News Article: Citizen article on ottawa sports scene

[The Lewler]

Libraries have clear social utility as a community gathering place and a critical access point for the poor for services and education.

They also provide neutral ground for debates and lectures, hallmarks of a free democratic society.

There are many poor people whose sole access to the internet is through libraries.

The benefits of the libraries to their communities are far more acceptable for their costs then subsidizing professional sports teams.

 

[Dingle]

Libraries have clear social utility as a community gathering place and a critical access point for the poor for services and education.

They also provide neutral ground for debates and lectures, hallmarks of a free democratic society.

There are many poor people whose sole access to the internet is through libraries.

The benefits of the libraries to their communities are far more acceptable for their costs then subsidizing professional sports teams.

Lewler..I will give the site 25-30 minutes..Then watch the posts you will get defending pro teams and condemning government agencies. You are globally right. But I believe that your argument is just as applicable to sports teams. The difference, the public library does not have a Eugene Melnyk, or a Jerry Jones, or a James Dolin...Had Melnyk remained the otherwise quiet, seemingly gentle man he first was in the 2002-2007. When we saw him as a savior and not as a a piranha, what would our views be? We may be throwing the library overboard in favor of the Sens.

 

[GCK]

Libraries have clear social utility as a community gathering place and a critical access point for the poor for services and education.

They also provide neutral ground for debates and lectures, hallmarks of a free democratic society.

There are many poor people whose sole access to the internet is through libraries.

The benefits of the libraries to their communities are far more acceptable for their costs then subsidizing professional sports teams.

I disagree on two of your points.

1. Libraries are no longer gathering grounds for neutral debate, groupthink is the norm. I also believe a large central library is an outdated concept and the money would be better spend increasing satellite digital access centres around the city.

2. Assistance in the construction costs of a major events centre in an under developed area of the city is beneficial. The Calgary model is appropriate in my opinion. Ongoing subsidization of pro sports is a non starter for me.

 

[Dingle]

I disagree on two of your points.

1. Libraries are no longer gathering grounds for neutral debate, groupthink is the norm. I also believe a large central library is an outdated concept and the money would be better spend increasing satellite digital access centres around the city.

2. Assistance in the construction costs of a major events centre in an under developed area of the city is beneficial. The Calgary model is appropriate in my opinion. Ongoing subsidization of pro sports is a non starter for me.

GCK..you could not have waited a moment, or read my post, one up!!!!

 

[Rand0m]

I (or my wife) go to the library all the time with my 2 kids. Libraries are definitely an important part of any community, infinitely more important than any professional sports team. My kids won’t read on their iPad, they just want to play games or watch shows on it, but you hand them a physical book and they’ll read it cover to cover. As it’s been mentioned, libraries might not be used by everyone but it’s used by many.

Building more local rinks and amateur sports facilities are a much better investment into the community than funding a billionaires’ hobby.

Lewler..I will give the site 25-30 minutes..Then watch the posts you will get defending pro teams and condemning government agencies. You are globally right. But I believe that your argument is just as applicable to sports teams. The difference, the public library does not have a Eugene Melnyk, or a Jerry Jones, or a James Dolin...Had Melnyk remained the otherwise quiet, seemingly gentle man he first was in the 2002-2007. When we saw him as a savior and not as a a piranha, what would our views be? We may be throwing the library overboard in favor of the Sens.

Even if Melnyk was quiet and we never heard him utter a single word he still doesn’t deserve any public money. The only acceptable public funding in my opinion is if it’s a loan and there’s an agreement to repay the loan overtime or that the city retains some ownership of the facilities in question that can be used for community purposes or to generate revenue overtime in effect paying back the value of the loan.

 

[Dingle]

I (or my wife) go to the library all the time with my 2 kids. Libraries are definitely an important part of any community, infinitely more important than any professional sports team. My kids won’t read on their iPad, they just want to play games or watch shows on it, but you hand them a physical book and they’ll read it cover to cover. As it’s been mentioned, libraries might not be used by everyone but it’s used by many.

Building more local rinks and amateur sports facilities are a much better investment into the community than funding a billionaires’ hobby.


Even if Melnyk was quiet and we never heard him utter a single word he still doesn’t deserve any public money. The only acceptable public funding in my opinion is if it’s a loan and there’s an agreement to repay the loan overtime or that the city retains some ownership of the facilities in question that can be used for community purposes or to generate revenue overtime in effect paying back the value of the loan.

Random..the issue is simple. We have a deteriorating professional sports scene. The Sens on this side..near the bottom of the league and drawing 11700 fans. So they will lose money. As they do, they will take it from the teams' operating (Payroll/scouting/etc.). OSEG may be following suit, particularly if the team goes through a 2-3 year down cycle. In their case, they will have the added issue of a dilapidated building.
So, what then? we say no money and even worse, we get angry and turn our back, thus making the above even worse. Or we consider bailouts in the hope of saving everything?
You and Lewler say a library is more important. 23000 fans at a Redblacks game, 17000 (when healthy) at a sens game, 9000(when healthy) at a 67's game, say otherwise. I would be shocked if the Ottawa libraries, all 20 branches/vans/side outlets see more than about 20000 people a year..The Redblacks blow by that in a game.
The same people who say: who cares, let them die...will be the same who will fill this site and others with complaints as they are leaving or support if somewhere down the-line another person tries again.
If the situation is a dire as perceived, we are in new territory, and could in extreme circumstance, see a collapse of all teams in rapid order. If some girder falls on the North side stands at Landsdown, damaging the football stand and the arena below it, what then? if Quebec's 15000 Pespsi center appears to be a good option to CTC's 11700, what then? we say, impossible, okay..let's hope you are right.

 

[The Lewler]

I disagree on two of your points.

1. Libraries are no longer gathering grounds for neutral debate, groupthink is the norm. I also believe a large central library is an outdated concept and the money would be better spend increasing satellite digital access centres around the city.

2. Assistance in the construction costs of a major events centre in an under developed area of the city is beneficial. The Calgary model is appropriate in my opinion. Ongoing subsidization of pro sports is a non starter for me.

I don't know what this means.

It's the fact that anyone can use the facility. Not that you force diversity of opinion amongst the users and speakers.

You've got the Toronto Library head librarian refusing to bow to protestors saying she shouldn't let Meghan Murphy speak. That's exactly what we want them to do.

What is the annual budget cost of the Ottawa Library system? Versus the cost of carrying debt for a new arena?

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Random..the issue is simple. We have a deteriorating professional sports scene. The Sens on this side..near the bottom of the league and drawing 11700 fans. So they will lose money. As they do, they will take it from the teams' operating (Payroll/scouting/etc.). OSEG may be following suit, particularly if the team goes through a 2-3 year down cycle. In their case, they will have the added issue of a dilapidated building.
So, what then? we say no money and even worse, we get angry and turn our back, thus making the above even worse. Or we consider bailouts in the hope of saving everything?
You and Lewler say a library is more important. 23000 fans at a Redblacks game, 17000 (when healthy) at a sens game, 9000(when healthy) at a 67's game, say otherwise. I would be shocked if the Ottawa libraries, all 20 branches/vans/side outlets see more than about 20000 people a year..The Redblacks blow by that in a game.
The same people who say: who cares, let them die...will be the same who will fill this site and others with complaints as they are leaving or support if somewhere down the-line another person tries again.
If the situation is a dire as perceived, we are in new territory, and could in extreme circumstance, see a collapse of all teams in rapid order. If some girder falls on the North side stands at Landsdown, damaging the football stand and the arena below it, what then? if Quebec's 15000 Pespsi center appears to be a good option to CTC's 11700, what then? we say, impossible, okay..let's hope you are right.

You're forgetting one detail. Professional sports relies on disposable income. If there were no sports teams, that extra money would be going to hundreds of businesses all over the city. More home improvement, more money to theaters and bars, more to stores and buying vanity items, more towards vacations and vehicles, etc. Pro sports adds a surprisingly small amount of new money into a local economy.

Public facilities like libraries, theaters, etc, help retain the current population and jobs within a city. Public infrastructure is important to any community.

 

[Dingle]

You're forgetting one detail. Professional sports relies on disposable income. If there were no sports teams, that extra money would be going to hundreds of businesses all over the city. More home improvement, more money to theaters and bars, more to stores and buying vanity items, more towards vacations and vehicles, etc. Pro sports adds a surprisingly small amount of new money into a local economy.

Public facilities like libraries, theaters, etc, help retain the current population and jobs within a city. Public infrastructure is important to any community.

NAC MAC..I don't know. I am not some "think tank" that can produce an in dept analysis. Nor a University, nor a consulting firm, etc. Yes, money spent in blunt terms, like building a new arena, is not beneficial. The question is: what is the impact, and the impact to the psyche of a community, if there is a loss of pro teams. Winnipeg, could not get the Jets back fast enough. I travel to Quebec City, there is a desire for a return of the Hockey team. I have ties to Cornwall, the loss of the Royals, some 25 years ago, has never been fully gotten over.

we have and had several major league teams. If lost, and in our case, I have some doubt of a return..now what? what will TSN1200 talk about? so, what do I listen to? What do I watch? Let's hope the North side stands are more sound than feared. let's hope OSEG/Hunt realize that charging $10 for parking and $30/ticket for a junior game is not realistic. Let's hope OSEG realizes, that a high end quarterback is not a luxury, but a necessity in the CFL. Let's hope Eugene, keeps quiet for a whole. That Dorion drafts well, the young prospects evolve and a winning team flourishes again.

Libraries, and parks are great, we spend serious coin on them. They are at the heart of a happy society and so we spend. 2 million people celebrated the Raptors' parade..you want to talk about community joy. Calgary's red mile, Ottawa'a red Market, etc..community joy. Winnipeg's white out.

 

[GCK]

I don't know what this means.

It's the fact that anyone can use the facility. Not that you force diversity of opinion amongst the users and speakers.

You've got the Toronto Library head librarian refusing to bow to protestors saying she shouldn't let Meghan Murphy speak. That's exactly what we want them to do.

What is the annual budget cost of the Ottawa Library system? Versus the cost of carrying debt for a new arena?

50.369M this year. Now add the expense of the new central library and the debt for that project.

In Calgary the city puts in 275M on a 35 year deal. The city gets 2% of all ticket revenue from any building event. Projections show a net loss of 0.6% in direct returns over the 35 year term but a net gain of 1.4% when including indirect gains such as future property taxes from nearby developments.

 

[Masked]

we have and had several major league teams.

No. We have one major league team - the Ottawa Senators. The other teams are minor or junior league teams.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

NAC MAC..I don't know. I am not some "think tank" that can produce an in dept analysis. Nor a University, nor a consulting firm, etc. Yes, money spent in blunt terms, like building a new arena, is not beneficial. The question is: what is the impact, and the impact to the psyche of a community, if there is a loss of pro teams. Winnipeg, could not get the Jets back fast enough. I travel to Quebec City, there is a desire for a return of the Hockey team. I have ties to Cornwall, the loss of the Royals, some 25 years ago, has never been fully gotten over.

we have and had several major league teams. If lost, and in our case, I have some doubt of a return..now what? what will TSN1200 talk about? so, what do I listen to? What do I watch? Let's hope the North side stands are more sound than feared. let's hope OSEG/Hunt realize that charging $10 for parking and $30/ticket for a junior game is not realistic. Let's hope OSEG realizes, that a high end quarterback is not a luxury, but a necessity in the CFL. Let's hope Eugene, keeps quiet for a whole. That Dorion drafts well, the young prospects evolve and a winning team flourishes again.

Libraries, and parks are great, we spend serious coin on them. They are at the heart of a happy society and so we spend. 2 million people celebrated the Raptors' parade..you want to talk about community joy. Calgary's red mile, Ottawa'a red Market, etc..community joy. Winnipeg's white out.

Oh, I'm not arguing that. Happiness levels in a community and community spirit are definitely enhanced with sporting teams (among other things like parks, recreational centers, buildings for the arts, etc).

I'm more just talking about economic impact of pro sports within a city.

 

[Dingle]

I don't know what this means.

It's the fact that anyone can use the facility. Not that you force diversity of opinion amongst the users and speakers.

You've got the Toronto Library head librarian refusing to bow to protestors saying she shouldn't let Meghan Murphy speak. That's exactly what we want them to do.

What is the annual budget cost of the Ottawa Library system? Versus the cost of carrying debt for a new arena?

These are in 1000, thus the 54,929 you see is actually $54 929 000 or ~ 55 million for 2020.
per the OPL site... so 55 million/15000 users that is $3700 a person.... If you go by library card holders..they claim 200,000. That means $275 a person. What is your guess? 15000 users or 200 000. Remember ~20 branches..at 200 000. It means 10,000 people per branch. And this is of single users. account for multiple users..They do claim a grand total of 4.16 million visitors. That would mean 570 visitors per branch, per day..Please come and we can sit in front of the MANOTICK BRANCH (IN SUMMER IF YOU ARE OKAY). I have doubts we will hit that number.

in the end.. we spend on libraries, because we feel a great public good is at hand. we do so, not regarding a financial efficiency, but a social good.

I return to the question that is always there? what is the greater good of a professional sports team and what dollar value can we assign to it?

 

[Rand0m]

...
if Quebec's 15000 Pespsi center appears to be a good option to CTC's 11700, what then? we say, impossible, okay..let's hope you are right.

Then my beloved Nordiques will be back! And there's no way in hell this happens with Melnyk as an owner so win-win!

 

[DaveMatthew]

Declining attendance is a professional sports industry problem, not an Ottawa problem. It’s happening across cities and leagues in North America. While some cities are big enough to absorb it and still sell enough tickets to fill their buildings (New York, Los Angeles, Toronto, etc), others aren’t so lucky.

It’s lazy to write it off as “bad fans”. There are a myriad of challenges.

1. Competition for entertainment dollars and time

There are way more high-quality entertainment options for consumers than there used to be, and they’re becoming more and more accessible. Netflix, Disney+, Amazon Prime, gaming, etc. There’s so much great content out there now and it’s all available in the comfort of our homes for $10-15 a month. That’s hard to compete with.

2. Improvement in the TV viewing experience

The experience quality of watching a game at home or at a restaurant/bar has caught up with being there live. 4K images, instant access to replays/multiple angles, the ability to flip between games, etc. I’m a huge Bills fan, but I have little interest in going to a live game. I’d much rather watch at home where I can flip between games.

3. Lack of innovation

Going to a game today feels almost exactly like going to a game in 2001. There’s been little done to improve the experience for fans.

4. It’s easier to be a fan of other teams

With the ability to watch so many teams so easily, where you live no longer determines who you cheer for. So many kids in the mid-00’s grew up as Penguins fans because of Crosby, and today, it’ll be the Oilers and McDavid. Those fans stick with their teams as they age, and won’t spend as much money going to their local games.

Add our own unique local challenges to that (terrible location, awful weather during 80% of the season, etc), and this is what you get.

Does it mean that sports are dying?

No, but the metric of “success” shouldn’t be live attendance. In the next 10-15 years, I think we’ll see the size of arenas and stadiums shrink to create a more premium live product, whereas most fans will watch their team on the internet.

In Ottawa, if we ever get a new rink, it should be ~15,000 seats.

Pro sports leagues and teams are going to need to find different ways to monetize their product.

 

[TonySoprano11]

I don't live in Ottawa so I don't have a skin in this game. I will say this though. You can't go comparing libraries and sports stadiums. They exist for two entirely different reasons. The bottom line for the people and government of Ottawa is, do you want your city to be considered a "world-class" city? That is what professional sports teams bring to cities; a tag the brings with it other benefits.

A major league professional sports franchise brings with it, by its nature of a major entertainment attraction, a host of other things that boost a city. This includes restaurants, hotels, transportation services, other venues of entertainment, attraction for industries to hold conferences in your city, major shopping and more. If the people of Ottawa do not care about having these kinds of things in their city, then don't help fund the arena. On the other hand, if the people of Ottawa want to keep these things in the city, then you better help do whatever it takes to keep the Sens around - unless you think the Redbacks could provide the same impact (maybe it can, I don't know how big the CFL is in Canada).

An abundance of public libraries, or one main awesome library downtown isn't going to attract other high class businesses, entertainment, shopping, and services to Ottawa.

If you don't believe me, ask the people of Hartford.

 

[Tuna99]

If the Sens win the draft lottery and also pick at say #7 but the time they made their 7th round pick on Sunday they would of sold 3000 season ticket packs and have 3000 more calls to return.

Selling hockey in Ottawa isn’t hard, tearing down a proud fan base is hard

 

[Dingle]

I don't live in Ottawa so I don't have a skin in this game. I will say this though. You can't go comparing libraries and sports stadiums. They exist for two entirely different reasons. The bottom line for the people and government of Ottawa is, do you want your city to be considered a "world-class" city? That is what professional sports teams bring to cities; a tag the brings with it other benefits.

A major league professional sports franchise brings with it, by its nature of a major entertainment attraction, a host of other things that boost a city. This includes restaurants, hotels, transportation services, other venues of entertainment, attraction for industries to hold conferences in your city, major shopping and more. If the people of Ottawa do not care about having these kinds of things in their city, then don't help fund the arena. On the other hand, if the people of Ottawa want to keep these things in the city, then you better help do whatever it takes to keep the Sens around - unless you think the Redbacks could provide the same impact (maybe it can, I don't know how big the CFL is in Canada).

An abundance of public libraries, or one main awesome library downtown isn't going to attract other high class businesses, entertainment, shopping, and services to Ottawa.

If you don't believe me, ask the people of Hartford.

Or WINNIPEG, who built a 1500 seater on the hope.
Or Quebec city, who did the same..then messed it up through crazy antics when expansion bids came up.

As for the Redblacks..the North Side is the older side of the stadium. It may be falling apart. below it, is a smaller hockey arena for the 67's. The local junior team..You can appreciate the issue. One problem with the structure, can take out two teams. The CFL is a 20 million dollar a team league (Net average revenue)..Your NFL is 250 million a year in TV rights alone. Apples and oranges. What the Redblacks have(had) was a phenomenal party environment. 23000 gathered to party most summer/early fall weekend nights. so, on their own, they cannot carry the mantel of "big league". They and the 67"s provide well organised entertainment.

The combination of Sens, Redblacks and 67 combine to complete the sports scene. The combination of the three, could not begin to muster enough cash to build so much as one facility, let along build an arena, re-furb a football stadium and hockey arena below it. The reality is: tax dollars, or nothing.

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

So many kids in the mid-00’s grew up as Penguins fans because of Crosby, and today, it’ll be the Oilers and McDavid. Those fans stick with their teams as they age

This is why I think it's pivotal to draft Laf.

He will do what Crosby and McDavid is doing to the younger generation.

Not to mention he speaks French which will attract fans from across the river

 

[GCK]

NAC MAC..I don't know. I am not some "think tank" that can produce an in dept analysis. Nor a University, nor a consulting firm, etc. Yes, money spent in blunt terms, like building a new arena, is not beneficial. The question is: what is the impact, and the impact to the psyche of a community, if there is a loss of pro teams. Winnipeg, could not get the Jets back fast enough. I travel to Quebec City, there is a desire for a return of the Hockey team. I have ties to Cornwall, the loss of the Royals, some 25 years ago, has never been fully gotten over.

we have and had several major league teams. If lost, and in our case, I have some doubt of a return..now what? what will TSN1200 talk about? so, what do I listen to? What do I watch? Let's hope the North side stands are more sound than feared. let's hope OSEG/Hunt realize that charging $10 for parking and $30/ticket for a junior game is not realistic. Let's hope OSEG realizes, that a high end quarterback is not a luxury, but a necessity in the CFL. Let's hope Eugene, keeps quiet for a whole. That Dorion drafts well, the young prospects evolve and a winning team flourishes again.

Libraries, and parks are great, we spend serious coin on them. They are at the heart of a happy society and so we spend. 2 million people celebrated the Raptors' parade..you want to talk about community joy. Calgary's red mile, Ottawa'a red Market, etc..community joy. Winnipeg's white out.

Tickets go for 23-36 bucks. Running a team isn’t cheap, I don’t know how low you need to go.

I thinks reasonable prices would be:
Sens
300 50-120
200 100 -225
100 150-350

67s are priced about right.

 

[Dingle]

Tickets go for 23-36 bucks. Running a team isn’t cheap, I don’t know how low you need to go.

I thinks reasonable prices would be:
Sens
300 50-120
200 100 -225
100 150-350

67s are priced about right.

GCK..this is not a peeing contest, this is simply me relaying to you what I know. In 1998, 22 years ago. A ticket for the 67's was 15 dollars and there was zero parking fee and concessions inside the arena where way more reasonable. 22 years at 2.5% inflation is a multiplier by 1.72. Thus a ticket should be $26 dollars. I will be honest, I cannot remember if there was a higher ticket section. I also do not know if what you have stated includes all fees. The $15 I spoke of was total. So if the bulk of all tickets is $23, then they are dead on, in fact below.. If the bulk is $36, well???? We have issues. I will log in and check it is an easy exercise. no parking, versus $10.

Concession..My friend and I could count on eating and drinking (soda) at both intermissions for ~ $20 dollars. At the same 1.72 multiplier, It gets me to $34..You would know better than I, but can two people eat (and I mean 1 pizza slice /per at break 1, 1 nachos / per at 2, 2 small drinks each break), for $34. If so, well then. The concessions are properly priced. If not..maybe we have issues.

In 1998, ~ $50, got me an evening with my lady friend at a 67's game, with all the trimmings. Can I have the same evening at $86 dollars and not sit in a ridiculously isolated section, and not have to contend myself with a bottle of water at 1 of the intermissions. I am guessing not. Maybe $110 is more accurate

So, if the 67's are wondering where the missing 5000 fans went.. They lost them about $24 ago. Jeff Hunt and OSEG need to read this.

prices must reflect reason. I know it is expensive to run a team. Heck, I have written a dozen posts, defending them on that, and have been crucified by repliers. But at some point, if I am to defend, I need to defend reason. $50 should have become $86...say $90...at $90, you are talking 2.7 % average yearly increase. The real inflation rate was ~ 1.75% for that period. Suggesting $50, should have been $73.. I am giving them an extra $17.

Like I said, If OSEG and Hunt want to know where the 5000, they need to call their accountant.

 

[GCK]

GCK..this is not a peeing contest, this is simply me relaying to you what I know. In 1998, 22 years ago. A ticket for the 67's was 15 dollars and there was zero parking fee and concessions inside the arena where way more reasonable. 22 years at 2.5% inflation is a multiplier by 1.72. Thus a ticket should be $26 dollars. I will be honest, I cannot remember if there was a higher ticket section. I also do not know if what you have stated includes all fees. The $15 I spoke of was total. So if the bulk of all tickets is $23, then they are dead on, in fact below.. If the bulk is $36, well???? We have issues. I will log in and check it is an easy exercise. no parking, versus $10.

Concession..My friend and I could count on eating and drinking (soda) at both intermissions for ~ $20 dollars. At the same 1.72 multiplier, It gets me to $34..You would know better than I, but can two people eat (and I mean 1 pizza slice /per at break 1, 1 nachos / per at 2, 2 small drinks each break), for $34. If so, well then. The concessions are properly priced. If not..maybe we have issues.

In 1998, ~ $50, got me an evening with my lady friend at a 67's game, with all the trimmings. Can I have the same evening at $86 dollars and not sit in a ridiculously isolated section, and not have to contend myself with a bottle of water at 1 of the intermissions. I am guessing not. Maybe $110 is more accurate

So, if the 67's are wondering where the missing 5000 fans went.. They lost them about $24 ago. Jeff Hunt and OSEG need to read this.

prices must reflect reason. I know it is expensive to run a team. Heck, I have written a dozen posts, defending them on that, and have been crucified by repliers. But at some point, if I am to defend, I need to defend reason. $50 should have become $86...say $90...at $90, you are talking 2.7 % average yearly increase. The real inflation rate was ~ 1.75% for that period. Suggesting $50, should have been $73.. I am giving them an extra $17.

Like I said, If OSEG and Hunt want to know where the 5000, they need to call their accountant.

GCK..this is not a peeing contest, this is simply me relaying to you what I know. In 1998, 22 years ago. A ticket for the 67's was 15 dollars and there was zero parking fee and concessions inside the arena where way more reasonable. 22 years at 2.5% inflation is a multiplier by 1.72. Thus a ticket should be $26 dollars. I will be honest, I cannot remember if there was a higher ticket section. I also do not know if what you have stated includes all fees. The $15 I spoke of was total. So if the bulk of all tickets is $23, then they are dead on, in fact below.. If the bulk is $36, well???? We have issues. I will log in and check it is an easy exercise. no parking, versus $10.

Concession..My friend and I could count on eating and drinking (soda) at both intermissions for ~ $20 dollars. At the same 1.72 multiplier, It gets me to $34..You would know better than I, but can two people eat (and I mean 1 pizza slice /per at break 1, 1 nachos / per at 2, 2 small drinks each break), for $34. If so, well then. The concessions are properly priced. If not..maybe we have issues.

In 1998, ~ $50, got me an evening with my lady friend at a 67's game, with all the trimmings. Can I have the same evening at $86 dollars and not sit in a ridiculously isolated section, and not have to contend myself with a bottle of water at 1 of the intermissions. I am guessing not. Maybe $110 is more accurate

So, if the 67's are wondering where the missing 5000 fans went.. They lost them about $24 ago. Jeff Hunt and OSEG need to read this.

prices must reflect reason. I know it is expensive to run a team. Heck, I have written a dozen posts, defending them on that, and have been crucified by repliers. But at some point, if I am to defend, I need to defend reason. $50 should have become $86...say $90...at $90, you are talking 2.7 % average yearly increase. The real inflation rate was ~ 1.75% for that period. Suggesting $50, should have been $73.. I am giving them an extra $17.

Like I said, If OSEG and Hunt want to know where the 5000, they need to call their accountant.

I have taken my nephews and I seem to pick the right nights. For 50 bucks I get 2 tickets a beer/pop and parking. I usually pick Friday games. I never get food because with one nephew we go to lone star and the other likes Italian on Preston (I only spoil him because I love good pasta).

 

[Dingle]

I have taken my nephews and I seem to pick the right nights. For 50 bucks I get 2 tickets a beer/pop and parking. I usually pick Friday games. I never get food because with one nephew we go to lone star and the other likes Italian on Preston (I only spoil him because I love good pasta).

okay GCK..2 people $50. can you tell me how? if the tickets are $23. You are at $46 already.
Parking is $10..you are at $56
a beer and a pop...... and they give you $6!!!!

I hear their commercials, they run specials... This is about a normal game, on an otherwise normal night...It was once $50..It is now $110.

like I said GCK..this ain't a peeing contest. As with the Sens, Don't convince me, convince the 5000 who are not going.. And the people of OSEG had better find solutions. If the few hundred people who have attacked me on "the rich owners crying foul " are a subsection of society..I an guessing, politicians maybe less inclined to help. It leaves OSEG on their own.

 

[GCK]

okay GCK..2 people $50. can you tell me how? if the tickets are $23. You are at $46 already.
Parking is $10..you are at $56
a beer and a pop...... and they give you $6!!!!

I hear their commercials, they run specials... This is about a normal game, on an otherwise normal night...It was once $50..It is now $110.

like I said GCK..this ain't a peeing contest. As with the Sens, Don't convince me, convince the 5000 who are not going.. And the people of OSEG had better find solutions. If the few hundred people who have attacked me on "the rich owners crying foul " are a subsection of society..I an guessing, politicians maybe less inclined to help. It leaves OSEG on their own.

They do deals all the time. Just go to the 67s site and pick a game to see the promotion available. It’s good value, the team is fun to watch. I warn you that you will be calling for Jack Quinn to drop to us in the 2nd once you watch him play live a couple times.

 

[GCK]