Post-Game Talk: Caps and Candy Canes

[hockeykicker]

No burakovsky again

 

[um]

If they want to trade him it would help to play him.

 

[hockeykicker]

 

[Dr John Carlson]

He's right. But I like 13-92-43. Still would like to try Stephenson on the top line, they really need someone with speed to play with 8 & 19.

 

[Coldplay619]

8-92-77
13-19-65
10-20-43
18-83-25

 

[ovikovy817]

I like Wilson on the 2nd line
I don't like Oshie on the first line
But why we change the lines after 2 games scoring 5 goals/game?

 

[Hivemind]

I like Wilson on the 2nd line
I don't like Oshie on the first line
But why we change the lines after 2 games scoring 5 goals/game?

Because they practically have a week before their next game, so the practices between now and then are ideal to experiment with different combos.

That being said, these are not very experimental line combinations.

 

[Capsman]

Good ol' Ovi. He's been covering for faulty defenses, suspect coaching and soft fellow forwards his entire career. Not perfect but, c'mon, get this man a Cup and not Ray Bourque style.

I'd think about dealing Burakovsky here at some point for a more consistent, well-rounded player. They have enough finesse types as it is.

I'm not sure Bura is really that good even as a finesse player. I guess lack of confidence can make anyone's play look bad, but I'm not seeing any particular skill in him that excites me. I guess you could say his shot but it's woefully inaccurate. He's not a speed burner, not a very good possession player, vision is meh.

 

[Capsman]

Never would have predicted 53 pts halfway through the season before the season started. After starting 7-10-1(?) would think this to be impossible. Lots of defensive problems but goaltending and opportunistic goal scoring has obviously been key. Trotz better ease up on Holtby or he will get worn out.

We were never 7-10-1, we were 10-7-1 at one point.

 

[Hivemind]

You send examples of players that were either small cogs or past their prime (or had had prolonged slumps that were not coming off significant injuries...you are using examples to fit your narrative. Doesn’t mean it’s a good narrative).

So you expect us to wait until 20 games until they take action regarding a struggling Oshie? Is 7 games not enough? How much leash do you give him?

Team played well while Oshie was hurt? WTH does that have to do with the message it send to the team in benching one of their warriors who is doing all he can to help? You keep missing the message man. Not sure why, but whatever.

I'm not missing the message. I fully understand your argument. You argument is just not resounding with me at all. The team isn't dumb. The other players know that Oshie is struggling. Oshie knows he's struggling, and admitted as much in his comments regarding the new line combinations. The messages this sends is that playing healthy matters, and that the ice time will be correlated with how well you are playing, regardless of stature. There's nothing to take as a dig at Oshie or a devaluation of a "warrior," especially given that the frequent consensus is that he's not yet 100% (which is even more reason to give Oshie a night or two off).

Look, as I stated above. We can simply agree to disagree. Your idea, in my opinion, is a huge mistake. You think it’s a tremendous idea. Fair enough. Why don’t you put a poll on the board and see what others think. Assuming you value other Caps fans opinion. I’m pretty sure it won’t be even close to 50/50.

It would be a lot easier to agree to disagree if you stopped including jabs like the "bad idea" line and "missing the message" in your post.

Oshie is a proven veteran with leadership qualities, Bura is not. Defer to experience and, in this case, the likelihood that we don't have the full story. Bura has repeatedly said he struggles with confidence. He needs to work through that somehow. At some point benching will stop working, I suspect.

I don't disagree with this. Oshie deserves a longer leash than Burakovsky. But Oshie's had seven consecutive bad games at this point. One more bad game, and he will have struggled for a full 10% of the season. My view is that his leash is up at this point.

With regards to Burakovsky and some other younger players, I also agree there needs to be something beyond just benching as well. There needs to be carrots in addition to sticks. As Langway pointed out, ice time can also be dangled, and I would be pleased to see young players being rewarded with larger roles when they play well. Or at least young players being afforded longer leashes when they are contributing elsewhere. I'm a big believer in looking at what a player can do positively on the ice, not just where a player struggles. While that's not a free pass to ignore the shortcomings in a players game, I do believe that players who contribute in one area can be given more leeway for deficiencies in other areas. If Burt (or Oshie for that matter) is producing offensively, or even contributing on special teams or in transition play, then defensive zone turnovers or blown coverages shouldn't be the only thing that coaches look at when it comes to evaluating the player and deciding their ice time.

 

[Langway]

I'm not sure Bura is really that good even as a finesse player. I guess lack of confidence can make anyone's play look bad, but I'm not seeing any particular skill in him that excites me. I guess you could say his shot but it's woefully inaccurate. He's not a speed burner, not a very good possession player, vision is meh.

It's more or less his hockey IQ and lack of confidence that makes everything look like crap right now. He can do some fancy stuff, stick handle, skates pretty well, finish and that but without confidence and he lacks the foundation and natural savvy to be an effective all-around player. He's another guy that doesn't really do the little things well enough. It's what makes him a particularly tough fit on the third line unless he's on his game. He's already been passed by Vrana. If Stephenson can earn more trust and maybe add some finishing ability I wouldn't doubt he gets passed once again. These are the elements that lead to a player getting traded. He's had plenty of time to find a groove and identity over the past few seasons. Time off hurts but he needs to be more focused on what makes him effective and play his game.

Any RD upgrade needs to be a puck-mover and not a Schenn or Ceci. Maybe not Mike Green in particular but someone similar to offset Orpik and also maybe help PP2. But, like I've said, I'm fine giving Bowey as long a leash as possible in the regular season unless he's costing them games. The standard needs to be higher to tighten up his game but they're so focused on team results that it often seems to take a back seat. The only other UFAPMDRD that comes to mind is Franson and it's hard to see that happening. But I'd be open to a W swap like Rieder+(?) from Arizona...a player that doesn't have the same skill level but is fast, defensively responsible, can PK and play a decent energy game in a depth role. Either that or maybe someone younger that has C/W ability in the off chance they want to guard against overpaying Eller. Whether it's the deadline or off-season, it's hard to see 65 on this team next season if he doesn't get his game in order. $3M isn't crippling but they're need to make a judgement call, esp. if they can still get offers from teams that think they can fix him.

 

[maacoshark]

I like Wilson on the 2nd line
I don't like Oshie on the first line
But why we change the lines after 2 games scoring 5 goals/game?

Probably to get the 2nd line going. Every time one of the top 3 lines is struggling Trotz throws Wilson on that line. It seems to be working.

 

[Tweedsuitcase]

it doesn't work, imo. Last year they tried to save Ovi fresh cutting his ice time for another 2nd round exit. I'm glad this team isn't a regular season powerhouse anymore. I hope they get a PO spot on 3rd of April, not earlier.

We have the 3rd most points in the league right now. The metro is tight, but I don't think we'll be that late clinching a spot, unfortunately.

 

[Hivemind]

But I'd be open to a W swap like Rieder+(?) from Arizona...a player that doesn't have the same skill level but is fast, defensively responsible, can PK and play a decent energy game in a depth role. Either that or maybe someone younger that has C/W ability in the off chance they want to guard against overpaying Eller.

I quite like Rieder, and would be on board with acquiring him, but not at the expense of Burakovsky. There's a pretty big gap in quality and upside between those two players, and Rieder is also struggling this season.

 

[um]

I quite like Rieder, and would be on board with acquiring him, but not at the expense of Burakovsky. There's a pretty big gap in quality and upside between those two players, and Rieder is also struggling this season.

Rieder/Duclair + Hjalmarsson (1.0-1.5 retained) for Burakovsky + Bowey

Orlov-Niskanen
Orpik-Carlson
Djoos-Hjalmarsson

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Oskar Osala?

Kind of, yes.

 

[maacoshark]

Rieder/Duclair + Hjalmarsson (1.0-1.5 retained) for Burakovsky + Bowey

Orlov-Niskanen
Orpik-Carlson
Djoos-Hjalmarsson

Just because Bowey is struggling doesn't mean we should get rid of him. He is a rookie. Give him a chance to prove himself. You have to remember dmen take a bit longer to developed because of the defensive responsibilities. Its a lot tougher than being a winger.

 

[Hivemind]

Rieder/Duclair + Hjalmarsson (1.0-1.5 retained) for Burakovsky + Bowey

Orlov-Niskanen
Orpik-Carlson
Djoos-Hjalmarsson

At this point, I'm against "win now" moves like moving out high potential younger players (Burt, Bowey) for veterans like Hjalmarsson. We'll see if anything changes in the next 20 games, but I don't have the confidence in this particular team to say it's worth selling off assets that could be very useful in the next 2-3 years for better odds this year.

 

[Langway]

I quite like Rieder, and would be on board with acquiring him, but not at the expense of Burakovsky. There's a pretty big gap in quality and upside between those two players, and Rieder is also struggling this season.

Their actual boxcars the past few seasons are awfully similar, though, and that's with Rieder on some bad teams and providing PK ability. Rieder is two years older and has played about four more minutes per game but he's also put up some pretty decent shot totals along the way. He's struggled this season and has had some contract issues with ARI but he's real close to what I'd consider the jversatile energy winger they could use to round them out up front.

Best case Burakovsky figures it out but that's the type of replacement I'd target. Athanasiou would be another...someone that can help push the pace further. I'd be willing to sacrifice some theoretical upside if the staff is convinced it's not going to happen here. It still might but for me his hockey IQ has always been a bit questionable and it's part of why he's so streaky. They're not the best at fixing those things and just sitting a guy in the hope he gets his head straight also leaves a lot to chance.

I'm for re-arranging or tweaking the mix a bit while still adhering to youth/pace if the fits are out there. Those would be more change-of-scenery type moves than typical deadline type short-term thinking deals.

 

[Hivemind]

I don't think there's much upside beyond what Reider has shown thusfar in his career. He's still a very useful 2-way player that can help round out a top 9, but he's hardly a "special" talent. I'd take the gamble with Burakovsky over Reider without hesitation.

Athanasiou would be a trade I'd seriously consider, though.

 

[MW6]

What about Sam Bennett from Calgary? Seems like he also could use a change of scenery. Could replace Eller next season or play wing if Stephenson’s a better fit a C.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Oshie is right when he says that Wilson and DSP are more deserving of the top spot, but he's being hard on himself. Oshie has been at times our best player over the past two years, and his intensity is unmatched.

Trotz recognizes that, and he's trying to spark Oshie by showing how much he trusts Oshie.

Oshie doesn't need punishment, he needs help. 8 and 19 to the rescue of 77.

 

[hockeykicker]

 

[hockeykicker]

 

[Ridley Simon]

Rieder/Duclair + Hjalmarsson (1.0-1.5 retained) for Burakovsky + Bowey

Orlov-Niskanen
Orpik-Carlson
Djoos-Hjalmarsson

That's a home run, IMO (for this year, and arguably next)