Prospect Info: Capitals Prospects and Minor League Affiliates (Hershey Bears, SC Stingrays) - 2014-18

Discussion in 'Washington Capitals' started by sk84fun_dc, Jun 26, 2014.

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  1. Brian23

    Brian23 Registered User

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    It's a bit of an off topic, but what happened with Chris Bourque. How does a dude dominate the AHL for so long but just not have anything in the NHL? Guess I've just never seen much of him besides his short stinst with the Caps and never understood it.
     
  2. CapitalsCupFantasy

    CapitalsCupFantasy It’s Go Time!!

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    He's a tweener....bona fide. Pens and Bruins gave him a good shot too.
     
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  3. Hivemind

    Hivemind We're Touched

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    There are numerous guys who can succeed in lower levels, but doesn't have quite all the tools to pull it off at the NHL level. We see it across many gaps in competition (guys who can dominate juniors due to their physical gifts, but get stuffed at the pro level when everyone has equal tools to them) and across multiple sports ("AAAA" baseball prospects). Among Bears alums you can also look at Keith Aucoin, Alexandre Giroux, and Mitch Lamoureux. Bourque has plenty of hockey sense and speed in his game, but not the elite levels of those skills required to overcome his lack of size. Similar story for Aucoin and Lamoureux.
     
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  4. Lurch

    Lurch Registered User Sponsor

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    Wrapping up this season, the one thing on my mind is how much Doug Yingst did for this organization and how much he is missed. This last year was a train wreck. As someone who has been close to the team for most of my life, I am seriously considering not renewing my 6 season tickets which would have been unthinkable years ago. The Bears have gone from being the diamond of the AHL to a lump of coal. Talking to folks on hockey operations, they are divided on who is more to blame the Caps or HERCO. Something has to change. Unfortunately, I don't see things getting better next year.
     
  5. hb11xchamps

    hb11xchamps Registered User

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    Hear anything about Mann's status or if Bourque will be back?
     
  6. AlexBrovechkin8

    AlexBrovechkin8 Playoff chokers, they said.

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    Care to explain how the Caps are to blame? Genuinely curious. Not enough talent? I can't imagine the budget constraints are coming from D.C.
     
  7. hb11xchamps

    hb11xchamps Registered User

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    I've seen a lot of older, long-time ticket holders talking about the relationship with the Capitals negatively recently. There's been some chatter about it on the Hershey Bears Fans FB group and I've seen twitter posts by the arena "bull**** chant leader" Terry on twitter where he's negatively talked about the Caps.

    I'm very curious as to why there's a lot of negativity going on. Not sure if it's a budget thing or if it's communication issues or if it's playing time issues etc. If I had to pinpoint I'd start with communication issues. The whole Trotz not knowing that Walker PKed last year in Hershey tipped that one off. I also think some of the FA signings came out of left field, Peluso in particular. I'd have to dig back a bit but I remember Mann or Helmer had commented in an interview something along the lines of "We didn't know the Caps were targeting him as a free agent and he wasn't in our plans" or something similar. That really showed some disconnect on how FA went last year.

    I will say that I haven't been very impressed with how the past few offseasons have gone. Last year we saw Cannata, Dietz, Malone and Thomas signed as UFA. Only Christian Thomas was on the roster at the end of the year and he didn't get a ton of playing time down the stretch. This offseason we had Peluso, Albert, and Wayne Simpson sign 2-way deals. All three were huge disappointments and Albert was shipped out mid season. I'm hoping this offseason is a lot different and we see some fresh new faces. I'd love to get back to the old ways of attacking the top-tier AHL guys like Kenny Agostino, Chris Terry, Eric Tangradi, Cal O'Reilly and Ben Street to pair with Bourque. We did that the year they went to the CC finals they had Carter Camper, Sean Collins and Paul Carey up front and had Mike Moore, Ryan Stanton and Aaron Ness on D. That was a good free agent class that helped mesh with the kids. They need to get back to that.
     
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  8. Lurch

    Lurch Registered User Sponsor

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    Nothing about Bourque, but apparently Mann is not happy with the situation and may leave the team in his own accord. Could have just been venting, but this is coming from people downstairs and very close to the situation.
     
  9. Lurch

    Lurch Registered User Sponsor

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    Lack of quality prospects and general support for the team. A great deal of what the Caps appear to do in support for the Bears is actually a promotion paid for in full by Hershey.
     
  10. Holtbyisms

    Holtbyisms SY-STEM SY-STEM!!

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    In your estimation what would the Caps need to do to help the Bears ice a good team? Sign good AHL UFAs to two-ways?
     
  11. AlexBrovechkin8

    AlexBrovechkin8 Playoff chokers, they said.

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    Interesting. I will admit that I have a hard time feeling too much sympathy re: lack of quality prospects... the Caps have been a top 5 team in the NHL for almost the entire decade so it's tough to continuously restock the Hershey shelf with Alzners and Carlsons. Wasn't it just two years ago as well that the Bears went to the Calder Cup? And weren't they one of the better teams in the AHL last year but didn't make the playoffs because of the dumb division formatting rule?
     
  12. Lurch

    Lurch Registered User Sponsor

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    The Bears did well 2015/2016, but have not been a very dynamic team since 2009/2010. As you have noted, the success of the Capps over the last decade puts them in a "win now" mode so high-end prospects are traded for NHL ready assets or put on the big team very quickly. Also, speaking to those who should be working closely with the Caps, there is not much communication and support. Someone very close to the team told me not long ago that they felt like red-headed stepchildren.

    I'm not saying I agree with all of these sentiments, but it is pervasive both with longtime fans and hockey operations staff. With the Flyers farm team less than an hour down the road bursting at the seams with talent and an integrated coaching staff, it really highlights the differences.

    From my perspective, since Doug Yingst left, the Bears have seemed to lose their soul. He would ensure we had quality vets on a 1-way contract if necessary to balance out the what was being done to the farm team at the NHL level. It doesn't seem like there is that priority anymore. Just looking at our attendence numbers it would appear that many feel the same. There are nearly 7,000 season ticket holders and our attendance is still dropping.
     
  13. Lurch

    Lurch Registered User Sponsor

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    That would certainly help, as the coaching staff is certainly not happy with the level of talent available to them. However from a hockey ops point of view better communication and collaboration would be the primary need. As I noted before, these are not necessarily my sentiments but come from conversations with people close to it. Sometimes a problem may be exaggerated or blown out of proportion when venting over a hockey soda after a game.
     
  14. AlexBrovechkin8

    AlexBrovechkin8 Playoff chokers, they said.

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    That sucks to read. I have a soft spot for Hershey. My travel team played in the Hershey Thanksgiving Tournament every year and if schedules aligned we'd catch a game as a team. Really cool and unique experience for a young hockey player and it was clear that Hershey was a hockey town that loved their team. I hope things get better...
     
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  15. Langway

    Langway ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    I did think it was illuminating recently, near around the traded deadline or so, when MacLellan was asked about Hershey's competitive and/or success and he blew it off as basically an afterthought. I think it's illustrative of his continued fixation on the top team winning to the exclusion of longer game management decisions that fall by the wayside. Does Hershey do exit meetings after their season (as NHL teams do)? I'd be curious just how much support they get relative to most teams, in terms of parent club involvement. Kolzig is sort of involved I guess and there's the coaching staff but it may be time to move on from Mann and bring in someone that better aligns with whoever ends up coaching Washington next season. The timing of that could be tough depending on just when Washington finally sorts that out but Hershey probably needs to move away from the more checking-type approach toward something younger and faster. They need the pieces from the Caps and that will continue to be an issue up front for a while most likely. Pinho, Pilon & Malenstyn should join the team next fall but they're definitely going to need some older, more consistent talent than they had this season.

    It also seems like the longer players are in Hershey, the more likely they are to fall off the radar and that's troubling. I don't put the blame on Hershey because it really should be the parent club that's orchestrating a more proactive and aggressive approach. Boyd is a recent example to the contrary where he's gotten a chance with the Caps after a lot of time with the Bears but at 24 his skating/strength should be further along than they are IMO. That also goes into Hershey's identity, which is (again) slower largely due to personnel. A lack of organizational depth impacts what they're even able to do, particularly when they don't compensate for a lack of picks by other means. There's really no excuse for that and we're seeing I think the limitations of MacLellan's scope as an overall GM. Here, too, is where at least traditionally the AGM (Mahoney now) tends to have a lot of say in these matters but it's never been clear whether that's the case these days or not.
     
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  16. hb11xchamps

    hb11xchamps Registered User

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    It sounds like a house cleaning might be in order. New NHL and AHL head coach that have the same type of vision and better communication between Helmer and the staff in DC. I also wouldn't be opposed to firing some of the AHL assistants either. Whoever runs the PP in Hershey definitely needs to be canned because it's atrocious.

    They really need an organizational plan in place to aid in the development of the young guys in Hershey while having success on the ice. Next year Hershey could have LuJo, Siegenthaler, Hobbs, Williams, Bindulis, Pinho, Pilon, Malenstyn, Vanecek, Samsonov, AJF and any other prospects they sign in the offseason. That's a lot of young talent that should be making developmental strides instead of having abysmal seasons because the two organizations can't get their **** together. It's disappointing as a fan because we've seen the success that took place from 2005-2010 and more recently in 2015/16.

    Attack top tier AHL guys to go along with Bourque this offseason and dump the likes of the Pelusos and the Garrett Mitchells who take up veteran status that should be allocated to goal scoring.
     
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  17. hb11xchamps

    hb11xchamps Registered User

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    Also, @Lurch what's the deal with Chappie/Whitney? Did the team let them go home early or what?

    Whitney has been scratched for a ton of consecutive games and you would have though Chappie would be in the ECHL the give SC some more depth
     
  18. spintheblackcircle

    spintheblackcircle ...so that happened.

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  19. hb11xchamps

    hb11xchamps Registered User

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    Interesting. Wonder if he's reporting this year then going to Washington for the playoffs? Hershey only has two games left this weekend
     
  20. Lurch

    Lurch Registered User Sponsor

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    I honestly don't know, haven't heard much about either. I'll see what I can dig up later this week.
     
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  21. GoCaps2004

    GoCaps2004 Registered User

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    Doesn't he have to wait until his KHL contract expires in late April (I think it is late April?) to sign? It seemed like his team, which offered him a contract extension, won't let him terminate his contract early, so I thought he'd have to wait. So seems that current assignment in AHL is unlikely, no?
     
  22. usiel

    usiel Aegrescit medendo Sponsor

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    Just want to say thanks to hb11xchamps and Lurch Hershey posters for chiming in on all the Hershey/Caps dynamic from prospect to AHL win championship this for many years with this current Washington Capitals association.
     
  23. Ajax1995

    Ajax1995 Registered User

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    Don’t forget Gersich. I don’t see him as the clear difference maker at the NHL level at this point that some apparently do and definitely feel he would benefit from at least a half season in Hershey and ideally a full season there.
     
  24. hb11xchamps

    hb11xchamps Registered User

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    That's what I thought but the reports and tweets out there made it sound like he'd be here sooner. Maybe they meant he was told he'd report to Hershey next season.
     
  25. Langway

    Langway ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    There's at least enough uncertainty with both him and AJF that they're not locks to be there at least. They may see time there but it sort of depends on what happens with Beagle, DSP and others like Boyd & Barber that will require waivers. Whereas those three I mentioned definitely should be there, with perhaps Pinho the closest from being NHL-ready.
     
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