Classic Wrestling Discussion (as in non-current): Part II

[M.C.G. 31]

May 14, 2001 on the observer rewind on reddit. 2.5-million wrestling fans just vanished, Austin’s heel turn is a major failure, and The Rock is filming. Oufff.

 

[koyvoo]

 

[M.C.G. 31]

Someone on reddit posted the segment where Batista told Eddie friends gotta hug, and it just reminded me he was going to win the World Title two days after his death. :/

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Watching old interviews with mean Gene god I love old school wrestling interviews. No one will ever top Mean Gene.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Someone on reddit posted the segment where Batista told Eddie friends gotta hug, and it just reminded me he was going to win the World Title two days after his death. :/

 

[boredmale]

Watching old interviews with mean Gene god I love old school wrestling interviews. No one will ever top Mean Gene.

Camera Man, Zoom It

 

[JackSlater]

Camera Man, Zoom It

Always funny when Mean Gene cracks up.

 

[boredmale]

Always funny when Mean Gene cracks up.

I was going to post that one but the last time I did(in a non wrestling thread) it wasn't that well received. lol

Here is another of my favs of Mene Gene with Paul Orndorff



It's sort of funny looking at these promos now how much better they are then the past 20+ years.

 

[JackSlater]

I was going to post that one but the last time I did(in a non wrestling thread) it wasn't that well received. lol

Here is another of my favs of Mene Gene with Paul Orndorff



It's sort of funny looking at these promos now how much better they are then the past 20+ years.

Yeah I think a lot of it is that in the 80s and 90s promos were far more important for business and the characters were much more defined. Basically now you primarily have faces cutting the same promos about how hard they've worked , how they want to entertain fans, and how they want respect. A heel is basically someone who says that they won't respect the face. There are still people doing good character work (Bryan and Ciampa in recent memory) but it's fallen by the wayside with most wrestlers.

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Yeah I think a lot of it is that in the 80s and 90s promos were far more important for business and the characters were much more defined. Basically now you primarily have faces cutting the same promos about how hard they've worked , how they want to entertain fans, and how they want respect. A heel is basically someone who says that they won't respect the face. There are still people doing good character work (Bryan and Ciampa in recent memory) but it's fallen by the wayside with most wrestlers.

I’ve been watching so many old videos lately and it’s just reminding me more and more how much I loved 80s wrestling compared to now.

Yeah the athleticism is there in today’s matches but that’s it. Also this is just a broad generalization there is some great stuff today but on a whole I am going to geezer out and talk about how I enjoy the old days.

The spot spot spot no sell spot spot no sell finisher kickout finisher finisher pin just doesn’t do it for me as much in today’s wrestling.

I’m excited for AEW but I have a bad feeling these are the type of matches I’ll just have to watch and deal with it.

 

[JackSlater]

I’ve been watching so many old videos lately and it’s just reminding me more and more how much I loved 80s wrestling compared to now.

Yeah the athleticism is there in today’s matches but that’s it. Also this is just a broad generalization there is some great stuff today but on a whole I am going to geezer out and talk about how I enjoy the old days.

The spot spot spot no sell spot spot no sell finisher kickout finisher finisher pin just doesn’t do it for me as much in today’s wrestling.

I’m excited for AEW but I have a bad feeling these are the type of matches I’ll just have to watch and deal with it.

We'll see with AEW. I hope that it does well but I doubt we see a return to interesting characters and noteworthy promos. I like some of what I've heard from Rhodes (though he does put his foot in his mouth too often) and Khan but I can't stand the Young Bucks (I somewhat respect their business sense in turning a small amount of talent into basically their own promotion) and Omega, while sometimes great in ring, is a tool. If AEW can drop the bad indy parts it has clung to thus far and find more guys like MJF then it could be solid. Beyond AEW though wrestling in general is a lot more bland in terms of personality. I'm tired of wrestlers doing cosplay and lazily dressing like other characters/wrestlers rather than actually trying to be an interesting character/wrestler.

 

[Roo Returns]

I’ve been watching so many old videos lately and it’s just reminding me more and more how much I loved 80s wrestling compared to now.

Yeah the athleticism is there in today’s matches but that’s it. Also this is just a broad generalization there is some great stuff today but on a whole I am going to geezer out and talk about how I enjoy the old days.

The spot spot spot no sell spot spot no sell finisher kickout finisher finisher pin just doesn’t do it for me as much in today’s wrestling.

I’m excited for AEW but I have a bad feeling these are the type of matches I’ll just have to watch and deal with it.

Matches back then were more "solid" overall and told a better story. More flow.

Problem with WWE is it's all about repetition. All the wrestlers have their three signature moves and have the same posses. And Michael Cole calls them the same nicknames every week in the same tone. It's fine if it was one promotion of many but as the only one it's too much of one style. Growing up in the 80s/90s in the Northeast, yes WWF ruled the airwaves, but I still had access to JCP/WCCW/AWA and later WCW/ECW.

 

[Say Hey Kid]

My all time favorite wrestling is the AWA.

 

[boredmale]

We'll see with AEW. I hope that it does well but I doubt we see a return to interesting characters and noteworthy promos. I like some of what I've heard from Rhodes (though he does put his foot in his mouth too often) and Khan but I can't stand the Young Bucks (I somewhat respect their business sense in turning a small amount of talent into basically their own promotion) and Omega, while sometimes great in ring, is a tool. If AEW can drop the bad indy parts it has clung to thus far and find more guys like MJF then it could be solid. Beyond AEW though wrestling in general is a lot more bland in terms of personality. I'm tired of wrestlers doing cosplay and lazily dressing like other characters/wrestlers rather than actually trying to be an interesting character/wrestler.

Is that you Jim Cornette?



Just a warning by the way not safe for work(language)

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

I’ve actually never listened to Cornette but I feel like I would agree with him a lot.

 

[boredmale]

I’ve actually never listened to Cornette but I feel like I would agree with him a lot.

To be honest his podcast(which is broadcast on youtube) is my only link to wrestling at this point. But yeah this clip from his most recent Thursday podcast almost to a word echos what JackSlater wrote, that's why it was fresh in my head

 

[boredmale]

My all time favorite wrestling is the AWA.

 

[JackSlater]

Is that you Jim Cornette?



Just a warning by the way not safe for work(language)

I wish motherf***er. Thank you f*** you BYE.

I do listen to Cornette's drive thru most weeks, rarely listen to his Thursday show but I have heard some of his AEW stuff. He's been quite generous to them from what I've heard and it's hard to argue with what he's said. One thing I always disagreed with Cornette on was his Omega take, but since he stopped complaining about the match with the little girl (which I enjoyed) and started on about "Kenny Olivier", something I have complained about regarding Omega before, he's pretty effectively burying Omega. You can see very clearly that Cornette does want AEW to succeed.

I’ve actually never listened to Cornette but I feel like I would agree with him a lot.

I don't think that people who dislike Cornette can even disagree with him most of the time. Of course you'll get excessive praise for some crappy elements of old rasslin that he liked and you'll get some over the top takes, but that's all part of the experience. You certainly don't have to agree with Cornette in order to be entertained by him. The guy is a great talker and has a tremendous amount of wrestling knowledge. Even when he's dead wrong it's worth a listen.

 

[boredmale]

I do listen to Cornette's drive thru most weeks, rarely listen to his Thursday show

I generally will listen to the drive thru, as for the Thursday show depending what the topic is and how much time I have I might be more inclined to fast forward through alot or just skip it. I do prefer the short question and answer format on the Drive thru but on occasion the Thursday show can be better depending on topic(more often then not though it isn't)

 

[JackSlater]

I generally will listen to the drive thru, as for the Thursday show depending what the topic is and how much time I have I might be more inclined to fast forward through alot or just skip it. I do prefer the short question and answer format on the Drive thru but on occasion the Thursday show can be better depending on topic(more often then not though it isn't)

I have to avoid his political rants. In wrestling, I can enjoy Cornette even when he's wrong. In politics, I can't enjoy Cornette even when he's right. I also don't enjoy his somewhat fawning interviews with old nobodies.

My all time favorite wrestling is the AWA.

I think that the AWA gets a bad rap that isn't exactly fair. I'm mostly familiar with the promotion from the mid 80s to the late 80s and there is good stuff there. It's pretty dry but not as bad as people say, and besides that if the AWA is dry then so was WWF in the 80s. The talent was really good too. Bockwinkel is basically the Flair of the north, there was Hennig, Martel in a prominent role, Heenan and Ventura, Hall and DDP before they took off, Buddy Rose being the man, Dr. D being a monster, early Michaels and Jannetty, heat magnet Colonel DeBeers. I even enjoy the AWA ESPN broadcasts. I'd like to see more AWA from before the 80s, particularly more Bockwinkel and Stevens.

 

[boredmale]

I think that the AWA gets a bad rap that isn't exactly fair. I'm mostly familiar with the promotion from the mid 80s to the late 80s and there is good stuff there. It's pretty dry but not as bad as people say, and besides that if the AWA is dry then so was WWF in the 80s. The talent was really good too. Bockwinkel is basically the Flair of the north, there was Hennig, Martel in a prominent role, Heenan and Ventura, Hall and DDP before they took off, Buddy Rose being the man, Dr. D being a monster, early Michaels and Jannetty, heat magnet Colonel DeBeers. I even enjoy the AWA ESPN broadcasts. I'd like to see more AWA from before the 80s, particularly more Bockwinkel and Stevens.

I live in Thunder Bay so I got my US Stations out of Minnesota at the time(Duluth) and my first memories of watching Wrestling was the Road Warriors sometime in early to mid 1984(I believe I must have missed Hogan in the AWA by a few months), we started getting WWF by mid 1985. Watching Classic ESPN AWA it looks like the promotion started to go downhill slowly roughly 1986ish, but still was decent if you view it as a regional promotion till about 1988, once Henning left they were toast.

Looking back on the Internet/Youtube it seems like the peak period for the AWA was the late 70s/early 80s. It's amazing how much Vince took from that roster from wrestlers, to managers to even Mean Gene. Hell they even took Jake the Milkman Milliman for the hell of it

 

[JackSlater]

I live in Thunder Bay so I got my US Stations out of Minnesota at the time(Duluth) and my first memories of watching Wrestling was the Road Warriors sometime in early to mid 1984(I believe I must have missed Hogan in the AWA by a few months), we started getting WWF by mid 1985. Watching Classic ESPN AWA it looks like the promotion started to go downhill slowly roughly 1986ish, but still was decent if you view it as a regional promotion till about 1988, once Henning left they were toast.

Looking back on the Internet/Youtube it seems like the peak period for the AWA was the late 70s/early 80s. It's amazing how much Vince took from that roster from wrestlers, to managers to even Mean Gene. Hell they even took Jake the Milkman Milliman for the hell of it

WWF, and now WWE, was always pretty bad at developing talent. Vince knew that he wanted Hogan though and Gagne was too conservative, so Hogan left and told Vince what other guys he should bring in. Adonis is another quality AWA guy that came over. Gagne may not have been a good booker but he seems to have been a good talent scout/trainer, even going back to Flair training and starting out in the AWA.

 

[boredmale]

Adonis is another quality AWA guy that came over. Gagne may not have been a good booker but he seems to have been a good talent scout/trainer, even going back to Flair training and starting out in the AWA.

Adonis actually main evented a few shows with Bob Backlund I believe in 82. Surprisingly the WWF at that time had both Ventura and Adonis but didn't reunite the East-West Connection

As for Gagne as a booker, his main fault was he seemed to like putting himself over when he was in his 50s to much, plus alot of his friends(although Bockwinkle deserved it despite being close to 50 in the 80s)

 

[Say Hey Kid]

...I think that the AWA gets a bad rap that isn't exactly fair. I'm mostly familiar with the promotion from the mid 80s to the late 80s and there is good stuff there. It's pretty dry but not as bad as people say, and besides that if the AWA is dry then so was WWF in the 80s. The talent was really good too. Bockwinkel is basically the Flair of the north, there was Hennig, Martel in a prominent role, Heenan and Ventura, Hall and DDP before they took off, Buddy Rose being the man, Dr. D being a monster, early Michaels and Jannetty, heat magnet Colonel DeBeers. I even enjoy the AWA ESPN broadcasts. I'd like to see more AWA from before the 80s, particularly more Bockwinkel and Stevens.

Yeah, there was a lot of talent in the AWA. Andre the Giant, Dusty Rhodes, Mean Gene, the Gagnes, Harley Race, Hulk Hogan, Iron Sheik, Jerry Lawler, Mad Dog Vachon, Mil Mascaras, Nikita Koloff, Ole Anderson, Ric Flair, the Road Warriors, Baron Von Raschke, Black Jack Lanza, Sgt Slaughter, Ricky "the Dragon" Steamboat, Jimmy "Superfly" Snuka, "Superstar" Billy Graham, Jim Brunzell, Russ Francis who played for the Patriots, and the list goes on and on. Bockwinkel and Stevens is my all time fav tag team.

 

[HandsomeHollywood]

The Drive Thru is probably the best wrestling podcast there is to me. The Experience is good when Corny has a strict wrestling topic to discuss, especially when reviewing shows.

Cornette is a wrestling knowledge fountain. And I will give credit to Brian Last too. I often disagree with a lot of what Last says and his hot takes, but the guy knows his wrestling history.