Iron Balls McGinty
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One thing to point out is that winning games will create loyalty to the city. Loyalty to the city alone won’t win games.
Pittsburgh is proof of that.
Confirmed with Link: Cam Atkinson traded to PHI for Jake Voracek
- Thread starter MAHJ71
- Start date
One thing to point out is that winning games will create loyalty to the city. Loyalty to the city alone won’t win games.
Pittsburgh is proof of that.
Double-Shift Lasse
Just post better
There’s a story about an old college football coach, who’s watching young players on the recruiting trail with an assistant.
They watch a kid get kicked down and not get up and the head coach says “That’s not the type of player we’re looking for.”
Then they see an kid get knocked down and get back up and the assistant says “That’s the kind of player we want, right?” But the head coach says nope.
So then they see a kid who keeps getting knocked down but always get up and is right back at it. The assistant says “Is that the kind of player we want?”
And the head coach says “You find me the kid who’s doing all of the knocking down. THAT’S the kind of player we want.”
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My take on “Loyalty:”
Player: “I hate it here and want out.”
Team: “So long, Asshat.”
Player: “I love it here!”
Team: “That’s great, we won’t have to get rid of you for being an asshat!”
As for the Cam trade, I think I posted it already, but from a hockey perspective I really like it, IMO Voracek is the better hockey player. Cam has played last two seasons at 22 goal pace and I don't really think he brings enough on the table otherwise to say that his usefulness is not pretty directly related to how much goals he scores.
The discussion around Cam/Laine and whether he was the guy (or one of) who wanted Laine gone highlights to me why I have zero respect for players leaking things like that to the media. If you really want him gone, have the balls to say it out in the open. Now we have some player/players whispering things from the dark and since it's not publicly known who exactly it is, it's just throwing shade on everyone. If I was running the team, I wouldn't want guys like that in the room.
I don't think sticking with the old core was really an option for CBJ, since all the most important players of that core are gone anyway. Comparing the CBJ core to Bruins seems a bit silly, and while I don't think all 'core players' need to be the best players in the team in their position, most of them should be. In a highly competitive environment it just holds a lot more weight for others if it comes from the best. Certainly you can be a good leader even from the middle of the lineup, but I'd say it's a bit different if Patrice Bergeron tells you how things should be done than if Cam Atkinson or Boone Jenner does (just an example). No slight to Jenner or Atkinson but Bergeron has the hardware, including the Cup and many deep runs, to add some weight to his words.
What comes to Laine, I don't think Jarmo 'needs' to make Laine great, or anyone else to make Laine great, what he needs is a Laine who gets back to his level and some players around him who can make some use of those talents. Last season Laine was on pace for 21 goals, which is by far the worst pace of his career this far. He scored 30-44 goals pre covid per season and in his last covid shortened full season as a Jet he was on pace for 34/82. CBJ simply needs Laine not underperforming, they don't need to turn him into anything he already isn't / hasn't been. Laine isn't a 'playdriver' but when he's anywhere near his best he isn't a passenger either, 16-17, 17-18 or 19-20 he wasn't a passenger 5v5 on his lines. But when he is struggling he digs himself a very deep hole, latter part of 18-19 and 20-21 were good examples of that, he was so deep in he was dragging others down with him. That's something he needs to sort out, even when you suck you should be able to maintain some kind of baseline of performance. In any case Laine is young enough he could still be at the height of his prime when some of these recents picks make their impact on very favourable ELC contracts.
I think from this trade alone it's clear full on tanking isn't in the plans, I think the idea is to stay as competitive as possible and then when you get those guys on ELCs making an impact, go all in. I think it's a good plan, I hate tanking.
The discussion around Cam/Laine and whether he was the guy (or one of) who wanted Laine gone highlights to me why I have zero respect for players leaking things like that to the media. If you really want him gone, have the balls to say it out in the open. Now we have some player/players whispering things from the dark and since it's not publicly known who exactly it is, it's just throwing shade on everyone. If I was running the team, I wouldn't want guys like that in the room.
I don't think sticking with the old core was really an option for CBJ, since all the most important players of that core are gone anyway. Comparing the CBJ core to Bruins seems a bit silly, and while I don't think all 'core players' need to be the best players in the team in their position, most of them should be. In a highly competitive environment it just holds a lot more weight for others if it comes from the best. Certainly you can be a good leader even from the middle of the lineup, but I'd say it's a bit different if Patrice Bergeron tells you how things should be done than if Cam Atkinson or Boone Jenner does (just an example). No slight to Jenner or Atkinson but Bergeron has the hardware, including the Cup and many deep runs, to add some weight to his words.
What comes to Laine, I don't think Jarmo 'needs' to make Laine great, or anyone else to make Laine great, what he needs is a Laine who gets back to his level and some players around him who can make some use of those talents. Last season Laine was on pace for 21 goals, which is by far the worst pace of his career this far. He scored 30-44 goals pre covid per season and in his last covid shortened full season as a Jet he was on pace for 34/82. CBJ simply needs Laine not underperforming, they don't need to turn him into anything he already isn't / hasn't been. Laine isn't a 'playdriver' but when he's anywhere near his best he isn't a passenger either, 16-17, 17-18 or 19-20 he wasn't a passenger 5v5 on his lines. But when he is struggling he digs himself a very deep hole, latter part of 18-19 and 20-21 were good examples of that, he was so deep in he was dragging others down with him. That's something he needs to sort out, even when you suck you should be able to maintain some kind of baseline of performance. In any case Laine is young enough he could still be at the height of his prime when some of these recents picks make their impact on very favourable ELC contracts.
I think from this trade alone it's clear full on tanking isn't in the plans, I think the idea is to stay as competitive as possible and then when you get those guys on ELCs making an impact, go all in. I think it's a good plan, I hate tanking.
William Nylander had terrible stats in one season, in 57 games 7 goals and 20 assists.. Before and after he didn't have similar. William Nylander at eliteprospects.com
I understand you're sad. But players like Cam can't be the main players. Jarmo knows it. His ideal partners are out. The team goes different way, CBJ doesn't need players like Nick Foligno, Cam Atkinson, David Savard anymore. Nothing bad simply style of play will be other.
Other thing, why did Jarmo say it so harshly.
I understand you're sad. But players like Cam can't be the main players. Jarmo knows it. His ideal partners are out. The team goes different way, CBJ doesn't need players like Nick Foligno, Cam Atkinson, David Savard anymore. Nothing bad simply style of play will be other.
Other thing, why did Jarmo say it so harshly.
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Just 2 things to consider:
1. Give it some time. Cam may have been much more popular with the fans then he was with his team mates.
2. Rumblings of Cam (post trade deadline) maybe hoping/assuming he would get the C.
I think we got the better player (worse contract albeit). Let's see how the team comes together. Again I don't think we will be good, but see who emerges and takes a leadership position.
1. Give it some time. Cam may have been much more popular with the fans then he was with his team mates.
2. Rumblings of Cam (post trade deadline) maybe hoping/assuming he would get the C.
I think we got the better player (worse contract albeit). Let's see how the team comes together. Again I don't think we will be good, but see who emerges and takes a leadership position.
cslebn
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I'm really just hoping Voracek is to Laine what Jagr was to him.
Iron Balls McGinty
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I'm not convinced the contract is worse. Real dollars left for Voracek are 21.25 and Cam is 21.1. Sure the cap hit is higher but the contract ends a year earlier for a player who is arguably more talented.
JacketsFanWest
Registered User
Agreed. Too many of the young players see where they are and what they want to be. But they see the route to get there is leaving the Jackets. Jake went through that process, but also was one of the players the young guys could look to that took off after leaving. It wasn't as simple as that though and hopefully Jake will be able to communicate that.
cslebn
80 forever
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We know can loved Columbus but let's not underplay the fact that Jake seems happy with the city too.
We traded him before and he's still got good words for us so maybe we should emphasize that he is happy to come back as far as the loyalty / attractive location optics.
We traded him before and he's still got good words for us so maybe we should emphasize that he is happy to come back as far as the loyalty / attractive location optics.
KJ Dangler
Registered User
According to Friedman, Philly front office knew their were a lot of players that didn’t like coach/ staff , their chemistry was a mess last yr , they have doubled down on backing the coaching staff , and feel that Cams good guy attitude was why Philly gave up a Voracek for Cam .
Long Live Lyle
Registered User
Hopefully the "loyalty" charade will stop on both sides now, and the organization starts fully focusing on the future instead of past pettiness and give up the "woe is us" attitude. (I'm fine for fans to hold grievances, talking about the organization itself.) That whole thing blew up yesterday.
LetsGOJackets!!
Registered User
build a winner, and the fans, city and NHL will get behind it. Detroit (Hockeytown) is a perfect example of that. Put together a winning organization that keeps competing & winning and Columbus will be a great place to be. Players leaking their agenda's to Portzy has struck a bad chord from the very beginning. Was there discord on the team, yes, frankly the CBJ just wasn't very good.
Note to Mgmt.. when we get these talented players and you want to play hardball in the negotiations.. get some 3rd party comps and pay the going rate. If you feel like swinging a hammer - please take a walk in the park and remember the 2021 team instead. Ownership, Management, Coaching, Leadership and team must be on the same page.
Ownership group: build a winning hockey organization to win a Stanley Cup. If that isn't your focus, sell the team.
Note to Mgmt.. when we get these talented players and you want to play hardball in the negotiations.. get some 3rd party comps and pay the going rate. If you feel like swinging a hammer - please take a walk in the park and remember the 2021 team instead. Ownership, Management, Coaching, Leadership and team must be on the same page.
Ownership group: build a winning hockey organization to win a Stanley Cup. If that isn't your focus, sell the team.
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Excepting Anderson in 2017, which was notably egregious, we aren't the only team paying RFAs in this range. A lot of clubs are trying to do the same thing. Every team wants to be that team where players expect to give a little discount to help build a better club.
Cyclones Rock
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Read a post on the main board about this trade that made a very good point I thought about the business impact of the trade.
Voracek has some decent marketability for the CBJ. Given that the team isn't a sell out every game team and that it probably won't be a playoff team this season, that's important. I started following the team the first year Voracek was gone, so he doesn't have any "pull" for me in terms of familiarity, but he no doubt does with a fair number of longer term fans. Given Cam's popularity, it may soothe his loss for some.
Certainly not the moving force behind the trade-perhaps it wasn't even considered by the front office. But a marketing benefit nonetheless I would think.
Voracek has some decent marketability for the CBJ. Given that the team isn't a sell out every game team and that it probably won't be a playoff team this season, that's important. I started following the team the first year Voracek was gone, so he doesn't have any "pull" for me in terms of familiarity, but he no doubt does with a fair number of longer term fans. Given Cam's popularity, it may soothe his loss for some.
Certainly not the moving force behind the trade-perhaps it wasn't even considered by the front office. But a marketing benefit nonetheless I would think.
There are definitely a lot of us who will get the feels seeing him back. We watched him get drafted live in nationwide. I have his jersey. I’ll miss Cam, but Jake being the return helps a lot.
For me being from NS I got to see Jake a few times in Halifax back in the day so Ive been a fan for a long time. Was pretty sad to see him go.
Like I mentioned previously he learned a lot from Jagr and really grew as a player. All the optics off the ice like fanfair is cool and all but I think hes another voice in the room who seems like a tough but fair kind of guy. He hates to lose and seems like a lot more vocal than a guy like Boone which the room could probably use these next couple years
Like I mentioned previously he learned a lot from Jagr and really grew as a player. All the optics off the ice like fanfair is cool and all but I think hes another voice in the room who seems like a tough but fair kind of guy. He hates to lose and seems like a lot more vocal than a guy like Boone which the room could probably use these next couple years
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
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LetsGOJackets!!
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Having thought a little bit about this I have to disagree, there were issues with Ryan Johansen's contract, with Andy and PLD. Quite a few contract negotiations have gone sideways here in Columbus. As you mention all Mgmt groups are trying to get deals, that is their job. Columbus needs to win and make themselves an organization and destination of choice. Then home town discounts might occur if players want to stay around on a winner.
Didn’t Stralman play on a team with Jake? Maybe not on the last team Jake played on, though.
Viqsi
"that chick from Ohio"
Yeah, that's why I specified "the last time he played"; I wasn't about to go through every roster.
I3LI3
Registered User
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Alpha Couturier
How has Jake been so far? Always loved the guy, not the most professional of athletes but a real character and no doubting his talent.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
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Good. He’s been a blessing for the PP, but 5on5 he’s just been fine.
Glad Cam is continuing his tradition of starting hot. Wish him the best
