utterly assinine. The fact that this team went 8-4-1 when their most important player was out is like extracting blood from a stone. The team is actually over achieving right now.

For my issues with Quinn, I respect that he almost always holds players accountable. My issue is though, from a players standpoint, when the coach is making obvious coaching mistakes, it’s hard to hear that accountability message.

And do what? Get fired for making a mistake on the PP they other day? Should he be given a time out from being behind the bench?

That’s why you need the best and brightest people at the top making the correct decisions about who to hold accountable and when.

That is why Gorton hired Quinn. I think that we all know that in your definition only winning the Stanley Cup gets that distinction. Thankfully, Gorton and JD view it completely differently than you. And quite realistically.

Yes I want the young guys to develop but I want this team to win at the same time. I don’t look at that as impossible which I think many on this board do.

We spend time on most days posting messages on a friggin' internet message board. We know more about current prospects and upcoming prospects than virtually the entire fanbase. Do you really think that we do not root for the team to win?

No it is not impossible to win AND develop at the same time. The chances are simply against icing a team that will compete for the playoffs when said team is this young and most of the players have miles to go in their development.

The fact that this team has the record that it currently does is a minor miracle.

 

[OthmannOut]

Last year we had 26 ROWs in 82 games.
So far this season, we have 13 ROWs in 26 games. Not sure if this has been pointed out, but that’s a real great sign that we are competing to win. We have also had a few comebacks this year that have been enjoyable and amazingly we are a winning streak away from being a wildcard team.

Will we keep this up? Probably not. But I’m enjoying this season considerably more than I expected. I believe Quinn deserves a lot of credit here.

And yes, the Panarin and Trouba signings have played a role there but all else equal most of the kids have taken steps forward from their playing last year. Quinn surely deserves praise for the progress of Chytil, Lindgren, Buch, Tony, Zbad, and Strome.

 

[True Blue]

Some scorching hot takes in here.

And then some.....

I mean didn't you know that Buchnevich's development is owed entirely to AV?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

And then some.....

I mean didn't you know that Buchnevich's development is owed entirely to AV?

Buchnevich, like Hayes, said that himself, but why wouldn't be take the word of the player himself over some conjecture by fans who never even got close to a locker room?

 

[True Blue]

Buchnevich, like Hayes, said that himself, but why wouldn't be take the word of the player himself over some conjecture by fans who never even got close to a locker room?

There is no player that ever says "I got nothing from the coach". But even if we go with this, are we really expected to believe that Buch's career arch, which started to take off in the second half of last year and continued this year, has nothing at all to do with the current coaching staff?

 

[JHS]

I am not happy to write it. I am simply stating my belief. And have listed my reasons in multiple threads and multiple replies.

Who said the team is not trying to win every game? Did I miss that?

What in the name of anything remotely relevant are you even talking about? I want the team to loose so that Quinn cannot be held accountable? Seems to me that you are suffering from the Quinn Derangement Syndrome here.

Are you really this obtuse? A coach for this Rangers team is judged differently than a coach for say the Boston Bruins. Or even Colorado. Why? Because those teams are either competing for the Cup or are at a minimum expected to make deep runs. A coach of a team that is icing the youngest collection of players in the league is not going to be judged by the same standards. His primary job last year and this year is to develop this assortment of young players, change the culture and ensure that they take steps forward. Do I want the Rangers to make the playoffs? Yeah, would be nice. I root for them to win each and every game. But my standard of success is not Playoffs or Bust. At least not this year. And I assure you, it is also not one that both Gorton and JD are utilizing.

This team is icing a defense that has THREE rookies and one sophomore. Can you name another team that is remotely even close to that? Can you name for me another team in the last decade that did that? How many teams in the last 25 years that have done that? And the fantastic thing is that this assortment of 'yoots is progressing. Of course they are not yet the caliber of a defense that makes deep playoff runs. But they are taking steps to get there. Same goes for the forwards.

The seeming notion that Quinn is to be judged by the same exact standard as a Butch Cassidy for this year is utterly assinine. The fact that this team went 8-4-1 when their most important player was out is like extracting blood from a stone. The team is actually over achieving right now.

And do what? Get fired for making a mistake on the PP they other day? Should he be given a time out from being behind the bench?

That is why Gorton hired Quinn. I think that we all know that in your definition only winning the Stanley Cup gets that distinction. Thankfully, Gorton and JD view it completely differently than you. And quite realistically.

We spend time on most days posting messages on a friggin' internet message board. We know more about current prospects and upcoming prospects than virtually the entire fanbase. Do you really think that we do not root for the team to win?

No it is not impossible to win AND develop at the same time. The chances are simply against icing a team that will compete for the playoffs when said team is this young and most of the players have miles to go in their development.

The fact that this team has the record that it currently does is a minor miracle.

Within this entire post you just proved my exact point-- you defend poor performance by justifying said performance based on inexperience. I don't view hockey that way-- anyone who plays competitive sports knows you always are out there to win and just because you are younger or less experienced does not mean you just roll over and die. That's what I keep reading from you over and over again. I refuse to accept such low standards. My point is, standards and expectations need to be high-- Quinn has said this over and over again. He's not using the " these guys are young so we will just accept mistakes" approach and you seem to love the guy so if at all possible, take the lead from the coach on this one.

I said I'm not holding Quinn to "Cup or Bust" standards but I will not just give blanket passes to the entire organization because the have an incredibly young team. The organization is placing these guys on NHL ice and, to hold them to less than "we expect to win" standards is an embarrassment to an NHL athlete. Can you imagine if a coach came into a locker room filled with professional athletes and said " Great effort out there guys, we are so happy you are developing-- we know we keep getting blown out but keep up the good effort." It's disrespectful and disingenuous to the NHL players on the ice if this is approach you are advocating for. Since you like to place your ideas into Gorton and Quinn's mind-- I can guarantee you not once has Quinn said this in a locker room post game chat.

Also, I'd ask you a favor-- stop multi quoting every response. It's a poor technique because any one line written in a response does not need to be dissected and it's easy to take sentences out of context to prove a point. You also often miss my points because of this technique you love so much because you get lost in your dissection of every word I write.

 

[Athor]

Within this entire post you just proved my exact point-- you defend poor performance by justifying said performance based on inexperience. I don't view hockey that way-- anyone who plays competitive sports knows you always are out there to win and just because you are younger or less experienced does not mean you just roll over and die. That's what I keep reading from you over and over again. I refuse to accept such low standards. My point is, standards and expectations need to be high-- Quinn has said this over and over again. He's not using the " these guys are young so we will just accept mistakes" approach and you seem to love the guy so if at all possible, take the lead from the coach on this one.

I said I'm not holding Quinn to "Cup or Bust" standards but I will not just give blanket passes to the entire organization because the have an incredibly young team. The organization is placing these guys on NHL ice and, to hold them to less than "we expect to win" standards is an embarrassment to an NHL athlete. Can you imagine if a coach came into a locker room filled with professional athletes and said " Great effort out there guys, we are so happy you are developing-- we know we keep getting blown out but keep up the good effort." It's disrespectful and disingenuous to the NHL players on the ice if this is approach you are advocating for. Since you like to place your ideas into Gorton and Quinn's mind-- I can guarantee you not once has Quinn said this in a locker room post game chat.

Why make it so black & white? You're acting like the two are mutually exclusive, and holding this team to ridiculously high, frankly unrealistic standards even if it's not cup or bust. Nobody is rolling over and dying. They're simply just not good enough at this point.

It's like asking why doesn't a player/coach trash someone they don't like in an interview. Can you imagine?

 

[JHS]

Why make it so black & white? You're acting like the two are mutually exclusive, and holding this team to ridiculously high, frankly unrealistic standards even if it's not cup or bust. Nobody is rolling over and dying. They're simply just not good enough at this point.

It's like asking why doesn't a player/coach trash someone they don't like in an interview. Can you imagine?

I'll be guilty of holding the team to a high standard all day. I sure do hope the coaching staff has the same standards.

I'm not sure how I'm acting like the two are mutually exclusive-- I'm saying that winning and development are intertwined

 

[Athor]

I'll be guilty of holding the team to a high standard all day. I sure do hope the coaching staff has the same standards.

I'm sure they hold them to high standards, which is why Quinn is holding everyone accountable with the lineup decisions & ice time. I just don't think their standards are directly parallel to winning games.

 

[JHS]

Not sure I see that. I went to the arrangers roundtable and listened carefully to what Quinn said. He mentioned all the time that his expectations are to win hockey games and be competitive. I think every NHL coach is about wins first and development at the same time. In the end of the day, wins are what matter and again, coaches can develop players and coach to win at the same time.

It’s only fans on here that love to talk about player development who can’t see how the two are intertwined.

 

[Chytilmania]

Howden has been 4C and Fast is 3rd/4th line so we should all be happy/ier.

 

[True Blue]

Within this entire post you just proved my exact point-- you defend poor performance by justifying said performance based on inexperience. I don't view hockey that way-- anyone who plays competitive sports knows you always are out there to win and just because you are younger or less experienced does not mean you just roll over and die. That's what I keep reading from you over and over again.

So what do you propose? Judging Quinn's performance the same way you would Butch Cassidy's? One team has a much better chance of winning than the other. Quinn benches or scratches players for poor performance. What do you propose should be done for him? Scratch the coach? Should he be fired when the team does not make the playoffs?

I refuse to accept such low standards. My point is, standards and expectations need to be high-- Quinn has said this over and over again. He's not using the " these guys are young so we will just accept mistakes" approach and you seem to love the guy so if at all possible, take the lead from the coach on this one.

What you the fan accepts or rejects is up to you. It seems that Rangers upper management views the world differently than you. Since I believe that Gorton has done a pretty good job on this rebuild, my confidence goes with him as opposed to your views.

I said I'm not holding Quinn to "Cup or Bust" standards but I will not just give blanket passes to the entire organization because the have an incredibly young team. The organization is placing these guys on NHL ice and, to hold them to less than "we expect to win" standards is an embarrassment to an NHL athlete. Can you imagine if a coach came into a locker room filled with professional athletes and said " Great effort out there guys, we are so happy you are developing-- we know we keep getting blown out but keep up the good effort." It's disrespectful and disingenuous to the NHL players on the ice if this is approach you are advocating for. Since you like to place your ideas into Gorton and Quinn's mind-- I can guarantee you not once has Quinn said this in a locker room post game chat.

Again, this team is icing a defense in which half are rookies and one is a sophomore. When was the last time you have ever seen a team do that? How much of a haircut are you giving on performance based on that? We are not even getting to the forwards or what is going on in goal.

Of course Quinn is not going into the lockerroom saying to the players "Good job on being the little engine that could". What I am saying is that more than likely when it comes to evaluating Quinn's performance, Gorton and JD are not putting as much emphasis on winning and loosing as you are. Which frankly is expected when icing a team like this. And again, given their record when considering all of the factors that have been said, the team is actually overachieving. So I am not sure what you are looking for. It seems that you are angry that more people are not joining you in your wailing against Quinn. Could be that more people view this team and its expectations differently than you.

Also, I'd ask you a favor-- stop multi quoting every response. It's a poor technique because any one line written in a response does not need to be dissected and it's easy to take sentences out of context to prove a point. You also often miss my points because of this technique you love so much because you get lost in your dissection of every word I write.

Sorry, but been doing it that way for a very long time and that is likely not to change.

It’s only fans on here that love to talk about player development who can’t see how the two are intertwined.

I think that this probably summarizes your issues. It seems that you are upset that more fans on this board do not view Quinn with the same viewpoint as you do. Not sure what to tell you on that anymore.

 

[JHS]

So what do you propose? Judging Quinn's performance the same way you would Butch Cassidy's? One team has a much better chance of winning than the other. Quinn benches or scratches players for poor performance. What do you propose should be done for him? Scratch the coach? Should he be fired when the team does not make the playoffs?

What you the fan accepts or rejects is up to you. It seems that Rangers upper management views the world differently than you. Since I believe that Gorton has done a pretty good job on this rebuild, my confidence goes with him as opposed to your views.

Again, this team is icing a defense in which half are rookies and one is a sophomore. When was the last time you have ever seen a team do that? How much of a haircut are you giving on performance based on that? We are not even getting to the forwards or what is going on in goal.

Of course Quinn is not going into the lockerroom saying to the players "Good job on being the little engine that could". What I am saying is that more than likely when it comes to evaluating Quinn's performance, Gorton and JD are not putting as much emphasis on winning and loosing as you are. Which frankly is expected when icing a team like this. And again, given their record when considering all of the factors that have been said, the team is actually overachieving. So I am not sure what you are looking for. It seems that you are angry that more people are not joining you in your wailing against Quinn. Could be that more people view this team and its expectations differently than you.

Sorry, but been doing it that way for a very long time and that is likely not to change.

I think that this probably summarizes your issues. It seems that you are upset that more fans on this board do not view Quinn with the same viewpoint as you do. Not sure what to tell you on that anymore.

If it's not about winning hockey games, what is the point in developing players? That's as simply as I can put it for you. Once you see how obviously linked the two are you may have a chance to understand how important it is to evaluate performance based on outcome.

I can assure you, Gorton and JD know the game way better than you( or likely even I) They absolutely want this team to win. In an interview I heard with JD earlier, they are basing trade deadline decisions about who to move based on how the team is performing. Sounds to me exactly like the logic a team would use when they believe they can compete. I'm listening to what the people are saying and making my evaluations based on that. You like to hypothesize on how Gorton and JD think-- If you just listen to them I think you can tell they are coming at this with winning games as a primary focus. The evidence supports this too- look at what Gorton did this off season, he went out and got two solid NHL players both of which have been good, one of which has been incredible. Again, in the same interview, JD complemented Gorton on doing this because he felt it allowed the team to remain competitive even while developing young players( this interview was when JD appeared on the "Michael Kay Show" a few weeks ago if you want to take a listen. Again, if the upper management did not want to place the team and the coach in a position to win than Gorton would have done nothing this off season( those are two roster spots that could be filled by other 22 year olds mind you)

The following quote was taken directly from JD during his introductory press conference

"It's a team that works, a team that plays hard and a team that plays the game the right way, and I credit coach David Quinn and his staff for doing exactly that," Davidson said. "And we're gonna continue to improve in that area. That's very important. I can't tell you how important it is to have the proper culture in an organization to try to win hockey games, and they've certainly done a terrific job in creating that already."

Notice how he is focusing on creating a WINNING culture. He did not say " we want the team to develop and we are ok with just competing." So it seems like JD, like I've been saying all along, recognizes that it's about creating a culture that WINS!!! It's not just about developing players and allowing them to be held to pathetically weak standards like you like to advocate for.

Now, do I think Gorton and JD will fire Quinn if they don't make the playoffs, absolutely not. Do I think they will evaluate him based on how many wins the team has-- absolutely.

 

[True Blue]

If it's not about winning hockey games, what is the point in developing players? That's as simply as I can put it for you. Once you see how obviously linked the two are you may have a chance to understand how important it is to evaluate performance based on outcome.

Winning games and developing players need not be mutually exclusive, but it does not have to be. Players can and do develop their games whether or not a team wins or looses.

I can assure you, Gorton and JD know the game way better than you( or likely even I) They absolutely want this team to win. In an interview I heard with JD earlier, they are basing trade deadline decisions about who to move based on how the team is performing. Sounds to me exactly like the logic a team would use when they believe they can compete. I'm listening to what the people are saying and making my evaluations based on that. You like to hypothesize on how Gorton and JD think-- If you just listen to them I think you can tell they are coming at this with winning games as a primary focus.

Who said that they did not want to win? Can you point just one instance where that has been written? I would doubt that. Of course they want to win. My point to you is their judgement of how Quinn performs is not dedicated to strictly the amount of wins the team has. I am not sure how to actually explain this to you any further. Of course I am only stating my opinion, but I believe it to be right for all of the multiple reasons that I have already stated. If you feel different, that is your prerogative but prepare to be disappointed when Quinn is still coaching the team next year.

The following quote was taken directly from JD during his introductory press conference

"It's a team that works, a team that plays hard and a team that plays the game the right way, and I credit coach David Quinn and his staff for doing exactly that," Davidson said. "And we're gonna continue to improve in that area. That's very important. I can't tell you how important it is to have the proper culture in an organization to try to win hockey games, and they've certainly done a terrific job in creating that already."

Notice how he is focusing on creating a WINNING culture. He did not say " we want the team to develop and we are ok with just competing

What did you expect him to say?

Again, I think that the major issue here is that you are actually mad that most people are not joining you in railing against Quinn. Not sure how to help you here.

 

[JHS]

Winning games and developing players need not be mutually exclusive, but it does not have to be. Players can and do develop their games whether or not a team wins or looses.

Who said that they did not want to win? Can you point just one instance where that has been written? I would doubt that. Of course they want to win. My point to you is their judgement of how Quinn performs is not dedicated to strictly the amount of wins the team has. I am not sure how to actually explain this to you any further. Of course I am only stating my opinion, but I believe it to be right for all of the multiple reasons that I have already stated. If you feel different, that is your prerogative but prepare to be disappointed when Quinn is still coaching the team next year.

What did you expect him to say?

Again, I think that the major issue here is that you are actually mad that most people are not joining you in railing against Quinn. Not sure how to help you here.

You keep narrowing your argument and point which means I don't think you are able to continue to stand by it. That's cool, I just keep saying what the upper management agrees with and you go off of your own ideas. To clarify again for the possibly 30th time-- I DO NOT WANT QUINN FIRED. I think he has potential to be a great coach. My issue is with the organization not waiting till the end of the season to hire him. I think that's been made clear by me.

Also, am I to believe that JD is now not to be taken at his word? That's disrespectful to the man. If he expects this team to develop with a winning culture( a phrase I'm sure he selected carefully) than that's what I believe.

I don't care what anyone supports on here. I'm not a like chaser and as I've said, I come here to engage in an honest discussion about a team I really like and root for. You've engaged me in that discussion and for that I'm appreciative. Makes no difference to me who agrees with me and who does not. What does frustrate me is when people advocate for such low standards but again-- to each his own.

 

[True Blue]

You keep narrowing your argument and point which means I don't think you are able to continue to stand by it. That's cool, I just keep saying what the upper management agrees with and you go off of your own ideas. To clarify again for the possibly 30th time-- I DO NOT WANT QUINN FIRED. I think he has potential to be a great coach. My issue is with the organization not waiting till the end of the season to hire him. I think that's been made clear by me.

I thought that this got renewed due to accountability?

Also, am I to believe that JD is now not to be taken at his word? That's disrespectful to the man. If he expects this team to develop with a winning culture( a phrase I'm sure he selected carefully) than that's what I believe.

Who said anything about that? Of course you believe him. But of course the script that he read was the virtually the same as anyone would have said.

I don't care what anyone supports on here. I'm not a like chaser and as I've said, I come here to engage in an honest discussion about a team I really like and root for. You've engaged me in that discussion and for that I'm appreciative. Makes no difference to me who agrees with me and who does not. What does frustrate me is when people advocate for such low standards but again-- to each his own.

Ahh, there it is. Sorry, but I take that to be that you are mad that people are not joining you in railing against Quinn.

 

[JHS]

I thought that this got renewed due to accountability?

Who said anything about that? Of course you believe him. But of course the script that he read was the virtually the same as anyone would have said.

Ahh, there it is. Sorry, but I take that to be that you are mad that people are not joining you in railing against Quinn.

Becoming impossibly difficult to continue with you. Your cynical view of JD reading some sort of a scrip is just blatant disrespect to a man who achieved way more in hockey than you or I every will.

Guilty as charged to your accusation of getting frustrated by people who want to give blanket passes to the entire organization. Of note, that's not this entire board however-- I think their is a very silent majority that see exactly what I am saying but just don't want to engage with you on this back and forth.

 

[True Blue]

Becoming impossibly difficult to continue with you. Your cynical view of JD reading some sort of a scrip is just blatant disrespect to a man who achieved way more in hockey than you or I every will.

Not sure what is so cynical by saying that what he said is what I would expect anyone to say during the introduction conference. Not sure where the disrespect is, but whatever.

Guilty as charged to your accusation of getting frustrated by people who want to give blanket passes to the entire organization. Of note, that's not this entire board however-- I think their is a very silent majority that see exactly what I am saying but just don't want to engage with you on this back and forth.

Ahh, yes. The silent majority that is completely on your side, that unfortunately do not make themselves heard at all to take up your cause.

If we believe the numbers in the poll, 55% of the board gave him a B. Nearly 30% gave him a C. Most of the conversations that have been had reflect that type of thinking. That does not lead me to believe that there is a silent majority who seems to have it out for Quinn.

Again, what it boils down to is that you are upset by the fact that people do not seem to be joining you in railing against Quinn. Since we both know that the logic of why that is will not change your position at ll, I am not really sure what to tell you. You can either continue to rail and get more upset when people do not join the cause or rethink the position. Either way, we seem to be right back where we started here.