Torts Reform: Coaching Discussion Thread III

[Viqsi]

Prior thread: Fire/Don't Fire/Discuss Torts II

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[CBJWerenski8]

Probably the last one...

until next year

 

[Johansen2Foligno]

HIS NAME IS TORTS!!

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Oops on the Bjorkstrand And since I'm revising, Cam has been solid top 6 of late. But neither of these 2 is an ideal top liner-and Roslovic certainly isn't. The CBJ are not a strong top 6 forward team was my point and I'll stand by that.

When do you think players peak? Hint: It's early in their careers. When did Doughty and Erik Karlsson peak? Pointwise at 27 for EK. Doughty at 28 (though he's having a good year that way this year). Players tend to peak in their 20s in hockey. Forwards tend to peak in their mid 20s. Naturally there are plenty of exceptions, but I don't see Jones being one.

Peaking offensively? Depends on the teams around them. I don't necessarily think their abilities got worse, but the teams around them did. I think that's whats happening to Jones and Z this year.

And even if I play into the whole thing, even if Jones has peeked he's still a top pairing guy. He's just not the Norris winner we thought he'd be 3 years ago. Disappointing, but still massive to have.

I still think this team is talented and good enough to be a playoff team. A cup contender? No. But we're certainly better than Chicago, Nashville, and maybe even Florida on paper. It's been a failure of a season but that doesn't mean all hope is lost.

If Jones won't negotiate, Z follows, and Laine accepts his QO...then all hope is lost.

 

[ViD]

I remember saying savor the moment when we traded for Duchene in 2019, that moment we’ve had the best roster in franchise history.

Sadly the years of mediocrity are ahead again unless we strike some insane luck and get a generational player in the draft - Bedard / Mitchkov maybe ?

 

[majormajor]

I remember saying savor the moment when we traded for Duchene in 2019, that moment we’ve had the best roster in franchise history.

Sadly the years of mediocrity are ahead again unless we strike some insane luck and get a generational player in the draft - Bedard / Mitchkov maybe ?

Michkov
Marchenko
Chinakhov
Voronkov

I like where this is going. Might as well bring over Bragin as the next coach.

 

[majormajor]

The Jackets don't have a shortage of overall talent at D, G, or W. Laine, Atkinson, Bjorkstrand? That's fantastic goal scoring ability from the wing. They have a big hole at center, that's it.

Right now when you watch them play they are far worse than their talent level. Their play has eroded, nearly by the game. They can't consistently execute any part of the transition game. The players are all going in different directions on the attack. They've either not been given clear instructions, or they just aren't following.

So yeah, I'd like to wake up and read that the coaching staff has been changed.

There's plenty that I don't like about the way Torts uses players, and some of the x's and o's too. For example, since the start of last season we have a lot of players in cautious passive positions on the ice. The other team gets to move into the Jackets zone with ease and I hate it. The zero or one man forecheck is useless. Last game I noticed a big difference in the way the two teams handled high flips into the neutral zone. When the Jackets did it, the Preds D-men stayed close to the Jackets high forwards, so when the puck came down at center ice, the Preds D were there to turn things the other way. When the Preds flipped it, and the puck came down at center ice to the Preds high forwards, both Jackets D were already backing across their own blueline! What is this garbage?

Remember three games ago when Torts started preaching that they should return to the zone in groups of 5? Now they're peeling off from the forecheck in loose puck situations even, with no pressure on the opponent's breakout. They've gone from losing 6-5 in OT to losing 2-1 in regulation.

 

[VT]

The Jackets don't have a shortage of overall talent at D, G, or W. Laine, Atkinson, Bjorkstrand? That's fantastic goal scoring ability from the wing. They have a big hole at center, that's it.

Right now when you watch them play they are far worse than their talent level. Their play has eroded, nearly by the game. They can't consistently execute any part of the transition game. The players are all going in different directions on the attack. They've either not been given clear instructions, or they just aren't following.

So yeah, I'd like to wake up and read that the coaching staff has been changed.

There's plenty that I don't like about the way Torts uses players, and some of the x's and o's too. For example, since the start of last season we have a lot of players in cautious passive positions on the ice. The other team gets to move into the Jackets zone with ease and I hate it. The zero or one man forecheck is useless. Last game I noticed a big difference in the way the two teams handled high flips into the neutral zone. When the Jackets did it, the Preds D-men stayed close to the Jackets high forwards, so when the puck came down at center ice, the Preds D were there to turn things the other way. When the Preds flipped it, and the puck came down at center ice to the Preds high forwards, both Jackets D were already backing across their own blueline! What is this garbage?

Remember three games ago when Torts started preaching that they should return to the zone in groups of 5? Now they're peeling off from the forecheck in loose puck situations even, with no pressure on the opponent's breakout. They've gone from losing 6-5 in OT to losing 2-1 in regulation.

This is the most serious part of offense. A center joins wingers, one plays in defence, cover a central zone. Which line was the best? With Stenlund. And in the last game? With Stenlund too. What did Foligno with Laine-Bjorkstrand? He didn't join them. How Bjork played with Foligno-Jenner?
I always say so that Torts joins Lane with Domi? Because Max, I hope, didn't lose skills of a center. As a practise showed, Roslovic isn't an ideal partner for Patrik. He loves to play with the puck IMHO he needs grinders.
We don't have classical centers in TOP six. There're two in a team, Stenlund and Nash. Compare it with other teams. We moved Texier to center but Domi plays on the wing. Why we don't join Laine and Bjork with him? Or Stenlund? Btw Grigorenko was a center too.
It's our problem. How do we want to play offense like Nashville/Chicago/Carolina... when we don't have not only problems in the central line but in wings too. Our wingers to combination, which are able to move the puck speed are Laine and Bjorkstrand, maybe Domi. That's all. And again they don't play with centers.
You say...fire Torts...but show me how another coach would coach in this situation. We need a center or return Domi and give a chance him. But not with Atkinson/Foligno or Texier as wingers. Try Laine and Bjork, even Jenner (yes he's a grinder but he had quite good hockey IQ) would be better. Maybe Grigo. Let Tex learns to play a center with 3th/ 4th line. It isn't nothing bad. Maybe Nash should help him to be a good center.

 

[EspenK]

Re New Title: Political Correctness or Wishful Thinking?

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Re New Title: Political Correctness or Wishful Thinking?

That this is version III of this thread should give some indication of the wishful thinking in past threads titles.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Re New Title: Political Correctness or Wishful Thinking?

Saves time for starting a new thread or renaming it when Torts is inevitably gone and we immediately start talking about firing the new guy, whoever that may be.

 

[Jive Pawnbroker]

If it were to happen today I would think there would already be some rumblings about it online but nothing yet from what I'm seeing. If not today, I don't think it will happen tomorrow either since tomorrow is a game day.

Also, I certainly hope that Torts' eventual replacement is better than the train wreck that was Scott Arniel.

 

[DJA]

I'm getting the feeling that Jarmo is trying to swing a trade to shake up the room instead of firing Torts. Just a hunch.

 

[Michael Smitley]

If it were to happen today I would think there would already be some rumblings about it online but nothing yet from what I'm seeing. If not today, I don't think it will happen tomorrow either since tomorrow is a game day.

Also, I certainly hope that Torts' eventual replacement is better than the train wreck that was Scott Arniel.

I doubt it will happen before the season ends

 

[Monk]

I'm getting the feeling that Jarmo is trying to swing a trade to shake up the room instead of firing Torts. Just a hunch.

To shake up the room even more than it already is? That seems like the problem, not the solution.

 

[DJA]

To shake up the room even more than it already is? That seems like the problem, not the solution.

Depends on your definition of "shaking up", I guess. They look like they're sleepwalking to me and need a wake up call.

I guarantee Jarmo won't stand by one way or the other, though.

 

[Kratti]

Can't put too much blame (or any, really) on the coaching with the center situation being what it currently is. With regards to the current group of centermen, we have a saying in Finnish that is very fitting here: "Paskasta ei saa timanttia."

 

[KJ Dangler]

There is absolutely no reason , with the lineup of centers on our roster , and Domi struggling to find a fit here , who was signed to come in and play #2 center role , that he isn’t given a week or so centering Laine, and Bjork , and see what comes from it . Clearly with Domi he has 0 confidence , he’s seeing ghost is what they would say of he was a quarterback . The kid is a talented player , and I refuse to accept he forgot how to play hockey the moment he was traded here . Looking at Karlsson , and now Wennberg , it sure seems that either Torts and his micromanaging of players , or his system and how they implement the center play is a huge issue . We saw Torts prop up Cam to play with Laine to get him going , why not give a few games to Domi at center with Bjork and Laine to see if you can get him going .

Also , Jenner is a very solid center , and for whatever reason they haven’t even tried him there this season , with all the deficiencies at the center position

 

[Jive Pawnbroker]

Can't put too much blame (or any, really) on the coaching with the center situation being what it currently is. With regards to the current group of centermen, we have a saying in Finnish that is very fitting here: "Paskasta ei saa timanttia."

Agreed. My algebra teacher in high school was of Danish heritage and when anyone in my class was asked to walk through a problem on the chalkboard and screwed it up, he would say (phonetically) "Ishkala ala poobala", which translated to "Great Flying Fish!!!" lol. Our center situation would require an R-rated response as opposed to the G-rated one my teacher used.

 

[Monk]

I guarantee Jarmo won't stand by one way or the other, though.

I think it's possible that's exactly what he does.

 

[DarkandStormy]

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Hoping to tank for a lottery pick is the only possibly explanation.

He's not going to find a beneficial trade. If he's going to ride the course with current personnel nothing good will come out of it except a high lottery pick that will be used on an unknown Siberian that Ville Siren once saw on a polar bear hunting trip.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

I'm getting the feeling that Jarmo is trying to swing a trade to shake up the room instead of firing Torts. Just a hunch.

Good luck trying to find a deal of any sort of value right now.

 

[Johansen2Foligno]

This really isn't too surprising. The team seems to be operating on a budget and it's unlikely they pay a premium to get a new coach when Tortorella will be done at the end of the year.

I don't know that I will say they have mailed it in on this year, but they seem comfortable letting it play out as it is.

 

[MoeBartoli]

Looks like he makes it thru the season.