Confirmed with Link: Canucks Sign D Luke Schenn to 2-Year, 1-Way Deal ($850K AAV)

[Billy Kvcmu]

He’s a bad hockey player who had a decent tiny sample size here three seasons ago.

There are 31 fanbases in the league that think this player sucks and one who is weirdly attached to him.

The bubble will burst pretty quickly.

Luke Schenn is a bad hockey player
But Cody Ceci is a decent nhl player according to you

Good grief MS, go worry about Seattle or something

 

[MS]

Luke Schenn is a bad hockey player
But Cody Ceci is a decent nhl player according to you

Good grief MS, go worry about Seattle or something

Are you ... actually serious here?

Luke Schenn has spent most of the last 3 years in the AHL or as a healthy scratch, and has produced poor results from limited soft minutes. He's 32 and is one of the slowest players in the NHL.

Cody Ceci just smoked #3 shutdown minutes for Pittsburgh. And did well for Toronto the previous year. He's an effective 2nd pairing defender who has been overly criticized because he's been played too far up on rosters earlier in his career.

Ceci is monstrously better than Schenn, and this shouldn't be a remotely controversial opinion. I honestly can't believe I'm having to defend this.

 

[vancityluongo]

Are you ... actually serious here?

Luke Schenn has spent most of the last 3 years in the AHL or as a healthy scratch, and has produced poor results from limited soft minutes. He's 32 and is one of the slowest players in the NHL.

Cody Ceci just smoked #3 shutdown minutes for Pittsburgh. And did well for Toronto the previous year. He's an effective 2nd pairing defender who has been overly criticized because he's been played too far up on rosters earlier in his career.

Ceci is monstrously better than Schenn, and this shouldn't be a remotely controversial opinion. I honestly can't believe I'm having to defend this.

To be fair, Cody Ceci is on an absolutely idiotic 4 year contract and being touted as a second pairing defenseman to be paired with a washed up Duncan keith... while Luke Schenn is going to be in the AHL or a healthy scratch.

This is like saying Tyler Myers is better than Jon Merrill or something. Like yes, but, uh...so? And to be clear, I know you're just responding to the person who called you out for saying Ceci > Schenn (this is true), but it's not like we should have signed Ceci at that price over Schenn.

 

[MS]

To be fair, Cody Ceci is on an absolutely idiotic 4 year contract and being touted as a second pairing defenseman to be paired with a washed up Duncan keith... while Luke Schenn is going to be in the AHL or a healthy scratch.

This is like saying Tyler Myers is better than Jon Merrill or something. Like yes, but, uh...so? And to be clear, I know you're just responding to the person who called you out for saying Ceci > Schenn (this is true), but it's not like we should have signed Ceci at that price over Schenn.

I have no problems with Ceci's contract. I don't really think it's unreasonable at all. He's a solid 2nd pairing defender and is still only 27/28. I had him as probably the best-value RHS UFA for this period once Larsson signed. I would take Hamonic on his contract over Ceci but I'd take Ceci 100 times out of 100 over Poolman and that contract.

Schenn is just ... an old and bad fringe player.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Are you ... actually serious here?

Luke Schenn has spent most of the last 3 years in the AHL or as a healthy scratch, and has produced poor results from limited soft minutes. He's 32 and is one of the slowest players in the NHL.

Cody Ceci just smoked #3 shutdown minutes for Pittsburgh. And did well for Toronto the previous year. He's an effective 2nd pairing defender who has been overly criticized because he's been played too far up on rosters earlier in his career.

Ceci is monstrously better than Schenn, and this shouldn't be a remotely controversial opinion. I honestly can't believe I'm having to defend this.

Cody Ceci had one good half season in Pittsburgh in his entire career and suddenly he’s a 2nd pair D. And no he was bad in Toronto

Ceci is going to stink in Edmonton just like usual, having an aging Keith as his partner is going to make him even worse

Oh and the Kraken probably will suck too looking at their roster for now

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

To be fair, Cody Ceci is on an absolutely idiotic 4 year contract and being touted as a second pairing defenseman to be paired with a washed up Duncan keith... while Luke Schenn is going to be in the AHL or a healthy scratch.

This is like saying Tyler Myers is better than Jon Merrill or something. Like yes, but, uh...so? And to be clear, I know you're just responding to the person who called you out for saying Ceci > Schenn (this is true), but it's not like we should have signed Ceci at that price over Schenn.

Tbf I wasn’t claiming Ceci> Schenn

I was laughing and doubting his player evaluation because he thinks Ceci is a good player and have said it in other thread before

 

[HockeyNightInAsia]

Chalk me in as another very surprised by this Ceci being good talk. Even Penguins fans aren't high about him. Yes Poolman is likely overpaid but Ceci is not the guy to make this point. Come on.

Anyway, Luke Schenn is what Luke Schenn is. Hopefully by March he will only be a #8/#9 depth defender -- either a trade deadline RHD acquisition or being outplayed by an improving player, who knows, maybe Brady Keeper?

 

[MS]

Cody Ceci had one good half season in Pittsburgh in his entire career and suddenly he’s a 2nd pair D. And no he was bad in Toronto

Ceci is going to stink in Edmonton just like usual, having an aging Keith as his partner is going to make him even worse

Oh and the Kraken probably will suck too looking at their roster for now

I watched Ceci a bunch in Toronto. He was solid despite playing further up the lineup than he really should have been.

He's a solid 2nd pairing defender. He got destroyed playing minutes that were too heavy as a young player on bad Ottawa teams and that reputation has stuck to him and fans haven't adjusted their opinions.

Whether he'll have a bad partner in Edmonton or not is irrelevant toward determining whether he's an effective player in a general sense.

Seattle's roster looks very solid. It's amazing how people learned nothing from Vegas.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Deleted

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Chalk me in as another very surprised by this Ceci being good talk. Even Penguins fans aren't high about him. Yes Poolman is likely overpaid but Ceci is not the guy to make this point. Come on.

Anyway, Luke Schenn is what Luke Schenn is. Hopefully by March he will only be a #8/#9 depth defender -- either a trade deadline RHD acquisition or being outplayed by an improving player, who knows, maybe Brady Keeper?

It’s hating the twins at their prime level of weirdness

 

[MS]

It’s also amazing how Seattle failed to acquire extra assets like Vegas did
Had all the leverages in the world but somehow they still screwed up

It's equally funny how triggered you are by me and by how you think insulting Seattle actually bothers me in some way, and are trolling with Seattle comments in every post you make.

I doubt too many teams were willing to trade 2/3 of a #1 line to protect a #7 defender this time around. I agree they probably should have harvested a couple extra #2-3 draft picks but that has nothing to do with their initial competitiveness.

 

[MS]

It’s hating the twins at their prime level of weirdness

What an insanely stupid comment. You have to be smarter than this.

'Guy who has generated good results as 2nd pairing defender recently is a solid 2nd pairing defender' is not the same thing as 'I hate the NHL MVPs playing for my team'.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

It's equally funny how triggered you are by me and by how you think insulting Seattle actually bothers me in some way, and are trolling with Seattle comments in every post you make.

I doubt too many teams were willing to trade 2/3 of a #1 line to protect a #7 defender this time around. I agree they probably should have harvested a couple extra #2-3 draft picks but that has nothing to do with their initial competitiveness.

My bad on that part
Replied to the wrong person honestly
But regardless, Cody Ceci is not a good nhl player and that is what I believe. Also you switching to Kraken’s avatar was just asking for ppl to troll on you

 

[MS]

My bad on that part
Replied to the wrong person honestly
But regardless, Cody Ceci is not a good nhl player and that is what I believe. Also you switching to Kraken’s avatar was just asking for ppl to troll on you

Here's my back-history in evaluating Ceci:

When he was traded from Ottawa to Toronto I said the same 'LOL what is Toronto doing? Ceci sucks!' sort of things as everyone else. But then actually watching Toronto games, what I saw was a player playing tough minutes for a pretty bad defensive team ... and actually looking pretty good and doing a good job. So I had to ask myself if Ceci really sucked or maybe if I was just parroting other peoples' wrong opinions (usually based on those stupid WAR charts) on a player I hadn't followed closely enough and maybe actually Ceci was a decent hockey player who was just in a bad situation in Ottawa. So he's been a guy I've followed pretty closely over the past couple years, including after he moved to Pittsburgh. And what I was watching and the results I was seeing didn't line up at all with the opinion of the masses on this player - what I've seen is a perfectly solid 2nd pairing defender who can play med-high leverage minutes pretty solidly without hurting you.

And this is not an 'anti-Benning' take in any way. Has nothing to do with Vancouver. I've listed him as a good target ahead of both of the last two offseasons when it was perfectly possible that he could have been a player we were interested in.

But hey, maybe I'm wrong. I'm endlessly fascinated by how willing people are to die on hills rather than admit they were ever wrong, and just get fixated on the same opinions forever. Like, these are human beings playing a sport. It's f***ing volatile. If anyone here gets things right 80% of the time (a success rate most NHL GMs would kill for) they're absolutely slaying it ... but that means they're still wrong constantly. And people should be constantly evaluating their opinions and updating for new information and trying to figure out why they were wrong so they can come up with better takes the next time. I'm wrong f***ing all the time (but hopefully less often than most) and it's hilarious when people act like cherry-picking a bad take from 10 years ago acts as some sort of 'gotcha'.

As for Seattle, it was making a point and predictably the people I expected would miss the point did in fact miss the point.

 

[F A N]

Here's my back-history in evaluating Ceci:

When he was traded from Ottawa to Toronto I said the same 'LOL what is Toronto doing? Ceci sucks!' sort of things as everyone else. But then actually watching Toronto games, what I saw was a player playing tough minutes for a pretty bad defensive team ... and actually looking pretty good and doing a good job. So I had to ask myself if Ceci really sucked or maybe if I was just parroting other peoples' wrong opinions (usually based on those stupid WAR charts) on a player I hadn't followed closely enough and maybe actually Ceci was a decent hockey player who was just in a bad situation in Ottawa. So he's been a guy I've followed pretty closely over the past couple years, including after he moved to Pittsburgh. And what I was watching and the results I was seeing didn't line up at all with the opinion of the masses on this player - what I've seen is a perfectly solid 2nd pairing defender who can play med-high leverage minutes pretty solidly without hurting you.

And this is not an 'anti-Benning' take in any way. Has nothing to do with Vancouver. I've listed him as a good target ahead of both of the last two offseasons when it was perfectly possible that he could have been a player we were interested in.

But hey, maybe I'm wrong. I'm endlessly fascinated by how willing people are to die on hills rather than admit they were ever wrong, and just get fixated on the same opinions forever. Like, these are human beings playing a sport. It's f***ing volatile. If anyone here gets things right 80% of the time (a success rate most NHL GMs would kill for) they're absolutely slaying it ... but that means they're still wrong constantly. And people should be constantly evaluating their opinions and updating for new information and trying to figure out why they were wrong so they can come up with better takes the next time. I'm wrong f***ing all the time (but hopefully less often than most) and it's hilarious when people act like cherry-picking a bad take from 10 years ago acts as some sort of 'gotcha'.

As for Seattle, it was making a point and predictably the people I expected would miss the point did in fact miss the point.

So Ceci is a late bloomer and learned how to defend after playing 415 NHL games (playoff games included)?

 

[MS]

So Ceci is a late bloomer and learned how to defend after playing 415 NHL games (playoff games included)?

Not really?

Ceci made the NHL at 20 and his first few seasons were totally fine as a mid-pairing #4-5 guy.

Then he got ramped to to being the #2 defender (on a team where Karlsson and later Chabot get big offensive minutes as the #1, and the #2 is really a ‘#1 defensive guy’) and spent the next 3 years getting destroyed. Basically at same age Juolevi is now he got shoved into playing Tanev minutes way over his head on a crap team usually with a poor partner.

Then he got moved to Pittsburgh/Toronto and backed down the lineup into the sorts of #4-type minutes he was playing earlier in his career, and magically looked way better. And then did very well in #3 minutes to close out this year.

I’m not trying to claim the guy is a world-beater or anything but what I’ve seen is probably a similar-level player to Hamonic (another guy who struggled when playing too high up the lineup at times in his career) and fair value at his contract.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Ceci is overpaid but certainly much better than schenn. Take off the homer glasses from 2 years ago.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Here's my back-history in evaluating Ceci:

When he was traded from Ottawa to Toronto I said the same 'LOL what is Toronto doing? Ceci sucks!' sort of things as everyone else. But then actually watching Toronto games, what I saw was a player playing tough minutes for a pretty bad defensive team ... and actually looking pretty good and doing a good job. So I had to ask myself if Ceci really sucked or maybe if I was just parroting other peoples' wrong opinions (usually based on those stupid WAR charts) on a player I hadn't followed closely enough and maybe actually Ceci was a decent hockey player who was just in a bad situation in Ottawa. So he's been a guy I've followed pretty closely over the past couple years, including after he moved to Pittsburgh. And what I was watching and the results I was seeing didn't line up at all with the opinion of the masses on this player - what I've seen is a perfectly solid 2nd pairing defender who can play med-high leverage minutes pretty solidly without hurting you.

And this is not an 'anti-Benning' take in any way. Has nothing to do with Vancouver. I've listed him as a good target ahead of both of the last two offseasons when it was perfectly possible that he could have been a player we were interested in.

But hey, maybe I'm wrong. I'm endlessly fascinated by how willing people are to die on hills rather than admit they were ever wrong, and just get fixated on the same opinions forever. Like, these are human beings playing a sport. It's f***ing volatile. If anyone here gets things right 80% of the time (a success rate most NHL GMs would kill for) they're absolutely slaying it ... but that means they're still wrong constantly. And people should be constantly evaluating their opinions and updating for new information and trying to figure out why they were wrong so they can come up with better takes the next time. I'm wrong f***ing all the time (but hopefully less often than most) and it's hilarious when people act like cherry-picking a bad take from 10 years ago acts as some sort of 'gotcha'.

As for Seattle, it was making a point and predictably the people I expected would miss the point did in fact miss the point.

Look
If Ceci doesn’t suck in edmon I will eat my words
But before that happen, I will laugh everytime when I see people calling Ceci good

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Ceci is overpaid but certainly much better than schenn. Take off the homer glasses from 2 years ago.

I’ve never once said he’s worse than Schenn

 

[krutovsdonut]

I have no problems with Ceci's contract. I don't really think it's unreasonable at all. He's a solid 2nd pairing defender and is still only 27/28. I had him as probably the best-value RHS UFA for this period once Larsson signed. I would take Hamonic on his contract over Ceci but I'd take Ceci 100 times out of 100 over Poolman and that contract.

Schenn is just ... an old and bad fringe player.

there is not a chance that you would not turn on tceci halfway through the season if we had signed to thay deal.

 

[MS]

there is not a chance that you would not turn on tceci halfway through the season if we had signed to thay deal.

What a juvenile comment.

If he stunk, if course I’d adjust my opinion. If he played well, absolutely not.

Some of us are more concerned with understanding the game and generating quality opinions than we are concerned about shilling for a bad GM over the health of the franchise.

 

[moog35]

Schenn is a better signing than Ceci

 

[MS]

Look
If Ceci doesn’t suck in edmon I will eat my words
But before that happen, I will laugh everytime when I see people calling Ceci good

Laughing at opinions that other people have put considerable thought into is a great way to look really dumb down the road.

 

[Bleach Clean]

Here's my back-history in evaluating Ceci:

When he was traded from Ottawa to Toronto I said the same 'LOL what is Toronto doing? Ceci sucks!' sort of things as everyone else. But then actually watching Toronto games, what I saw was a player playing tough minutes for a pretty bad defensive team ... and actually looking pretty good and doing a good job. So I had to ask myself if Ceci really sucked or maybe if I was just parroting other peoples' wrong opinions (usually based on those stupid WAR charts) on a player I hadn't followed closely enough and maybe actually Ceci was a decent hockey player who was just in a bad situation in Ottawa. So he's been a guy I've followed pretty closely over the past couple years, including after he moved to Pittsburgh. And what I was watching and the results I was seeing didn't line up at all with the opinion of the masses on this player - what I've seen is a perfectly solid 2nd pairing defender who can play med-high leverage minutes pretty solidly without hurting you.

And this is not an 'anti-Benning' take in any way. Has nothing to do with Vancouver. I've listed him as a good target ahead of both of the last two offseasons when it was perfectly possible that he could have been a player we were interested in.

But hey, maybe I'm wrong. I'm endlessly fascinated by how willing people are to die on hills rather than admit they were ever wrong, and just get fixated on the same opinions forever. Like, these are human beings playing a sport. It's f***ing volatile. If anyone here gets things right 80% of the time (a success rate most NHL GMs would kill for) they're absolutely slaying it ... but that means they're still wrong constantly. And people should be constantly evaluating their opinions and updating for new information and trying to figure out why they were wrong so they can come up with better takes the next time. I'm wrong f***ing all the time (but hopefully less often than most) and it's hilarious when people act like cherry-picking a bad take from 10 years ago acts as some sort of 'gotcha'.

As for Seattle, it was making a point and predictably the people I expected would miss the point did in fact miss the point.

Your statement in bold is correct. Theoretically, this is what is supposed to happen. Does it though? I don't know. Just this past week it's been your opinion on Dmen in general, and Hughes specifically. Then it's Ceci is a good defender in absolute terms regardless of the data. Subjectively fine to say, but you're not getting any buy-in this way.

'I've watched him play' is just what almost everyone here can say. So why wonder if that perception is being questioned?

Saying Ceci is better than Schenn is not controversial. Saying he's a significantly improved player, rather than he was just used differently and is the same player he's always been, obviously is.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Laughing at opinions that other people have put considerable thought into is a great way to look really dumb down the road.

Again, if I am proven wrong in the future then I deserve to look extremely dumb.
But as for now, I can’t not agree your with statement of Cody Ceci is a solid 2nd pair D