Can Rathbone follow Fox?

[VanJack]

I think many Canuck fans, myself included, have a tendency towards an abundance of caution in pumping the tires on incoming prospects. Too many disappointments over the years.

But Hughes broke out of the mold last season; and I have a sense that Rathbone might be cut from the same cloth. I know you can point to all kinds of reasons why it'll be tough for Rathbone to replicate what Fox and Marino did, coming out of the Harvard program. But in my limited viewing of the Crimson games, Rathbone has better basic tools than either of those guys. All he lacks is an extra season of NCAA hockey.

Besides, the likelihood of Edler staying healthy on the left side for an entire season is basically 'zero' imo. So Rathbone's competition for a job is Benn and Juolevi. And his skating is already light years ahead of either of those guys.

I think the Canucks walking away from Tanev, Stecher and Tanev in the off-season tells me they're counting on at least one of their young -men, and possibly two, breaking down the doors at training camp. And given the Canucks injury history on the blueline, Rathbone, Rafferty and Juolevi will probably see lots of playing time anyway.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

I think many Canuck fans, myself included, have a tendency towards an abundance of caution in pumping the tires on incoming prospects. Too many disappointments over the years.

But Hughes broke out of the mold last season; and I have a sense that Rathbone might be cut from the same cloth. I know you can point to all kinds of reasons why it'll be tough for Rathbone to replicate what Fox and Marino did, coming out of the Harvard program. But in my limited viewing of the Crimson games, Rathbone has better basic tools than either of those guys. All he lacks is an extra season of NCAA hockey.

Besides, the likelihood of Edler staying healthy on the left side for an entire season is basically 'zero' imo. So Rathbone's competition for a job is Benn and Juolevi. And his skating is already light years ahead of either of those guys.

I think the Canucks walking away from Tanev, Stecher and Tanev in the off-season tells me they're counting on at least one of their young -men, and possibly two, breaking down the doors at training camp. And given the Canucks injury history on the blueline, Rathbone, Rafferty and Juolevi will probably see lots of playing time anyway.

The Canucks are not going 'all in', in this condensed (Canadian teams?) season....There's no better time to put the younger players in, I think ,given the opportunity, some of them will surprise...

I still see Benning acquiring a vet 3rd pairing D man before alls said and done. (another Luke Schenn type player).Injury is a given, and these younger players will get their shot.

 

[HockeyNightInAsia]

The Canucks are not going 'all in', in this condensed (Canadian teams?) season....There's no better time to put the younger players in, I think ,given the opportunity, some of them will surprise...

I still see Benning acquiring a vet 3rd pairing D man before alls said and done. (another Luke Schenn type player).Injury is a given, and these younger players will get their shot.

In terms of contract status, Rafferty is probably the guy Nucks had wanted to play the most, should have even tried him during this past season, but his defensive side probably isn’t ready.

So now I wonder if Rafferty is still unready, and if so this 3rd pairing D should be right-sided, allowing a battle of Juolevi/Rathbone for playing time. The Rathbone fan in me says he would win.

 

[StreetHawk]

While I think Rathbone has a higher upside than Rafferty and Juolevi and ends up the best of the three, I think it’s highly optimistic to expect him to replicate the arc of Fox and Marino. It would be huge for the organization if he did but just because they played for Harvard doesn’t mean it’s the most likely scenario.

But we are not talking about the long term career here. We are talking about just this upcoming season and for me I don’t expect Rathbone to make the impact that Fox did.
He might but I would not count on it. Similar to Stecher in that you can hope an undersized undrafted kids makes the roster out of camp but probably best not to put money on it, though Stecher came back up just over a week into the season and never went back down.

 

[ChilliBilly]

Like what I have heard about Rathbone, but there is a big question here. What is this season going to look like? Where are the AHL teams going to play? No use in having a Utica team if there is a 2 week quarantine to bring a player up. not clear at all on what is going to happen this year.

 

[kcunac]

I like Rathbone alot but i don't think successful teams should be counting on rookies, especially later picks, making the team. Unless we sign another D-man both Rathbon one and Juolevi could certanily make the team, which i don't think is fair to either:

Hughes - Myers
Edler - Schmidt
Juolevi/Rathbone - Benn
Juolevi/Rathbone.

 

[ChilliBilly]

I like Rathbone alot but i don't think successful teams should be counting on rookies, especially later picks, making the team. Unless we sign another D-man both Rathbon one and Juolevi could certanily make the team, which i don't think is fair to either:

Hughes - Myers
Edler - Schmidt
Juolevi/Rathbone - Benn
Juolevi/Rathbone.

Its not like they are teenagers, 21 and 22. But yes lets hope they find a way out of their cap hell.

 

[VanJack]

I like Rathbone alot but i don't think successful teams should be counting on rookies, especially later picks, making the team. Unless we sign another D-man both Rathbon one and Juolevi could certanily make the team, which i don't think is fair to either:

Hughes - Myers
Edler - Schmidt
Juolevi/Rathbone - Benn
Juolevi/Rathbone.

The only way the Canucks are going to be able to add another d-man is via the trade route....and there'd have to be an equal contract number going back the other way to fit under the cap. Pretty unlikely.

And even if there was someone left as a UFA who could help (and scanning the list, I can't see who that would be), the Canucks have no cap room to fit them in anyway.

So it's down to two of Juolevi, Rafferty or Rathbone almost by default.

 

[kcunac]

Yes but its not like they have been dominating the AHL. Prospects take different amounts of time to develop.

Its not like they are teenagers, 21 and 22. But yes lets hope they find a way out of their cap hell.

 

[kcunac]

The only way the Canucks are going to be able to add another d-man is via the trade route....and there'd have to be an equal contract number going back the other way to fit under the cap. Pretty unlikely.

And even if there was someone left as a UFA who could help (and scanning the list, I can't see who that would be), the Canucks have no cap room to fit them in anyway.

So it's down to two of Juolevi, Rafferty or Rathbone almost by default.

There are plenty of D getting signed for approximately the same that Rathbone or Juolevi make. I've seen some names is this thread, like Jan Rutta for example.

If /when Ferland goes on LTIR we would have over 2 million in cap with a 22 man roster. This could be enough for a Vatanen type, for example.

 

[VanJack]

There are plenty of D getting signed for approximately the same that Rathbone or Juolevi make. I've seen some names is this thread, like Jan Rutta for example.

If /when Ferland goes on LTIR we would have over 2 million in cap with a 22 man roster. This could be enough for a Vatanen type, for example.

Vatanen earned $4.3m last season and Rutta made about $2.36m. Both Rathbone and Juolevi are still on entry level contracts barely earning more than the league minimum.

With the season still a couple of months away, there's no way either Vatanen or Rutta is coming to the Canucks for a one-year contact of $800,000 or so. Besides, the Canucks are in the market for a scoring winger in case Virtanen doesn't cut it in the top-six. And that's a higher priority right now than some depth d-man in the Oscar Fantenberg mold.

So unless something unexpected lands in the their laps like the trade for Schmidt, what you see is what you're going to get on the blueline. So it's
trial by fire' for Rathbone, Rafferty and Juolevi.

 

[kcunac]

Vatanen earned $4.3m last season and Rutta made about $2.36m. Both Rathbone and Juolevi are still on entry level contracts barely earning more than the league minimum.

With the season still a couple of months away, there's no way either Vatanen or Rutta is coming to the Canucks for a one-year contact of $800,000 or so. Besides, the Canucks are in the market for a scoring winger in case Virtanen doesn't cut it in the top-six. And that's a higher priority right now than some depth d-man in the Oscar Fantenberg mold.

So unless something unexpected lands in the their laps like the trade for Schmidt, what you see is what you're going to get on the blueline. So it's
trial by fire' for Rathbone, Rafferty and Juolevi.

I hope you're wrong. You may be right. If so, my original point was and continues to be that the Nucks should sign another depth NHL d-man. While perhaps my examples weren't the best ones (though I think you are overestimating the contracts Rutta and Vatanen will receive), there are still NHL depth defenseman free agents that can and should be signed for league minimum to create competition for the bottom pair - as opposed to just handing it to rookies who may not be ready. Fantenberg would have been a good example, except we should be looking at a RHD, since we have only one on the roster. Signing a cheap depth defenseman for near minimum has no impact on the cap, it just creates competition. I agree we also need a F, but that doesn't mean we can't also be looking for or signing depth D.

 

[Lindgren]

Rathbone! What a prospect!

 

[VanJack]

Rathbone! What a prospect!

Canucks Army reporting that Rathbone had an outstanding first day of training camp......his skating skills, defending against NHL players and transitioning the puck stood out.

Pretty exciting young prospect on the blueline.....can he follow in the footsteps of Marino and Fox from Harvard and crack the NHL in his rookie season? Unfortunately the lack of any exhibition games will really make it tough, but he's knocking on the door.

 

[logan5]

Looking back at Ben Hutton and Troy Stecher, they both went almost directly from college to the NHL (they both played 4 games in Utica). Rathbone seems a lot more highly touted than both those guys. Certainly far better offensively, so it would not surprise me to see him make the team out of training camp.

The leap from College to the NHL must not be all that huge...

 

[Pip]

Seems like he’s gone from everyone’s favourite under the radar prospect to a can’t miss overnight. Hmmm

 

[HockeyNightInAsia]

Looking back at Ben Hutton and Troy Stecher, they both went almost directly from college to the NHL (they both played 4 games in Utica). Rathbone seems a lot more highly touted than both those guys. Certainly far better offensively, so it would not surprise me to see him make the team out of training camp.

The leap from College to the NHL must not be all that huge...

Yep. Such occurrences seemed rare the previous decade, but NCAA must have improved quite a bit last 10 years, at least in terms of continuity towards the NHL. Usually quite similar for forwards like a Gaudette too. We shall see whether Rathbone or Michaelis can show it this year.

 

[StreetHawk]

Looking back at Ben Hutton and Troy Stecher, they both went almost directly from college to the NHL (they both played 4 games in Utica). Rathbone seems a lot more highly touted than both those guys. Certainly far better offensively, so it would not surprise me to see him make the team out of training camp.

The leap from College to the NHL must not be all that huge...

Hutton, Stecher, Marino were all seniors from the ncaa. Played like double what Rathbone did as he only did 2 years there. It’s possible but i wouldn’t keep him or Olli around just for the taxi squad. It’s fine to start there if the A isn’t up and running until Feb but once it is better to have them go down and play and use a Sautner on the taxi squad instead.

 

[VanJack]

Just caught up with the Rathbone interview after practice yesterday. Impressive. Say what you want about a Harvard education, but the kid is mature beyond his years.

And in terms of stature, he may be under 6' but he's clearly built up his upper body. I can understand why he's more than holding his own in the one-on-one battle drills.

He's knocking on the door, and at the very least he ends up on the taxi squad. And when the inevitable injuries hit the blueline he makes his NHL debut this season. Almost an automatic.

 

[StreetHawk]

Just caught up with the Rathbone interview after practice yesterday. Impressive. Say what you want about a Harvard education, but the kid is mature beyond his years.

And in terms of stature, he may be under 6' but he's clearly built up his upper body. I can understand why he's more than holding his own in the one-on-one battle drills.

He's knocking on the door, and at the very least he ends up on the taxi squad. And when the inevitable injuries hit the blueline he makes his NHL debut this season. Almost an automatic.

He won’t be on the taxi for the whole season if the A is up and running. Like I said earlier taxi is for emergency like you 15-17 forward or 8-9 Dman. Not expected to play if all goes well.

he could start on the taxi since the A isn’t up and running yet. But he’d be sent down once they do if he is not playing nhl games.

 

[701]

Interesting to compare Rathbone and Hughes re their NCAA stats. The comparison doesn't prove much of anything,
but with two intelligent, driven young athletes famous for their skating ability it's reasonable to wonder if their past
might be prologue to their future success. In the case of Hughes we know the answer. The question is about Rathbone.

Both played two NCAA seasons, totalling 69 (H) and 61 (R) games. They tallied 62 and 53 points, for points-per-game
averages of (rounded up) .90 (H) and .87 (R), and their plus-minuses were +12 (H) and +13 (R). Hughes had more
assists in his point total, while Rathbone had more goals: .15 goals per game (H) and .24 goals per game (R).

In other raw metrics, Hughes is listed in DB and EP as 5'10" / 170 pounds, while Rathbone is listed as 5'11" / 190.
I have almost zero faith in these numbers being accurate at the present time, but perhaps at least they're equally wrong.
What can't be argued is that Hughes is about 5 months younger than Rathbone: Oct 14 1999 (H) and May 20 1999 (R).
Both are currently 21 years old.

So Rathbone is almost a half-year older than Hughes, is taller and heavier by good margin (maybe), and has a shot that's
well-known to be high-end for the NCAA. So far, though, he has zero pro experience thus no track recored in the NHL.

Hughes in his rookie season proved to be one of the best young defensemen in the history of the NHL, and is now an
established star. Could lightning strike twice?

My guess is that Hughes is a freak, and Rathbone is a semi-freak who needs time in and out of NHL games, on the taxi squad
or on the Comets during this short season upcoming. And that next season we'll find out that it did indeed strike twice.

 

[UnleashRasmus]

There are a few kids coming up that can ease the pressure of losing Tanev. Obviously, Hamonic is the guy to take the natural step, but I'd rather see more of Rathbone and Joulevi than Benn.

 

[VanJack]

Rathbone with another strong scrimmage tonight.....the way he reads the play, head-mans the puck and joins the rush reminds you of Quinn Hughes lite.....but he might actually have a harder, more accurate shot than Quinn from the point.

He also played well defensively, and is proving hard to beat in one-on-one battles. With Hamonic likely unavailable until opening night, and having played so little in the last eight months, I could see a scenario where both Juolevi and Rathbone are on the opening night roster.

 

[kcunac]

Rathbone with another strong scrimmage tonight.....the way he reads the play, head-mans the puck and joins the rush reminds you of Quinn Hughes lite.....but he might actually have a harder, more accurate shot than Quinn from the point.

Rathbone has always had a good slapshot, Hughes not so much

 

[VanJack]

There are a few kids coming up that can ease the pressure of losing Tanev. Obviously, Hamonic is the guy to take the natural step, but I'd rather see more of Rathbone and Joulevi than Benn.

I'm with you on this one.....Green loves his veterans. But Benn is a UFA at the end of this season, and there's no scenario in which the Canucks re-sign him.

So unless Juolevi and Rathbone really start to struggle, I'd rather seem them in the lineup learning the NHL ropes of the fly. They'll be much better players by the end of the season for going through an entire NHL season.