Is this you saying that Laine maintained the 23%+ he had as of mid November last year and that you think he will maintain the 40% he has been riding through this hot streak?
Cat to the table: Auston Matthews vs Patrik Laine
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Is this you saying that Laine maintained the 23%+ he had as of mid November last year and that you think he will maintain the 40% he has been riding through this hot streak?
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The Winter Soldier
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I really don't care much for the shooting % argument. Laine has proven his detractors wrong so often on this, it's a wonder why they don't give up on this notion and just realize this is not the average Joe muffin shot shooter.
At the end of the year when you look at it. Laine will be near or at 50 goals. And I suspect he will be shooting 18%-19% Which is very much in line of his career shooting % of 18.7%.
ObscureAlien
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its 2018 and we still got people fudging facts about Matthews to put him down. W/e boys have fun in imagination land.
18% is fine. 17 to 20 is what the "detractors" predicted- To be a Stamkos and above level "best shooter in the game". That the mid 20's and above were not sustainable. That the 40+ he's riding over the last month or so is not sustainable.
Fun fact of the day: Having a prediction come to pass is the opposite of being proven wrong.
Simple questions:
A. Yes or No. Did Laine's shooting percentage fall from 23+% during his hottest stretch last year to 17.6 at the end of the ear?
B. Yes or No. Do you think he will maintain the 40+% that has been driving this hot streak?
He doesn't care about numbers until they help him prove a point. I still remember he chose Eichel over Matthews because Eichel got more assists and he likes his centers that distribute the puck instead of ones that score. Because apparently the objective isn't to just put the puck in the net at the end of the day. That 5-10 assist gap was just far too much for Auston to overcome. Goals be damned!
The Winter Soldier
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Fun fact. If you want to continue beating an unsustainable shooting % narrative.
Laine since joining the NHL is on a 44 goal pace over 82 games. A sampling of 143 games. The biggest sample we have. Shooting at 18.7%.
This is what you should be looking at, not cut and pasting segments. Over the long haul he is a player that is quite capable of shooting 18 to 19 %. Again people that are obsessed with shooting % for Laine just fail to realize this is not a muffin shot average player, so I do not understand why people continue to try to beat this shooting % argument to death comparing his shot to the muffin shot average Joe.
The Winter Soldier
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I'm still waiting for yours. Is Laine an average muffin shot Joe as you are trying to link him up as? Or is he not a career 18.7% shooter over 143 games and not the cherry picked segment you picked, that is also playing the best hockey of his 18 and 19 year historic career to pull ahead of Gretzky in most goals as a teenager?
Laine is a great player who is in the middle of a massive hot streak that is not representative of anything? I hope you answer the calls when he goes cold. I know you usually have a habit of running into hiding when things don't go in your favor.
Last season, Laine's shooting % in the slot area(high danger) was 56%. This season, Laine's been shooting more from the slot, which means that his shooting % has been going up - especially lately. In any case, the shooting % comparison you should use is his season shooting % 19.7 vs his career shooting % 18.7. It's slightly higher but within sample size - It's possible that his first season, he shot at a lower rate than expected.
Note that Matthews's 19 shooting % at the time was also assisted by enormous high danger scoring chance ratio. Laine's always had a very low amount of high danger scoring chances, yet he still has scored a higher amount. I performed some maths and using Laine's last season's slot shooting % and Matthews's last season's slot shot amount, Laine would be approaching 150 goals for the season.
That naturally means that Laine's expected to have a significantly higher shooting % than Matthews in relation to their scoring chance quality. Using the sample sizes available to us, which admittedly isn't a whole lot at this point in their careers.
It also means that you have to consider xGF completely differently for both players because Laine's expected to score far more goals with the equal xGF.
Laine fans really don't learn do they? We're talking a 42% shooting during a 16 goal surge in 13 games. No one is calling Laine a 20 goal scorer. He would've gotten to 40 either way but he's not going to shoot this stupid high regardless of where he's shooting from.
BeastoftheEast85
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Voted too close to call. I believe Matthews is a better guy to build around. Elite player who excels at every aspect of the game. The kind of player most cup team need. While Laine is a more prolific player/game breaker. Like comparing Kopitar to Kovalchuk.
He's shooting at 19.7%.
I don't expect him to score 100 goals in a season if that's what you thought.
The point is in using the entire season's sample size up to this point and not picking and choosing a hot streak.
If Laine for example continued shooting at 50% until the end of the season, his shooting % is probably not even going to reach 25%.
Well it's a tough one- to actually dispute what is being said would require attaching his name to statements explicitly:
A- denying a factual and documented occurrence (last year's unsustainable % hot streak ending)
B- predicting something the he knows is hugely unlikely to happen (this years unsustainable % hot streak not ending)
That leaves:
A. Concede the point
B. Agree with the facts but completely ignore the context in an effort to re-frame the initial positions and move the goalposts.
We know the road a 30,000 post fake fan is going to take.
The Winter Soldier
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If you want to be an adult when discussing hockey, refrain yourself from the insults okay? You will not win any arguments with me by throwing them around.
We have heard the unsustainable shooting percentage for Laine the past 2 years. Each year he has proven you and others wrong. He is shooting in the range he has always shot in his 2 seasons as a teenager in the NHL. 18-19%. He is at 41 goals now. Just about where he should be. Now if he maintains this pace he should finish with 47-48 goals this year. So I don't know what you are saying. You expect him to go cold and not shoot 18-19% and finish with 47-48 goals? You seem to be bothered Laine is doing so well, well get used to it. He is 19 and is just starting to hit his best stride as a player.
The Winter Soldier
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Wayne Gretzky in his record setting 92 goal year shot 25%. Modern day Stamkos shot 20% when hit 60 goals.
Lesson, regardless of how good you are or how many goals you score. When you're shooting 42% on a streak covering more than 1/3 of your goals, its a hot streak and not the norm.
Lesson, regardless of how good you are or how many goals you score. When you're shooting 42% on a streak covering more than 1/3 of your goals, its a hot streak and not the norm.
The Winter Soldier
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First off its not an insult. You do run away when things don't go your way.
Secondly no one is saying he's not a consistent 40 goal guy. I'm just saying that hot streaks are followed up for cold streaks. Laine isn't going to keep up his 42% shooting for much longer. No one is arguing about his season shooting % being unsustainable.
It obviously is not the norm or he would score 100 goals in a season.
But what it is is adjustment for the rest of the time, when he wasn't scoring that much.
Again, he's shooting at 19.7% and not 42%.
The Winter Soldier
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As Ijuka so succinctly put it. I don't expect Laine to score 100 goals a season shooting 42% if this is what you are trying to say. And I am usually always here, so running off as you put it, I guess is another way of you showing you cannot discuss hockey with me. I will be sure to hang the out of office sign when I log off next time. Bye now. I have better things to discuss here than continue this Laine is not going to score 100 goals a season thing @nobody and @4thline are clearly obsessed with since I never claimed this.
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