GWT: Champions League Quarterfinals Reaction

[Evilo]

I mean, everyone thought Kovacic was great despite small sample size and he is average. It goes both ways.

Also, out of curiosity can Pepe play LW? Not relevant to the better than debate, but want to know

Can play all 3 forward positions.

 

[Ajacied]

BTW, I forgot his name, but the ref that whistled the Juve - Ajax game did a great job.

 

[Evilo]

Turpin.

 

[Pouchkine]

So?

The 'quality of competition' argument is completely redundant when you're referring to clubs in the CL knockout stages. Even the weakest teams you encounter at that level are still very good. It's an overused argument in general, apparently there's only about five teams in the world worth scoring against.

This Porto team was very weak, just like Schalke, had an easy group and an easy last round. Still Mane is playing great though and is very fun to watch... Decent but not great teams still can advance from weaker groups.

 

[Power Man]

I rarely play Fifa these days. Only when I am with friends, but I prefer Bayer Leverkussen.

Ajax are horrible in Fifa I think. Just very weak physically it seems and not in the least bit as quick as in real life. Ajax is more fun to play with in FM (or Fifa career mode). They have a bunch of wonderkids popping up each season.

I beat Barcelona 7-0 with Ajax yesterday in FIFA lol
The key with Ajax is quick passing- timing has to be on point though
They move well without the ball

 

[koyvoo]

 

[maclean]

I don´t think Spurs are paper favourites.

Whatever you think, that's how the meia's going to cast it, that's why I put it in quotes. The PL team'll always be favouite over some youngbloods, whatever the reality is. Maybe if it were like Watford, they'd earn official underdog status, but it is what it is.

 

[Gecklund]

This is a take.

I mean it’s not wrong.

 

[YNWA14]

I mean it’s not wrong.

Yeah it isn't comparable at all. Sakho was never on the level of Mane, and nobody was proclaiming van Dijk being better than Sakho before he'd even played a game at the top level (even though he probably was better anyway).

 

[Stray Wasp]

View attachment 217231

That picture made me smile.

Mind, another thing that makes me smile is the idea of what a Man United fan's face would look like if you suggested that Sir David might have been allowed another two and a half years at Old Trafford and given a further £450 million or so to spend.

I presume it's been mentioned elsewhere, but it occurred to me this morning that, having previously said Guardiola's time at City would be deemed a disappointment unless he conquered the Champions League, I hadn't paid attention to a curious point about his current squad - the shortage of players who've previously won the trophy.

Contrast with the start of the decade when City's goal was simply to win the EPL - they splashed out on a fair few players who'd achieved league titles with one club or another - Horrible Nigel De Jong had landed the title in Holland, Dzeko in Germany, while Toure and Tevez had carried off the league and European Cup elsewhere, not to forget Balotelli in Italy. Even Hargreaves and Kolo Toure brought experience of winning to the important task of parking their arses on the subs bench and collecting vast amounts of money.

Maybe City's problem is that, for all their talent, in European terms they need a couple more players who can say, 'been there, won that' rather than expecting pretty much everyone to acquire the winning habit at that level together. (If you want to sound the 'veteran grit' klaxon I can merely offer a shrug).

 

[spintheblackcircle]

Whatever you think, that's how the meia's going to cast it, that's why I put it in quotes. The PL team'll always be favouite over some youngbloods, whatever the reality is. Maybe if it were like Watford, they'd earn official underdog status, but it is what it is.

Looks like the odds to win it all are close to this:

Barcelona +150
Liverpool +240
Spurs +400
Ajax +450

 

[les Habs]

Where are the Pep fanboys?

No fanboy here, but I'll be your Huckleberry.

I still can't believe Spurs are in the semis of the CL before Pep could take any team sans Messi to the final (and hasn't made the semis with City even with somewhat favourable draws in Spurs and Monaco) despite his outlay, the level of the teams he's been coaching, and their domestic dominance.

EDIT: Forgot that he did make the semis with Bayern each time. My b. I was thinking of his lack of finals streak.

You do realize you can either delete your post or simply edit it out completely right? Lack of finals streak indeed.

You lot can disagree with me all you want

We already know that mate.

If United was smart, they’d whack Ole and throw the money truck at Poch this summer.

Yeah, that'd be smart. Sack the manager you just hired, who had a tougher opponent in the same round of the CL and who convincingly beat the manager you want to "throw the money truck at", away no less. Not to mention the following:

• When Solskjaer took over they were 13 points behind Spurs and are now only 3 points behind.
• Since Solskjaer took over they have 10 more points than Spurs along with a better goal differential, more goals scored and fewer goals allowed.
• Since Solskjaer took over they have third best record in the Premiership with City at 40 points, Liverpool at 39 points and United at 38 points followed by Arsenal at 32 points, Chelsea at 29 points and Spurs at 28 points.

 

[Live in the Now]

Looks like the odds to win it all are close to this:

Barcelona +150
Liverpool +240
Spurs +400
Ajax +450

That sounds about right although I'd have Barcelona and Liverpool much closer if I was a bookie. The (likely very large) amount of Liverpool bets to come in makes those odds quite bad.

Anyway, as bad as things got for a while there, this could be Liverpool's fourth CL final in the last 15 years if the team advances. To be honest this means as much to me as the league, I want the team to win a big trophy, period. I've been careful not to let my mind wander, but I can't wait to see these games. Both teams have the ability to not just win but to put the other team to the sword. As far as two legged ties go it doesn't get better. I think every fan is quite aware of the potential of what could happen and is looking forward to it regardless.

 

[les Habs]

That picture made me smile.

Mind, another thing that makes me smile is the idea of what a Man United fan's face would look like if you suggested that Sir David might have been allowed another two and a half years at Old Trafford and given a further £450 million or so to spend.

I presume it's been mentioned elsewhere, but it occurred to me this morning that, having previously said Guardiola's time at City would be deemed a disappointment unless he conquered the Champions League, I hadn't paid attention to a curious point about his current squad - the shortage of players who've previously won the trophy.

Contrast with the start of the decade when City's goal was simply to win the EPL - they splashed out on a fair few players who'd achieved league titles with one club or another - Horrible Nigel De Jong had landed the title in Holland, Dzeko in Germany, while Toure and Tevez had carried off the league and European Cup elsewhere, not to forget Balotelli in Italy. Even Hargreaves and Kolo Toure brought experience of winning to the important task of parking their arses on the subs bench and collecting vast amounts of money.

Maybe City's problem is that, for all their talent, in European terms they need a couple more players who can say, 'been there, won that' rather than expecting pretty much everyone to acquire the winning habit at that level together. (If you want to sound the 'veteran grit' klaxon I can merely offer a shrug).

That's interesting because that picture made me laugh. One of those cases where it's actually worse to have posted such a graphic than to have created it I'd say. And as lame as it is, it's even worse considering the fact that City's net spend since Guardiola became manager (and not Director of Football it probably should be noted) is closer to 363 pounds. Then of course there's no mention of City's Premiership title win last season and the two League Cups (I know) to go along with the fact they're leading the league this season. Should they do a domestic treble this season, or simply add the league, despite the outlay it's still a good return. Yes the Champions League should be considered a disappointment, but there's context there as well considering they went out to a Finalist and two Semifinalists, the most recent of which barely went through on the away goals rule.

To your point about a lack of winners though, I think there's something to that. City's title last season aside, they still have some "proven winners" in the side. Aguero, Bernardo Silva, Mendy, David Silva, Gundogan and Mahrez all have some significant wins on their respective resumes. However the role they played in those wins should be noted and a couple of those guys for me weren't so convincing in that regard. Still for me there's room to add a few more "proven winners" and some better examples at that, but with Guardiola at the helm I don't think it's as important. I think the bigger problem is for the money spent on this squad they're still lacking some serious quality in a couple of key areas, most notably in the center of midfield and in the center of the defense. Players like Gundogan and Laporte for example aren't players you want to be relying on as starters in the Premiership much less the CL, and at a combined total of about 80 million pounds, which is about 15% of even @koyvoo 's laughable figure, is pretty bad. Still Guardiola has won a league in very impression fashion and is leading a league again this season. The fact that they're as good as they are has more than a lot to do with his skill as a manager. A talented side to be sure, but very few if any managers would be getting that return out of this side in the same circumstances.

 

[Gecklund]

Yeah, that'd be smart. Sack the manager you just hired, who had a tougher opponent in the same round of the CL and who convincingly beat the manager you want to "throw the money truck at", away no less. Not to mention the following:

• When Solskjaer took over they were 13 points behind Spurs and are now only 3 points behind.
• Since Solskjaer took over they have 10 more points than Spurs along with a better goal differential, more goals scored and fewer goals allowed.
• Since Solskjaer took over they have third best record in the Premiership with City at 40 points, Liverpool at 39 points and United at 38 points followed by Arsenal at 32 points, Chelsea at 29 points and Spurs at 28 points.

Yeah I agree I feel like OGS needs a lot more time to really cement his place. He should be given at least summer. Right now we have a team from 3 managers. Wait until we get OGS targets. If the board backs him and we get a CB, RB, and RW this summer and get rid of some of the deadweight. I’ll be happy. Obviously we need a lot more but one step at a time.

Yeah it isn't comparable at all. Sakho was never on the level of Mane, and nobody was proclaiming van Dijk being better than Sakho before he'd even played a game at the top level (even though he probably was better anyway).

I mean I agree it’s not really comparable because no one was comparing them and it seems like a much lower level (or so we thought). I don’t really think anyone thought VVD was gonna be this good where as lots of people think Pepe will be great.

 

[Chimaera]

No fanboy here, but I'll be your Huckleberry.



You do realize you can either delete your post or simply edit it out completely right? Lack of finals streak indeed.



We already know that mate.



Yeah, that'd be smart. Sack the manager you just hired, who had a tougher opponent in the same round of the CL and who convincingly beat the manager you want to "throw the money truck at", away no less. Not to mention the following:

• When Solskjaer took over they were 13 points behind Spurs and are now only 3 points behind.
• Since Solskjaer took over they have 10 more points than Spurs along with a better goal differential, more goals scored and fewer goals allowed.
• Since Solskjaer took over they have third best record in the Premiership with City at 40 points, Liverpool at 39 points and United at 38 points followed by Arsenal at 32 points, Chelsea at 29 points and Spurs at 28 points.

I happily admit it was a bit of a hot take. I think some of the Ole stats might need to be updated to reflect a bit of the last few matches as it does seem the honeymoon is over.

I mean, he’s done a great job, but if you would rather him than Poch, I don’t know what to tell you. I realize firing a manager they just extended looks bad, and there’s basically no chance they do. But I do think they might regret the decision.

 

[les Habs]

I happily admit it was a bit of a hot take. I think some of the Ole stats might need to be updated to reflect a bit of the last few matches as it does seem the honeymoon is over.

I mean, he’s done a great job, but if you would rather him than Poch, I don’t know what to tell you. I realize firing a manager they just extended looks bad, and there’s basically no chance they do. But I do think they might regret the decision.

The last few matches are 100% reflected in my post. And from the chants I could hear I would say the honeymoon is far from over.

What has Pochettino won? He just got through the QFs on the away goals rule and some luck too boot. And regretting Solskjaer at some point doesn't have to have anything to do with Pochettino nor should it.

 

[JJ68]

Messi on a mission. Unstoppable.

 

[Stray Wasp]

Still Guardiola has won a league in very impression fashion and is leading a league again this season. The fact that they're as good as they are has more than a lot to do with his skill as a manager. A talented side to be sure, but very few if any managers would be getting that return out of this side in the same circumstances.

No doubt, in terms of their performance over the last two seasons of the EPL, City's form is astonishing (I know Liverpool fans have posted previously about historic points totals achieved by past EPL winners / runners-up, but it bears stressing that to date only Mourinho's machine-like Chelsea team of 04-06 has managed consecutive 90-point seasons - indeed 90 points is a barrier only one side breached during the three 42-game campaigns between 1992 and 95 - and City will only fail to pass that figure in the event of a slump even the most optimistic Scouser wouldn't dare dream of.)

I'll confess I've become so accustomed to the fact of City spending extravagantly that it passed me by how little business they'd done last summer (also, a rather more northerly club's parsimony was foremost in my mind). And easy as hindsight is, if they were going to spend big on a 27-year old (the age at which you expect an instant, collective-enhancing return), perhaps it should have been someone with a more imposing Champions League history than Mahrez, and someone who plays in a more central role. Granted, such players don't grow on trees.

City's core of players in the 23-28 age range means their window is a long time from closing - indeed, how Guardiola ushers a lot of those talents into their nominal peak years will make or break their hopes of winning the European Cup. I'm unsure anyone would argue your point about their need to upgrade in the centre of defence and midfield, which is another way of saying that they've thus far failed to find younger, like-for-like players convincingly to replace Kompany and Fernandinho. Meanwhile, formidable as Aguero remains, he's approaching his 31st birthday - the age at which received wisdom has it strikers often begin to fade. So more money does indeed need spending before dry rot sets in.

In short, counterintuitive as it is to call such a team so expensively-assembled, and within a shout of retaining a domestic championship a work in progress, I suppose that's the fairest description. I agree that in European terms it's unlikely they'd be better off with a different coach (rather falling short in a different style). But even if City can't win the Champions League next season, I'd repeat a point I made before the second leg - at the very least I think they need a signature win in the knockout stages rather than flat-track bullying lame ducks before tripping over the first moderately complex obstacle that comes in sight. After all, demanding anything else of Guardiola really would represent treating him as if he were on the level of Sir David Moyes.

 

[Havre]

City´s "window" mainly depends on FFP and how much money they are allowed to spend.

If they have to replace Kompany, Fernandinho, Silva and Aguero like a normal club they could easily find themselves among the mortal. Doesn´t mean they will become average of course, but the way they have gone about it so far is quite ridiculous. Buy defenders for 100m+ one summer. Didn´t like them so spent 100m+ on defenders the summer after as well.

De Bruyne, Sterling and B. Silva is a nice start. But they would need a lot more from their future "core" to dominate England like they have. Europe is a bit more random as Spurs and Ajax have shown this year - and many others before them. Of course a City team with De Bruyne, Sterling, B. Silva etc. could win the CL even without the four mentioned "old" players some time in the future.

 

[Pouchkine]

Pep can't win without Messi!!! Messi can't win without Barcelona!!! Nothing new there.

 

[Stray Wasp]

Pep can't win without Messi!!! Messi can't win without Barcelona!!!

It's early yet.

 

[Pouchkine]

Early? Not many chances left for Messi and Pep it's been what 6-7 years of failures in a row?

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Who’s Barca? Xavi,iniesta, puyol?

Mind you no one should take his posts serious just for comic relief.

 

[YNWA14]

It's really strange how Messi doesn't lose a step but all his teammates when playing for Argentina seem to play 2 levels worse. It's like a curse almost.