Confirmed with Link: Complete Rebranding, New Logo & Arena Renovations - Part II

[PhysicalGraffiti]

Thank you bladoww and FeloniousPython for bring some sense and help my point.

I've said many times, I am big into jerseys and logos as it is my teams identity. I want to like what I'm wearing or seeing. When a team looks like ****, I'm not going to buy that so I look like **** too.

My main thing is still the owners/managements refusal to listen to fans. They said they are all about hearing the fans, but clearly that isn't the case in this situation.

I wouldn't be so passionate if I didn't love the team so much. I've said before, over 15 years of season tickets I've seen it all with this team. It's very dissapointing to have a new ownership do so well, and then spit out some BS new designs that clearly are not up to professional standards.

Sorry I'm not sorry. I love my Bolts.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Thank you bladoww and FeloniousPython for bring some sense and help my point.

I've said many times, I am big into jerseys and logos as it is my teams identity. I want to like what I'm wearing or seeing. When a team looks like ****, I'm not going to buy that so I look like **** too.

My main thing is still the owners/managements refusal to listen to fans. They said they are all about hearing the fans, but clearly that isn't the case in this situation.

I wouldn't be so passionate if I didn't love the team so much. I've said before, over 15 years of season tickets I've seen it all with this team. It's very dissapointing to have a new ownership do so well, and then spit out some BS new designs that clearly are not up to professional standards.

Sorry I'm not sorry. I love my Bolts.

They do listen to fans.

read about Boltsfan2029's experience


http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=871194&page=24

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Thank you bladoww and FeloniousPython for bring some sense and help my point.

I've said many times, I am big into jerseys and logos as it is my teams identity. I want to like what I'm wearing or seeing. When a team looks like ****, I'm not going to buy that so I look like **** too.

Except the fact they're not asking you to smear **** all over yourself, its just a logo you don't like.

My main thing is still the owners/managements refusal to listen to fans. They said they are all about hearing the fans, but clearly that isn't the case in this situation.

Everyone on the management crew has made themselves publicly available to answer any and all questions regarding this stuff including inviting STHs and others in to voice opinions, changes, and so on so wherever you're getting this idea that "they just don't care, they're not listening to me" is pure ********, sorry.

Like i've told others - if you want to make yourself heard, thats fine and you should, but have an idea how to direct your ideas. Posting on the SP Times blog and showing a poll (lol) that the brilliant folks over there have voted on isn't going to do ****. Creating a generic online petition on a site where I can create a petition to get Chad to hit on me isn't lending itself to any credibly, and someone else has probably done it.

I wouldn't be so passionate if I didn't love the team so much. I've said before, over 15 years of season tickets I've seen it all with this team. It's very dissapointing to have a new ownership do so well, and then spit out some BS new designs that clearly are not up to professional standards.

Translated: "It makes me angry the new ownership didn't pick something I like."

Professional standards? Its plenty professional, and its a lot better than many of the logos I see now that look dated or have little to no representation of the actual "mascot".

Sorry I'm not sorry. I love my Bolts.

Appeal to pity much? As if all other opinions about the logo are false and ridiculous because you just love this team that much more?

Constructive criticism is one thing, but ranting like an emotional child is another.

 

[Felonious Python]

Except the fact they're not asking you to smear **** all over yourself, its just a logo you don't like.


Everyone on the management crew has made themselves publicly available to answer any and all questions regarding this stuff including inviting STHs and others in to voice opinions, changes, and so on so wherever you're getting this idea that "they just don't care, they're not listening to me" is pure ********, sorry.

Like i've told others - if you want to make yourself heard, thats fine and you should, but have an idea how to direct your ideas. Posting on the SP Times blog and showing a poll (lol) that the brilliant folks over there have voted on isn't going to do ****. Creating a generic online petition on a site where I can create a petition to get Chad to hit on me isn't lending itself to any credibly, and someone else has probably done it.

Translated: "It makes me angry the new ownership didn't pick something I like."

Professional standards? Its plenty professional, and its a lot better than many of the logos I see now that look dated or have little to no representation of the actual "mascot".


Appeal to pity much? As if all other opinions about the logo are false and ridiculous because you just love this team that much more?

Constructive criticism is one thing, but ranting like an emotional child is another.

Someone's already made a petition to get Chad to hit on you?

Generic online petitions are fine IMO. While petitions as a whole may not do much, some of them do, and that makes them worthwhile. Petitions are grassroots and populist. 'Credibility' doesn't enter the equation.

As long as we don't see spam about getting people to sign it.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Raw Charge re-branding reaction survey results

http://www.rawcharge.com/2011/2/14/1991997/results-lightning-re-branding-reaction-survey

Raw Charge ran an impromptu (and admittedly unscientific) survey from Wednesday, February 2nd, until Wednesday, February 9th, in order to gauge NHL fans opinions on the Bolts new uniforms. While the sample size (335 total responses to the survey) was less than we had hoped for, the results gave us an idea about how you - the fans - felt about various aspects of the changes.

Of the 335 respondents to the survey, 34% approved of the new Bolts uniform design, while 46% disapproved, and 20% were undecided. The results for self-described Tampa Bay Lightning fans are: 28% approve, 50% disapprove and 22% are undecided.

|Season Ticket Holders|Regular / Often / Rare game attendees|Not In Market / never attend games
Approve|27%|29%|27%
Undecided|25%|19%|25%
Disapprove|48%|52%|48%

|Eastern Conference fan|Western Conference fan
Approve|48%|49%
Undecided|17%|12%
Disapprove|35%|39%

Summary of results: Lightning re-branding reaction survey
http://www.rawcharge.com/2011/2/14/1992050/summary-of-results-lightning-re-branding-reaction-survey

 

[bladoww]

Wow that is nuts. Thanks for pointing those findings out, I hadn't seen that before. Even if you consider the fact that it's not "scientific" or anything like that, you're still talking about real people (using the honor system obviously) who don't like what they see - for the most part.

Using the Net Promoter method, this wouldn't fare well in the corporate world. Many business use the NPS to gauge customer satisfaction and it works like this:

The Net Promoter Score is obtained by asking customers a single question on a 0 to 10 rating scale: "How likely is it that you would recommend our company to a friend or colleague?" Based on their responses, customers are categorized into one of three groups: Promoters (9–10 rating), Passives (7–8 rating), and Detractors (0–6 rating).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Promoter

So basically, as an individual, if you scored the new branding overall at a decent 8 (which I don't think it is), you'd still be a detractor in the eyes of most companies since most "passives" by default aren't promoters, they're considered detractors. Based on the above findings, I think it's safe to say most fans are detractors regarding the new branding overall.

 

[BoltSTH]

The problem with surveys like this it is often the very opinionated that bother to answer, and that skews the results. Just like most political demonstrations, the view of the protesters do not reflect the the 85% + who roll with the flow.


IMO it is time to concentrate on getting to the playoffs, and getting through a round or two, instead of worrying what they are wearing.

 

[PhysicalGraffiti]

Except the fact they're not asking you to smear **** all over yourself, its just a logo you don't like.

A logo I, and clearly many others, don't like. It looks like a childs work. That is ******. Thus my statement.

Everyone on the management crew has made themselves publicly available to answer any and all questions regarding this stuff including inviting STHs and others in to voice opinions, changes, and so on so wherever you're getting this idea that "they just don't care, they're not listening to me" is pure ********, sorry.

Like i've told others - if you want to make yourself heard, thats fine and you should, but have an idea how to direct your ideas. Posting on the SP Times blog and showing a poll (lol) that the brilliant folks over there have voted on isn't going to do ****. Creating a generic online petition on a site where I can create a petition to get Chad to hit on me isn't lending itself to any credibly, and someone else has probably done it.

Ok, since you're an expert. Direct me in contacting someone who isn't just some customer service flunkie to express my distaste in their new changes.

Translated: "It makes me angry the new ownership didn't pick something I like."

I, and alot of people don't like. It's annoying when it's clear more dislike than like. I'm not alone.

Professional standards? Its plenty professional, and its a lot better than many of the logos I see now that look dated or have little to no representation of the actual "mascot".

I think plain and boring logos like this are something belonging in high school. A million dollar project should yield much better results of a professional team. Not what a 12 year old could make.

Appeal to pity much? As if all other opinions about the logo are false and ridiculous because you just love this team that much more?

Constructive criticism is one thing, but ranting like an emotional child is another.

Not trying to appeal to pity. Just stating facts. Why you need to be ignorant about it is beyond me. Sorry you need to put words in my mouth.

And an emotional child? Really? Ah, couldn't go a whole post without reverting to an insult. Are you and Superstar R Jones buddies?

I'm discussing on a forum and expressing my distaste. Nothing child like about it. Child like would be you and others reverting to name calling and personal attacks.

And I'm very glad to see the surveys showing the fans and ticket holders don't like this.

Too bad they don't give a **** because they like it.

They need to put some polls like that themselves if all these are supposedly not valid or accurate to be used. Not sure how a poll isn't accurate, people voted on their opinions. This is how a poll works. Someone should foward those polls to the owners.

They do listen to fans.

read about Boltsfan2029's experience


http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=871194&page=24

How exactly did that occur?

I didn't know that I could talk with all three at some point.

And they listened, I guess you're right. But listening is only part of it. Doing is the other part.

 

[Doctor Drej]

Listening is not just a part. I, for one would be just thankful that they even would care to hear my opinion if I had the opportunity to talk with them. How many other teams would do that? Certainly not Mr. Wang..

 

[PhysicalGraffiti]

Listening is not just a part. I, for one would be just thankful that they even would care to hear my opinion if I had the opportunity to talk with them. How many other teams would do that? Certainly not Mr. Wang..

Lol, I'm not sure how to reach him though.

I'm sure if he was in a scenario approached by a fan, he'd listen to them. I'm sure Snow would too.

Again, sending emails and what not, people can read and even shoot back a prefab response, but that isn't the whole thing.

I really think if the fans right now feel so strongly against the new identity, they could consider tweaking some things.

As much as I hate the logo, and I really hate it, if they at least added back some black and/or silver, bolts on the pants, and victory stripes. I could work with that.

I still think they should just stay with what they have. I love the current look.

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Lol, I'm not sure how to reach him though.

I'm sure if he was in a scenario approached by a fan, he'd listen to them. I'm sure Snow would too.

Again, sending emails and what not, people can read and even shoot back a prefab response, but that isn't the whole thing.

I really think if the fans right now feel so strongly against the new identity, they could consider tweaking some things.

As much as I hate the logo, and I really hate it, if they at least added back some black and/or silver, bolts on the pants, and victory stripes. I could work with that.

I still think they should just stay with what they have. I love the current look.

Remember that not knowing how to get ahold of him doesn't constitute "not listening to fans". He walks the halls at every home game, and email your ticket rep to give him info or get an email for you to reach him at. He listens...

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

How exactly did that occur?

I didn't know that I could talk with all three at some point.

And they listened, I guess you're right. But listening is only part of it. Doing is the other part.

She emailed her opinions to Tod Leiweke and Leiweke mailed her back twice saying he and Yzerman would like to meet with her before the game to get her thoughts and opinions face to face. I think Boltsfan2029 was successful in meeting them though because she was fair, respectful, but also constructive even though she didn't like the jersey.

 

[PhysicalGraffiti]

She emailed her opinions to Tod Leiweke and Leiweke mailed her back twice saying he and Yzerman would like to meet with her before the game to get her thoughts and opinions face to face. I think Boltsfan2029 was successful in meeting them though because she was fair, respectful, but also constructive even though she didn't like the jersey.

You are assuming becuase I'm pissed about the changes, that I'm going to come off like some asswipe if I talked to someone in the higher ups.

I haven't been an asswipe to anyone here, why would I be direspectful to the managemente? I'd rather go right to Vinik.

And placating someone is not cutting it. When he listens to a few fans and lets them know it's ok, that's different than taking into consideration the overwhelming negative reception and choosing to ignore it.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

You are assuming becuase I'm pissed about the changes, that I'm going to come off like some asswipe if I talked to someone in the higher ups.

I haven't been an asswipe to anyone here, why would I be direspectful to the managemente? I'd rather go right to Vinik.

And placating someone is not cutting it. When he listens to a few fans and lets them know it's ok, that's different than taking into consideration the overwhelming negative reception and choosing to ignore it.

That's not what I meant. When I said fair, respectful, and constructive, I meant her ideas and opinions, not her attitude. She's giving suggestions and judgment that can help the jerseys for the better instead of just saying something like this is awful.

 

[PhysicalGraffiti]

That's not what I meant. When I said fair, respectful, and constructive, I meant her ideas and opinions, not her attitude. She's giving suggestions and judgment that can help the jerseys for the better instead of just saying something like this is awful.

So you want me to outline my suggestions to you guys instead of stating how ****** it is?

Suggestion, keep what we have. It looks great.

I don't think you can help a logo that bad. It's just putrid. There is no detail and no creativity.

I don't understand the point of the new logo and uniforms anyways. I hate hearing owners say, we need a new identity and this BS. No, you need more money in your pockets.

We just recently updated our look and I like it alot. Say what you want about Koules, but he did an EXCELLENT job with updating the logo/jersey scheme.

Updating and moving foward is part of what I like in sports sets. The Sharks and Lightning are 2 examples to me of some of the best upgrades in uni/logo sets. They essentially modernized the logo for both teams. I like that alot, that is alot better than going back to a throwback. Or now in our case trying to create a throwback and go back in time with a minimal design.

I would love to email a letter to Vinik explaining my issue, and have no problem telling him I believe this is merely a money related move. I don't buy the rebranding when there was nothing wrong with what we had.

The polls and reactions show I am not alone, and hope to have others express their dislike for the new logo and unis.

They already made the mistake of selling logoed merchandise, so the logo will be here for at least a few years. But in the mean time we can fix the jerseys and color scheme, and push towards a different logo when we can.

Alot of people like the shoulder patch, and it is better than the primary. But what's impressive about it. It's just another ripoff of what every other f'ing team does. Circular logo with words. Wow, orginal.

Seriously, I can't believe people didn't expect more with a $1 million spent on this.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

So you want me to outline my suggestions to you guys instead of stating how ****** it is?

Suggestion, keep what we have. It looks great.

I don't think you can help a logo that bad. It's just putrid. There is no detail and no creativity.

I don't understand the point of the new logo and uniforms anyways. I hate hearing owners say, we need a new identity and this BS. No, you need more money in your pockets.

We just recently updated our look and I like it alot. Say what you want about Koules, but he did an EXCELLENT job with updating the logo/jersey scheme.

Updating and moving foward is part of what I like in sports sets. The Sharks and Lightning are 2 examples to me of some of the best upgrades in uni/logo sets. They essentially modernized the logo for both teams. I like that alot, that is alot better than going back to a throwback. Or now in our case trying to create a throwback and go back in time with a minimal design.

I would love to email a letter to Vinik explaining my issue, and have no problem telling him I believe this is merely a money related move. I don't buy the rebranding when there was nothing wrong with what we had.

The polls and reactions show I am not alone, and hope to have others express their dislike for the new logo and unis.

They already made the mistake of selling logoed merchandise, so the logo will be here for at least a few years. But in the mean time we can fix the jerseys and color scheme, and push towards a different logo when we can.

Alot of people like the shoulder patch, and it is better than the primary. But what's impressive about it. It's just another ripoff of what every other f'ing team does. Circular logo with words. Wow, orginal.

Seriously, I can't believe people didn't expect more with a $1 million spent on this.

I was just talking about Boltsfan2029. I wasn't comparing you two, or suggesting you do the same. I'm just saying that's what helped her get a chance to speak face to face with them.

 

[IdealisticSniper]

So you want me to outline my suggestions to you guys instead of stating how ****** it is?

Suggestion, keep what we have. It looks great.

I don't think you can help a logo that bad. It's just putrid. There is no detail and no creativity.

I don't understand the point of the new logo and uniforms anyways. I hate hearing owners say, we need a new identity and this BS. No, you need more money in your pockets.

We just recently updated our look and I like it alot. Say what you want about Koules, but he did an EXCELLENT job with updating the logo/jersey scheme.

Updating and moving foward is part of what I like in sports sets. The Sharks and Lightning are 2 examples to me of some of the best upgrades in uni/logo sets. They essentially modernized the logo for both teams. I like that alot, that is alot better than going back to a throwback. Or now in our case trying to create a throwback and go back in time with a minimal design.

I would love to email a letter to Vinik explaining my issue, and have no problem telling him I believe this is merely a money related move. I don't buy the rebranding when there was nothing wrong with what we had.

The polls and reactions show I am not alone, and hope to have others express their dislike for the new logo and unis.

They already made the mistake of selling logoed merchandise, so the logo will be here for at least a few years. But in the mean time we can fix the jerseys and color scheme, and push towards a different logo when we can.

Alot of people like the shoulder patch, and it is better than the primary. But what's impressive about it. It's just another ripoff of what every other f'ing team does. Circular logo with words. Wow, orginal.

Seriously, I can't believe people didn't expect more with a $1 million spent on this.

And that right there, is why your opinion doesnt matter. They are changing, deal with it. If you want to talk to some of the higher ups, maybe come up with tweaks or things youd like to see to the new stuff. Saying its garbage and to keep the current stuff really doesnt matter as its just not going to happen.

You love the Yankees logo. Its more bland this logo.

You love the Islanders logo. Its a freaking design disaster if you actually look at it.

 

[IdealisticSniper]

You are assuming becuase I'm pissed about the changes, that I'm going to come off like some asswipe if I talked to someone in the higher ups.

I haven't been an asswipe to anyone here, why would I be direspectful to the managemente? I'd rather go right to Vinik.

And placating someone is not cutting it. When he listens to a few fans and lets them know it's ok, that's different than taking into consideration the overwhelming negative reception and choosing to ignore it.

Yes you have. Youve just done it in a generalized way rather than to any one specific poster.

I believe you basically implied anyone who likes the logo, or buys the gear, is basically a lemming and/or doesnt have any standards to stand up to.

 

[PhysicalGraffiti]

I was just talking about Boltsfan2029. I wasn't comparing you two, or suggesting you do the same. I'm just saying that's what helped her get a chance to speak face to face with them.

I got ya. I'm just saying my piece because I feel like others have potrayed me, as the person saying a child ranting, like I'm coming off the wrong way about it.

And that right there, is why your opinion doesnt matter. They are changing, deal with it. If you want to talk to some of the higher ups, maybe come up with tweaks or things youd like to see to the new stuff. Saying its garbage and to keep the current stuff really doesnt matter as its just not going to happen.

You love the Yankees logo. Its more bland this logo.

You love the Islanders logo. Its a freaking design disaster if you actually look at it.

I'm ok with change, if it was something good. I was simply stating I think what we have is great. It was not a huge change, but a nice modern upgrade of what we had. We haven't even had this set that long, and already these guys want to get something new.

The Yankees logo is not more bland than this, unless you are merely referring to the NY logo which is their hat/jersey/helmet logo. Their offical logo is the Yankees script with hat and bat. That's a nice logo.

The Islanders logo is pretty cool. The use of the Island in the logo with the I pointing to where the Colesium is. The Islanders and that logo have been around for over 30 years now, minus the fisherman years, and also isn't as plain or lame as the new Bolts logo.

You're comparing my favorite teams together. I never said the Islanders logo was the best in the NHL, or the Yankees in the MLB. Those are my favorite teams in their respective sports and I happen to like their logos. I'm a Giants fan in the NFL, and sure their logo is ok, but nothing special and I don't think it's the best in the NFL.

So you're kinda off base with those chief.

 

[PhysicalGraffiti]

Yes you have. Youve just done it in a generalized way rather than to any one specific poster.

I believe you basically implied anyone who likes the logo, or buys the gear, is basically a lemming and/or doesnt have any standards to stand up to.

Nope. Sure haven't.

I clarified myself in preivous posts in this thread.

I'm not typing it all again for you because you can't read what else I wrote and just assume what I meant.

Come at me with something better if you're gonna try and point out I'm an asswipe in general.

Just because your buddy Jones can't discuss without losing his mind and attacking me, doesn't mean I was responsible for his overreaction and assumption of what I said.

 

[ThunderAlleyNomad]

And I'm very glad to see the surveys showing the fans and ticket holders don't like this.

Too bad they don't give a **** because they like it.

They need to put some polls like that themselves if all these are supposedly not valid or accurate to be used. Not sure how a poll isn't accurate, people voted on their opinions. This is how a poll works. Someone should foward those polls to the owners.



How exactly did that occur?

I didn't know that I could talk with all three at some point.

And they listened, I guess you're right. But listening is only part of it. Doing is the other part.

No. Listening is a courtesy that they extended to more than one fan. And it is meaningful even if you don't see it. You are entitled to your opinion, but I seriously doubt that there are very many teams in the league that will put the CEO, COO and GM in a room with a fan who they know is unhappy with something, give her an hour of their time and actually listen. And let her ask questions. And make the effort to put her at ease.

I agree that it is doubtful that they change much if anything, but if they don't it doesn't mean that they were just placating the fans they met with. It simply means that they have made a decision they are happy with and are sticking to it.

 

[PhysicalGraffiti]

I don't get how people can like the new stuff, but that's their choice. I hate it, that's mine. Kinda like polital stance, I have friends on both sides of the spectrum. We have difference of opinions, I think some of theirs are ill-informed or not great, but this is a great world we live in where you can share your opinion. I respect everyones opinion, regardless of whether I agree with it.

 

[Rschmitz]

Sent Gaines in email regarding what he said about the rebranding of the uniforms. Gaines replied to my email. Very interesting info and I am shocked none of us have come across sooner than this.

Hello. I read an article that quoted you as hearing one of the Lightning's radio guys saying that the new uniforms might change for next season. This is very big news for Lightning fans, and I was curious if you could share some more information. Very much appreciated!

RE:

Not much more than what was written. It was Dave Mishkin talking to JP Peterson on 1010AM. He was clear that there wouldn't be any changes to the new logo that was unveiled, but that we would likely see some minor changes to the actual uniform that was unveiled last week. The only thing he mentioned specifically was adding a lightning bolt to the sides of the shorts. But even that he said "maybe."

This is exactly the kind of tweaking that I thought they would do. The fact that a guy as close to the team as Mishkin hasn't ruled out the possibility of some tweaks, and that they are meeting with fans, might mean that they don't quite have a finished product.

The logo is literally everywhere now, that and the two color scheme is in all respects a dead issue. But those hoping for victory stripes and/or bolts on the pants should feel free to express some veiled optimism.

 

[Felonious Python]

...I don't understand the point of the new logo and uniforms anyways. I hate hearing owners say, we need a new identity and this BS. No, you need more money in your pockets....

On the second part, I'm too pragmatic (or pessimistic) to think it doesn't play a part.

On the first, I get the feeling that it wouldn't be the opinion if we were still losing, as has been the team's tradition. Maybe we would be, since it'd be our proud tradition of losing.

A year ago, a lot of you guys were claiming that you're just happy to have a team, or at least not the Islanders. Now you're demanding. Like you should be.

 

[Tokala]

I still think that a lot of this is an attempt to bury the OK Hockey days. I don't have a problem with an owner changing the logo/jersey to put their mark on their team. The underlying problem is that there is no long-term owners in the Lightning's history. You're not really going to have "traditions" as long as some new rich guy rolls into town to take over every 4-5 years. If Vinik stays long-term (10-15+ years), all of this will be forgotten.

As for the polls, you can dig long enough and find "data" to back up an opinion. The problem that I have with that poll is they didn't show how it was conducted? We know people can use multiple IP addresses to overload a poll in their favor....just look at the NHL All-Star selection process.