Champions League Quarterfinals

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

No issues with Alisson/DDG/Oblak/MaTS being put in convo, but those 4 are not significantly better than the other IMO.

If it was last year, DDG would have 1,2,3 positions Lol. But he has dipped a bit in form since.

He's been horrendous for Spain and MAtS is on another level.

I said scoring 2 goals over two games was possible and then every Barca fan comes out saying “Stahp underrating our defense it’s incredible” blah blah blah. United scoring 1 goal a game against Barca isn’t underrating your guys defense

Well for one thing the original comment was from you it was Sharkie who said Manu should be able to score "some" goals the issue is how many they let it... as if the game will end up 4-3 or 5-4. Barca will not concede that many IMO.

Also MATS, Oblak, DDG are the easy top 3 currently. I’d still take DDG over all 3 but the difference between the 3 is minuscule.

MAtS is on par in shot block is miles miles better at keeper sweeper.

 

[les Habs]

I said scoring 2 goals over two games was possible and then every Barca fan comes out saying “Stahp underrating our defense it’s incredible” blah blah blah. United scoring 1 goal a game against Barca isn’t underrating your guys defense

This is exactly what I was expecting. One Barça supporter came out. You've already been corrected on this and you're still getting it wrong. On top of that every point made about our defense has been correct and while I wouldn't rule out United putting two goals past us over the course of the tie I also wouldn't put it past us to allow fewer than two goals.

 

[Cassano]

He's been horrendous for Spain and MAtS is on another level.

Yes, he has had a bit of a dip of form, but he put in one of the best GK displays in history last season when he carried Utd to 2nd place.

 

[The Abusement Park]

This is exactly what I was expecting. One Barça supporter came out. You've already been corrected on this and you're still getting it wrong. On top of that every point made about our defense has been correct and while I wouldn't rule out United putting two goals past us over the course of the tie I also wouldn't put it past us to allow fewer than two goals.

I mean there were 3 comments from 3 different people regarding it so that’s false. And again no one here has said anything bad or negative about Barca’s defense. In fact I think everyone here agrees that they have a good defense and I wouldn’t be surprised if were held to less than 2 goals over the tie. But we easily have 2 goal potential.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Yes, he has had a bit of a dip of form, but he put in one of the best GK displays in history last season when he carried Utd to 2nd place.

I'm not hating on the guy I actually like him and was a big fan prior to his move to Manu.argued with many united fans about his talent I'm glad he fulfilled his potential but on here he's talked about like some sort of Messi. He's great and all but MAtS is better overal.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Yes, he has had a bit of a dip of form, but he put in one of the best GK displays in history last season when he carried Utd to 2nd place.

He had a meh World Cup but other than that he’s been just as elite as he’s always been.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

He had a meh World Cup but other than that he’s been just as elite as he’s always been.

Meh? He was terrible and has been awful for Spain.

 

[Cassano]

He had a meh World Cup but other than that he’s been just as elite as he’s always been.

Utd conceding way more goals this year than last with same backline. You wouldn't see last year's DDG make the mistake like he did on the Xhaka goal last week.

2017-18 DDG was the best goalkeeping I've seen in my years of following the sport.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Utd conceding way more goals this year than last with same backline. You wouldn't see last year's DDG make the mistake like he did on the Xhaka goal last week.

2017-18 DDG was the best goalkeeping I've seen in my years of following the sport.

He hasn’t been as good as last year no. But he’s still been elite like he always is.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Utd conceding way more goals this year than last with same backline. You wouldn't see last year's DDG make the mistake like he did on the Xhaka goal last week.

2017-18 DDG was the best goalkeeping I've seen in my years of following the sport.

NUEr the answer here is always nuer

 

[les Habs]

I mean there were 3 comments from 3 different people regarding it so that’s false. And again no one here has said anything bad or negative about Barca’s defense. In fact I think everyone here agrees that they have a good defense and I wouldn’t be surprised if were held to less than 2 goals over the tie. But we easily have 2 goal potential.

No, there was one comment.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

No, there was one comment.

And the one comment was bang on.

 

[Gecklund]

I mean you watch MAtS for 5 mins and it's quite clear he is the best. Too bad he doesn't play In the epl. The comment is just hilarious when you conside that ok DDG is better(he isn't) who's next Oblak ok... then who pickard? Lol

DDG Neuer and Oblak.

 

[Live in the Now]

Neuer has fallen off hard. There's quite a few keepers better than him right now. I'm not basing it on mid-week as I thought that was more down to great skill from Mane, but Neuer has had some bad injuries it seems he has not fully recovered from.

Also, Umtiti is the #2 CB in the world behind VVD, and I wouldn't be surprised to see Barcelona keep two clean sheets in this round.

While he's been great, it's hard to put him anywhere near e.g Alan Hansen, mainstay of 8 league titles and 3 CLs and all that...

They're also much different players, with Hansen being more elegant and having far more ability going forward, while VVD is better in the air and much more of a powerhouse. The game has changed so much that nobody really plays like Hansen anymore.

 

[Evilo]

Of course you don't think so, but it was most definitely a foul on Lenglet prior to the goal

Sure and Ronaldo fouled the Atletico defenseman on his goal then? Right?

 

[Corto]

Neuer has fallen off hard. There's quite a few keepers better than him right now. I'm not basing it on mid-week as I thought that was more down to great skill from Mane, but Neuer has had some bad injuries it seems he has not fully recovered from.

Also, Umtiti is the #2 CB in the world behind VVD, and I wouldn't be surprised to see Barcelona keep two clean sheets in this round.

I agree about Neuer. Since his big injury, he just seems slower a wee bit, which leads to some insecure reactions.
MatS would be my #1 pick atm.

...

And VVD - and I'm a VVD believer - is getting a bit too much noise right now.
Liverpool plays a much more defensive system compared to the first half of last season, it's set up to have their CBs succeed (all 4 have looked good or great), though he's definitely world class and one of the very best.

But I don't know if I'd call him THE BEST.
He's won exactly nothing and has been "a thing" for a year. In a world where Sergio Ramos is still in his prime, where Varane plays, etc... I dunno.
Those two won 4 CLs in 5 years playing in a system that basically has them on defending counters 10 times a game. Not to mention both are also WC champions and played integral parts in their teams winning it. One bad year for Madrid and suddenly people act like the player playing there are scrubs.

 

[Savant]

I agree about Neuer. Since his big injury, he just seems slower a wee bit, which leads to some insecure reactions.
MatS would be my #1 pick atm.

...

And VVD - and I'm a VVD believer - is getting a bit too much noise right now.
Liverpool plays a much more defensive system compared to the first half of last season, it's set up to have their CBs succeed (all 4 have looked good or great), though he's definitely world class and one of the very best.

But I don't know if I'd call him THE BEST.
He's won exactly nothing and has been "a thing" for a year. In a world where Sergio Ramos is still in his prime, where Varane plays, etc... I dunno.
Those two won 4 CLs in 5 years playing in a system that basically has them on defending counters 10 times a game. Not to mention both are also WC champions and played integral parts in their teams winning it. One bad year for Madrid and suddenly people act like the player playing there are scrubs.

I dont know if you can hold winning nothing against Virgil when he spent 3 years on Southampton. If you want to omit his Celtic wins that is. Ramos spend most of his careers on Madrid. Virgil has only been on Liverpool a year and a half. Madrid was a winner without Ramos and went into a ready made team. Liverpool are in position to win, because of Virgil.

 

[Live in the Now]

RM, to take nothing away from how much they won, also gave up an absolute load of goals.

 

[Il Mediano]

The best keeper is obviously Robin Olsen.

 

[Corto]

Madrid was a winner without Ramos and went into a ready made team.

Yes and no.
Madrid were in a transition period between the Galacticos of the early 2000's and what would become the Ronaldo Madrid.
Ramos was definitely there for the building of that Madrid squad and was a corner stone to it, didn't just come into a winning team and take over from some guy or other.

RM, to take nothing away from how much they won, also gave up an absolute load of goals.

They did. But they also played stupidly offensive football, which was why they broke all sorts of records under Zidane. It was fun to watch them, they were historically successful, and they usually ended up giving up less goals than they scored - largely thanks to Ramos and Varane.

Dude's won everything (also had the luck to be born a Spaniard and play in a stupidly gifted generation that won 3 major titles), has countless individual awards (for a reason) and is still on top of his game.

...

In the end, doesn't matter.
Virgil IS a fantastic player, one of the very best, I agree.

 

[Savant]

Yes and no.
Madrid were in a transition period between the Galacticos of the early 2000's and what would become the Ronaldo Madrid.
Ramos was definitely there for the building of that Madrid squad and was a corner stone to it, didn't just come into a winning team and take over from some guy or other.



They did. But they also played stupidly offensive football, which was why they broke all sorts of records under Zidane. It was fun to watch them, they were historically successful, and they usually ended up giving up less goals than they scored - largely thanks to Ramos and Varane.

Dude's won everything (also had the luck to be born a Spaniard and play in a stupidly gifted generation that won 3 major titles), has countless individual awards (for a reason) and is still on top of his game.

...

In the end, doesn't matter.
Virgil IS a fantastic player, one of the very best, I agree.

That's fair, but also you cant compare Madrid to Southampton on a metric of capacity to win trophies

 

[les Habs]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Barcelona keep two clean sheets in this round.

I'm not saying we will, but it's definitely possible and it's not just down to the defense. The midfield and how much possession we have will play a role.

 

[Live in the Now]

That's fair, but also you cant compare Madrid to Southampton on a metric of capacity to win trophies

The problem is that VVD took the long road to the top because of his time as a youth player. He wasn't ever supposed to get this far and because of that, he's nearly 28 and only now playing at this level. It is incredible that a bigger club didn't buy him off Celtic in the first place.

 

[YNWA14]

And VVD - and I'm a VVD believer - is getting a bit too much noise right now.
Liverpool plays a much more defensive system compared to the first half of last season, it's set up to have their CBs succeed (all 4 have looked good or great), though he's definitely world class and one of the very best.

Just to be clear this isn't really true either. Matip and Lovren both have been very shaky (Matip in particular is a pretty scary defender at times). Gomez is just a fantastic defender/talent, and van Dijk has completely transformed not only the backline but the way the midfield plays as well. Yes, Klopp has taken a more pragmatic approach this season, but that's something he's been able to do largely because of van Dijk...he deserves every bit of praise he's received this season, if not more.

 

[Corto]

Just to be clear this isn't really true either. Matip and Lovren both have been very shaky (Matip in particular is a pretty scary defender at times). Gomez is just a fantastic defender/talent, and van Dijk has completely transformed not only the backline but the way the midfield plays as well. Yes, Klopp has taken a more pragmatic approach this season, but that's something he's been able to do largely because of van Dijk...he deserves every bit of praise he's received this season, if not more.

I think Matip's done great. Yeah, he had two shots on his own goal in the Bayern tie - both difficult situations - and other than that he's been solid.
Lovren's had one bad game in over a year, he's been stellar.
Even Fabinho/Matip looked competent vs Bayern (not that Bayern took many chances going forward, but still)...
My point isn't to slag Virgil or anything, I'm just saying that Liverpool's system is much more CB-friendly, setting them up for success, compared to the system that was played in Madrid over the years.

That said, I agree, Virgil is the reason why it all went from good to great and is a huge reason why they look so solid defensively.

EDIT: I also agree with the other guys, and you're right, comparing trophies isn't the best measuring stick (or a good one) seeing how VVD's route went.

But my point was more to show that people are writing off Ramos and Varane after one bad year rather than to "blame" Virgil for his lack of trophies.