Player Discussion Thomas Chabot (D) Extended 8 years 8M AAV

[bert]

Boston's highest paid player has a 7.25 aav.
[mod]

And another one.

Another terrific cherry pick. A team that just bridged a player to avoid paying him while the rest of their stars were signed 4 plus years ago.

Ottawa is the outlier they refuse to pay bonus money. They just lost 3 stars because of it. No other teams are doing that. They pay up. That was an unprecedented amount of talent leaving in its prime 1 year removed from the ECF. The sens were lucky Chabot wants to be cmose to home and had to slightly over pay up front to get Chabot done.

Ottawa is clearly the outlier right now.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

I don't understand why some are in a rush to pay massive bonuses. Good for the players but very few teams can afford to play that game long term, hence why Toronto is an outlier because they can afford to get bent over and Tampa saves a lot of money thanks to their very favourable income tax context so they pay a lot in bonus money.

 

[bert]

I don't understand why some are in a rush to pay massive bonuses. Good for the players but very few teams can afford to play that game long term, hence why Toronto is an outlier because they can afford to get bent over and Tampa saves a lot of money thanks to their very favourable income tax context so they pay a lot in bonus money.

Toronto isnt the only team paying bonus money though. Tampa has done it with several players.

 

[Sensung]

Boston's highest paid player has a 7.25 aav.

Signing bonus by team for 19-20 from capfriendly.
Toronto 69M
Sharks 31M
Vancouver 30.5M
Washington 28M
Stars 25.5M
Rangers 25M
Tampa 24M
Habs 18M
Chicago 18M
Flyers 16.5M
Kings 16M
Preds 15M
Florida 14.5M
Isles 14M
Oilers 13M
Boston 13M
Vegas 13M
Canes 12M

18 teams with more than 10M in signing bonuses. The Leafs are an outlier, but the market is being set by the majority of teams, including the Bruins.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I don't think anyone wants to pay huge bonuses, but it's the new trend. And players are just as competitive off the ice as they are on it. It drifts into the whole pride and ego thing among players to get what you're worth and keep up with your comparables.

And when we have a history of lockouts over the last 20 years when a new CBA needs to happen....most guys simply aren't willing to lose a full season salary if they can work around it in a contract. And it really felt like a lockout was on the horizon over the past year or two.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Toronto isnt the only team paying bonus money though. Tampa has done it with several players.

The point isn't bonus, the point is massive bonuses. Toronto can afford to pay out something ludicrous like 50 million dollars in one day, Tampa can also afford big bonus since they get a "rebate" on total contract dollars thanks to no income tax.

We paid Heatley bonus money, we pay Ryan bonus money. I'm not saying we shouldn't pay bonus, no one is. The problem is the growth of the bonus rates and those are backed by outliers like Toronto, Tampa and Nashville. If those outliers dictate what other teams must pay in terms of bonus rates, if they set the market, then it will collapse.

The NHL needs teams that get players to understand that the crazy contracts agents get from behind Dubas over or get thanks to absolutely insane state tax laws are not the standard.

 

[Sensung]

The point isn't bonus, the point is massive bonuses. Toronto can afford to pay out something ludicrous like 50 million dollars in one day, Tampa can also afford big bonus since they get a "rebate" on total contract dollars thanks to no income tax.

We paid Heatley bonus money, we pay Ryan bonus money. I'm not saying we shouldn't pay bonus, no one is. The problem is the growth of the bonus rates and those are backed by outliers like Toronto, Tampa and Nashville. If those outliers dictate what other teams must pay in terms of bonus rates, if they set the market, then it will collapse.

Toronto 69M
Sharks 31M
Vancouver 30.5M
Washington 28M
Stars 25.5M
Rangers 25M
Tampa 24M
Habs 18M
Chicago 18M
Flyers 16.5M
Kings 16M
Preds 15M

11 teams spend more on bonuses than the Preds.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Toronto 69M
Sharks 31M
Vancouver 30.5M
Washington 28M
Stars 25.5M
Rangers 25M
Tampa 24M
Habs 18M
Chicago 18M
Flyers 16.5M
Kings 16M
Preds 15M

11 teams spend more on bonuses than the Preds.

I just chose the Predators because they also are in a no income tax state... Do try to follow if you are going to insta quote me.

It is a complex situation. Again, I'm not saying we shouldn't pay any bonus ever.

 

[Sensung]

I just chose the Predators because they also are in a no income tax state... Do try to follow if you are going to insta quote me.

It is a complex situation. Again, I'm not saying we shouldn't pay any bonus ever.

Add Florida at 14.5M.

Perhaps we should move the signing bonus issue to a separate thread instead of going somewhat off topic.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

They will lose players if they try to set the market and not budge. If its the market standard, it makes it pretty tough to cross your arms and say no without any flexibility. Same goes for things like trade protection.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Two good signings, this one being great on and off the ice especially.

Man I’m looking forward to more long term deals for the rest of the core as they come up. I love how all of the contract talks are being done behind closed doors, next to no news at all.

We went through a summer of “having trouble signing White” and “losing Chabot to an offersheet”, so this is a nice piece of mind for fans, much needed.

I know the fear will simply move on to the next guy that needs signing, for now, but this gives a nice shine of hope for the team, management, and players, and makes long term deals for guys like BT (and whomever else steps up to join the core) more than simply wishful thinking.

I dislike massive singing bonuses and the idea that the biggest budget teams get to set the market. This is another deal that shows that this isn’t always the case, and that these players are people at the end of the day. Some want every single dollar they can squeeze out of the league, team be damned, and some put their team and wanting to be a part of something long term at the top of the list, along with contracts.

Perhaps this is part of the character element that our team seems to covet.

 

[Sensung]

Hey mods, can we have a budget/salary cap thread please?

It would be great to be able to discuss those extremely important issues in dedicated threads, as opposed to derailing threads with off topic posts.

Thanks.

 

[DueDiligence]

Signing bonus by team for 19-20 from capfriendly.
Toronto 69M
Sharks 31M
Vancouver 30.5M
Washington 28M
Stars 25.5M
Rangers 25M
Tampa 24M
Habs 18M
Chicago 18M
Flyers 16.5M
Kings 16M
Preds 15M
Florida 14.5M
Isles 14M
Oilers 13M
Boston 13M
Vegas 13M
Canes 12M

18 teams with more than 10M in signing bonuses. The Leafs are an outlier, but the market is being set by the majority of teams, including the Bruins.

The Leafs are paying out over 5 times the amount of bonuses than the Bruins and more than double the 2nd place team. They are the outlier.

 

[Sensung]

The Leafs are paying out over 5 times the amount of bonuses than the Bruins and more than double the 2nd place team. They are the outlier.

They are the outlier on the spend side.

The Sens are the outlier on the "have other teams pay your bonus and spend well under the cap floor in real dollars" side.

 

[BondraTime]

The Leafs are paying out over 5 times the amount of bonuses than the Bruins and more than double the 2nd place team. They are the outlier.

The Leafs also had 3 star RFA's due contracts within 10 months of each other, as well as a superstar UFA. No other team had more than a single star RFA to sign. The Leafs are an outlier because they are the only team that had to re-up more than a single star.

They would be the highest bonus spending team regardless, but comparing a team that had to sign Nylander, Marner, Matthews and Tavares from July 1st 2018-today, and signed the all to 5-8 years in length, and a team that had to sign Charlie McAvoy and Brandon Carlo in the same time frame seems foolish. If the Bruins had to re-up Bergeron, Marchand and then get a big UFA, I'd think they would be up way higher on the list.

I'd think most teams signing stars like Marner and Matthews would be paying out big bonuses. The Leafs signed 4 guys like that, at a time where bonuses have become a big sticking point.

No team has had to sign guys like the Leafs have had to in this time frame. Not even close. The closest is the Rangers with Trouba and Panarin, who are making 21 million in signing bonuses this season. Stars being signed within the last year have had big bonus options, no other team has signed, or had as many RFA stars as the Leafs.

The Leafs are always going to be able to spend big money, and up front. They will always have the highest offers. But, the Leafs are not always going to have 3 RFA's who have become stars up for contract within a year, and then be able to sign a franchise UFA on July 1st. That whole situation is an outlier.

 

[Sensung]

The Leafs also had 3 star RFA's due contracts within 10 months of each other, as well as a superstar UFA. No other team had more than a single star RFA to sign. The Leafs are an outlier because they are the only team that had to re-up more than a single star.

They would be the highest bonus spending team regardless, but comparing a team that had to sign Nylander, Marner, Matthews and Tavares from July 1st 2018-today, and signed the all to 5-8 years in length, and a team that had to sign Charlie McAvoy and Brandon Carlo in the same time frame seems foolish. If the Bruins had to re-up Bergeron, Marchand and then get a big UFA, I'd think they would be up way higher on the list.

I'd think most teams signing stars like Marner and Matthews would be paying out big bonuses. The Leafs signed 4 guys like that, at a time where bonuses have become a big sticking point.

No team has had to sign guys like the Leafs have had to in this time frame. Not even close. The closest is the Rangers with Trouba and Panarin, who are making 21 million in signing bonuses this season. Stars being signed within the last year have had big bonus options, no other team has signed, or had as many RFA stars as the Leafs.

The Leafs are always going to be able to spend big money, and up front. They will always have the highest offers. But, the Leafs are not always going to have 3 RFA's who have become stars up for contract within a year, and then be able to sign a franchise UFA on July 1st. That whole situation is an outlier.

Great post.

It was a very unique situation.

 

[Sensung]

Brady's brother just signed.

Year 1 4M signing bonus.
Year 2 3.5M signing bonus.

 

[BonkTastic]

Joel Edmundson's new locker nameplate in Carolina is pretty great:

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Joel Edmundson's new locker nameplate in Carolina is pretty great:

LOL- awesome

 

[BondraTime]

Joel Edmundson's new locker nameplate in Carolina is pretty great:

Carolina have had the best PR and marketing in the league over the past year, and I'm one who s not a fan of their after game stuff

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Joel Edmundson's new locker nameplate in Carolina is pretty great:

jerks

 

[Spartachat]

Signing bonus by team for 19-20 from capfriendly.
Toronto 69M
Sharks 31M
Vancouver 30.5M
Washington 28M
Stars 25.5M
Rangers 25M
Tampa 24M
Habs 18M
Chicago 18M
Flyers 16.5M
Kings 16M
Preds 15M
Florida 14.5M
Isles 14M
Oilers 13M
Boston 13M
Vegas 13M
Canes 12M

18 teams with more than 10M in signing bonuses. The Leafs are an outlier, but the market is being set by the majority of teams, including the Bruins.

If a team can get cheap short-term financing, then signing bonuses are not a big problem. Massively front-loading contracts is a bigger problem as it would require longer term financing. There is also a chance you would trade the player before their low earning years of the contract.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

The Leafs also had 3 star RFA's due contracts within 10 months of each other, as well as a superstar UFA. No other team had more than a single star RFA to sign. The Leafs are an outlier because they are the only team that had to re-up more than a single star.

They would be the highest bonus spending team regardless, but comparing a team that had to sign Nylander, Marner, Matthews and Tavares from July 1st 2018-today, and signed the all to 5-8 years in length, and a team that had to sign Charlie McAvoy and Brandon Carlo in the same time frame seems foolish. If the Bruins had to re-up Bergeron, Marchand and then get a big UFA, I'd think they would be up way higher on the list.

I'd think most teams signing stars like Marner and Matthews would be paying out big bonuses. The Leafs signed 4 guys like that, at a time where bonuses have become a big sticking point.

No team has had to sign guys like the Leafs have had to in this time frame. Not even close. The closest is the Rangers with Trouba and Panarin, who are making 21 million in signing bonuses this season. Stars being signed within the last year have had big bonus options, no other team has signed, or had as many RFA stars as the Leafs.

The Leafs are always going to be able to spend big money, and up front. They will always have the highest offers. But, the Leafs are not always going to have 3 RFA's who have become stars up for contract within a year, and then be able to sign a franchise UFA on July 1st. That whole situation is an outlier.

Unique situation that was taken advantage of by the agents who knew that Dubas had to cave to pressure before their clients did.

This whole "no that's the oulier" is ridiculous. I used the word "outlier" in the context of NHL teams not being anywhere near the same financial footing, that having the outliers, in terms of financial ability, set the market can only end in spectacular failure.

Not trying to single you out here Bondra, you are absolutely right that what the Sens just did is insane and in uncharted waters. It's just that using the same word to talk about something completely different (the unwillingness to spend on top of limited ability to of the Senators) seems silly. It makes me feel like you are saying that claiming that Toronto and Tampa are outliers, in terms of financial clout, is wrong and that is preposterous.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

We don't give Chabot enough credit or appreciation. Kid is a stud. By far our best player.

 

[aragorn]

We don't give Chabot enough credit or appreciation. Kid is a stud. By far our best player.

Agreed, but he has to learn to manage the puck a little bit better & learn the KISS principle. He takes a few too many risks with the puck especially when he is the last guy back & tries to beat players & if he loses the puck .... it leads to a breakaway against.