Have you seen Walters much this season? How has he looked. Am intrigued by him, I think he has a decent package of skills.
Button's 2012 top-30 (October)
- Thread starter Tormentor
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Have you seen Walters much this season? How has he looked. Am intrigued by him, I think he has a decent package of skills.
BPD
Registered User
The craziest thing about Karlsson v Karlsson?
Both of them will be drafted at 5'11 170 out of Frolunda.
Both of them will be drafted at 5'11 170 out of Frolunda.
ScottyK
Hi, I'm mat.
Hopefully Ebert does fall I want him in NJ
And no not just because he's a Devil fan and Stevens is his favorite player.
And no not just because he's a Devil fan and Stevens is his favorite player.
This new EK is too fat.
Pass.
Always makin me chuckle, no matter how simple, whenever you follow up my posts.
Rabid Ranger
2 is better than one
I wonder if Ebert is getting the "too long in the spotlight" treatment? He's been under the microscope for awhile now-and all the warts end up getting exposed (not that there are a ton of warts). Flavors of the week like Dumba and Trouba end up vaulting past.
It's the risers that always get overhyped. I don't think Dumba or Reilly are better defensemen than Murray, but since they have broke out this year, they are ranked higher.
Murray being at the U20 camp last year makes him less of a surprise to be performing.
Murray being at the U20 camp last year makes him less of a surprise to be performing.
GIANLUCA CURCURUTO Sault Ste. Marie (OHL) Feb. 25/94 D L 6'1/187 10 0 4 4 12
His stats are uglier than his game. I think he could be a 1st rounder.
His stats are uglier than his game. I think he could be a 1st rounder.
R S
Registered User
- Sep 18, 2006
- 25,468
- 10
Watched him over the weekend actually. Wasn't overly impressed. He did get stronger as the game went on, to his credit. Only played physical when he wanted and only played hard when he wanted.
Would like more consistency, but he does have a nice well rounded blend of skills.
I just don't think he's worth a top 60ish selection.
Boomhower
Registered User
I expect Athanasiou to continue falling in Button's ranking.
Was shocked to see him ranked in Button's top ten earlier this year.
He'll probably be a third rounder by the time the draft rolls around. Great skater, but lacks hockey sense and has no real offensive instinct. Seems to make his linemates worse, he gets tunnel vision and holds the puck too much, usually leading to turnovers. Has shown to be fairly soft and timmid aswell.
That said, the kid can fly, a true speedster.
Was shocked to see him ranked in Button's top ten earlier this year.
He'll probably be a third rounder by the time the draft rolls around. Great skater, but lacks hockey sense and has no real offensive instinct. Seems to make his linemates worse, he gets tunnel vision and holds the puck too much, usually leading to turnovers. Has shown to be fairly soft and timmid aswell.
That said, the kid can fly, a true speedster.
Pulkkinen
Elias Lindholm.
It's interesting the fact that from 18th to 30th, there's only one player outside the OHL (Oscar Dansk) and nearly the half of the list is from OHL (14/30). At ISS, 12/30 are from OHL. If we put in front the numbers, we can see that they are pretty similar:
Button & ISS
OHL: 14/30 - 12/30
Europe: 6/30 (5/6 SWE + 1/6 FIN) - 5/30 (4/5 SWE + 1/5 RUS)
WHL: 5/30 - 5/30
QMJHL: 3/30 - 2/30 (Bussières)
USHL: 2/30 - 6/30 (Matheson, Skjei, Schmaltz and Kerdiles)
It seems that ISS take more into consideration the USHL than Button, who fixes more at the top leagues. At this moment, both list ranks players from the same leagues. What are the chances of players from other leagues, like Cristoval Nieves or Jujhar Khaira? We can see players from another countries like Czech Republic (Tomas Hertl), Slovakia, Switzerland, Germany or Denmark?
Button & ISS
OHL: 14/30 - 12/30
Europe: 6/30 (5/6 SWE + 1/6 FIN) - 5/30 (4/5 SWE + 1/5 RUS)
WHL: 5/30 - 5/30
QMJHL: 3/30 - 2/30 (Bussières)
USHL: 2/30 - 6/30 (Matheson, Skjei, Schmaltz and Kerdiles)
It seems that ISS take more into consideration the USHL than Button, who fixes more at the top leagues. At this moment, both list ranks players from the same leagues. What are the chances of players from other leagues, like Cristoval Nieves or Jujhar Khaira? We can see players from another countries like Czech Republic (Tomas Hertl), Slovakia, Switzerland, Germany or Denmark?
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nanzenkills
Registered User
I wouldn't call Trouba a flavor of the week, he's always been ranked in the same neighborhood as Ebert.
Dumba is definitely a recent riser though.
I think its a matter that the scouts have expected to see a whole lot more. Ebert fans have been saying wait until Ellis is gone and he is the man. That time is here, and while he is having is a good season, his numbers this year are on pace for no better than last year. Arguably offensively better seasons are being had by a few OHL draft eligible D men like Koekkoek, Ceci which is the closest comparison. And the WHL dmen are on fire.
Before the season started I felt that Ebert, Ceci and Koekkoek really had to have seasons of around a PPG to move into the upper echelon, and 50 points minimum or they would find themselves falling. Ebert currently is projecting less than 50 points, hence IMHO why he is falling.
Rabid Ranger
2 is better than one
Right-but what is is his role? I don't get to see many OHL games so is Ebert being looked to purely for offense or is he being relied upon in a shutdown capacity? Even in juniors that makes a difference.
I think in Junior you can still do both. Ceci is a good example, averaging over a point a game while being recognized as one of the best defensive D men in the league. Ebert certainly is getting PP time.
Really, with Gibbons gone in Ottawa and Ellis in Windsor these two D men were expected to be the go to guy in D in their respective organizations. Their placement before the season started in some draft lists was based upon expectations. Exceed them, move up, fall short and move down. Its not always that a kid is playing bad, its what the scouts expected to see. I'm sure with Ellis gone they were not expecting Ebert to produce a 45 point campaign. Good news though is he has lots of time to pile up some points.
Rabid Ranger
2 is better than one
R S
Registered User
- Sep 18, 2006
- 25,468
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How so? He's been pegged as a potential top 10-15 since this time last year. And even with that, many people considered him a top 5, which he still is.
nanzenkills
Registered User
Dumba went from consensus top 10-15 to consensus top 3 in the last 2 months. To me, that qualifies as a recent rise.
R S
Registered User
- Sep 18, 2006
- 25,468
- 10
How is he consensus top 3?
Even the recent ISS ratings only had him 6th, with two WHL defenders ahead of him.
I don't call that consensus top 3....
nanzenkills
Registered User
I guess it's not a consensus yet, but McKenzie's panel of NHL scouts have him #2 overall, and Craig Button and his people have him #3 overall. Before the Hlinka tournament, I didn't really hear anyone talking about him higher than the 10-15 range.
McKenzie and Button essentially use the same scouts
Probably better to say that Dumba has been a consensus Top 10 than Top 3
DangerMan
@danlizee
I'd still consider Murray, Trouba and maybe even Rielly before I would consider Dumba. Dumba is the type of Dman a team could afford to take if your D is really good already. But if you are trying to build D around Dumba, you could be building it for awhile. Dumba is a low end #1 or a really good #2.
I still consider Dumba something of a wild card. At times he really looks like top end talent, and other times you see the odd WTF play. I do not think that is entirely unexpected out of a D man this age though. Sometimes you see players who you know are home run or bust, and at times you get players who game to game, play to play can be home run or bust (just think Subban to get your head around that thought). Dumba to me is a guy that okays pretty well, and at times absolutely sparkles, Scouts look at that and think "If he could do that all the time" and its hard to pass up that potential.
Probably what impresses me most about Dumba, however, is that he always seems to save his best for the big stage (where luckily I pretty much only see him). He shines in the spotlight, and that is why I would rank him in my top 5.
