Can the Winter Classic and the Heritage Classic co-exist?

Brodie

the dream of the 90s is alive in Detroit
Mar 19, 2009
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Chicago
I don't get the *****ing about the date of the HC... they put it on the one weekend 90% of Canadians get off after New Year's Day before the end of the season. They don't want to risk the temps that hurt the first HC, so they can't hold the game in the depths of winter. The only other date that would make sense is the Sunday of Canadian Thanksgiving weekend, which would make an okay kick off event I guess but is really no better than the Family Day weekend date.

And the complaints about being a gimmick are just dumb. It's working. Sorry you hate seeing the league grow... maybe you should follow the AHL or something.
 

The Shrike

Registered User
Jul 13, 2008
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Toronto
What next, then? Two separate All-Star Games? A separate six-team Canadian playoffs?

How about the League just be operate a single entity like it's supposed to?
Fine, but that means the winter classic must occasionally be played on Canadian soil, involving Canadian teams. Otherwise we're back to the compromise I suggested earlier.
 

berklon

Registered User
Dec 24, 2008
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And the complaints about being a gimmick are just dumb. It's working. Sorry you hate seeing the league grow... maybe you should follow the AHL or something.

Yes, it's a gimmick and it won't be helping much when the novelty wears off soon. It's not much better than a pre-season game as many players hold back due to the conditions of the ice.

Personally, I don't care if Canada gets to play them or not. The novelty wore off on me after the 2nd outdoor game.
 

Hollywood Burrows

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Jan 23, 2009
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I really have no idea what Burnside is talking about. I think as a hockey journalist in the U.S., he suffers from severe insecurity when confronted with the NHL's almost total irrelevance in the American sports media. Now, the sanctity of the one day of the year when his writing on espn.com might get bumped to the front page, or he might get to do a thirty second hit on Sportscenter, must be protected at all costs!

The Winter Classic is never going to be a long-term success for the NHL, because it is a gimmick. The more people watch it, the less they are going to care about it. The problems with the Winter Classic are inherent to the Winter Classic itself and won't be affected by holding a second game in Canada, which nobody in America will be even dimly aware of.
 

razorsedge

Registered User
Oct 19, 2006
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And the complaints about being a gimmick are just dumb. It's working. Sorry you hate seeing the league grow... maybe you should follow the AHL or something.

Interesting statement, coming from somebody who's state's universities just had their own record setting gimmick.

The outdoor games have become a gimmick that doesn't really celebrate the history of the NHL they way it should.
 

Brodie

the dream of the 90s is alive in Detroit
Mar 19, 2009
15,399
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Chicago
of course the outdoor games are gimmicks... but they're also fun. I loved the Big Chill at the Big House (which I went to) and I love watching the WC's and HC's.

it's really not a big deal
 

bacon25

Unenthusiastic User
Nov 29, 2010
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Well the WC gimmick has backfired this year, with the game being held at night (which I think would it would be cooler to play at night) there won't be as wide of an audience as there would be earlier that day. The WC will have to compete with basketball, other hockey games and ....... the college bowl games. And it is the college bowl audience that needs to be watching hockey.
 

htpwn

Registered User
Nov 4, 2009
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So let's get this straight...

Point 1: Canadian teams can't participate in the WC because Americans don't care about Canada.

Point 2: Another outdoor game in Canada will dilute the effect of the Winter Classic in the United States.

:huh:
 

He Lied to Mario

Registered User
May 16, 2009
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Well the WC gimmick has backfired this year, with the game being held at night (which I think would it would be cooler to play at night) there won't be as wide of an audience as there would be earlier that day. The WC will have to compete with basketball, other hockey games and ....... the college bowl games. And it is the college bowl audience that needs to be watching hockey.

Actually the WC will have less bowl competition at 8PM. It's a blessing in disguise. There's only one bowl game at 8:30PM Connecticut and Oklahoma. Plus the end of the Rose Bowl. The 3 1PM games featured major programs; Florida, Penn State, Michigan State, Michigan, and Alabama. That means the ratings will be higher in Philadelphia, and Detroit for sure since they play their next game on Sunday afternoon. Pittsburgh will also have higher ratings.
 

CorbeauNoir

Registered User
Apr 13, 2010
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Football fans who hate hockey aren't NBC's target audience. Sports fans who don't have an investment in Penn State-Florida/Alabama-Michigan State and are channel surfing are, and there's way more of them than the first.

1) That demographic is dubious. People with no investment in participating WC teams still watch the game because they're hockey fans, why are football fans not going to be more likely to watch the sport they enjoy than a sport they don't?
2) If the supposed master plan for the WC is based off of casual channel surfing, what does it matter if a participating team is Canadian in the first place? Particularly one from a highly-recognizable city? Any American who has any potential interest in hockey is going to familiar with Vancouver. Again, if it's all supposed to be all about the event, it shouldn't matter who participates.
 

He Lied to Mario

Registered User
May 16, 2009
388
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1) That demographic is dubious. People with no investment in participating WC teams still watch the game because they're hockey fans, why are football fans not going to be more likely to watch the sport they enjoy than a sport they don't?
2) If the supposed master plan for the WC is based off of casual channel surfing, what does it matter if a participating team is Canadian in the first place? Particularly one from a highly-recognizable city? Any American who has any potential interest in hockey is going to familiar with Vancouver. Again, if it's all supposed to be all about the event, it shouldn't matter who participates.

Maybe because Vancouver's viewers don't count towards NBC's ratings which is what they use to sell spots to advertisers.
 

Gnashville

HFBoards Hall of Famer
Jan 7, 2003
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Another anti-Canadian rant by an American. I suspect he would also prefer that there were no Canadian teams in the NHL as well....:rant:
Your joking right:shakehead Scott Burnside is hated by Predators fans. When Jimmy boy tried to buy the team, he was on Baldy's side from the beginning, and ripped into Nashville fans worse than the Globe and Mail. He continued to even after the local ownership took over.

The Winter Classic is becoming a New Years tradition in the US. After College Football abandonded New Years Day the NHL has taken the Bull by the horns. Who says the Winter Classic is an American event or the Heritage is a Canadian one anyways.
 

bodybreak

Whiteshell Wild
Jul 11, 2006
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The Winter Classic is postponed due to rain so what is CBC showing in the game's original afternoon slot? A replay of the first ever Winter Classic!

Yeah, Canada must really hate the WC and it's all the Heritage Classic's fault :shakehead

NBC is showing 2009s game. Think I'll watch that as I had to miss it last year.
 

Moobles

Registered User
Mar 15, 2009
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Yeah, I'm so sick of outdoor games. They piss me off so ****ing much, I'm really angry. When I watch hockey, I need novelty. I need new, exciting. I don't watch for the game whatever ice conditions, I watch for a certain kind of game- the novel game.

No these events can't co-exist. When I watch hockey I can only handle so many conflicting types of these games. If there's a Winter Classic, you know there's no way in hell I'm watching a second outdoor game. Never. Whichever gets put first I'll watch, but the other one is just a cheap, nationalistic rip off.

Yes, it's a gimmick and it won't be helping much when the novelty wears off soon. It's not much better than a pre-season game as many players hold back due to the conditions of the ice.

Personally, I don't care if Canada gets to play them or not. The novelty wore off on me after the 2nd outdoor game.
 

berklon

Registered User
Dec 24, 2008
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Yeah, I'm so sick of outdoor games. They piss me off so ****ing much, I'm really angry. When I watch hockey, I need novelty. I need new, exciting. I don't watch for the game whatever ice conditions, I watch for a certain kind of game- the novel game.

No these events can't co-exist. When I watch hockey I can only handle so many conflicting types of these games. If there's a Winter Classic, you know there's no way in hell I'm watching a second outdoor game. Never. Whichever gets put first I'll watch, but the other one is just a cheap, nationalistic rip off.

I'm not sure how your response relates to my post that you quoted.
 

BigT2002

Registered User
Dec 6, 2006
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Somwhere
What do you expect? Its a way to give the fans and the players something different to experience the game. The fact its showboated blame that on the marketing departments for doing it.
 

Confucius

There is no try, Just do
Feb 8, 2009
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Toronto
I think it doesn't matter at all. Examine the facts. U S tv does not care about Canadian viewership. We hear that over and over. Americans don't care what happens in Canada between Canadian teams because they don't watch non American teams. So why would the heritage classic have any effect at all on the Winter Classic?
 

29dryden29

Registered User
Jul 4, 2010
3,393
1
London Ont
Of course it is, fans of the other 22 non-participating US teams are all tuning in to that one single game - exactly like what happens during the Stanley Cup Finals. The event itself is what draws high viewership, not the teams that happen to be playing it. The ratings don't prove anything about the kind of 'exposure' the WC is giving to hockey, ratings would be just as high if they exploited a cross-border rivalry like Habs-Bruins. If a fan of the Kings clearly hasn't given a **** about watching two US teams he otherwise couldn't care less about why would he suddenly stop watching when the oldest, most storied franchise in the league is involved?


And if you're a football fan who considers hockey a joke sport, which game are you going to watch?



Actually being a HABS fan I don't watch any other NHL games lol I watch the HABS and our national teams play and that is it. I don't watch NHL hockey after the HABS season is done no point for me honestly. I only follow CIS football also as I don't care for football or baseball as far as I am concerned if the sport isn't played with skates and a puck it isn't worth watching till the Olympics roll around anyhow.
 

Confucius

There is no try, Just do
Feb 8, 2009
21,890
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Toronto
Actually being a HABS fan I don't watch any other NHL games lol I watch the HABS and our national teams play and that is it. I don't watch NHL hockey after the HABS season is done no point for me honestly. I only follow CIS football also as I don't care for football or baseball as far as I am concerned if the sport isn't played with skates and a puck it isn't worth watching till the Olympics roll around anyhow.

I feel almost the same way. Since the weather was bad today and I was inside I would have tuned in to the game. However since the game is postponed to tonight, I'll be watching the Leaf game instead. U S tv doesn't care about my viewership anyway, so what's the big deal?

Speaking of the game time move. I guess CBC gets burned,(I'm guessing it must have paid something to air the game) were they going to show it? Now I assume they'll be airing the Leafs.
 

Murphy9

Registered User
Nov 8, 2010
563
0
St.Louis
The winter classic is such an obvious gimmick to try and gain fans, that it almost mocks the current fans. I'd rather see teams with a historic rivalry instead, but I guess if your gonna gain interest you want the two top stars to be in the game.

Whats wrong with attracting fans?
 

Dado

Guest
What conclusions would be reasonable to draw if the US TV ratings for the game aren't good?
 

29dryden29

Registered User
Jul 4, 2010
3,393
1
London Ont
What conclusions would be reasonable to draw if the US TV ratings for the game aren't good?

I would conclude that if the american viewers have nothing better to watch they will watch this game if something else peaks their interest it doesn't get a second thought.
 

29dryden29

Registered User
Jul 4, 2010
3,393
1
London Ont
I feel almost the same way. Since the weather was bad today and I was inside I would have tuned in to the game. However since the game is postponed to tonight, I'll be watching the Leaf game instead. U S tv doesn't care about my viewership anyway, so what's the big deal?

Speaking of the game time move. I guess CBC gets burned,(I'm guessing it must have paid something to air the game) were they going to show it? Now I assume they'll be airing the Leafs.

as much as it pains me to say this I hope CBC airs the Leafs lol and I am by no means a Leaf suppoerter but we should be airing our teams regardless of the **** show they call the WC hell why not forego the ASG and just have the WC if it seems to be such an important thing to the US. By the way I am not an advocate of the All Star Weekend either it is a joke and they should just go back to the game itself not the carnival sideshow it has become.
 

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