Connor McDavid Playing With His PCL Torn In Half

[CycloneSweep]

Urlacher was still a freak athlete before that injury. He could have played 4-5 more years if not for it.

Shawne Merriman was another good football player that had that injury. He was injured at age 25, out if football by 29. Dude looked like he was going to be a top pass rusher. Had 10+ sacks his first 2 seasons.

I've never seen this injury in a hockey player before, so I can only go off of how devastating it has been to football players.

For McDavid, he's such an exceptional skater that it might take his skating from best in the world to merely above average. From everything I've heard, this injury saps explosiveness significantly.

EDIT: After reading the tweet, they may have found a new way to treat this injury. Apparently, McDavid opted for an experimental recovery that worked and saved his skating ability. Hopefully he's the guinea pig for elite athletes so that PCL injuries aren't career killers anymore.

He took the rehab over the surgery because the surgery would of almost guaranteed he would lose a step speed wise.

 

[tenken00]

I'm not sure what you're not understanding. I'm saying that the article you posted is a poor source for anyone who is trying to decipher what McDavid's future might hold due taking a conservative treatment approach rather than surgical. The article alone is lower quality evidence due to the study design, and it studies a general population that is not relatable to McDavid at all, and likely not relatable at all to the rehab protocol and adherence to the program that McDavid went through.

So sure, anyone can read articles even if they aren't medical professionals, but if you read this article for example and came to the conclusion that McDavid made a poor choice by going the conservative route over surgery, then you'd be laughed out of the room by anyone who has any clue what they're talking about. Not only that, but the article itself cites that there is no clear conclusion in the existing literature whether or not an individual is more likely to have poorer outcomes in the future from either treatment option.

So to clear it up, I'm saying that the article you posted is ****, and the quote from the article that you posted for the shock effect is also ****.

I never said anything of that sort. You were the one who thought that by injecting your biases into what you believed was my intent. Here is what I wrote in the Oilers forum after someone posted that up:

Well it's not guaranteed he will experience those things, just a higher risk. And still even then, occurence (actual reinjury/surgury and not just degernative arthritis) is only a small chance.

Like the others say, it really boils down to it's his choice, and he calculated that it is worth the risk. And unless his life was at risk, no doctor could tell him otherwise.

I mean, what is life if not just a series of risk management events.. haha

Edit: Sorry I didn't realize this was the Oiler's board. Didnt mean to intrude!

The other stuff you are stating doesn't even make sense, I only posted that study up because people were saying that there is nothing out there that shows that having PCL reconstruction is even beneficial or not and that yes, you can find stuff like that through public records. It's just your own clouded closed-mindedness that doesn't want to hear anything otherwise.

Then you went off on some tangent because it is an evidence level 3. Evidence level 3 just means that you are dealing with documents like hospital records and other patient records. A lot of highly-regarded medical studies are level 3.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

He could be doing Platelet-Rich Plasma (PRP) injections which has been proven to be extremely beneficial and in some cases surgery is not needed.

For regrowing knee ligaments? Do you have any source for this?

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

For regrowing knee ligaments? Do you have any source for this?

Yeah. Both Urlacher and Merriman had that done to try and save their careers. It didn't work for them.

 

[Unspecified]

For regrowing knee ligaments? Do you have any source for this?

Platelet Rich Plasma (PRP) therapy is a relatively new treatment designed to aid in the healing and regeneration of soft tissues such as tendons and ligaments. ... The blood carries platelets and growth factors that allow for the healing of the tissue by creating new collagen fibers.

Here is some reading on it:
The Effectiveness of Platelet-Rich Plasma (PRP) Injections & How They Work

 

[Tkachuky]

Injury clearly affected him on that play/goal. Looked very slow and awful mobility.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Here is some reading on it:
The Effectiveness of Platelet-Rich Plasma (PRP) Injections & How They Work

Any scientific studies showing it is successful for rebuilding ACL/PCL? I've looked this up in the past and didn't find any evidence PRP helped in those instances.

 

[McFlyingV]

I never said anything of that sort. You were the one who thought that by injecting your biases into what you believed was my intent. Here is what I wrote in the Oilers forum after someone posted that up:



The other stuff you are stating doesn't even make sense, I only posted that study up because people were saying that there is nothing out there that shows that having PCL reconstruction is even beneficial or not and that yes, you can find stuff like that through public records. It's just your own clouded closed-mindedness that doesn't want to hear anything otherwise.

Then you went off on some tangent because it is an evidence level 3. Evidence level 3 just means that you are dealing with documents like hospital records and other patient records. A lot of highly-regarded medical studies are level 3.

Well you're posting it in a thread about McDavid where people are discussing and even criticizing the organization for him choosing conservative treatment over surgery, and yet even in that article they admit the literature is not clear on if either method is better in the long run. So my apologies if I misinterpreted your intentions.

With that said, level 3 evidence is still not very strong, and posting a prospective cohort study or systematic review/meta-analysis would at least carry more weight than a study that just looked at a general population and did not account for the types of rehab programs used or the adherence to those programs from the non-surgical population. So to the point of the bolded, really the literature is not clear on the long-term differences, and there likely hasn't been many if any studies conducted using a standardized rehab protocol similar to McDavid's done on elite athlete participants.

So I suppose if your intention was to solely give people some place that they can read the research then great (although most of the general public won't have a clue how to interpret or even appraise the quality of a study), but you posted a quote from the article that is one-sided and neglected to quote the rest of the article that essentially states that more research in the area is necessary to understand the long-term effects of surgical vs. non-surgical management of PCL ruptures.

 

[MLSE]

Injury clearly affected him on that play/goal. Looked very slow and awful mobility.

The guy in the blue is Rielly, not McDavid.

 

[McFlyingV]

For regrowing knee ligaments? Do you have any source for this?

Ligaments do not regrow. They scar together if you can get the knee positioned for a period of time where the two torn ends can meet for the scarring to occur.

 

[Del Preston]

Terry Jones has seen the documentary and published some quotes from the film:

JONES: McDavid knee injury documentary bares harrowing journey of non-surgery route

McDavid's agent Jeff Jackson:

Jackson: “There was a point where we went for an MRI where we got to the point where we thought if the PCL fibers aren’t connecting, we might have to do the surgery now. Connor was very nervous that day. Lo and behold, that day you could see the fibers had started to cross and they said ‘It’s starting to heal.’ At that point with Connor, you could see the relief.”

 

[Smiggie Balls]

Terry Jones has seen the documentary and published some quotes from the film:

JONES: McDavid knee injury documentary bares harrowing journey of non-surgery route

McDavid's agent Jeff Jackson:

I can't imagine scar tissue would be as strong or as forgiving as the real thing, can anybody attest to this?

 

[McFlyingV]

I can't imagine scar tissue would be as strong or as forgiving as the real thing, can anybody attest to this?

A cadaver donor or tendon also isn't as good as the original, but scar tissue can become quite strong and quite functional with appropriate loading. Of course, no tissue will ever be 100% of the original when it comes to ligaments or tendons, but with the proper rehab you can get it remarkably close (say maybe 80-90%), and in the case of the PCL that should be more than enough for a hockey player. Of course if he had another incident like the original he could re-injure it, but if there's enough impact for that then it would probably injure anyone with or without a previous rupture.

 

[Shanahanigans]

That interview and the Terry Jones article....wow. So let me get this straight. Mcdavid had:

-a fully torn PCL
-fully torn meniscus
-factured tibia
-fully torn popliteus muscle
-complete tear of the posterior capsule

- Initial prognosis was career in jeopardy. He required a fully reconstructed knee that came with MAYBE a 2 year return timeline if surgery went well, and even then he'd never be the same player.
- Opted for an ground-breaking rehab process that hadn't ever been attempted before.
- PCL somehow grew back without surgery, along with all the other injuries healing properly (which were all significant by themselves)

And now.....after initial prognosis told him he'd probably miss 2 years, he was back after the summer, leads the league in scoring again and doesn't look like he's missed a step. I really have no words to describe how in awe I am. Wow.

 

[Captain Fantastic]

I honestly don't understand how it grew back with rehab.

This is from Harvard's health website:

If the PCL is torn completely, it can be reconstructed surgically using either a piece of your own tissue (autograft) or a piece of donor tissue (allograft). With an autograft, the surgeon typically replaces the torn PCL with part of your own patellar tendon (the tendon below the kneecap) or a section of tendon taken from a large leg muscle. Almost all these surgeries are performed using arthroscopic (camera-guided) knee surgery, which uses smaller incisions and causes less scarring than traditional surgery. After surgery to reconstruct the PCL, you'll wear a long-leg knee brace and gradually begin a rehabilitation program to strengthen the leg muscles around the knee.

 

[TheUltimateOiler]

I honestly don't understand how it grew back with rehab.

This is from Harvard's health website:

If the PCL is torn completely, it can be reconstructed surgically using either a piece of your own tissue (autograft) or a piece of donor tissue (allograft). With an autograft, the surgeon typically replaces the torn PCL with part of your own patellar tendon (the tendon below the kneecap) or a section of tendon taken from a large leg muscle. Almost all these surgeries are performed using arthroscopic (camera-guided) knee surgery, which uses smaller incisions and causes less scarring than traditional surgery. After surgery to reconstruct the PCL, you'll wear a long-leg knee brace and gradually begin a rehabilitation program to strengthen the leg muscles around the knee.

Connor mcjesus ?

 

[Tkachuky]

The guy in the blue is Rielly, not McDavid.

 

[Cobra Commander]

McDavid > Gretzky

not even close

 

[Sam Spade]

That interview and the Terry Jones article....wow. So let me get this straight. Mcdavid had:

-a fully torn PCL
-fully torn meniscus
-factured tibia
-fully torn popliteus muscle
-complete tear of the posterior capsule

- Initial prognosis was career in jeopardy. He required a fully reconstructed knee that came with MAYBE a 2 year return timeline if surgery went well, and even then he'd never be the same player.
- Opted for an ground-breaking rehab process that hadn't ever been attempted before.
- PCL somehow grew back without surgery, along with all the other injuries healing properly (which were all significant by themselves)

And now.....after initial prognosis told him he'd probably miss 2 years, he was back after the summer, leads the league in scoring again and doesn't look like he's missed a step. I really have no words to describe how in awe I am. Wow.

 

[BlackDogg]

View attachment 312023

"He's simply out of this world!"

 

[Rogue Leader]

Chara has been playing on a torn PCL for a few years I believe.

Edit. He tore it 5+ years ago

The Score: Chara has permanently torn PCL.

Chara is like a huge tower. Practically his PCL is the size of a fist. When it's torn it's just like an average HFboard bro PCL. On the other hand McDavid's game is speed & skills. I don't think this is good for him long term. The Oilers are very selfish for letting him play like this. Health is the most important thing!

 

[Garbageyuk]

What is the upside to going public with this information?

 

[Sam Spade]

What is the upside to going public with this information?

 

[Garbageyuk]

Opposing players are going to "test" his knee come playoff time.

 

[OldCraig71]

I watched the game where Giordano sent McJesus into the post, I thought that his leg was broken and although not quite that serious, it must have been bad. He is a tough bastard to get through something like that and come back looking faster than ever.