central scouting mid terms

[Seachd]

Strange that Michal Gulasi isn't ranked.

 

[Vlad The Impaler]

hmm, that's quite a bit.

I'd have thought that a team might see the average player play something like 5-15 times per season, and with that kind of sample, it stands to reason that each of the 30 teams will see him on a different "average" game.

And that's even if all teams evaluate talent in an identical manner, which would be a bizarre assumption IMO

Well, I doubt most organizations get to see a player 33 times, that's for sure. And really, while I think the more viewings the better the read, at one point this is just wasting your scouting ressources.

Many teams in the past have drafted guys that they saw once or twice, tops. And I suspect that still takes place sometimes. The top guys can get many looks in tournaments. Then you have to divide your scouts to see the rest of the prospects.

The logistic that goes into this and the costs prohibits 33 viewings in most cases. 33 viewings is an exception, far from the rule.

5-7 games well spread out usually give you a fairly accurate look. And the better you are/the more experience you have, the quicker you can make up your mind on a player. You'll still make mistakes from time to time, though. Pro scouts must be used to those difficult circumstances. There are players who rise late in the season and teams rush to get a limited look on them. You just have to make up your mind a little quicker.

 

[speeds]

5-7 games well spread out usually give you a fairly accurate look. And the better you are/the more experience you have, the quicker you can make up your mind on a player. You'll still make mistakes from time to time, though. Pro scouts must be used to those difficult circumstances. There are players who rise late in the season and teams rush to get a limited look on them. You just have to make up your mind a little quicker.

One can give a player a reasonable look, and it might well be accurate and might not. But this is a large part of I believe what accounts for a significant difference in opinion between the scouting lists team to team. If I see Bobby Ryan play 7 times, and 29 other scouts see him play 7 times, there's a pretty good statistical chance that those 7 game samples will have one or two or three outliers, both ways, in terms of seeing ryan on good days or bad days. Even if we are 30 identical scouts, I'll bet we won't all have him ranked at the same spots on our lists.

 

[montreal]

I know the Habs scouts saw Kostitsyn play over 40 times before drafting him.


As for the list, it makes for interesting reading. One guy I think is overlooked is goalie Joe Fallon, who's putting up solid numbers as a freshman.

 

[Vlad The Impaler]

I know the Habs scouts saw Kostitsyn play over 40 times before drafting him..

Over how long?

 

[Hiishawk]

Why is it so strange that Kopitar is #1 from Europe? There is no clear cut #1 guy from Europe this year and Kopitar is as good as I've seen from the Euro 2005 class. He's very close to Bobby Ryan in skill (and style!) from what I've seen.

Bergfors is a little flashier right now but we're talking a 5 inch 25 lb difference too. Kopitar also has not had as much exposure to elite opposition as Bergfors (although he he is now- and doing well!)- which means that his upside is tremendous.

 

[montreal]

Over how long?

Don't know. Before being drafted, he only played in Russia during his draft year. Before that he played in the EEHL. I don't know how much of him they saw while he was in the EEHL as a 16 year old, but I'm guessing it wouldn't be a whole lot. They likely saw a lot of him throughout various international tournaments and in Russia.

 

[Riddarn]

Why is it so strange that Kopitar is #1 from Europe? There is no clear cut #1 guy from Europe this year and Kopitar is as good as I've seen from the Euro 2005 class. He's very close to Bobby Ryan in skill (and style!) from what I've seen.

Bergfors is a little flashier right now but we're talking a 5 inch 25 lb difference too. Kopitar also has not had as much exposure to elite opposition as Bergfors (although he he is now- and doing well!)- which means that his upside is tremendous.

The height of Kopitar is debated http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=117545 in this thread.

 

[AgentNaslund*]

yup, so the listings for myself at the centralscouting official web site. Brule is at 6 and Zapparegan is 27. Which is good. So Vancouver Canucks can take him for good.

for those girls who care, round 2 looks like this.

30 POKULOK, SASHA ECAC CORNELL UNIVERSITY 5/25/1986 6' 5" 220 D L 13 2 6 8 21
2 31 PELECH, MATT OHL SARNIA 9/4/1987 6' 3.5" 220 D R 22 0 3 3 35
2 32 BERTRAM, DAN H-EAST BOSTON COLLEGE 1/14/1987 5' 11" 175 F R 15 6 2 8 20
2 33 FINLEY, JOE USHL SIOUX FALLS 6/29/1987 6' 7" 229 D L 27 0 4 4 88
2 34 BROPHEY, EVAN OHL BELLEVILLE 12/3/1986 6' 1" 195 C,LW L 35 16 27 43 29
2 35 JONES, BLAIR WHL MOOSE JAW 9/27/1986 6' 2" 195 C R 38 7 18 25 46
2 36 DENNY, CHAD QMJHL LEWISTON 3/27/1987 6' 2.5" 210 D L 34 4 10 14 60
2 37 NISKANEN, MATT USHSW VIRGINIA 12/6/1986 6' 0.5" 194 D R
2 38 BASS, CODY OHL MISSISSAUGA 1/7/1987 6' 0" 186 C R 37 5 10 15 53
2 39 KURCEBA, PAUL WHL RED DEER 2/19/1987 6' 1.5" 178 D R 37 3 9 12 61
2 40 TRUKHNO, VIATCHESLAV QMJHL PRINCE EDWARD ISLAND 2/22/1987 6' 1" 196 C L 33 15 23 38 31
2 41 RABBIT, WACEY WHL SASKATOON 11/11/1986 5' 10" 175 C L 38 15 24 39 44
2 42 SMOLENAK, RADEK OHL KINGSTON 12/3/1986 6' 2.5" 190 LW L 35 17 14 31 36
2 43 DRAZENOVIC, NICHOLAS WHL PRINCE GEORGE 1/14/1987 6' 0.5" 178 C L 38 11 21 32 12
2 44 MAY, JEFF WHL PRINCE ALBERT 4/4/1987 6' 1.5" 186 D L 39 3 11 14 44
2 45 HAGEMO, NATHAN WCHA UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA 10/8/1986 5' 11.5" 192 D R 14 1 2 3 14
2 46 MACIAS, RAYMOND WHL KAMLOOPS 9/18/1986 6' 1" 190 D R 39 4 18 22 4
2 47 BAILEY, JASON USA US NAT'L U-18 6/4/1987 6' 0" 205 RW R 25 3 5 8 79
2 48 KUNES, TIMOTHY EJHL NEW ENGLAND 2/12/1987 6' 1" 170 D L 28 4 14 18 30
2 49 HESHMATPOUR, DEVEREAUX OHL OSHAWA 2/2/1987 6' 6" 237 D L 34 1 7 8 121
2 50 STAMLER, BRETTON WHL SEATTLE 3/10/1987 6' 1" 201 D R 36 0 6 6 44
2 51 BARTULIS, OSKARS QMJHL MONCTON 1/21/1987 6' 2" 188 D L 33 2 11 13 32
2 52 HANSON, CHRISTIAN USHL TRI-CITY 3/10/1986 6' 3.5" 196 RW R 31 9 16 25 15
2 53 YANDLE, KEITH USHSE CUSHING ACADEMY 9/9/1986 6' 2" 203 D L
2 54 RYDER, DAN OHL PETERBOROUGH 1/12/1987 5' 10" 193 C R 38 16 25 41 24
2 55 D'AGOSTINI, MATT OHL GUELPH 10/23/1986 5' 11" 170 RW R 36 18 13 31 16
2 56 MCQUAID, ADAM OHL SUDBURY 10/12/1986 6' 3.5" 197 D R 36 1 9 10 48
2 57 BUTLER, CHRIS USHL SIOUX CITY 10/27/1986 6' 1" 178 D L 32 1 12 13 55
2 58 FLATT, DALYN WHL SASKATOON 10/7/1986 6' 3" 215 D L 38 1 9 10 138
2 59 FRASER, MARK OHL KITCHENER

 

[Erack82]

Wow that list is brutal...simply brutal.

Anyways, I'll add my two cents here: Being more familar with NCAA players, I don't get how anyone in their right mind can rank Nathan Davis of Miami higher than T.J. Hensick. No I am not a biased U of M fan, but Hensick is by far the best CCHA prospect out there, if not the best NCAA prospect. I thought for sure he would be ranked at least in the late 1st round or early to mid 2nd round. Wow.

 

[LaLaLaprise]

Very, very big fall for Guillaume Latendresse. He went from a top 10 pick to a 67th ranked prospect in NA!

I also didn't find Stanislav Lascek on the rankings, which I think is quite odd.

As for the European list, I'm suprised to see Sergei Kostsitsyn ranked so high (13th), I thought he would fall under the radar. He's ahead of the likes of Shirokov, Zubov and Korhonen.

There's many familiar family names on the lists like Toivonen, Ryder, Kostsitsyn, Statsny, Pyatt, Zubov, Staal, Sauer, Tuzzolino, Aubin, Gauthier...

Lascek is 2nd year eligible. They dont list him.

 

[Ströba]

Can someone provide me the links with the list from CSB and ISS????

http://www.nhl.com/futures/

 

[Guig]

Clarke MacArthur is eligible ????

4 120 MACARTHUR, CLARKE WHL MEDICINE HAT 4/6/1985 5' 11.5" 180 LW L 70 23 52 75 104

 

[John]

Clarke MacArthur is eligible ????

4 120 MACARTHUR, CLARKE WHL MEDICINE HAT 4/6/1985 5' 11.5" 180 LW L 70 23 52 75 104

That's Peter MacArthur of BU. They have changed it to his name now.

 

[gamblor]

I suspect that listing Clarke MacArthur was a mistake they've since corrected. The pdf file from the NHL site shows player #120 as "Peter MacArthur" from Boston University.

To the person who said they don't list 2nd year eligibles (i.e. Lascek), look no further than 3rd year eligible Danny Syvret at #121.

 

[tuckerdomi]

Here's the first round for NA skaters:

1. CROSBY, SIDNEY
2. POULIOT, BENOIT
3. RYAN, BOBBY
4. BOURDON, LUC
5. JOHNSON, JACK
6. BRULE, GILBERT
7. PARENT, RYAN
8. MCARDLE, KENNDAL
9. SKILLE, JACK
10. LASHOFF, MATT
11. STOA, RYAN
12. SETOGUCHI, DEVIN
13. MIKKELSON, BRENDAN
14. STAAL, MARC
15. DURAND, CHRIS
16. LEE, BRIAN
17. O'MARRA, RYAN
18. KINDL, JAKUB
19. BOURRET, ALEX
20. NEAL, JAMES
21. BLUNDEN, MICHAEL
22. JACKSON, SCOTT
23. COLLINS, DAN
24. DAVIS, PATRICK
25. SAUER, MICHAEL
26. LAWRENCE, CHRIS
27. ZAGRAPAN, MAREK
28. PAQUET, JEAN-PHILIPPE
29. ABDELKADER, JUSTIN
30. POKULOK, SASHA

Wheres Daniel Ryder?

 

[Meat Wave]

Wheres Daniel Ryder?

Ryder is #54 in North American skaters.

 

[Hiishawk]

Strange that Michal Gulasi isn't ranked.

Gulasi is an '85 birthdate. The date written on the WHL website is a typo.

 

[HabLover]

Gulasi is an '85 birthdate. The date written on the WHL website is a typo.

Late '86 on the IIHF website? Says he's an '87 on the WHL site? Who knows?

 

[LeafErikson]

HF use to have a better following of central scoutings records. Now I can't seem to find a good list anywhere. Is there a place on the site where I can go to get a full list, NA, Europe all together?

 

[Ville Isopaa]

HF use to have a better following of central scoutings records. Now I can't seem to find a good list anywhere. Is there a place on the site where I can go to get a full list, NA, Europe all together?

McKeen's has the full lists up.

http://mckeenshockey.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=378421

 

[Joe d]

Chief: I'd take your point one step further and say if look at the various scouting reports around, everyone's got their rankings and their lists. But you what? There's always those big and not so big surprises on draft day, no matter where they're ranked. Case and point, Blake Wheeler. I don't recall seeing Wheeler listed as a first rounder or certainly not a top 10 pick on ANY of the scouting lists.

The only list's that count are the NHL team list's......and those are not made avaliable for the public. I believe Blake Wheeler was on many teams first round list. CSS had him at #17 in the NA Final Ranking....that right there is boderline first round. McKeen's, Red Line etc....could create a scouting report from reading the "Hockey News"..........I can't wait to see who the Blake Wheeler is of the 2005 draft......Kid's like this make it alot more interesting in evaluating and following prospects.....

 

[LovestheO]

How about Phil Oreskovic of the Brampton Battalion? Gets a ton of ice with a decent hockey team.

 

[CSUFBomb]

Vladmir Karpov?

Okay, what's a Vladmir Karpov?

He seems to be quite safely hidden away somewhere in Belarus. I can't find any info on him anywhere, from McKeen's to a Google search. Why does he keep turning up as a high ranker on CSS?

Does anyone have any info on the mysterious Mr. Karpov's style of play and unique skills that keep him high on the CSS ladder?

 

[Draft Guru]

I suspect that listing Clarke MacArthur was a mistake they've since corrected. The pdf file from the NHL site shows player #120 as "Peter MacArthur" from Boston University.

To the person who said they don't list 2nd year eligibles (i.e. Lascek), look no further than 3rd year eligible Danny Syvret at #121.

Or 2nd year eligible Joe Barnes (#78), who opted out of last year.

#78 is way too low for this kid. He could sneak into the late 1st round, but most likely a 2nd rounder. Heard the Rangers took a serious look at him recently, with Sather and Renney interviewing him and video-taping a physical exam and work-out. With three 2nd rounders, would love for them to take him.

What a rebound year he's having, along with the whole Saskatoon organization. Wise move by him, his dad and Brisson to opt out last year.