Player Discussion Colin White signed for 6 years x $4.75M

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OgieO

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May 17, 2006
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I'm going on record... Love this move. If it bombs, I won't roast PD. It's a really strong bet imo and helps keep the outlook positive. Nice to have some good news.
 

BK201

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Apr 11, 2011
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The deal is totally a fair one.

Logically, he might not be worth that cap hit in years 1 & 2. But he will very likely be worth it in years 3 & 4. And he could easily be worth much more in years 5 & 6.

One way or another the team must be very convinced that hes the real deal. Which should encourage most people anyways.
I dont like it. I wish this team just signed guys to shorter deals and paid them market value. We took on a bunch of risk just to maybe save a few mil if things go perfectly.


But if he turns into marner it's bad PR for melnyk to trade him xD.

Now they look good. Committing to a young player the fan base wants long term for the most part.
 

Sweatred

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Jan 28, 2019
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If he gets 40 points again that’s more than 2.5 mill value right there

I don’t understand - he is making $4.0 next year... do you mean ... if he gets 40 points he is worth 2.5 (1.5 overpay) or - 40 point player is worth $6.5 (2.5 free value).

I think he will prob get 40 points and end the season around a 1.5 overpay. To make that up in year 5 he would need to be nearly a $8 million dollar player.
 

West Coast Eagles

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Good launching point for renewed commitment from ownership. Honestly expected that we would bridge him. Pretty happy with this outcome. Hopefully White can develop into a 20 - 35 guy and make this contract a steal.
 

thinkwild

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Jul 29, 2003
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Not bad. I guess if he gets the Fisher role, where he plays 2 C sometimes but half the fans wish he was regularly a 3 C or RW, that would be pretty good.

I want to take this as a hopeful sign but Melnyk could still be spending to the floor after this so im still at wait and see mode
 

BondraTime

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Nov 20, 2005
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I don’t understand - he is making $4.0 next year... do you mean ... if he gets 40 points he is worth 2.5 (1.5 overpay) or - 40 point player is worth $6.5 (2.5 free value).

I think he will prob get 40 points and end the season around a 1.5 overpay. To make that up in year 5 he would need to be nearly a $8 million dollar player.
This line of thinking makes no sense whatsoever.

A 40 point player is essentially a 4+ million dollar paid NHLer at this point in time, and will only go up. This isn't 2010 anymore, 4-7 million is the going rate for 2nd line players, and Whites contract places him on the low end. White is 22, will improve, and is already a 5 million dollar NHLer, even if he just replicates his 0.58ppg he got in his rookie season. Then take into account he isn't just a scorer, and it's easy to see.

Turris contract was assuredly used as a benchmark by both the Sens and White's camp.

White's 4.75 x 6 and Turris's 3.5 x 6 come out to be the exact same % of total team cap, down to the 2nd decimal point, at 5.83%. This isn't a coincidence, and is a going rate for a low level 2nd, high level 3rd line center. They are the exact same deal, prorated by cap hit.
 
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BondraTime

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It's the Turris deal prorated by caphit.

Both are 6 years at 5.83% of the cap, White just benefits at the much higher cap and all players being paid at a higher level, literally the exact same deal as Turris % based.

Extremely good deal, just as the Turris deal was. 4.75 may look large without understanding the scope of what players are making today compared to a few years ago, but in reality it's not large whatsoever. It's likely to be average 3rd line level in a year or 2, just as Turris' 3.5 was.
 

dumbdick

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May 31, 2008
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It's the Turris deal prorated by caphit.

Both are 6 years at 5.83% of the cap, White just benefits at the much higher cap and all players being paid at a higher level, literally the exact same deal as Turris % based.

Extremely good deal, just as the Turris deal was. 4.75 may look large without understanding the scope of what players are making today compared to a few years ago, but in reality it's not large whatsoever. It's likely to be average 3rd line level in a year or 2, just as Turris' 3.5 was.
Turris is a substantially better player though and had a much higher offensive upside than white.
 

BondraTime

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Turris is a substantially better player though and had a much higher offensive upside than white.
Kyle Turris was 23 and had a career high of 12 goals and 29 points in 3 NHL seasons, while White is 22 with a career high of 14 goals and 41 points in 1 NHL season.

Turris has been a ~50/55 point player over his career, not sure that's too unrealistic for White, while White is the better, stronger defensive player.

Outside of draft pedigree, not sure what made him substantially better
 
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Micklebot

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Apr 27, 2010
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Turris is a substantially better player though and had a much higher offensive upside than white.

Turris was 22 when signed and was coming off a 43 pts pace season (55 games)
White is 21 and coming of a 47 pts pace season (71 games).

Turris put up 35 pts in 36 games as an 18 year old in his first year of college after getting drafted.
White put up 43 pts in 37 games as an 18 year old his first year of college after getting drafted.

Turris tore apart the BCHL in his draft year and was drafted higher, he also had a better year in the AHL, while White got mono and slid in the draft rankings his draft year while struggling with injuries early in his pro career, but I don't think the two are as far apart as you suggest at the time of their signings.
 

dumbdick

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Kyle Turris was 23 and had a career high of 12 goals and 29 points in 3 NHL saasons
29 points in a 49 game season. And he was drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Namely more raw talent than white has. We gambled on turris and won, but I will be shocked if white turns out as good as turris. It's a rose-coloured comparable.
 

BondraTime

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29 points in a 49 game season. And he was drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Namely more raw talent than white has. We gambled on turris and won, but I will be shocked if white turns out as good as turris. It's a rose-coloured comparable.
Turris' best year came in at 0.52ppg, compared to White's 0.58ppg.

He signed his contract 5 years after he was drafted, ask Puljijarvi how long draft pedigree lasts.

It's not rose-colored whatsoever, it is a literal direct-comparable. Is it rose colored to think White will be a better player in his mid 20's than his 21 year old rookie season, the same thing the Sens did with Turris at 22 (outside of Turris being in his 3rd NHL season compared to White's rookie year)?

22 and 23 years old
1st round picks
0.52 and 0.58 points per game in the season prior to signing
6 year deal with increasing salary for the duration
Exact same cap hit %
No signing bonuses or NMC/NTC

It is, by leaps and bounds, the best comparable possible.

Sure, you don't think White will get any better than his rookie season, that's fair. I don't see why White won't be a 45-60 point 2-way center over the duration of his contract, similar to Turris, in which case he would vastly be outperforming this contract.
 
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Tundraman

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Feb 13, 2010
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According to CapFriendly there is no up-front bonus in any of the years so no expiring CBA protection was built into the deal. That is potential value-added on the financial side for the Sens and White might be getting a little more annual cash based on performance potential. Both sides are happy.

Colin White - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps
 

Micklebot

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Apr 27, 2010
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29 points in a 49 game season. And he was drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Namely more raw talent than white has. We gambled on turris and won, but I will be shocked if white turns out as good as turris. It's a rose-coloured comparable.

At the end of the day, White's season last season compares favourably to Turris' at the time each was signed. It's certainly no guarantee that he turns out as good as Turris did, he would have cost a lot more if it was.
 

Cosmix

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I am happy to see White signed for 6 years even though I think he is a bit overpaid.

I wonder if these types of contracts will become the norm for our better prospect players and set up the Senators for trading those players if they perform at a level where the Senators can no longer afford to pay them similar to the trading of Zibby, Karlsśon, Stone and Duchene. I hope not but it might be the future we will experience.
 

Sweatred

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Turris was 22 when signed and was coming off a 43 pts pace season (55 games)
White is 21 and coming of a 47 pts pace season (71 games).

Turris put up 35 pts in 36 games as an 18 year old in his first year of college after getting drafted.
White put up 43 pts in 37 games as an 18 year old his first year of college after getting drafted.

Turris tore apart the BCHL in his draft year and was drafted higher, he also had a better year in the AHL, while White got mono and slid in the draft rankings his draft year while struggling with injuries early in his pro career, but I don't think the two are as far apart as you suggest at the time of their signings.

Ya - Just my opinion but I thought Turris was wayyyyyy better than White.

Just because some 13G scorers are getting $4 million doesn’t mean we need to give them all that. Boedker at $3million may be going rate for a third liner but he can also be replaced at $1 million and the money used elsewhere. Hey - I hope ass much as anyone that White’s value follows Turris’.
 

Micklebot

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Turris had a very uneven year before his extension. He came in hot with 13 pts in his first 16 games as a Sen, then he went ice cold with 5 pts and only 2 goals in his next 18. He finished off the season with 11 in 15.

White's season was far more even, never having either the ice cold stretch that Turris did. Turris also had far more support playing on a much deeper team. The next year he had something like a 20+ game stretch with zero goals.

I for one remember the criticism Turris was receiving back in 2011-12 and 2012-13. I'm not going to re-write history and pretend there weren't any bumps in the road after signing him.
 

Nac Mac Feegle

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Jun 10, 2011
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Good for the team. Very little risk of White under-performing that deal.

But I am surprised that White would sign for six years at that rate. Kid isn't "betting on himself" at all here. Makes the skeptical side of me wonder if White knows something about his injury history/potential that we don't.
 

Alex1234

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Oct 14, 2014
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Good signing
Let’s not forget 41p in 71g with the Sens is easily 55p with Tampa , Calgary or TO
 
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Laphroaig

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Aug 26, 2011
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I like this deal and believe that White will slot in nicely as a second line centre behind whoever we draft next off season. The money seems to be about right.
 

Masked

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29 points in a 49 game season. And he was drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Namely more raw talent than white has.

This is such a stupid argument. Turris was drafted in a weak draft while White, who saw his stock drop due to injuries and mono, was drafted in what is looking like one of the best drafts ever.

Would you claim Turris has more raw talent than guys like Barzal or Aho because he was drafted 3rd overall for a reason and they weren't?
 
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