Canadian Division (Canada Cup) Part IX

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NoName

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I really hope the Oilers add at the deadline. Last game showed just how inconsistent this group is. I don't think you can say any part of it other than the PP and goaltending is really "on". It's just a lot of disjointed parts that aren't quite fitting. Wins without chemistry so far. But there are good pieces here, and it feels like they are being mostly wasted. And I don't mean just McDavid and Draisaitl.
It might seem weird, but what about getting Hall? Could they make it work with the cap hit? The Oilers always seem one star winger away from having a dominating forward group, and I think once Hall is away from the black hole that is Buffalo he will be solid again; he is damn talented and still fairly young.
 

NoName

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Edmonton's gotta be feeling good it's extremely unlikely they play Montreal in the first round.
I mean, as a Leafs fan I would much rather face Montreal then Winnipeg in the 1st round and I would be surprised if it came down to it the Oilers would have the opposite opinion. Not dumping on the Habs, they are a hardworking cohesive group and I definitely wouldn’t write them off in a series with Price in net, but the Jets have a ton of talent and the most deep playoff experience in the division.
 
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Lshap

Hardline Moderate
Jun 6, 2011
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About Jack Campbell, the two easy reference points are Jordan Binnington and Andrew Hammond. Two bookends on the far ends of the success spectrum. Obviously Campbell will cool off; the question is whether he'll stabilize at a consistent high like the former, or crack under the pressure like the latter. A goalie's job is mostly mental. There's simply no way to gauge what's going on under the hood right now and predict where Campbell will be in a month.

But whatever your feelings on the Leafs, you've gotta appreciate the cool story of a not-so-young guy getting his first crack at the starter's job and killing it. I may not like the Leafs, but I kinda like Campbell. Felt the same way about Hammond. I'm a sucker for feel-good stories.
 

Peasy

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May 25, 2012
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About Jack Campbell, the two easy reference points are Jordan Binnington and Andrew Hammond. Two bookends on the far ends of the success spectrum. Obviously Campbell will cool off; the question is whether he'll stabilize at a consistent high like the former, or crack under the pressure like the latter. A goalie's job is mostly mental. There's simply no way to gauge what's going on under the hood right now and predict where Campbell will be in a month.

But whatever your feelings on the Leafs, you've gotta appreciate the cool story of a not-so-young guy getting his first crack at the starter's job and killing it. I may not like the Leafs, but I kinda like Campbell. Felt the same way about Hammond. I'm a sucker for feel-good stories.
I mean theres also guys like Markstrom, Kuemper, Raanta (if he could find a way to stay healthy).

If Campbell became a starter at the age of 29/30, its really not out of the ordinary...

Goalie development is a lot different from a skaters development.
 

Mr Positive

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Nov 20, 2013
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It might seem weird, but what about getting Hall? Could they make it work with the cap hit? The Oilers always seem one star winger away from having a dominating forward group, and I think once Hall is away from the black hole that is Buffalo he will be solid again; he is damn talented and still fairly young.
I'm not in favor of that deal as a plan A. However, it's not that weird imo. It's usually better to have a fresh start without history, but Hall was popular and never wanted to leave. It might also be good optics, as having both Hall and Larsson makes that original trade come full circle.

I'm more in favor of a veteran, more low key option that costs a bit less. But, if it is Hall, I don't think the cap is a problem. Where there is a will, there's a way. I'm sure Buffalo is absorbing half the salary, and would take a cap dump. The real cash they'd be paying up there wouldn't be a ton this late in the season.
 

Essenege

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Oct 5, 2019
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Maybe I'm reading your post wrong, but that's not true. When the NHL introduced the 5 minute sudden death OT in 1983, and until they introduced the "loser point" in 1999, a team didn't get a point if they lost in OT. It was considered simply a loss.

Comparing 4v4 OT with the game ending as a tie most of the time is a completely different situation then forcing a result via shootout/ 3v3 OT.

From a competition standpoint it would be garbage having a 2-0 distribution to the team winning in gimmicks. Way to much weight would be given to the stupid skills competition
 

TopChedder

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Oct 2, 2013
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Montréal still seems firmly planted in the drivers seat of this division. This is right about the time the late season collapse begins in Maple Laugh town. Tomorrow night will be a glimpse of just how much stronger Montreal is from top to bottom. I’m fully expecting it to get ugly for the poor Leafers.

I love this post! It's crazy because I actually think you believe it.

All we need is @KotkaCaufield in this conversation talking about the Habs being the team to beat and how every prospect they have is McDavid 2.0

Cheers
 
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Rhaegar Targaryen

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I love this post! It's crazy because I actually think you believe it.

All we need is @KotkaCaufield in this conversation talking about the Habs being the team to beat and how every prospect they have is McDavid 2.0

Cheers

Tomorrow should be a good matchup. Toronto is getting hot again after going through a slump, and Montreal is playing great hockey (minus that game vs Ottawa). Plus, with Price/Andersen out, both teams will actually be playing their top goalie.
 
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Petrus

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I mean theres also guys like Markstrom, Kuemper, Raanta (if he could find a way to stay healthy).

If Campbell became a starter at the age of 29/30, its really not out of the ordinary...

Goalie development is a lot different from a skaters development.

You guys forgot the big one: Tim Thomas.
 

Kudo Shinichi

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Apr 20, 2012
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I mean, as a Leafs fan I would much rather face Montreal then Winnipeg in the 1st round and I would be surprised if it came down to it the Oilers would have the opposite opinion. Not dumping on the Habs, they are a hardworking cohesive group and I definitely wouldn’t write them off in a series with Price in net, but the Jets have a ton of talent and the most deep playoff experience in the division.

The habs have 5 Stanley cup champions in their lineup (Staal, Toffoli, Perry, Edmundson, Allen).
 

notDatsyuk

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Jul 20, 2018
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Since we are dealing in alternate universes turn MTL's 9 OT loses to OT wins and they are solidly ahead of the Jets and Oilers. This is silly.

In this REAL universe MTL is in 4th place with 9 OT loses and they still have a chance to catch WPG and EDM.
Since we're talking about the effects of overtime/shootout on the standings, I did a bit of number crunching using just this year's results.

I recalculated the standings based on the old system: every game ends in regulation and is worth two points, with two for a win, one for a tie, none for a loss.

I then recalculated the standings based on the soccer-type system, which a number if people have said they would like to see: every game worth three points, with three for a regulation win, two for an OT or SO win, one for an OT or SO loss, and none for a regulation loss.

Standings using the current point system:
Tor - 55
Wpg - 49
Edm - 48
Mon - 43
Cal - 35
Van - 35
Ott - 30

Standings using the old point system:
Tor - 49
Edm - 46
Wpg - 43
Mon - 41
Cal - 33
Van - 30
Ott - 26

Standings using the 3-2-1-0 point system:
Tor - 75
Edm - 69
Wpg - 66
Mon - 58
Cal - 49
Van - 46
Ott - 39

Only one change in order, and it is the same for both systems that give the same number of points for every game, which I think shows how the current system is flawed.

Edmonton and Calgary fare slightly better, because more of their games end in regulation, regardless of whether they have winning or losing records. The point spreads between teams, allowing for the 2:3 point difference, are almost identical. By multiplying the 'old' by 1.5, you get:
Tor - 74.5
Edm - 69
Wpg - 65.5
Mon - 61.5
Cal - 49.5
Van - 45
Ott - 39

Montreal's 9 OT losses represent the only noticeable difference between them.
 
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Harry22

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Mar 28, 2005
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Maybe I'm reading your post wrong, but that's not true. When the NHL introduced the 5 minute sudden death OT in 1983, and until they introduced the "loser point" in 1999, a team didn't get a point if they lost in OT. It was considered simply a loss.

I think what he meant, is when the league changed the extra time rule from regular hockey (5 on 5), teams have earned a point.

An OT loss between 1983 and 1999 was 5 on 5.
 

Sidney the Kidney

One last time
Jun 29, 2009
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I think what he meant, is when the league changed the extra time rule from regular hockey (5 on 5), teams have earned a point.

An OT loss between 1983 and 1999 was 5 on 5.

Yeah, he clarified that since then.

Originally it sounded like he was saying that teams always earned a point for an OT loss, whether it was 5on5 OT, 4on4 OT, or the current 3on3 format.
 

Fisticuffer

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Mar 14, 2020
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Take away Montreal's 9 overtime loss points and they're on the outside looking in.
There’s always been a point awarded for games that are tied after regulation.
If there’s an issue with 3 point games it’s the extra gimmick point.
 

Harry22

Registered User
Mar 28, 2005
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There’s always been a point awarded for games that are tied after regulation.
If there’s an issue with 3 point games it’s the extra gimmick point.

Especially since the gimmick point is awarded to what comes down to nothing that looks like regular hockey. 3 on 3 isn’t hockey (it’s shinny) and the SO is a skill competition.
 
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NoName

Bringer of Playoffs!
Nov 3, 2017
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The habs have 5 Stanley cup champions in their lineup (Staal, Toffoli, Perry, Edmundson, Allen).
How many Stanley cups did that group win together as on the Habs? What sort of deep playoff runs has montreal's core made in recent years? The Jets made it to the Conference finals in 2018, the 1st round in 2019 and the play-ins last year with most of this core. Having veterans with deep playoff experience at all is definitely useful, which is why every team has those sort of veterans on them, but the real test is what the team as a whole has done together.
 

Papi 4 Hart

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Nov 9, 2018
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Why can't people just say the Leafs are having a great season. Probably best we have seen them play. All the potential and youth (combined with some veterans) is coming together and show some respect?

Like I can hate a team with all my heart but if they are good I will still say they are good.
 

HockeyVirus

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Nov 15, 2020
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IMO, miracle run isn't just about constantly stealing games. It also includes not really costing teams games by not giving up a bunch of bad goals. Even the best goalies in hockey will have games where they cost their team a game here or there with a bad night. I don't think Campbell's had that yet, so that's part of his "miracle run".

I also don't think Campbell's had one of those "bad luck" games where even if he's playing well, all the bounces seem to go against him.

I think both of those are also factors in "miracle run" and not just him stealing game after game.

If I didn't pay attention to the poster I could've easily assumed you're a leafs fan who watched every game -- kudos on a pretty accurate description and good assessment of Campbell there.

Except that's not true. Campbell gives up a soft goal a night this entire run. He's just done something Andersen wasn't. Making timely saves. No back breakers. Not in general allowing the first shot of the period in, or letting the first shot he faces in after minutes of possession for the Leafs. And he can make some saves on the PK and through traffic. NHL level goaltending.

An example of playing well but having bad bounces? Well look at these two goals.. The only two he let in





He hasn't been standing on his head. He's just in general making the saves an NHL goalie should.
 
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Sidney the Kidney

One last time
Jun 29, 2009
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Except that's not true. Campbell gives up a soft goal a night this entire run. He's just done something Andersen wasn't. Making timely saves. No back breakers. Not in general allowing the first shot of the period in, or letting the first shot he faces in after minutes of possession for the Leafs. And he can make some saves on the PK and through traffic. NHL level goaltending.


He hasn't been standing on his head. He's just in general making the saves an NHL goalie should.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I'll be willing to bet you anything that you'll start to see the type of goals and the type of "down" performances I'm referring to over a larger sample size.

Unless you truly believe the Leafs are just so dominant that him sporting a 1.53 GAA and .944 save percentage is simply "making the saves an NHL goalie should" and that those numbers aren't a result of him playing above what one can expect from him every night.
 
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