News Article: Citizen article on ottawa sports scene

GCK

Registered User
Oct 15, 2018
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That screenshot is for the Guelph game on Jan 11
 

Dingle

summer is gone
Nov 22, 2019
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That screenshot is for the Guelph game on Jan 11

I am going to hate myself for engaging you, what is the catch? you can buy a ticket in the normal range 23-36, or buy one that gets you a ticket and a beer for $20 ...why on God's green earth would anyone buy a normal ticket????? and if there are promotions for every game, once again, I will ask,,why the bleep buy a normal ticket? you would have to be an idiot.

GCK..You may find this hard to believe, but I am with you. Far more sympathetic to Ottawa professional sports than most. If you could download my 25 so posts, a good 20 would be favorable to you. But here, I have to draw a line. I will check the site for the fine print!!!!! and the limitations, etc. And if none, I will write the 67's and politely ask that they change their web site.. It reminds me of an incident I had at Freshco..A dozen eggs $2.27. A dozen and a half, $4.50...I had to explain to the Manager that if you bought two, one dozens, you paid the same $4.50, but got 6 more eggs. I am not sure if they ever changed it. I always wanted to stand there and see what idiot bought the dozen and a half.
 

Nac Mac Feegle

wee & free
Jun 10, 2011
34,829
9,252
Declining attendance is a professional sports industry problem, not an Ottawa problem. It’s happening across cities and leagues in North America. While some cities are big enough to absorb it and still sell enough tickets to fill their buildings (New York, Los Angeles, Toronto, etc), others aren’t so lucky.

It’s lazy to write it off as “bad fans”. There are a myriad of challenges.

1. Competition for entertainment dollars and time

There are way more high-quality entertainment options for consumers than there used to be, and they’re becoming more and more accessible. Netflix, Disney+, Amazon Prime, gaming, etc. There’s so much great content out there now and it’s all available in the comfort of our homes for $10-15 a month. That’s hard to compete with.

2. Improvement in the TV viewing experience

The experience quality of watching a game at home or at a restaurant/bar has caught up with being there live. 4K images, instant access to replays/multiple angles, the ability to flip between games, etc. I’m a huge Bills fan, but I have little interest in going to a live game. I’d much rather watch at home where I can flip between games.

3. Lack of innovation

Going to a game today feels almost exactly like going to a game in 2001. There’s been little done to improve the experience for fans.

4. It’s easier to be a fan of other teams

With the ability to watch so many teams so easily, where you live no longer determines who you cheer for. So many kids in the mid-00’s grew up as Penguins fans because of Crosby, and today, it’ll be the Oilers and McDavid. Those fans stick with their teams as they age, and won’t spend as much money going to their local games.

Add our own unique local challenges to that (terrible location, awful weather during 80% of the season, etc), and this is what you get.

Does it mean that sports are dying?

No, but the metric of “success” shouldn’t be live attendance. In the next 10-15 years, I think we’ll see the size of arenas and stadiums shrink to create a more premium live product, whereas most fans will watch their team on the internet.

In Ottawa, if we ever get a new rink, it should be ~15,000 seats.

Pro sports leagues and teams are going to need to find different ways to monetize their product.


Well said.


Basically, it's the same thing movie theaters went through over the past 20 years. Transitioning to a different, more luxurious experience overall and offering a different type of service for movie goers which the average middle class person can't duplicate at home (yet). That's where (certain) pro sports leagues need to go. Arena leagues need to dramatically enhance the in-game experience. Much better (and bigger) seating. Better food service. Likely more mini-suites throughout the arena. More technology (perhaps even like airlines where certain levels have their own tv screens and even choose your own camera angles). Lots of things arenas can do to bring arena sports into the next century.
 

GCK

Registered User
Oct 15, 2018
15,494
9,742
I am going to hate myself for engaging you, what is the catch? you can buy a ticket in the normal range 23-36, or buy one that gets you a ticket and a beer for $20 ...why on God's green earth would anyone buy a normal ticket????? and if there are promotions for every game, once again, I will ask,,why the bleep buy a normal ticket? you would have to be an idiot.

GCK..You may find this hard to believe, but I am with you. Far more sympathetic to Ottawa professional sports than most. If you could download my 25 so posts, a good 20 would be favorable to you. But here, I have to draw a line. I will check the site for the fine print!!!!! and the limitations, etc. And if none, I will write the 67's and politely ask that they change their web site.. It reminds me of an incident I had at Freshco..A dozen eggs $2.27. A dozen and a half, $4.50...I had to explain to the Manager that if you bought two, one dozens, you paid the same $4.50, but got 6 more eggs. I am not sure if they ever changed it. I always wanted to stand there and see what idiot bought the dozen and a half.
The promo seats are low end seats It’s still a good time.
 

Pierre from Orleans

Registered User
May 9, 2007
26,101
17,276
Well said.


Basically, it's the same thing movie theaters went through over the past 20 years. Transitioning to a different, more luxurious experience overall and offering a different type of service for movie goers which the average middle class person can't duplicate at home (yet). That's where (certain) pro sports leagues need to go. Arena leagues need to dramatically enhance the in-game experience. Much better (and bigger) seating. Better food service. Likely more mini-suites throughout the arena. More technology (perhaps even like airlines where certain levels have their own tv screens and even choose your own camera angles). Lots of things arenas can do to bring arena sports into the next century.
Increase in TV screens would make the point of going to a game almost pointless. It's like how people attend these things and spend a large chunk of their time on their mobile devices
 

DrEasy

Out rumptackling
Oct 3, 2010
10,911
6,569
Stützville
Increase in TV screens would make the point of going to a game almost pointless. It's like how people attend these things and spend a large chunk of their time on their mobile devices
Honestly these days when I go to the movies or to a concert and have to deal with noisy people, tall people who block my view, etc. I ask myself why I bothered going out. Going to a Sens game is often the same thing: paying for parking, dealing with the long commute, the traffic jam on the way out, the long cold walk to the car, the people who have to go through the bathroom during the game, expensive beer. It's just not worth the hassle. Maybe I'm too old for this sh*t, or maybe like NMF said they need to come up with new reasons to get me off my couch.
 

Crosside

Registered User
Aug 1, 2018
4,724
1,842
I would not be opposed if company make a price for watching all game on tv like 200$
 

JD1

Registered User
Sep 12, 2005
15,991
9,555
I am going to hate myself for engaging you, what is the catch? you can buy a ticket in the normal range 23-36, or buy one that gets you a ticket and a beer for $20 ...why on God's green earth would anyone buy a normal ticket????? and if there are promotions for every game, once again, I will ask,,why the bleep buy a normal ticket? you would have to be an idiot.

GCK..You may find this hard to believe, but I am with you. Far more sympathetic to Ottawa professional sports than most. If you could download my 25 so posts, a good 20 would be favorable to you. But here, I have to draw a line. I will check the site for the fine print!!!!! and the limitations, etc. And if none, I will write the 67's and politely ask that they change their web site.. It reminds me of an incident I had at Freshco..A dozen eggs $2.27. A dozen and a half, $4.50...I had to explain to the Manager that if you bought two, one dozens, you paid the same $4.50, but got 6 more eggs. I am not sure if they ever changed it. I always wanted to stand there and see what idiot bought the dozen and a half.

Well im no egg expert but ive been in plenty of pubs where a pitcher of beer is more expensive than 3 pints
 

Nac Mac Feegle

wee & free
Jun 10, 2011
34,829
9,252
Increase in TV screens would make the point of going to a game almost pointless. It's like how people attend these things and spend a large chunk of their time on their mobile devices

I'm thinking more along the lines of some interactive tv screens in the mini-suite areas. Kinda like how first class seating in airplanes can show movies or have access to the internet on screens on the back of the seat in front of you. Stuff like that. Make it worthwhile to spend the extra money to sit in priority seating areas.
 

JD1

Registered User
Sep 12, 2005
15,991
9,555
Honestly these days when I go to the movies or to a concert and have to deal with noisy people, tall people who block my view, etc. I ask myself why I bothered going out. Going to a Sens game is often the same thing: paying for parking, dealing with the long commute, the traffic jam on the way out, the long cold walk to the car, the people who have to go through the bathroom during the game, expensive beer. It's just not worth the hassle. Maybe I'm too old for this sh*t, or maybe like NMF said they need to come up with new reasons to get me off my couch.

Completely agree that the at home situation has improved dramatically

But a live game is a live game and it's not comparable to watching at home.

I don't find the commute that bad anymore compared to say 20 years ago. Major highway improvements. Later start times.

Cold walk to the car? Come on man, this it ottawa.

Expensive beer is a problem. Definitely

Come on doc, going to a game is different. What i find on this board is guys making up a shit ton of excuses why they dont go and the reality for most of them is it's too expensive to go. Not all guys here...there's certainly guys around that used to be STHs but for the most part, it is cost prohibitive and guys won't say that....so all the excuses come out.

I had tickets back in the civic center days and going to a game was a lot of fun and a good night out. It wasn't prohibitively expensive like it is today
 
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Pierre from Orleans

Registered User
May 9, 2007
26,101
17,276
I'm thinking more along the lines of some interactive tv screens in the mini-suite areas. Kinda like how first class seating in airplanes can show movies or have access to the internet on screens on the back of the seat in front of you. Stuff like that. Make it worthwhile to spend the extra money to sit in priority seating areas.
More emphasis should probably made on the overall experience. Lots of empties in the upper bowls and non suite seats.
 

Dingle

summer is gone
Nov 22, 2019
765
208
if you read all posts in systematic fashion, you will get a chuckle.
1) we jump all over the place, we start talking about apples, only to end up at oranges.
2) when we do stay on a subject a short while, we get polar opposite views. Like say the attendance..some say: we need to improve the in arena experience. Pretty much all suggestion point directly at increased cost..posh seats, wider seats, TV, game consoles, etc....Others say: the issue is cost, that it is too costly...well?

You can appreciate guys, as a society we tend to pull just hard enough on an issue in all directions that it never moves. So imagine Melnyk, Greenberg, Hunt, et all , being bombarded by hundred of thousands of signals, in hundred of thousands of different directions. And jumping around like a hoping transceiver (Any electrical Engineer will understand this..google it)

So they tune everyone out. And we get upset as to why they are not listening to us!

If the above guys read this thread...they would close it and not take so much as a signal message or issue from it. Essentially, they would say..let the masses swim that murky pool all day.

The Iranian General that got assassinated...you have no idea of the few million view points on that subject. If Canada was like Europe in the 70's and had 6-10 major parties. The 360 seat House would have 6-10 parties with 36-50 seats each. And we would be having elections once a year.
 

Dingle

summer is gone
Nov 22, 2019
765
208
Well im no egg expert but ive been in plenty of pubs where a pitcher of beer is more expensive than 3 pints


Sadly, it makes beer drinkers and egg eaters slightly less .... I will leave it at that.
 

DrEasy

Out rumptackling
Oct 3, 2010
10,911
6,569
Stützville
Completely agree that the at home situation has improved dramatically

But a live game is a live game and it's not comparable to watching at home.

I don't find the commute that bad anymore compared to say 20 years ago. Major highway improvements. Later start times.

Cold walk to the car? Come on man, this it ottawa.

Expensive beer is a problem. Definitely

Come on doc, going to a game is different. What i find on this board is guys making up a **** ton of excuses why they dont go and the reality for most of them is it's too expensive to go. Not all guys here...there's certainly guys around that used to be STHs but for the most part, it is cost prohibitive and guys won't say that....so all the excuses come out.

I had tickets back in the civic center days and going to a game was a lot of fun and a good night out. It wasn't prohibitively expensive like it is today
Oh for me though a lot of this is simply about me getting older/lazier and not be willing to put up with inconveniences. Up until 2018 I still went to 2-4 games a year (last year I switched my 2-4 games to the 67s: go Rossi!). 2-4 Sens games isn't going to make a difference to my family budget, so no it's not only about the cost for me. Still, I've also cut back on my cable package, so all those HNIC where they don't show the Sens game anywhere unless you need to have some premium package, well I just watch something else instead. Way to lose some hockey fans, Rogers!

For the live game experience to be noticeably better than watching at home, well it would have to be less pre-packaged entertainment mostly designed for families, and more just about the hockey. And I don't see this happening anytime soon; most people probably want the opposite. And if they build a rink on LeBreton it would also make it easier for me, as I live near an O-train station. Lazy me would still be willing to get off the couch and mostly stay warm until I get inside the rink.

But this is just one data point. I'm not speaking for everyone.
 

JD1

Registered User
Sep 12, 2005
15,991
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Oh for me though a lot of this is simply about me getting older/lazier and not be willing to put up with inconveniences. Up until 2018 I still went to 2-4 games a year (last year I switched my 2-4 games to the 67s: go Rossi!). 2-4 Sens games isn't going to make a difference to my family budget, so no it's not only about the cost for me. Still, I've also cut back on my cable package, so all those HNIC where they don't show the Sens game anywhere unless you need to have some premium package, well I just watch something else instead. Way to lose some hockey fans, Rogers!

For the live game experience to be noticeably better than watching at home, well it would have to be less pre-packaged entertainment mostly designed for families, and more just about the hockey. And I don't see this happening anytime soon; most people probably want the opposite. And if they build a rink on LeBreton it would also make it easier for me, as I live near an O-train station. Lazy me would still be willing to get off the couch and mostly stay warm until I get inside the rink.

But this is just one data point. I'm not speaking for everyone.

I hear you....for me, i think there are many factors leading to a drop in attendance but the situation is masquerading primarily as a Melnyk issue. Don't get me wrong, Melnyk is an issue for sure, but watching live NHL hockey has become a real financial commitment and it's playing out across Canada, not just here.

There's cost, quality of watching at home, shifting priorities....there are all kinds of problems.
 
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AchtzehnBaby

Global Matador
Mar 28, 2013
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I hear you....for me, i think there are many factors leading to a drop in attendance but the situation is masquerading primarily as a Melnyk issue. Don't get me wrong, Melnyk is an issue for sure, but watching live NHL hockey has become a real financial commitment and it's playing out across Canada, not just here.

There's cost, quality of watching at home, shifting priorities....there are all kinds of problems.

They made the interactive TV experience better than the live games.

More stimulating than a barefax booth.
 
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DrEasy

Out rumptackling
Oct 3, 2010
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Stützville
I hear you....for me, i think there are many factors leading to a drop in attendance but the situation is masquerading primarily as a Melnyk issue. Don't get me wrong, Melnyk is an issue for sure, but watching live NHL hockey has become a real financial commitment and it's playing out across Canada, not just here.

There's cost, quality of watching at home, shifting priorities....there are all kinds of problems.
Absolutely, and that's why I don't buy the "bad fans" narrative. This has been a trend in sports and more generally entertainment everywhere, and it's natural that smaller markets will feel the pinch first.

Even the Melnyk stuff is related to it. After all, it truly was disappointing to see that we couldn't sell out all of our playoff games (no doubt due to the trends above), and that's what lead to his infamous rant that made things worse.
 

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