Post-Game Talk: Capitals 3, Penguins 1 - Rage Rage Against The Dying Of the Light

Discussion in 'Pittsburgh Penguins' started by BHD, Feb 16, 2021.

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  1. DocEmrickSkitters Registered User

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    Prague was a trendy place to travel for a while, but it started getting the Transylvania treatment a bit pre-Covid.
     
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  2. HandshakeLine Now brought to you in glorious Shaw-Scope!

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    Hey, Dracula was from Romania, by the by. We just have golems and alchemists and throwing people out of windows.
     
  3. HandshakeLine Now brought to you in glorious Shaw-Scope!

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    Man, you and I could have been arguing about tailoring options in unlicensed Viet-Russian after hours bars! You probably lucked out. :laugh:
     
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  4. DocEmrickSkitters Registered User

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    I went to a wedding in Romania a couple years ago. Cool, cheap place. I'd like to go to the CR at some point.
     
  5. Honour Over Glory Blueger Booster Bloke

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    We'd probably get into a row over pant length :laugh:
     
  6. Soggy Biscuit Rent A Barn

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    Elite talent and spacing where everybody is comfortable in their place can make up for a lot of coaching shortcomings.
     
  7. HandshakeLine Now brought to you in glorious Shaw-Scope!

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    No break or death.
     
  8. Soggy Biscuit Rent A Barn

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    My post was dedicated to PP performance, so that's where our focus should be.

    Zucker doesn't make our top 6 or PP better, so I fail to see how he enters into the conversation.

    The lesson everyone should take from the Kessel trade is that if an almost irreplaceable talent is helping you a lot in an area, it's better to try to shelter their weaknesses than get rid of them altogether.

    The lesson we need to take moving forward is that if we want to help the PP, since don't have much in the way of assets, maybe that player doesn't have to be a Patrice Bergeron-esque renaissance talent. Maybe he can just be good on the PP, and we'll put a Hagelin on his other wing to do the yeoman's work at ES.
     
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    Sure, I'm not disputing that. But problem is, we haven't had a power play which actually used said elite talent in probably close to a decade. Kessel made it better for a period, same with Hornqvist, but even then, we were never able to harness the man advantage the way Tampa and Washington did.
     
  10. Soggy Biscuit Rent A Barn

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    Yeah that would help.

    I don't see the PP coaching cavalry coming any time soon though.

    True. But we did a hell of a lot better than we're doing now.
     
  11. Gurglesons Registered User

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    You’d be okay with a player producing 26 points on Malkin’s wing making 6.8 million at 32?
     
  12. Soggy Biscuit Rent A Barn

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    1. He'd be playing on Malkin's wing, not Stepan, Keller, Brassard, or Dvorak. 26 points are very unlikely. He had 46 the last season he played with the Pens.
    2. I don't see a single area where Zucker makes the Pens a better team. Kessel could be productive at ES and on the PP. That was never not the case for Kessel in Pittsburgh, whatever his other failings.

    Most importantly, I'd trade Zucker for another high-priced forward if he could help our PP, even if he struggled in other areas. Because we're asset-deprived, and well-rounded PP performers are scarce at the best of times. If we narrow the aperture to players who aren't only great on the PP but also play great defense and work the boards and go to the net we're not going to find anyone, and on the off chance we do they'll be out of our price range.

    Like, are we just crossing our fingers and praying Forsberg will come to us or what?
     
  13. KIRK Registered User

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    Would they listen now the way they did then, when it was fresh, or would it lose them further?

    (I kind of file that one under separating Malkin and Zucker . . . who knows if it would work, but the status quo isn't working, so may as well try something different)

    As to the tactical flexibility, yeah, the Pens certainly need a coach like 2016-2017 Mike Sullivan now.
     
  14. KIRK Registered User

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    Not going to get in the middle of your discussion of a particular name to acquire. Rather, I hopped in here to say this: I don't care how productive or unproductive a specific Malkin winger is as much as I do about his impact, be it positive or negative, on whether Malkin is driving possession, chances, etc.
     
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  15. Gurglesons Registered User

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    I'm confused why Zucker isn't suddenly tearing it up with being on Malkin's wing since he played with inferior players in Minnesota as well.

    Kessel is no longer productive at ES and the whole argument is putting a fit on his wing that helps Malkin succeed. Kessel never set up Malkin to succeed aside from the 2017 playoffs while here.

    Also, we have no idea what Zucker adds to our power play because he has spent like 5 minutes on the 1st unit. Which is bizarre because he's out best net front player and has put up 20+ pts on the power play every season besides this one. Did you know Zucker had one less power play goal than Hornqvist in 37 less games last year on PIT and also produced at a better PPPG pace. He also had as many PP goals as Hornqvist in the playoffs. Yet Sully gon' Sully.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2021
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  16. Gurglesons Registered User

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    Which more to the point never happened with Kessel on Malkin's wing as we all know.
     
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  17. KIRK Registered User

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    Well duh. :laugh:

    Funny thing is, IF they flipped wingers for a game or two, you'd get a pretty good idea about how much of Malkin's struggles are about Malkin and about how much are the bad mix (especially with Zucker).

    PERSONALLY, I see the argument both ways. On the one hand, when Malkin has the puck, the other two (mainly Zucker) are flat footed and not supporting. On the other hand, when the other two are flying north, Malkin rarely is keeping up . . . what I don't know is if that's conditioning (i.e., it was that extra burst last year that made the timing work with Jake and Rust) or discouragement (i.e., when he does bust his ass to be third man with them, they have no clue he's there anyway, so kind of a 'why kill myself if they're going to ignore me'). You stick him with Jake and Rust for a game or two, and you'll get your answer.

    EDIT: I think the defensive issues are all about trying to cheat offensively. IF he's right, then you would see a marked improvement defensively as well with Jake and Rust. Maybe not like last year in any zone, but as least you'd have an idea what you've got, because right now you're dead with this Malkin and Zucker attached to his hip.
     
  18. Will Hunting Immortal Adams

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    My guess about what happens if Geno and Sid switch wingers. Zucker and Kap would kill Crosby similarly as to how they are killing Malkin. And Malkin would neutralize Rust and Jake too. So instead of one great line and one awful line we would have 2 mediocre lines, IMO. Because Kap, Zucker and Geno are all playing really bad hockey now and I don´t think it is gonna change soon. Especially with Zucker and Geno, maybe they are who they are at this point.
     
  19. Gurglesons Registered User

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    Well, what we currently have happening is a line that is barely good enough to get us going .500 and an absolute trash line. So what is the problem with trying something different?

    Zucker was an absolute lightning bolt for us last year with Sheary. How does that fall off completely?
     
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  20. KIRK Registered User

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    The 'safer' move then is to flip Malkin and Blueger.
     
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  21. KIRK Registered User

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    And the operative word is SOMETHING. If not flipping Sid and Geno, then something else. Pretty much anything else.
     
  22. Gurglesons Registered User

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    It'll be cool when we see nothing different besides like Tanev and Kapanen switched on Thursday which is obviously an even stupider thing to do since X (and especially ZAR) - Blueger - Tanev have been one of the few bright spots this year.
     
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  23. mpp9 Registered User

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    That actually may be the best realistic move lol. Malkin likely gets back to acceptable play and Blueger gets a chance to play with some skilled players.

    They’re pretty much rolling the top 3 lines anyway.
     
  24. Gurglesons Registered User

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    Bleuger is outproducing Malkin this year, so if Sullivan is going to play favorites. Might as well do it and hold Malkin and Zucker accountable.

    Guentzel - Blueger - Kapanen
    Zucker - Crosby - Rust
    ZAR - Malkin - Tanev
     
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  25. KIRK Registered User

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    Oh, it's kind of my default position at this point to expect the absolute worst from Sullivan where the management of L2 is concerned.
     
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