News Article: CJ Podcast

BlueForever75

Registered User
Oct 4, 2017
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With Nylander getting $7mil, there is no way Marner signs for $9. Dubas blew that one.

So if Nylander gets put on Matthews wing for an entire season as he should be, and bags 70+ points next season did Dubas still blow it?

Marner only got the points he did this season because he played with Tavares. If he still played with Kadri and Marleau he once again would get his 65+ points and we wouldn't be having this discussion. Kadri would not have had a down year, and Marleau wouldn't have been all that bad. Marner is the object of playing with Tavares as Tavares is the object of playing with Marner. As is Hyman.

Still doesn't make him better or more expensive then Kucherov or Kane as a winger.

Marner signs for under 10 million a season or the Leafs should trade him or let him be OS. Use money and picks to better team for the longer term.
 
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Morgs

#16 #34 #44 #88 #91
Jul 12, 2015
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We had similar type thinking before the Nylander & Matthews contracts too. Didn't mean much.

Let's hope the super optimists are right this time.

Well honestly my estimation for Nylander/Matthews money was almost dead on (7x7 for Will, 8x11 for Auston), but its clear the years are what I got wrong, so I'm not even gonna try to speculate the years with Mitch.

My guess is he's paid just a shade under 9, and that's probably perfect for our cap moving forward with the big 4.
 

HoweHullOrr

Registered User
Oct 3, 2013
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Well honestly my estimation for Nylander/Matthews money was almost dead on (7x7 for Will, 8x11 for Auston), but its clear the years are what I got wrong, so I'm not even gonna try to speculate the years with Mitch.

My guess is he's paid just a shade under 9, and that's probably perfect for our cap moving forward with the big 4.

OK ;). I doubt many had predicted $7 m for Nylander. Most (vast majority) had him around Ehlers money, or Pastrnak at the high end. Not sure many had Matthews at $11.6 either. They would have been tarred and feathered in here for such a travesty. Lots of ppl do the revisionist history thing though. That's a fact.

Having said that, my guess is that if Marner's camp is playing hardball like the public statements seem to suggest, I see a short term bridge deal coming.
 
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WillNy29

Registered User
Jun 20, 2018
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Glad to see you are happy the Leafs got eliminated in the 1st round... again. Dubas is your boy, GL with that.
At the end of the day there's one winner and all these hockey men on the Islanders will not get them that title. All these hockey men they have over there got passed a much easier opponent than the leafs had ti go through (Boston and Babcock)
 

HoweHullOrr

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Oct 3, 2013
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Marner only got the points he did this season because he played with Tavares.

Marner is the object of playing with Tavares ....

Marner drives offense as well as or better than any Leaf player. So many players benefited from Marner passes, and many tap in goals were the result of Marner's passes. Doubt if Dubas or any of the other 30 NHL GMs are sleeping on this.
 

Morgs

#16 #34 #44 #88 #91
Jul 12, 2015
19,518
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London, ON
I doubt many had predicted $7 m for Nylander. Most (vast majority) had him around Ehlers money, or Pastrnak at the high end. Not sure many had Matthews at $11.6 either. They would have been tarred and feathered in here for such a travesty. Lots of ppl do the revisionist history thing though. That's a fact.

Having said that, my guess is that if Marner's camp is playing hardball like the public statements seem to suggest, I see a short term bridge deal coming.

Well for me the Nylander one was relatively obvious because he built it off Pasta money with inflation because the cap went up. Nylanders and Pastas cap% i think were identical the day they signed their respective deal.

Matthews on the other hand i thought 11M, was fantastic.... except the 5 years sucks. I don't think he's leaving, but I do think he's gonna get a bigger payday in 5 years and be the highest paid player in the league.
 

killer1980

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Sep 15, 2014
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At the end of the day there's one winner and all these hockey men on the Islanders will not get them that title. All these hockey men they have over there got passed a much easier opponent than the leafs had ti go through (Boston and Babcock)

Sorry for my foolishness. Obviously, it was much tougher to lose to the Bruins than sweep the Pens. I apologize to you and Kyle.
 
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WillNy29

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Jun 20, 2018
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Sorry for my foolishness. Obviously, it was much tougher to lose to the Bruins than sweep the Pens. I apologize to you and Kyle.
And here we have the ultimate hockey men sitting on a 2-0 deficit because their goalie is having a hard time maintaining his 930 save pct....
 

killer1980

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Sep 15, 2014
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And here we have the ultimate hockey men sitting on a 2-0 deficit because their goalie is having a hard time maintaining his 930 save pct....

And goalies win Stanley Cups, as we are so painfully aware. Sorry Freddie, or as I like to call him Mr. Softee.
 

WillNy29

Registered User
Jun 20, 2018
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And goalies win Stanley Cups, as we are so painfully aware. Sorry Freddie, or as I like to call him Mr. Softee.
But you said it was the hockey men? Which is it? The goalie or the hockey men? Is Lou one of these hockey men because your house of cards is crumbling quickly he brought in and extended the goalie youre calling Mr. Softee. So riddle me this is it the hockey men? Is it the goalie? Is Lou a hockey man? Is the goalie he signed in Toronto not a legacy of a hockey man?

Would you like me to continue to tie you up in knots?
 
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Notsince67

Papi and the Lamplighters
Apr 27, 2018
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So if Nylander gets put on Matthews wing for an entire season as he should be, and bags 70+ points next season did Dubas still blow it?

Marner only got the points he did this season because he played with Tavares. If he still played with Kadri and Marleau he once again would get his 65+ points and we wouldn't be having this discussion. Kadri would not have had a down year, and Marleau wouldn't have been all that bad. Marner is the object of playing with Tavares as Tavares is the object of playing with Marner. As is Hyman.

Still doesn't make him better or more expensive then Kucherov or Kane as a winger.

Marner signs for under 10 million a season or the Leafs should trade him or let him be OS. Use money and picks to better team for the longer term.
So Nylander gets paid 100k per projected point with a top center with the projection being almost 15% higher than his career high with that center. He signs for only 6 years. Marner should not be paid on higher projected points even though he has been playing at an over 90 point pace for 82 straight regular season games since December 1? This is such a weak argument and is getting tiresome.
 

killer1980

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Sep 15, 2014
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edmonton
heh. think Killer forgot who traded for "Softee"

whoopsie

Never said it was all Lou. As a matter of fact I believe the Isles is now a team effort. AAMOF, I am a bigger fan of Trotz and his ability to pull a team together. I do like the discipline that Lou insists on. Had Lou stayed, he may have insisted on having a goalie challenge with McElhinney and Andersen, but never would have allowed Sparks to be called up.
 

Sypher04

Registered User
Jan 20, 2011
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If he wants say 5 x 10.14 million, I tell him to search for an offer sheet.

How do you guys not see that would be a disaster for us? An offer sheet is literally the worst possible scenario. We're trying to win a cup. You can't just pick up players of Marner's calibre like it's nothing. Whatever team were to get him in this scenario gets A LOT better. Those picks will be middling first rounders in most likely case. If you can't make a contract work, and I'm not worried about this personally - I'd be shocked if we don't get it done - but if you can't, you 100% have to trade him for comparable value. Losing him for a bunch of unknowns would be horrible.
 

The Iceman

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Sep 22, 2007
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The bunch of unknowns carry a cap hit of 0 dollars, and are also valuable trade pieces for deadline bolsters. Not the worst thing.
 

WestCoastLeafs

I beleaf
Jun 10, 2013
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IMO totally depends on the team. If it's a bottom 5 team, the picks will likely be lottery balls for at least a year or two.
If it's a contender on the upswing, probably 25ish x 4
If it's a contender at the end of the cycle, could be lottery picks year 3 and 4.

Mental exercise, if a team had every pick in the 1st round, what is the minimum spots youd need back to equal Marner? Taking out hopefully signing a huge free agent to offset the costs because that's unknown.

Would you do it for the 5th, 10th, 15th and 20th?
What about the 10th, 15th, 20th 25th?

Agreed. Now consider that one of those picks maybe goes into a roster replacement of some king, and another goes in a Muzzin-type trade. Maybe one busts, and one ends up an NHLer. In the end seems like a pretty weak return for Marner.

Now if Marner's **** agent and **** dad know full well that a deal needs to get done by July 1 and don't make it, I'm talking to Panarin and if he'll sign as a UFA for a more reasonable amount than Marner will as an RFA, I sign Panarin and let the chips fall where they may.

I mean if it's the 2009 Leafs that want to sign him, yeah sure I'll take those 4 first rounders. But more realistically, it will be a decent to good teams, and the first round picks we get away will soon be frittered away to mediocrity.
 

Faltorvo

Registered User
Feb 18, 2008
21,067
1,941
Poor soul. I wonder who is going to go from a #1 / top pairing stud to an over rated 2nd pair "maybe third pair on a contender" minutes after it is announced..

Also curious to see who is now amazing and a star that the idiotic Leafs gave up on.
Nylander, Kappy, zait for a RHSD on LA????
 

Stephen

Moderator
Feb 28, 2002
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Never said it was all Lou. As a matter of fact I believe the Isles is now a team effort. AAMOF, I am a bigger fan of Trotz and his ability to pull a team together. I do like the discipline that Lou insists on. Had Lou stayed, he may have insisted on having a goalie challenge with McElhinney and Andersen, but never would have allowed Sparks to be called up.

The thing with these grit grind underdog stories is the bubble always bursts. You get a little run and people get excited but then the chemistry wears off or the goalie cools down or all the pending UFAs leave town. So while it’s nice to credit Lou for piecing together a nice run this season, it’s not really worth comparing the short term, temporary Islander gains with the long term project the Leafs are trying to build up.
 
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Faltorvo

Registered User
Feb 18, 2008
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I can see nylander contract pretty much led to this but I'm bot talking about what he wants to sign for even if he thinks hes better then Matthew's the fact hes gonna ask for same or more is just ridiculous and getting irritating. What have these kids done to deserve so much.
Dubas is in a corner so let's not be too negative for decisions he has to make.

Now my question is....is hes requesting this 10M+ avv and leafs wont give it to him.....what team can afford to offer sheet or trade, more specifically what contending team can fit this in their cap?
Because if I'm the leafs I dont trade unless its McDavid coming back...an offer sheet means u have to fit him in ur cap and give up 4 1st round picks. Sure bad teams might be able to fit this but what contending team can? I assume that's only situation he would want to go to...

Also...this Toronto kids want to play for leafs and now do this kind of thing, tired of this narrative. If they to be a leaf then suck it up and make effort to show ur commitment, dont care how much of a business it is, still getting millions

Well,,,ummm (yikes)) ahhh,,,,,,, the islanders fit your description to a T
 

Gary Nylund

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
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The thing with these grit grind underdog stories is the bubble always bursts. You get a little run and people get excited but then the chemistry wears off or the goalie cools down or all the pending UFAs leave town. So while it’s nice to credit Lou for piecing together a nice run this season, it’s not really worth comparing the short term, temporary Islander gains with the long term project the Leafs are trying to build up.

Like.
 

Faltorvo

Registered User
Feb 18, 2008
21,067
1,941
Nope, been a Leaf fan for a very long time. I'm just disappointed by the lack of growth over the last few years. Hope we don't stall here. Something has to change for us to get to the next level.

Lack of growth???
 

Joey Hoser

Registered User
Jan 8, 2008
14,232
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Guelph
The thing with these grit grind underdog stories is the bubble always bursts. You get a little run and people get excited but then the chemistry wears off or the goalie cools down or all the pending UFAs leave town. So while it’s nice to credit Lou for piecing together a nice run this season, it’s not really worth comparing the short term, temporary Islander gains with the long term project the Leafs are trying to build up.

No kidding. There's teams like this every year.

And what do we even learn from that? Get rid of all our stars, play a bunch of nobodies and have an "us against the world" team-first mentality?

Great story. Terrible plan.
 

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