Could Toronto Wind Up With Two 1st Round Picks?

[TheGoldenJet]

Now he's as accomplished as Chiarelli, great.

I hear Doobler has zero votes though.

 

[Dekes For Days]

now were suddenly back to rebuilding

We're not rebuilding at all.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Freddy to the right cash strapped team (half da league right now) will get a 1st rounder. Still think it will be Canes. With Canes Freddy is #1 guy. With CBJ it is part of a bigger deal with Freddy as backup but no 1st rounder. Either way we need a top 4 dman who plays defense or a 1st rounder which we can package for same. Bottom line we can't afford a NAME guy who wants a boatload. But a real solid guy like Savard would really help. Than add a Dillon type for our 3rd pair and we become a much better defensive team next year.

 

[Papi 4 Hart]

Yes, both what I said and what you said can be simultaneously right.

I was responding to this: "If Dubas were to play his cards right and trade Freddy Anderson in a year when there are numerous quality FA goalies available, could he get a 1st round pick+"

That doesn't make any sense. Supply and demand.

It does because you have to pay for the other goalies with more Money and a cash strapped team can instead use assets to get a similar or better goalie for 1 million dollars. If supply is high and you can't afford to meet the demand you will find a lesser or equal value asset for less dollars.

 

[kb]

Freddy to the right cash strapped team (half da league right now) will get a 1st rounder. Still think it will be Canes. With Canes Freddy is #1 guy. With CBJ it is part of a bigger deal with Freddy as backup but no 1st rounder. Either way we need a top 4 dman who plays defense or a 1st rounder which we can package for same. Bottom line we can't afford a NAME guy who wants a boatload. But a real solid guy like Savard would really help. Than add a Dillon type for our 3rd pair and we become a much better defensive team next year.

Savard and Korpisalo for Freddy. It works on so many levels for both teams. Saves them $5.2 million cash and $2 million in cap to resign Dubois and Josh Anderson They already have 3 NHL RHD signed for next season in Jones, Nuutivara, and Kukan.

 

[Mess]

Freddy to the right cash strapped team (half da league right now) will get a 1st rounder. Still think it will be Canes. With Canes Freddy is #1 guy. With CBJ it is part of a bigger deal with Freddy as backup but no 1st rounder. Either way we need a top 4 dman who plays defense or a 1st rounder which we can package for same. Bottom line we can't afford a NAME guy who wants a boatload. But a real solid guy like Savard would really help. Than add a Dillon type for our 3rd pair and we become a much better defensive team next year.

Getting a 1st round pick for what might be a 1 year rental even if for just $1 mil in real dollars certainly not something I would be endorsing if the shoe was on the other foot, and I was the team acquiring Andersen. So its a little hard to believe its possible, unless the team acquiring him can renegotiate an extension first.

If Dubas can convince someone of this move, then take it like a thief in the night and run, but I remain dubious until it happens.

I can see more of a bigger trade with Canes that includes Andersen as part on Leafs part with Brett Pesce being the principle coming back and then deciding what else the Leafs would need to add.

 

[Big Muddy]

Andersen doesn't have the term and RFA year left on his deal like Kapanen does. Andersen would arguably occupy a greater role though. That could/should very well be worth a first or more in return.

Hopefully, but with the amount of free agent goalies on the market this year, I'm not as sure about that.

 

[Big Muddy]

Savard and Korpisalo for Freddy. It works on so many levels for both teams. Saves them $5.2 million cash and $2 million in cap to resign Dubois and Josh Anderson They already have 3 NHL RHD signed for next season in Jones, Nuutivara, and Kukan.

That would be a great deal for us. Going to guess that CBJ would get more if they moved those two players in separate deals.

 

[kb]

That would be a great deal for us. Going to guess that CBJ would get more if they moved those two players in separate deals.

I thought of that. To free up the equivalent budget room, they would need to move out Savard for strictly futures, and then trade Korpisalo for someone making league minimum, while still being a 1A/1B goalie - which isn't out there short of Demko. Who will require an overpay to get, so some or all of the return from Savard.

Seems like a lot of moving parts that could be solved by one easy move. Add the Leafs 2nd if that tips the scales. One of Korpisalo or Merzlikins would need to be exposed in the expansion draft anyway, so they will most likely only get one season whomever is exposed.

 

[Big Muddy]

I thought of that. To free up the equivalent budget room, they would need to move out Savard for strictly futures, and then trade Korpisalo for someone making league minimum, while still being a 1A/1B goalie - which isn't out there short of Demko. Who will require an overpay to get, so some or all of the return from Savard.

Seems like a lot of moving parts that could be solved by one easy move. Add the Leafs 2nd if that tips the scales. One of Korpisalo or Merzlikins would need to be exposed in the expansion draft anyway, so they will most likely only get one season whomever is exposed.

If they make one of Korpisalo or Merzlikins, the starter (i.e. 48 games) and then look for a goalie that could be decent for 34 games, maybe that's a possibility. I included a list of goalies and sorted on games played. I think there's a handful that might meet the criteria (from about #24 downwards). Haven't done an analysis on salaries, so there's another step there for sure.

NHL Stats

 

[Tak7]

Dermott might be the better dman right now but Sandin has had 3 less years of development and should be better than Dermott sooner rather than later. I also do not lathing Dermott will be better than Liljegren in the future and he has the problem of being left handed on a team that is full of good lefties. If you have to trade one he probably makes the most sense.

I'm trading the Dman who hasn't played any NHL hockey, with big warts in his game (Liljegren), over the established cost-controlled NHLer.

This 3L - 3R on the blueline is such nonsense as well.

Vegas and Dallas have combined for just ONE single right handed D amongst them: western conference finalists.

Islanders and Tampa have combined for just THREE right handed D amongst them: eastern conference finalists.

The final 4 teams in the NHL playoffs = 4 right handed D, 8 left handed D. It's just not necessary.

 

[ToneDog]

Savard and Korpisalo for Freddy. It works on so many levels for both teams. Saves them $5.2 million cash and $2 million in cap to resign Dubois and Josh Anderson They already have 3 NHL RHD signed for next season in Jones, Nuutivara, and Kukan.

Some saying Freddy worth a 2nd. I understand CBJ want to shed dollars but how does a 2nd get you Savard and Korpisalo ?

They can dump Savard and Korpisalo for virtually nothing and sign a $1M backup and they would be further ahead. What am I missing ??

 

[Gabriel426]

Why do we want TWO 1st round picks? The current team is build to win now not three years from now.
Unless one of those picks is the 1OA, just don't see why Leafs need another 1st rounder.

 

[Gabriel426]

I'm trading the Dman who hasn't played any NHL hockey, with big warts in his game (Liljegren), over the established cost-controlled NHLer.

This 3L - 3R on the blueline is such nonsense as well.

Vegas and Dallas have combined for just ONE single right handed D amongst them: western conference finalists.

Islanders and Tampa have combined for just THREE right handed D amongst them: eastern conference finalists.

The final 4 teams in the NHL playoffs = 4 right handed D, 8 left handed D. It's just not necessary.

Kind of throw that LHD-RHD out the window, doesn't it.
I really don't know how it started and I think the first person who mentioned that was Babs during the Olympics and I think that was due to not playing playing someone b/c he is RHD.

 

[Superstar]

that pkg of dermott and johnson wont get you a 1st.

Maybe the first pick in the 3rd round...

 

[ToneDog]

Kind of throw that LHD-RHD out the window, doesn't it.
I really don't know how it started and I think the first person who mentioned that was Babs during the Olympics and I think that was due to not playing playing someone b/c he is RHD.

In a Vegas game Burke showed how their LHD playing the RS had difficulty keeping the puck in at the point. I am sure it makes a difference but it should not be the be all end all.

 

[Fogelhund]

Kind of throw that LHD-RHD out the window, doesn't it.
I really don't know how it started and I think the first person who mentioned that was Babs during the Olympics and I think that was due to not playing playing someone b/c he is RHD.

I'm trading the Dman who hasn't played any NHL hockey, with big warts in his game (Liljegren), over the established cost-controlled NHLer.

This 3L - 3R on the blueline is such nonsense as well.

Vegas and Dallas have combined for just ONE single right handed D amongst them: western conference finalists.

Islanders and Tampa have combined for just THREE right handed D amongst them: eastern conference finalists.

The final 4 teams in the NHL playoffs = 4 right handed D, 8 left handed D. It's just not necessary.

Tampa has run 7 D

Hedman LD
Sergachev LD
McDonagh LD
Schenn RD
Bogo RD
Cernak RD
Shattenkirk RD

Tampa Bay Lightning - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Islanders last game... 7 D

New York Islanders - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Leddy LD
Pelech LD
Greene plays both sides, but is Left Handed
Pulock RD
Mayfield RD
Toews LD
Boychuk RD

Dallas (last game)

Oleksiak LD
Klingberg RD
Heiskanen RD (Left handed, plays RD)
Sekera LD
Lindell LD
Hanley LD

Note, Johns is injured and can't play... but is RD He's played four games before injury... before that, they ran 3RD:3LD.... Harley has only played one game... RD Fedun 11 games...

So they've played with 4 RD, and 4 different LD over the playoffs

Vegas

Whitecloud - RD
McNabb - LD
Holden - LD
Martinez - LD
Theodore Plays either side - Left Handed
Schmidt RD - Left Handed

Handedness isn't everything, but the ability to play on your offside, if you are handed a certain way is.... Plenty of players just can't do it, and asking a PRO, who has never played on their offside, just might not work... I don't care about handedness, just their ability to play on whatever side we need... and btw, unless Cap Friendly has these wrong, your conclusion is offbase.

 

[Tak7]

Kind of throw that LHD-RHD out the window, doesn't it.
I really don't know how it started and I think the first person who mentioned that was Babs during the Olympics and I think that was due to not playing playing someone b/c he is RHD.

This is the first that I remember it as well - the Sochi Olympic team, when Babcock talked up the importance of LH - RH.

I don't actually think other teams / GMs have put too much emphasis on it; just seems like fans have put enhanced importance on something that doesn't matter all that much.

 

[Buds17]

Hopefully, but with the amount of free agent goalies on the market this year, I'm not as sure about that.

I'll admit to actually being overly optimistic in my post. Goalie value is tough to gauge even if just because there are substantially fewer of them in comparison to defencemen and forwards. I'd still lean towards the Leaf starter being someone else going into the season based on all of the chatter. Better to evaluate that if and when it happens.

 

[Gabriel426]

In a Vegas game Burke showed how their LHD playing the RS had difficulty keeping the puck in at the point. I am sure it makes a difference but it should not be the be all end all.

Tampa has run 7 D

Hedman LD
Sergachev LD
McDonagh LD
Schenn RD
Bogo RD
Cernak RD
Shattenkirk RD

Tampa Bay Lightning - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Islanders last game... 7 D

New York Islanders - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Leddy LD
Pelech LD
Greene plays both sides, but is Left Handed
Pulock RD
Mayfield RD
Toews LD
Boychuk RD

Dallas (last game)

Oleksiak LD
Klingberg RD
Heiskanen RD (Left handed, plays RD)
Sekera LD
Lindell LD
Hanley LD

Note, Johns is injured and can't play... but is RD He's played four games before injury... before that, they ran 3RD:3LD.... Harley has only played one game... RD Fedun 11 games...

So they've played with 4 RD, and 4 different LD over the playoffs

Vegas

Whitecloud - RD
McNabb - LD
Holden - LD
Martinez - LD
Theodore Plays either side - Left Handed
Schmidt RD - Left Handed

Handedness isn't everything, but the ability to play on your offside, if you are handed a certain way is.... Plenty of players just can't do it, and asking a PRO, who has never played on their offside, just might not work... I don't care about handedness, just their ability to play on whatever side we need... and btw, unless Cap Friendly has these wrong, your conclusion is offbase.

This is the first that I remember it as well - the Sochi Olympic team, when Babcock talked up the importance of LH - RH.

I don't actually think other teams / GMs have put too much emphasis on it; just seems like fans have put enhanced importance on something that doesn't matter all that much.

I think it all depends on the player. Like if the LHD has been playing RD and LD since little than to the pro. Don't think it matters much. Afterall, Hainsy is the best RD the Leafs had since literally forever and he is a LHD.
I do agree that if the LHD has little to no exp playing RD, it might not be the best idea to try them in 1st pairing, but it needs to start somewhere.
If a LHD player can play RD and be good at it, just let him play RD.

 

[Maplebeasts]

I'm trading the Dman who hasn't played any NHL hockey, with big warts in his game (Liljegren), over the established cost-controlled NHLer.

This 3L - 3R on the blueline is such nonsense as well.

Vegas and Dallas have combined for just ONE single right handed D amongst them: western conference finalists.

Islanders and Tampa have combined for just THREE right handed D amongst them: eastern conference finalists.

The final 4 teams in the NHL playoffs = 4 right handed D, 8 left handed D. It's just not necessary.

Liljegren is a better AHL Defenseman than Dermott ever was and has more upside. He has little to no warts in his game at the AHL level and is too young/didn't get enough of a chance to write him off at the NHL level. He didn't have a great few games up with the team but he was still only 20 and showed flashes. Dermott has not shown us anything with 2 more years of development and time in the NHL to suggest he'll be more than a bottom pairing guy.

 

[Chief keefe]

What makes you think Liljegren isn't developing?

By all accounts his defensive game, gap control, and skating have all improved.

Dermott is also a serviceable NHLer, who will sign for a cost-controlled cheap deal in the coming few weeks, and who just finished only his 2nd full season in the NHL. Thought he got better during the CBJ series, especially when Muzzin went down

I'm not sure I agree with you on either player, to be honest.

I do recognize that you have to give up quality in order to get quality, which is why I wouldn't be disappointed to see one of Sandin / Liljegren go depending on the return, but Dermott is probably a big no for me if he's in that package.

Liljegren has seen many people blow past him in the depth shart over the last 3 years. Honestly, I am not saying he won't be a great D but as it seems like now he did not seem like he would be anything more than a Jake Gardiner. I go to Marlies games all the time and watch the marlies a few times a year. In the games I have watched, he did not st and out other than the fact i was looking for him. The players that always stood out to me where Korskosv and Sandin.... Sandin is a player I would not move at all. I think Dermott has some value to other teams but I would say he has not developed as well as I would have hoped. The first year, my expectations were blown out the park. This year, not so much. He underwhelmed me. Could be a sophomore slump or could be just who he is. I am not entirely sure and guess time will tell. Hey, I do hope I am wrong. I hope they work out and we don't need to make moves but.... by the looks of the makeup of this team we will need to make moves

 

[Chief keefe]

What do you mean Liljegren isn't developing well? He just played his 20 year old season and was an All-Star calibre two way dman for the Marlies. I like him as an NHLer right now over Sandin even though that is probably not a popular opinion. He's steadier defensively and is less mistake prone.

I honestly have not seen it. Maybe I am missing something..

 

[Tak7]

Liljegren is a better AHL Defenseman than Dermott ever was and has more upside. He has little to no warts in his game at the AHL level and is too young/didn't get enough of a chance to write him off at the NHL level. He didn't have a great few games up with the team but he was still only 20 and showed flashes. Dermott has not shown us anything with 2 more years of development and time in the NHL to suggest he'll be more than a bottom pairing guy.

I'd like to see more than the first 2 NHL seasons of a 23 year old, before making judgment on Dermott - I complete disagree with the idea that he hasn't shown us anything with more than 2 years of development time in the NHL.

I personally thought he improved in the CBJ series, especially when Muzzin went down, and he was thrust into a top 4 role.

 

[CreeksideStrangler]

We got Kapanen for a 1st and then some. Anything is possible

kap produced outside of our top 6. johsson has disappeared after his contract