Chistov - to the minors!

[Siberian]

Datsyuk injured his knee, and Ak took him in....
I don't think you understand how truly difficult it is to not speak a word of english, and come into this league....
Larionov gave him a place to stay, taught him the language, and showed him how to play the game on North American ice...sure, he might have learned his moves in Russia, but how can he put them to use if he's homeless and can't even understand basic words like hockey stick....
Datsyuk learned a hell of a lot more from Larionov than just the english language, you make it seem like Datsyuk was an all-star coming into this league when he in fact wasn't anything close...

Datsyuk is having a break out year due to increased ice time due to the values and skills Larionov taught him...he's not having a breakout year because he all of a sudden is doing fantastic moves...

First of all I have no idea what exactly Datsyuk might have learnt from Larionov. I heard all those ramblings about Larionov being a mentor for Pavel and Datsyuk kind of nodded hearing that just to help secure Larionov's job with the Wings. Datsyuk was already a better passer, shooter, checker, everything you can think of than Larionov ever was. The only thing Datsyuk lacked is fitness and muscle to stay energetic during the long NHL season.

Sure, English is important, but that is why you have English teachers....

 

[Epsilon]

Siberian is the Russian version of Hablover...

 

[Siberian]

Siberian is the Russian version of Hablover...

And you are Canadian version of Dolboeb....

 

[Siberian]

Larionov taught him how to play on North American ice....and his leadership is the reason he had a job with the wings.....

i dont think Datsyuk has time to learn one of the most complecated if not the most complecated language from a teacher while playing an 82 game scgedule

I think you are just one of those who blindly read whatever some writers write on the subject and eat it up. Yes, I know that every Detroit paper wrote on how Larionov was a mentor and taught Datsyuk so many things. This was just a regular hype many hockey observers like to write about.

Try to think with your own brains yourself, what exactly Larionov could have taught Datsyuk? How to play on North American ice? How is that? Let me imagine one of those lessons.

L: Hey Datsyuk, see the ice here is smaller. So you shouldn't skate so fast with the puck or you can hit the boards.....
D: Yeah-yeah he he he

L: The distance between goals is also shorter... Remember that Dats.
D. Yeah-yeah he he he

D: Igor, I just learnt great lesson from you, you are truly my mentor.....

 

[Ruckus007]

Artem Kryukov would sure be happier playing in the AHL.

Siberian's thoughts on Kriukov would certainly be of interest to me. Seeing as he hasn't played at all this year. But I guess that's what's best for his development, it's a good thing he's not coming over early no matter how much he wants to.

 

[Siberian]

Siberian's thoughts on Kriukov would certainly be of interest to me. Seeing as he hasn't played at all this year. But I guess that's what's best for his development, it's a good thing he's not coming over early no matter how much he wants to.

Kriukov is not elite Russian hockey talent. All his medical problems took his game away from him. I have no idea why you bring him up but if you had a stick blade in your mouth to prevent you from swallowing your own tongue right during the game I do not think you would have been dreaming about playing in AHL. Perhaps he does not want to play hockey at all?

 

[Buffaloed]

Kriukov is not elite Russian hockey talent. All his medical problems took his game away from him. I have no idea why you bring him up but if you had a stick blade in your mouth to prevent you from swallowing your own tongue right during the game I do not think you would have been dreaming about playing in AHL. Perhaps he does not want to play hockey at all?

Obviously you're not the least bit familiar with the situation. Kryukov wanted very badly to play for the Rochester Amerks. He came to Buffalo in June to attend workouts, had an impressive camp with the Sabres and practiced with the Amerks until November while trying to secure his release from Yaroslav who has him under contract for one more season. The release was not forthcoming and Kryukov returned to Russia where he hasn't played in a single game. But I guess he'll develop faster in Russia not playing than he would have in Rochester.
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/sports/amerks/11067629E1P_amerks06_amerks.shtml

 

[Siberian]

Obviously you're not the least bit familiar with the situation. Kryukov wanted very badly to play for the Rochester Amerks. He came to Buffalo in June to attend workouts, had an impressive camp with the Sabres and practiced with the Amerks until November while trying to secure his release from Yaroslav who has him under contract for one more season. The release was not forthcoming and Kryukov returned to Russia where he hasn't played in a single game. But I guess he'll develop faster in Russia not playing than he would have in Rochester.
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/sports/amerks/11067629E1P_amerks06_amerks.shtml

If this is true then I am not on Lokomotiv's side here. Poor kid should have just been let go. But I can not speculate about this matter because I do not have enough information, I can not fully trust the information that comes from AHL sources....

Situation with Kryukov is so much different from situation with the other prospects and very irrelevant to the subjest of this thread...

 

[Buffaloed]

If this is true then I am not on Lokomotiv's side here. Poor kid should have just been let go. But I can not speculate about this matter because I do not have enough information, I can not fully trust the information that comes from AHL sources....

The Rochester Democrat and Chronicle is not an AHL source.
Talks continued with center Artem Kriukov, the Buffalo Sabres’ first-round draft pick in 2000. Should the Sabres and Kriukov come to terms on a contract, the highly skilled forward will join the Amerks lineup. Kriukov has been practicing with the Amerks for four weeks but can’t play without a contract. “ He wants to be here and we’d like to have him here,†said Larry Carriere, assistant to Sabres general manager Darcy Regier. “ We’re continuing to work on it; that’s why he’s still here.â€


There we also numerous articles in the Buffalo News on his situation and it was widely discussed on the Sabres board. Unfortunately they charge a fee to view older articles:
http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20030920/1004165.asp
http://www.buffalonews.com/editoria...002/1002701.asp
http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20031107/1031242.asp

If you're still skeptical I can only conclude that you're so set in your agenda that further discussion is pointless.

 

[Russian Fan]

The thing is Datsyuk was not rushed to NHL. He peaked in Ak Bars and was already a better passer than Larionov ever was. There was nothing he could learn from him except English language...

Whew! I love Datsyuk SO MUCH, many people around here can attest but from a Russian fella saying that Larionov one of the best passers in the history of hockey (not only the NHL because he came too late sniff sniff) was not that good.

You lost me there.

Larionov could have push one of the greats in the NHL if he came @18-20 yo.

 

[Siberian]

If you're still skeptical I can only conclude that you're so set in your agenda that further discussion is pointless.

What agenda?
I have my own point which is Russian prospects should not come to North America before they peak in Russia so this would be natural move to go to NHL and continue on improving as a player.

I had nothing against Kovalchuk, Frolov, Volchenkov going to NHL because they grew out of Russia!!!
What I did not agree with is when struggling NHL clubs want to rush some of the kids (Zherdev and Chistov are simply good examples) and change the process of constant improving.

Columbus groupies think that this was good move for Zherdev, I say this was not aa good move as the kid was misled by his agent.

If you do not agree with fine, but do not call it an agenda as everybody else has a right on opinion...

 

[ZBORNAJA]

try chinese if u wanna know hard langugage..
Otherwise i quite see the point of siberian and in some points i agree with him...

 

[Siberian]

Whew! I love Datsyuk SO MUCH, many people around here can attest but from a Russian fella saying that Larionov one of the best passers in the history of hockey (not only the NHL because he came too late sniff sniff) was not that good.

You lost me there.

Larionov could have push one of the greats in the NHL if he came @18-20 yo.

This is totally different subject but Larionov is one of the most overrated Russians to ever play in NHL. He benefited from the fact that he played on a very talented line with Krutov, Makarov and Fetisov. Krutov was a heart of that line and Makarov was one of the best goalscorers in Soviet hockey history.

To call Larionov one of the best passers in history is just blind following of Soviet hockey propoganda and later NHL propaganda. Larionov was never as good as many people say he was and I can prove this to you by showing you the numbers he had during his career. He was an average NHL player but used the fact that he had great record on resume with Soviet team and used it as much as he could.

Look at him now, he sucks big time, 40 plus games- no goal which is embarassment for any hockey forward but he does manage to squeeze last penny (1.5 mil) out of NJ Devils only because he created this aura of one of the best passers in the hockey history...

 

[dats-13]

i had a response to what you said earlier Siberian, but these boards are all screwed up and it wouldn't let me post it

o well im right you're wrong :p

 

[dats-13]

This is totally different subject but Larionov is one of the most overrated Russians to ever play in NHL. He benefited from the fact that he played on a very talented line with Krutov, Makarov and Fetisov. Krutov was a heart of that line and Makarov was one of the best goalscorers in Soviet hockey history.

To call Larionov one of the best passers in history is just blind following of Soviet hockey propoganda and later NHL propaganda. Larionov was never as good as many people say he was and I can prove this to you by showing you the numbers he had during his career. He was an average NHL player but used the fact that he had great record on resume with Soviet team and used it as much as he could.

Look at him now, he sucks big time, 40 plus games- no goal which is embarassment for any hockey forward but he does manage to squeeze last penny (1.5 mil) out of NJ Devils only because he created this aura of one of the best passers in the hockey history...

he's as old as my jokes....which is why he isnt putting up some serious #'s this year

 

[Siberian]

I am sorry to those Russian hockey fans who likes Larionov. I really liked him to until I started doing my research on the numbers and the fact that Larionov was too greedy to squeeze as much money out of NHL and could not retire at high point with Stanley Cup two years ago completely took all respect I had for Igor.

 

[dats-13]

try chinese if u wanna know hard langugage..
Otherwise i quite see the point of siberian and in some points i agree with him...

to Datsyuk english might as well be chinese

 

[dats-13]

First of all I have no idea what exactly Datsyuk might have learnt from Larionov. I heard all those ramblings about Larionov being a mentor for Pavel and Datsyuk kind of nodded hearing that just to help secure Larionov's job with the Wings. Datsyuk was already a better passer, shooter, checker, everything you can think of than Larionov ever was. The only thing Datsyuk lacked is fitness and muscle to stay energetic during the long NHL season.

Sure, English is important, but that is why you have English teachers....

Larionov taught him how to play on North American ice....and his leadership is the reason he had a job with the wings.....

i dont think Datsyuk has time to learn one of the most complecated if not the most complecated language from a teacher while playing an 82 game scgedule

 

[SIBIR]

i dont think Datsyuk has time to learn one of the most complecated if not the most complecated language from a teacher while playing an 82 game scgedule

the most complicated language?!

 

[dats-13]

the most complicated language?!

their,there,they're 3 different ways to say one word that sounds exactly the same

not to mention adjectives,adverbs,sentence fragements,double-negatives,incorrect comman,colon,semicolon,paranthesis, and sentence endings, learning thousands upon thousands of new words, not to mention many many more examples....

seems easy to most, but why are you required to take an english class from the age of 3 to the age of 22?????

so what i said really isn't that ludacris now is it...

on that

 

[Dr_Chimera*]

the most complicated language?!

True thing. Pedestrian English isn't at all complicated.

We're not talking Shakespeare.

 

[Ruckus007]

Kriukov is not elite Russian hockey talent. All his medical problems took his game away from him. I have no idea why you bring him up but if you had a stick blade in your mouth to prevent you from swallowing your own tongue right during the game I do not think you would have been dreaming about playing in AHL. Perhaps he does not want to play hockey at all?

Tongue still firmly in mouth, I think it'll be there a while.

 

[Buffaloed]

If you do not agree with fine, but do not call it an agenda as everybody else has a right on opinion...

It's an agenda as you can't simply admit you were wrong about Kryukov and you dismiss others opinions as propaganda. I already posted this thread that I agreed that it's generally better to leave prospects in Europe until they're older, but since I don't have an agenda I'm open-minded on the subject and can accept that there are numerous exceptions.

 

[DJ Spinoza]

I am sorry to those Russian hockey fans who likes Larionov. I really liked him to until I started doing my research on the numbers and the fact that Larionov was too greedy to squeeze as much money out of NHL and could not retire at high point with Stanley Cup two years ago completely took all respect I had for Igor.

Maybe he still wanted to play, and challenge for a Stanley Cup again?

 

[Buffaloed]

Maybe he still wanted to play, and challenge for a Stanley Cup again?

Don't you have a problem respecting someone who gets paid well for doing something he loves to do?