Crosby Hits #1 in All Time Pay

[GrizzGreen]

Lol the average NHL salary is enough for me to comfortably retire on at age 25. I'm sure as shit not going to feel bad for them for what they're making

The average NHLer makes $2.6 million or so a year, so you can live a $100k per year life and never run out of money using the rule of 4%. Yeah, I don't feel bad for any pro athlete when it comes to money.

They end up seeing less than $1MM of that after tax, agent fees, etc.

You're pretty much completely hosed if you're retiring on less than a million today at retirement age so it'd be fairly difficult to ensure stability for the next ~70 years of life on that amount

 

[Empoleon8771]

They end up seeing less than $1MM of that after tax, agent fees, etc.

You're pretty much completely hosed if you're retiring on less than a million today at retirement age so it'd be fairly difficult to ensure stability for the next ~70 years of life on that amount

So do you seriously think players lose over 70% of their earnings due to taxes, agent fees and stuff? Because going down to $1 million is already losing 62%, and you said "less than $1 million". That might be a worst case scenario, where you're living in a city with a high jock tax and/or high state income taxes, but you'd also be a dummy for not hiring a financial advisor to figure out loopholes for paying those taxes. The highest estimate I've seen including an 11.5% escrow was McDavid losing about 62% after escrow, agent fees and taxes were included.

And fine, let's pretend that a player somehow magically loses 75% of their salary due to taxes, agent fees, escrow and such, even though that's an absolutely insane number. They're still taking home $650k a year. They can play for 3 years, make a total of about $2 million and retire on about $80k a year with never running out of money. And I'll also add that $80k a year in expenses isn't the same as $80k a year in salary and the 4% rule is probably even an overly conservative estimate, where you can likely go to 5% or 6% and still be fine.

Again, feeling bad for pro athletes when it comes to money is just something I find absolutely laughable. They're the top 1% of this country.

 

[GrizzGreen]

So do you seriously think players lose over 70% of their earnings due to taxes, agent fees and stuff?

That's exactly what happens, thank you for the indulgence.

It's not "feeling bad for them", it's just looking at the actual quantifiable characteristics of the situation... as well as understanding the sad truth of many professional athletes ending up broke and struggling due to a lack of marketable skills outside of their profession, a poor understanding of fundamental financial principles, and surrounding themselves with the wrong people.

Laugh all you want at the "1%" who are the 1% in the moment of their importance, however, $80k/yr is not a sizable salary by any means, especially with children or other dependents to support.

 

[Empoleon8771]

That's exactly what happens, thank you for the indulgence.

It's not "feeling bad for them", it's just looking at the actual quantifiable characteristics of the situation... as well as understanding the sad truth of many professional athletes ending up broke and struggling due to a lack of marketable skills outside of their profession, a poor understanding of fundamental financial principles, and surrounding themselves with the wrong people.

I see basically no sources that suggest that even the highest earners lose that kind of money to taxes, fees and whatnot. Please provide a source for that.

The source I have is in the tweet below, which suggests McDavid was one of the highest losers at about 62%, but that included an 11.5% escrow.



Add on agent fees and you're at most at 65% or so. And that's for the absolute most, and a guy making $2 million is going to be getting taxed much less than a guy at $15 million.

Just because I saw Kopitar's number there, someone with a $10 million salary is getting taxed at about a 51.5% rate in LA, while someone with a $2 million salary is getting taxed at about 46.5% tax rate.

Laugh all you want at the "1%" who are the 1% in the moment of their importance, however, $80k/yr is not a sizable salary by any means, especially with children or other dependents to support.

$80k a year in net income is not the same as $80k a year salary. $80k a year in net income is more like $120k a year in salary, depending on where you live. And that number is a conservative number using the rule of 4%, when you can very likely still be fine on a 5% ($100k) or 6% ($120k) withdrawal rate as well.

Anyone who can have $2 million in their bank accounts after working for 2 years at an average salary in the league doesn't get any sympathy from me when it comes to money. Sorry, I'm not going to feel bad for the 1% of the world because they have to live the equivalent to a $120k-$160k life to be able to retire after 2 years in their 20s.

 

[Sky04]

Messi made more than that last year, Mahomes will make that 2.5 years, crazy how high other sports are.

 

[GrizzGreen]

I see basically no sources that suggest that even the highest earners lose that kind of money to taxes, fees and whatnot. Please provide a source for that.

The source I have is in the tweet below, which suggests McDavid was one of the highest losers at about 62%, but that included an 11.5% escrow.



Add on agent fees and you're at most at 65% or so. And that's for the absolute most, and a guy making $2 million is going to be getting taxed much less than a guy at $15 million.



$80k a year in net income is not the same as $80k a year salary. $80k a year in net income is more like $120k a year in salary, depending on where you live. And that number is a conservative number using the rule of 4%, when you can very likely still be fine on a 5% ($100k) or 6% ($120k) withdrawal rate as well.

The actual tax typically levels out past $3MM+ depending on state, situation, etc.

Dog, I understand how income works. Your speculations assume they spend zero of their salary to live which is obviously not the case. "Pro athletes playing the sport I watch make money: bad" is not the own you think it is.

These individuals are in a phenomenal place to work from for financial security but many end up struggling because they're treated with kid gloves their entire lives for being the best in all the leagues they play in, may suffer injuries or other complications during their career, including stunted growth as an 18 year old millionaire... and then it all ends and they're ruined because no one showed them the correct way to do things. There's no need to feel bad about their salaries but I think we can all level with the idea of helping those who find themselves in poor situations due to the effects of the world around them, as well as their own actions to some extent; that's all I'm saying.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The actual tax typically levels out past $3MM+ depending on state, situation, etc.

Dog, I understand how income works. Your speculations assume they spend zero of their salary to live which is obviously not the case. "Pro athletes playing the sport I watch make money: bad" is not the own you think it is.

These individuals are in a phenomenal place to work from for financial security but many end up struggling because they're treated with kid gloves their entire lives for being the best in all the leagues they play in, may suffer injuries or other complications during their career, including stunted growth as an 18 year old millionaire... and then it all ends and they're ruined because no one showed them the correct way to do things. There's no need to feel bad about their salaries but I think we can all level with the idea of helping those who find themselves in poor situations due to the effects of the world around them, as well as their own actions to some extent; that's all I'm saying.

No, I'm saying "don't feel bad about the finances of people making millions of dollars to play a game".

I'm not going to feel bad for lottery winners who piss away their lottery winnings, so why should I feel bad for pro athletes who hit the biological/situational lottery and became millionaire pro athletes? These guys make more in 1 season than a huge percentage of the population makes in their entire lifetimes. I imagine that most hockey teams and agents give these players ample amounts of guidance, or at least refers them to people who can give them guidance.

I just fundamentally can't feel bad for pro athletes when it comes to finances. The impact of injuries, especially CTE? That's definitely something else entirely. But if we're talking financial empathy, there are millions of people I'd give it to before I give it to any sort of pro athlete.

 

[Eisen]

Zach friggin' Parise?

 

[Bandit]

So... less than Mahomes latest 7 year deal? Cool.

Edit: LMAO that was his last contract. Current one is even more insane.

 

[Rapsfan]

Lol the average NHL salary is enough for me to comfortably retire on at age 25. I'm sure as shit not going to feel bad for them for what they're making

The average NHLer makes $2.6 million or so a year, so you can live a $100k per year life and never run out of money using the rule of 4%. Yeah, I don't feel bad for any pro athlete when it comes to money.

But the thing is, you're a TOP tier player of a sport in the entire world (possibly GOAT). Sure it's enough to live a good life but look at NBA players. They are able to afford big houses and live the good life with everything possible to spend. I wish the same could be said for NHL players. The issue with saying that about pro athletes is they had to train and risk their body and grind for all that so surely they deserve way more.

EDIT: Not to mention hockey costs A LOT to play and maintain so imagine all the ice time expenses and equipment every year + travel. I wonder how much "net" he gets.

 

[GeeoffBrown]

If you include all his other income, Crosby has to be way ahead of everyone

Zach friggin' Parise?

Parise has one of those ridiculous back-diving cap-circumvention contracts that are illegal now

 

[Voight]

Is this just based on yearly salary? Cause I know Ovy/Sid were racking up 5-10 million/year in endorsement cash during their primes.

 

[Kshahdoo]

McDavid will get him soon for playing hockey + golf...

 

[StumpyTown]

I see basically no sources that suggest that even the highest earners lose that kind of money to taxes, fees and whatnot. Please provide a source for that.

The source I have is in the tweet below, which suggests McDavid was one of the highest losers at about 62%, but that included an 11.5% escrow.



Add on agent fees and you're at most at 65% or so. And that's for the absolute most, and a guy making $2 million is going to be getting taxed much less than a guy at $15 million.

Just because I saw Kopitar's number there, someone with a $10 million salary is getting taxed at about a 51.5% rate in LA, while someone with a $2 million salary is getting taxed at about 46.5% tax rate.



$80k a year in net income is not the same as $80k a year salary. $80k a year in net income is more like $120k a year in salary, depending on where you live. And that number is a conservative number using the rule of 4%, when you can very likely still be fine on a 5% ($100k) or 6% ($120k) withdrawal rate as well.

Anyone who can have $2 million in their bank accounts after working for 2 years at an average salary in the league doesn't get any sympathy from me when it comes to money. Sorry, I'm not going to feel bad for the 1% of the world because they have to live the equivalent to a $120k-$160k life to be able to retire after 2 years in their 20s.

I wonder how many players have tax shelters set up whereby they divert portions of their incomes into deferred accounts to reduce taxes paid now? Not sure if that's a thing for professional athletes or not...

 

[Garthinater]

Really interesting. I was just thinking about this recently.

I wonder how much it changes if you account for era and inflation.

Shocking that crosby has so little signing bonus and shea weber has almost 70 mil.

 

[molon labe]

Messi made more than that last year, Mahomes will make that 2.5 years, crazy how high other sports are.

Football is living on borrowed time. Soccer - on the other hand - will continue to reign strong for the rest of our lives.

 

[D1az]

Football is living on borrowed time. Soccer - on the other hand - will continue to reign strong for the rest of our lives.

You mean "American football" and "football"?

 

[SEALBound]

Zach Parise being in the top 10 all time in career earnings is hilariously awful.

Imagine being all-time games played leader Partrick Marleau and seeing the likes of Brad Richards and Marion Gaborik ahead of you.

 

[Confused Turnip]

I wonder how many players have tax shelters set up whereby they divert portions of their incomes into deferred accounts to reduce taxes paid now? Not sure if that's a thing for professional athletes or not...

Not an accountant, but I think the nature of athlete pay structures would make this difficult to impossible. Their income is earned in a very specific and public location and you'd never get away with classifying them as anything but employees.

 

[SouthGeorge]

Can anyone explain to me how Crosby is ahead of Ovechkin here?

Better player earns more money. What's confusing?

 

[Confused Turnip]

Better player earns more money. What's confusing?

I trust you'll continue to say this when Crosby's back diving contract leaves him well behind Ovi over the next 4 years?

 

[412 Others]

Can anyone explain to me how Crosby is ahead of Ovechkin here?

Secondary assists.

 

[tabness]

List dont look right, Belfour got at least a billion dollars

 

[andrjusha]

Secondary assists.

Needs to be payed in secondary dollars (no disrespect to Canada)
a dollar is a dollar, right?

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

Scott Gomez has the greatest "earnings to goals" ratio.