Calvin De Haan

[Darth Milbury]

Well, he's 6'1 which is about the average height of a defenseman. Maybe an inch shy of average, not sure. Either way, physicality is of no importance to me. Being able to play reliable defense is all that should matter, and that's something de Haan does well. Not to mention his ability on the breakout, which is another huge problem for this team. Once the puck enters our zone it stays there, and when we're lucky enough to get the puck it's quickly flubbed to the blue-line and sent right back in deep. de Haan has enough skill and poise to help in that area.

I understand wanting him to shake off whatever rust remains in Bridgeport, but I don't know how anyone could be against seeing him here with the current personnel we're icing. Especially with the reasoning being "he's small".

de Haan is actually only a tad bigger than Hickey. I think he still weighs in between 180 and 190 pounds. There is no bulk to his body at all - I saw him in warm ups one night and his chest looks almost concave.

it is fine to have a few mobile puck handling types that are not all that physical on the blueline. Its not fine when nearly all your dmen are of that ilk. A blueline of Hickey, Ness, Martinek, and de Haan could be out muscled by some high school teams. Heck, the #2 dman on the team I played for (I was the number one!) was 6'3" 230 pounds.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

I honestly feel bad for him. The fact that he's been hurt so much has translated to him not being a talented prospect in some eyes, which is completely false. If he can stay on the ice and get past his shoulder issues, I don't see why he couldn't become a key part of our future blue-line(maybe even our present blue-line).

I don't know how you can say that Blink. If we had put Potvin in a coat closet until the age of 26 then pulled him out would he have been even half the force he was? Doubtful. If you want to say that he is a recoverable asset to some degree that's fine, but CdH has lost a significant amount of development time. Is he a complete loss? Hopefully not. But there is no way he reaches what his ceiling could have been. Heck, just look at normally healthy prospects that jump too quickly to the NHL. Most everyone accepts the fact that the one extra year of development when the draft eligibility age jumped several decades back set prospects and the ability to judge them back. Calvin didn't even get that - he got zero development for large swaths of time.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

The problem with this is the timing's off. The team likely won't be reay to punch it's way into the next weight class until a few of Reinhart, Mayfield, Pedan, Pelech, Pokka, etc. hit their stride and they won't be Norris Trophy winners or anything immediately.

There's little that could be done on D right now short of killing and already half-dead-looking Bridgeport and hoping that someone can pull a Hamonic squared. Defensive depth is going to be a problem until defense is a strength in Bridgeport, even.

There is always the freak occurrence of a guy stepping out of the farm early and doing well. Most don't do that. I have that argument with Scott regularly.

Two more are on the way next season. They will be dropped head first into a high pressure situation on a weak blueline with forwards who for the most part are small and not physical themselves. There is no size to this club with the exception of Martin and a couple others. That puts even more pressure on raw rookies to be flawless top 4 material. IMO, recipe for mediocre results, if not outright disaster.

 

[blinkman360]

How can you be so sure of that, though? You don't even seem to be speculating, but stating it as fact. The problem is a lot of defensemen look good at the AHL level, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're upgrades over anyone currently playing at the NHL level.

Shouldn't Matt Donovan be a perfect example of this? Last season, he could basically replace de Haan in your post. I read quite a few posts about how the Isles should bring up Donovan because he was a clear upgrade over some of the guys on the Isles' roster. Yet now that he's in the NHL, all I read about in your GDTs is how much of a liability he is in his own zone.

Note, my post isn't to take a shot at Donovan or anything. Or to even say that it's impossible that de Haan wouldn't be an upgrade. Rather, it just seems too often when a team struggles, fans start to automatically assume that the player playing in the farm/junior is no doubt about it better than what's currently playing. And 9 times out of 10, that's simply not the case.

Maybe I'm a bigger CdH fan than most, but I'm pretty confident that he's a better option than Ness, Martinek and Donovan(at least at this moment). Maybe shouldn't have stated it as fact, but that's basically how I see it.

de Haan is actually only a tad bigger than Hickey. I think he still weighs in between 180 and 190 pounds. There is no bulk to his body at all - I saw him in warm ups one night and his chest looks almost concave.

it is fine to have a few mobile puck handling types that are not all that physical on the blueline. Its not fine when nearly all your dmen are of that ilk. A blueline of Hickey, Ness, Martinek, and de Haan could be out muscled by some high school teams. Heck, the #2 dman on the team I played for (I was the number one!) was 6'3" 230 pounds.

The difference is that CdH really isn't your typical "mobile puck handling" D-man. He excels more in his own zone than he does in the opponents. Considering the main issue right now is keeping the puck out of our net, that should give him a leg up on some of our other options(Donovan/Ness). Just take Hickey as an example. From looking at him you'd assume that his job is to score goals or contribute to scoring goals, but he's(at this point) probably been our 2nd best defensive defenseman with Visnovsky out. Maybe de Haan won't have that type of impact right off the bat, but like I said before, are we really deep enough to not at least explore that option?

I don't know how you can say that Blink. If we had put Potvin in a coat closet until the age of 26 then pulled him out would he have been even half the force he was? Doubtful. If you want to say that he is a recoverable asset to some degree that's fine, but CdH has lost a significant amount of development time. Is he a complete loss? Hopefully not. But there is no way he reaches what his ceiling could have been. Heck, just look at normally healthy prospects that jump too quickly to the NHL. Most everyone accepts the fact that the one extra year of development when the draft eligibility age jumped several decades back set prospects and the ability to judge them back. Calvin didn't even get that - he got zero development for large swaths of time.

deHaan's strength is in his legs. His skating. I'm not worried about his shoulders holding his game back. The only thing I'm worried about is whether or not he'll get hurt again. If he stays on the ice, I see him getting his shot, and I see him cementing a spot. I've always been big on Calvin, and from getting to see him on Sunday*(1st time all year), I'm still as high on him as ever. The kid has obvious talent, he just needs to stay healthy.

 

[Goombha]

I don't know how you can say that Blink. If we had put Potvin in a coat closet until the age of 26 then pulled him out would he have been even half the force he was? Doubtful. If you want to say that he is a recoverable asset to some degree that's fine, but CdH has lost a significant amount of development time. Is he a complete loss? Hopefully not. But there is no way he reaches what his ceiling could have been. Heck, just look at normally healthy prospects that jump too quickly to the NHL. Most everyone accepts the fact that the one extra year of development when the draft eligibility age jumped several decades back set prospects and the ability to judge them back. Calvin didn't even get that - he got zero development for large swaths of time.

The phrase "development time" needs to be retired already. Players develop at their own speed. I'm not in any way comparing DeHaan to Potvin, or Coffey or Bourque or Lidstrom, but you can't say with absolute certainty that he's Thomas Hickey either (and yes, I'm referring to Hickey as a piece of crap drafted 4th - yes). We don't know. What we do know is the current D is absolutely horrible and it would be hard pressed to make it any worse.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

The phrase "development time" needs to be retired already. Players develop at their own speed. I'm not in any way comparing DeHaan to Potvin, or Coffey or Bourque or Lidstrom, but you can't say with absolute certainty that he's Thomas Hickey either (and yes, I'm referring to Hickey as a piece of crap drafted 4th - yes). We don't know. What we do know is the current D is absolutely horrible and it would be hard pressed to make it any worse.

I can say with certainty that you don't lose that much development time, at his own speed, without sacrificing a lot. And as Blinkman described, he is still built like a girl. How do you think that is going to translate vs. guys who are 6'2" and 220 lbs? I can see the way this argument is going to play out in the future:
- He needed help there from his defensive partner.
- Crap, his defensive partners is 5'8" tall and 160 lbs soaking wet.
- He need help from the forward.
- Oh crap, all the forwards on that line are avg 5'10" and built like Ghandi on a fruit diet.
- He needed help there from the goaltender.
- Oh crap, goaltenders aren't allowed to use AK-47s or call in arc fire...


Yes that was silly, but I hope you get my point. This team is built like Keebler Elves. DeHaan is yet another elf. Sooner or later you need to get some men out there. Mayfield, Reinhart, etc... circa when? 2017? What does JT and crew do until then?

 

[blinkman360]

I can say with certainty that you don't lose that much development time, at his own speed, without sacrificing a lot. And as Blinkman described, he is still built like a girl. How do you think that is going to translate vs. guys who are 6'2" and 220 lbs? I can see the way this argument is going to play out in the future:
- He needed help there from his defensive partner.
- Crap, his defensive partners is 5'8" tall and 160 lbs soaking wet.
- He need help from the forward.
- Oh crap, all the forwards on that line are avg 5'10" and built like Ghandi on a fruit diet.
- He needed help there from the goaltender.
- Oh crap, goaltenders aren't allowed to use AK-47s or call in arc fire...


Yes that was silly, but I hope you get my point. This team is built like Keebler Elves. DeHaan is yet another elf. Sooner or later you need to get some men out there. Mayfield, Reinhart, etc... circa when? 2017? What does JT and crew do until then?

I can think of other d-men built like "girls" who excel in the NHL. A guy who was taken in the same draft comes to mind, in OEL. We have big guys on the way in Reinhart, Pulock, Mayfield, Pedan, etc. We're going to need the PMD's like de Haan. While we have a lot of them currently at the NHL level, which of them would you say are part of the core? None? Hickey might remain in a bottom-pairing or #7/8 role, but after that it's possible that none of these guys will stick. Visnovksy will be gone in a year; Ness will either be in Bridgeport or gone; Martinek will be gone; MacDonald should be gone. Donovan could stick, and he'll get a chance to, but at this point I don't think you can call him a 'core piece' with the way he's struggled.

Maybe de Haan doesn't bring the size we need, but who cares? If you think he could be a better defenseman than Ness or Martinek or Carkner, wouldn't it be worth giving him a shot? Dismissing him because he's not big or physical would be a mistake.

 

[Goombha]

I can say with certainty that you don't lose that much development time, at his own speed, without sacrificing a lot. And as Blinkman described, he is still built like a girl. How do you think that is going to translate vs. guys who are 6'2" and 220 lbs? I can see the way this argument is going to play out in the future:
- He needed help there from his defensive partner.
- Crap, his defensive partners is 5'8" tall and 160 lbs soaking wet.
- He need help from the forward.
- Oh crap, all the forwards on that line are avg 5'10" and built like Ghandi on a fruit diet.
- He needed help there from the goaltender.
- Oh crap, goaltenders aren't allowed to use AK-47s or call in arc fire...


Yes that was silly, but I hope you get my point. This team is built like Keebler Elves. DeHaan is yet another elf. Sooner or later you need to get some men out there. Mayfield, Reinhart, etc... circa when? 2017? What does JT and crew do until then?

I get your point. I feel your pain. What I've been reading is that DeHaan is - for whatever reason - fact or fiction - the closest player to being called up that we have. If that's true, I'll take him. I'll take a 12 year old Ballerina at this point. Oh wait, we already have a bunch of those, scratch that. Point is, we need something, and I'm okay with the go bold or go home approach (for a handful of games).

 

[ThreeLeftSkates]

I'm not worried about his shoulders holding his game back. The only thing I'm worried about is whether or not he'll get hurt again.

Now you see why he was not the first guy called up. Frajilly, like they say in a Christmas Story.

 

[blinkman360]

Now you see why he was not the first guy called up. Frajilly, like they say in a Christmas Story.

I don't have a problem with people being skeptical about his durability. My problem is when he's considered to be a mediocre prospect because of the injuries. I don't see that being the case.

I suppose the Isles want to wait a bit longer until he proves that he can stay on the ice, but when/if he does and when/if he gets his promotion, I predict a lot of people around here will start jumping on the CdH bandwagon. THE WATER'S FINE...or something like that..

 

[steveat]

I know stats don't mean everything, but I wanted to see how CDH was doing...he's got 1 assist in 12 games AND is a -4 ..I am pretty sure that has something to do with not being called up It looks like he will be getting back into game shape this whole season. Maybe next year we get to see him.

 

[blinkman360]

I know stats don't mean everything, but I wanted to see how CDH was doing...he's got 1 assist in 12 games AND is a -4 ..I am pretty sure that has something to do with not being called up It looks like he will be getting back into game shape this whole season. Maybe next year we get to see him.

You're right, it doesn't mean everything. He looked great on Sunday in Bridgeport, and his work on the PK(along with Mayfield I believe) was probably the only reason they were able to stay in that game and eventually win it. If there was rust, it appears as if he's worked through it.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

I can think of other d-men built like "girls" who excel in the NHL. A guy who was taken in the same draft comes to mind, in OEL. We have big guys on the way in Reinhart, Pulock, Mayfield, Pedan, etc. We're going to need the PMD's like de Haan. While we have a lot of them currently at the NHL level, which of them would you say are part of the core? None? Hickey might remain in a bottom-pairing or #7/8 role, but after that it's possible that none of these guys will stick. Visnovksy will be gone in a year; Ness will either be in Bridgeport or gone; Martinek will be gone; MacDonald should be gone. Donovan could stick, and he'll get a chance to, but at this point I don't think you can call him a 'core piece' with the way he's struggled.

Maybe de Haan doesn't bring the size we need, but who cares? If you think he could be a better defenseman than Ness or Martinek or Carkner, wouldn't it be worth giving him a shot? Dismissing him because he's not big or physical would be a mistake.

One out of six, sure, you can make that work. However girlscouts and pacifists dominate our blueline. That CdH is an injury plagued weakling (compared to the average NHL player he will face) just makes it worse.

 

[Jester9881]

You can clearly tell the people around here.... the armchair scouts if you will, that never actually watched any of these kids play. Or, have watched them play but through severely biased eyes.

 

[LeapOnOver]

You can clearly tell the people around here.... the armchair scouts if you will, that never actually watched any of these kids play. Or, have watched them play but through severely biased eyes.

I'll never forget the first camp and preseason I saw CDH play in and he was very solid. Got pucks through to the net, making great first passes, and positionally sound. The second camp I thought for sure he was going to make the team, and he was one of the last cuts, then bam the injury. So although he's been fragile if he is still at the level he was before injury then I am not worried. He'll get up here eventually and be a solid Kenny Jonsson type guy for us I hope (well, except for concussions).

 

[redbull]

I don't have a problem with people being skeptical about his durability. My problem is when he's considered to be a mediocre prospect because of the injuries. I don't see that being the case.

I suppose the Isles want to wait a bit longer until he proves that he can stay on the ice, but when/if he does and when/if he gets his promotion, I predict a lot of people around here will start jumping on the CdH bandwagon. THE WATER'S FINE...or something like that..

I agree with this.

The same people that want to toss Donovan aside and complain about Hickey are also down on CDH. He was an AHL all-star before he got hurt. He missed a full year. Can we just let him play and see how he does?

Players, especially dmen, need time and minutes against pro hockey players to improve. deHaan has one thing that most dmen don't have - SMARTS.

With a brain for hockey, fluid skater, elusive, great passer - that's enough tools to be an effective NHL dman, especially the way the Isles want to play.

I wouldn't worry about his stats or why he wasn't called up. Give him a year and see how things go.

 

[steveat]

I didn't realize he was considered mediocre? If he was never injured, would you consider him mediocre?

 

[InformTheMasses]

I agree with this.

The same people that want to toss Donovan aside and complain about Hickey are also down on CDH. He was an AHL all-star before he got hurt. He missed a full year. Can we just let him play and see how he does?

Players, especially dmen, need time and minutes against pro hockey players to improve. deHaan has one thing that most dmen don't have - SMARTS.

With a brain for hockey, fluid skater, elusive, great passer - that's enough tools to be an effective NHL dman, especially the way the Isles want to play.

I wouldn't worry about his stats or why he wasn't called up. Give him a year and see how things go.

The Voice Of Reason.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

I agree with this.

The same people that want to toss Donovan aside and complain about Hickey are also down on CDH. He was an AHL all-star before he got hurt. He missed a full year. Can we just let him play and see how he does?

Players, especially dmen, need time and minutes against pro hockey players to improve. deHaan has one thing that most dmen don't have - SMARTS.

With a brain for hockey, fluid skater, elusive, great passer - that's enough tools to be an effective NHL dman, especially the way the Isles want to play.

I wouldn't worry about his stats or why he wasn't called up. Give him a year and see how things go.

If true then why hasn't he bulked up a bit? Injuries look like a recurring issue, and added size would help to mitigate them to some degree. I'd guess that his injuries have prevented even that kind of program, so how did that not impact his development? Just curious.

 

[Sheva7]

Did I miss something? Is CDH hurt again? Holy dim and grim in here

 

[redbull]

If true then why hasn't he bulked up a bit? Injuries look like a recurring issue, and added size would help to mitigate them to some degree. I'd guess that his injuries have prevented even that kind of program, so how did that not impact his development? Just curious.

He has. I think he's up to 187lbs now, from the training camp weigh-ins.

I saw him in Oshawa, I doubt he even weighed 150 at 17. That's generous. He was a really skinny kid, very small frame. His neck was thicker compared to how thin he was with this body.

I remember watching Lindros at the same age and thinking if Lindros has played against deHaan, and caught him with a hit, he would have broken him in pieces.

deHaan doesn't have the frame to be 200lbs. He'll top out at where he is now, maybe 190. A Chris Chelios lean frame, if only he had that ability and could stay healthy and avoid big hits!

It remains to be seen what will become of deHaan. I think he'll be an NHLer sooner or later. Too many desirable tools.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

He has. I think he's up to 187lbs now, from the training camp weigh-ins.

I saw him in Oshawa, I doubt he even weighed 150 at 17. That's generous. He was a really skinny kid, very small frame. His neck was thicker compared to how thin he was with this body.

I remember watching Lindros at the same age and thinking if Lindros has played against deHaan, and caught him with a hit, he would have broken him in pieces.

deHaan doesn't have the frame to be 200lbs. He'll top out at where he is now, maybe 190. A Chris Chelios lean frame, if only he had that ability and could stay healthy and avoid big hits!

It remains to be seen what will become of deHaan. I think he'll be an NHLer sooner or later. Too many desirable tools.

You are the first person I have seen state he is almost at 190 lbs, which would be a significant change for the better. One question though, it was pointed out by several posters here that Finley was the best defenseman at the Bridge for a while. How about now? I know how bad Finley is and would think if there is hope for CdH to payoff into the NHL that he would have at least passed Finley.

 

[24diving]

You are the first person I have seen state he is almost at 190 lbs, which would be a significant change for the better.

I just got my free yearbook at the coli last night, and it has him listed as 6'1", 197 lbs. I of course thought that would be typical, all the measurements were boosted for all players, -- but it doesnt seem that way, for example Donovan is listed 6'0", 195lb. So either it's a DeHaan conspiracy, or he really did bulk up.

 

[InformTheMasses]

You are the first person I have seen state he is almost at 190 lbs, which would be a significant change for the better. One question though, it was pointed out by several posters here that Finley was the best defenseman at the Bridge for a while. How about now? I know how bad Finley is and would think if there is hope for CdH to payoff into the NHL that he would have at least passed Finley.

Finley has been out due to injury, so can't compare any other defenceman to him at this point.

Mayfield seemed to be getting more comfortable the last couple of weeks (6 games) were much better than the first 3 weeks (first 6 games). He had a poor showing in Albany, but the whole team was lousy.

The kids in Bridgeport (and mainly I'm speaking de Haan, Pedan, Mayfield since those are the only potential NHL caliber defenceman) are going to take time. It is going to be a slow progression for these kids to 1. adjust to the speed of the AHL 2. Adjust to the size and style of play in the NHL 3. Adjust to the length of the season and practice schedule of the AHL. THEN after all the adjustments are made (which doesn't happen over night) these players have to find their games within the system the organization sets for them. Find out what works consistently, find out what doesn't work, can they improve certain areas of their game to make them more complete. Become disciplined in both style of play and aggression. Then finally create an identity in themselves and make themselves a wanted commodity for an NHL team. This is a TON to accomplish. It's going to take years and seasons Not days and weeks.

So in summary, Calvin de Haan (who is not nearly as soft as people here make him out to be, he initiates contact a lot, and is quite strong, even for his build) should he stay healthy all year long should be ready to make the jump at the NHL level next year. Even if it's as a 5/6/7 rotational defenceman to get eased in and find himself at the NHL level for a season. As redbull says, the kid has too many tools (SMART, Skating, Positioning, Reliable, Passing). Good player to have

Scott Mayfield is probably at least a couple AHL seasons away. He has progressed over his first month, but so much more is possible with his game, and he needs to show consistency in all facets. He is worth cultivating and further developing.

Then Andrey Pedan...oh boy. Still not sure what to make of this guys after watching him for a couple years in Guelph and now in bridgeport for a few months. Pedan is worth investing in and developing him for as long as possible, so if it's 3 seasons in Bridgeport So Be It! Pedan can look as bad as Vladimir Malakhov on his worst day or as good as Zdeno Chara on a good day. He really has quite an intriguing set of tools. He's long, tough, has a temper, skates VERY well, has excellent puck skills, and a pretty big shot. He is a guy that under the right coaching could really blossom into something special, because his weakness is his decision making... decisions with the puck, decisions defensively, decisions on his level of aggression and apparently decisions on whom to hang out with and when to show up to practice. Pedan is a guy you challange to get better and improve his IQ on the ice, and work with day in and day out. As a fan you are happy to let him find his way in Bridgeport for however many years it takes, and hopefully the coaching is there and in a few years you really have something, and if not... well you can either chose to blame the player or the coaching.

 

[msv957]

Just saying the name Calvin Dehaan sounds like a small, soft, weak hockey player. It certainly does not have the tough hockey name.. lol