Player Discussion Cam Fowler

[Ducks DVM]

lost without Theo and Vatanen. Is there some rule that a team can only have 1 player with a dangerous shot I don't know about? Where are we if there's an injury?

Furthermore, I love Theo, but he can't match Sami's one-timer, as far as I know.

It's trumped by the rule that there's no rule against having two defensemen who can anchor a top pairing. Where are we if Lindholm gets injured?

Theodore has a better GPG and essentially the same PPG this year, granted sample size is too small to mean anything.

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[DaDucks*]

It's trumped by the rule that there's no rule against having two defensemen who can anchor a top pairing. Where are we if Lindholm gets injured?

Theodore has a better GPG and essentially the same PPG this year, granted sample size is too small to mean anything.

We're back to distributing the minutes, and we have Despres back now. We just won a bunch of games without Fowler AND Despres, c'mon man.

 

[Sojourn]

We're back to distributing the minutes, and we have Despres back now. We just won a bunch of games without Fowler AND Despres, c'mon man.

You just proved DVM's point. We won a bunch of games because we had someone like Lindholm to step up. What happens if Fowler is moved, and Lindholm is the one getting injured? You really think Vatanen is going to be the guy carrying the blue line? Or Bieksa?

 

[Ducks DVM]

We're back to distributing the minutes, and we have Despres back now. We just won a bunch of games without Fowler AND Despres, c'mon man.

Because we currently have TWO defensemen able to anchor a top pairing, and Vatanen isn't one of them. Trade Fowler, and Lindholm gets injured, we have zero. That's the point. Bieksa - Vatanen is a top pairing for a team interested in a top 3 pick.

Edit - dammit. Ninja'd by a cartoon character.

 

[Sojourn]

In a skirt!

Uh, kilt. I meant a kilt.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I was going to say "who won't wear pants" to keep the irony going.

 

[DaDucks*]

You just proved DVM's point. We won a bunch of games because we had someone like Lindholm to step up. What happens if Fowler is moved, and Lindholm is the one getting injured? You really think Vatanen is going to be the guy carrying the blue line? Or Bieksa?

DVM credited the forwards for stepping up, not the D corpse, in Fowler's absence. We can win as long as that is maintained. It will even be bolstered with the return we get from Cam.
We lose key people to injury, it happens. We play very good team defense with distributed minutes, and we have Despres back now, who nobody seems to want to aknowlege. Bieksa-Vats certainly looks better than the current pairing.

Besides, we're catching Cam in his recovery cycle. It could take a whole offseason to see him back as a "shutdown guy."

 

[Sojourn]

DVM credited the forwards for stepping up, not the D corpse, in Fowler's absence. We can win as long as that is maintained. It will even be bolstered with the return we get from Cam.
We lose key people to injury, it happens. We play very good team defense with distributed minutes, and we have Despres back now, who nobody seems to want to aknowlege. Bieksa-Vats certainly looks better than the current pairing.

Besides, we're catching Cam in his recovery cycle. It could take a whole offseason to see him back as a "shutdown guy."

Fowler had his best game tonight since coming back. He's already getting better. And you're bolstering something that wouldn't need to be bolstered nearly as much if you replace Vatanen with Theodore. Theodore is a better fit there.

And you're just living a fantasy if you think we can go anywhere in the playoffs with Lindholm and "team defense".

 

[DaDucks*]

Because we currently have TWO defensemen able to anchor a top pairing, and Vatanen isn't one of them. Trade Fowler, and Lindholm gets injured, we have zero. That's the point. Bieksa - Vatanen is a top pairing for a team interested in a top 3 pick.

Edit - dammit. Ninja'd by a cartoon character.

so you're talking about long term injury? Well, we'd have to make a trade. Shouldn't be too hard finding a guy to match Cam's numbers.

 

[Sojourn]

As far as shutdown hockey goes, who spent the most time against the Giroux/Voracek line? Hint: it wasn't Lindholm.

 

[Ducks DVM]

DVM credited the forwards for stepping up, not the D corpse, in Fowler's absence. We can win as long as that is maintained. It will even be bolstered with the return we get from Cam.
We lose key people to injury, it happens. We play very good team defense with distributed minutes, and we have Despres back now, who nobody seems to want to aknowlege. Bieksa-Vats certainly looks better than the current pairing.

Besides, we're catching Cam in his recovery cycle. It could take a whole offseason to see him back as a "shutdown guy."

You're completely ignoring the "what if Lindholm gets injured" thing.

so you're talking about long term injury? Well, we'd have to make a trade. Shouldn't be too hard finding a guy to match Cam's numbers.

You're planning on making a trade during the playoffs how, exactly? 1-2 weeks is long term enough at that time of year.

 

[DaDucks*]

Fowler had his best game tonight since coming back. He's already getting better. And you're bolstering something that wouldn't need to be bolstered nearly as much if you replace Vatanen with Theodore. Theodore is a better fit there.

And you're just living a fantasy if you think we can go anywhere in the playoffs with Lindholm and "team defense".

Cam is a minus factory. He can go.

 

[Sojourn]

Cam is a minus factory. He can go.

Are you back to this again? What happened to original ideas?

 

[Ducks DVM]

If we lose Lindholm in the playoffs, it's most likely over.

That's the point. That's why you need multiple top pairing D.

Lindholm has to prove he can not get worse in the playoffs before we should be relying on him as the guy regardless.

 

[Sojourn]

That's the point. That's why you need multiple top pairing D.

Lindholm has to prove he can not get worse in the playoffs before we should be relying on him as the guy regardless.

I don't think either of them are the guy at this point. Which is, well, the point. We need both of them. We absolutely need them in the playoffs.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I don't think either of them are the guy at this point. Which is, well, the point. We need both of them. We absolutely need them in the playoffs.

Agreed. Fowler at least has shown the ability to up his play though. And having two shutdown capable pairings is much better when a team has two offense capable lines.

 

[DaDucks*]

That's the point. That's why you need multiple top pairing D.

Lindholm has to prove he can not get worse in the playoffs before we should be relying on him as the guy regardless.

Using one of my lines, nice. Can't argue that.

Sure, I can let him finish out the year. Doesn't have to be now.

Fowler has got to put points on the board.

http://ducks.nhl.com/club/m_player.htm?id=8475764

 

[Sojourn]

Agreed. Fowler at least has shown the ability to up his play though. And having two shutdown capable pairings is much better when a team has two offense capable lines.

Absolutely. For me, it's all about the playoffs. Two shutdown capable pairings is definitely what you want. You won't always get the match ups you want, and having two gives you options. It also gives you a redundancy if one goes down.

As you've said before, Fowler is also the guy who has proven he play with **** and make it stink a bit less. He's done it for most of his career.

 

[DaDucks*]

It's redundant if Cam's numbers don't improve. He APPEARS to have less trouble than Sami handling the tougher match ups, but the results aren't nearly as good. The Vatanen-Bieksa pairing is better than what we are seeing now. It should be only a matter of time until Despres and Cam are put back together. This is ridiculous. Cam's like a Ferrari, only with a Honda engine. Who wants to pay full sticker price for that in two years? Not me.

 

[nbducksfan19]

If we lose Lindholm in the playoffs, it's most likely over.

correct if we lose lindholm, having fowler will not save us.

Also, i am not understanding the logic that you can't trade Cam, because if Lindholm gets hurt in the playoffs, we are screwed. It ignores the return we would get. What if Getz gets hurt... But What if we had traded Cam for Nugent-Hopkins and Johansen, then we would be glad we did it? Because without Getz and another great center, we would be screwed.

 

[Ducks Nation*]

Fowler is a great defensemen but bieksa anchors anyone he is with, I do wish Fowler was alittlr stronger on the boards even Sami wins more battles than Fowler.

And whoever said Theodore shot can replace vatanen don't kid yourself vatanen has a bomb and Theodore has a snapshot that he is really really good at getting through. It's like comparing a Karlsson lite shot to a Weber lite shot. Different things, if we could have both on a PP it would be awesome.

 

[Nordic*]

As far as shutdown hockey goes, who spent the most time against the Giroux/Voracek line? Hint: it wasn't Lindholm.

Which makes me question what they coaches are thinking.

In my eyes, Lindholm is the overall best defenceman on this team. He can handle both the speed and the heavier/physical opponents - which Fowler and Vatanen struggle against.

It's a shame that both Fowler and #47 are lefties, would love to see them together.

 

[George Binks]

Oh man this is already good

 

[manspaceman]

Cam's like a Ferrari, only with a Honda engine. Who wants to pay full sticker price for that in two years? Not me.

Wait, what? Shouldn't Honda be like the best car ever? PAY THE FULL PRICE, DUCK!

 

[Ducks DVM]

correct if we lose lindholm, having fowler will not save us.

Also, i am not understanding the logic that you can't trade Cam, because if Lindholm gets hurt in the playoffs, we are screwed. It ignores the return we would get. What if Getz gets hurt... But What if we had traded Cam for Nugent-Hopkins and Johansen, then we would be glad we did it? Because without Getz and another great center, we would be screwed.

The return will be a forward. Another forward won't help us if all of our D is a 3-4 at best.

I'll assume you meant RNH OR Johansen, and my answer is that neither has proven squat in the playoffs, and neither is what I'd call a defensive standout.

I really don't get the Lindholm worship around here. Let's swap him back to Bieksa and see how well he does again. Or are we still pretending that partners don't matter? Note - I'm not saying Lindholm is no good. I AM saying that he has not shown the ability to play well when his partner doesn't play well though, and find it amusing that Fowler's ability to play a top pairing role while lugging Lovejoy and Bieksa around is seen as no big thing when Lindholm looked like he'd regressed about 3 years when placed with Bieksa.